Killings Sting Proud Battalion

[NNN0LHI]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/latimests/20041213/ts_latimes/killingsstingproudbattalion&cid=2026&ncid=1478

BAGHDAD — The men from Task Force 1-41 fought the battle for Sadr City last summer, chasing Al Mahdi militiamen through the slums in 120-degree heat. A year earlier, the unit had helped lead the charge into Baghdad.


The 1st Battalion, 41st Infantry Regiment has a distinguished combat history, from the D-Day landing to the Iraq (news - web sites) desert campaign of the Persian Gulf War (news - web sites). Its motto: "Straight and Stalwart."


Last week, in a makeshift military courtroom, the unit's reputation came under assault. Soldiers from 1-41 described how a member of a rogue platoon hauled an unarmed Iraqi man away from his family one hot August morning and casually fired two shots into his head. Then he photographed the corpse.


As disturbing as the testimony was for soldiers from a proud unit, it was just one episode in a shocking series of killings. Over a period of 26 days in August and September, seven 1-41 soldiers were charged with six murders on two continents.


Soldiers have described renegade infantrymen who bragged about their kills. In one case, they testified, soldiers from a 1-41 platoon argued over who should get credit for killing an unarmed Iraqi because they had bet on who would be the first.

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[Cooley Hurd]

1. Jeebus... support our troops?

...soldiers from a 1-41 platoon argued over who should get credit for killing an unarmed Iraqi because they had bet on who would be the first.

Oh, the inhumanity...:grr:

[NNN0LHI]

2. Read down. They are killing each other too

>>>Four of the victims were Iraqi civilians. In addition to the two alleged executions, soldiers were accused of shooting a critically wounded Iraqi teenager in a "mercy killing," and shooting an unarmed Iraqi, who, according to two soldiers, was waving a white cloth. Two more infantrymen were charged with murdering two fellow 1-41 soldiers in Kansas.<<<

[maddezmom]

4. and again...just a few bad apples

:eyes:

Court testimony suggests a unit in chaos, plagued by a handful of out-of-control soldiers and riven by internal divisions.


Soldiers said one squad leader ordered his men to take no prisoners, and at least one soldier who complained about misconduct had to be transferred for his safety.

[Cooley Hurd]

5. I guess it's pretty hard to turn off the killing machine within themselves

When all of this is over, these men will come home and live amongst us.:scared:

[tabasco]

13. It is troops reporting it and troops prosecuting the criminals.

Please remember that most of the military does not commit crimes and will report those who do. I do not support the criminals who commit these acts and desire that they be punished severely.

I was an infantryman and the last thing I would ever do is intentionally harm a civilian.

[Cooley Hurd]

18. I wish every soldier had your morals and self-control...

Unfortunately, actions committed by these few soldiers overshadow the actions of the many good soldiers...

Thank you for your service, tabasco!:thumbsup:

[izzie]

3. In an army like ours now you have the men that like this life.

Our army used to to people who felt they had to fight for a reason or were forced into it, and the ones that liked it. I was for getting rid of the draft but I think our founding father's knew better than I . I feel I was wrong. We need a citizen army where all people are more in play to to what is going on. I spent 20 years on the side lines of this life, having been married to a career service man.

[NYC]

8. In The Imperial Presidency by Arthur Schlesinger, Jr.,

he described the dangers of a professional army.

(I'm sorry I can't get to that information right now.)

[sherilocks]

6. Three years for murder? If it happened in Texas

he'd have been executed.

<snip>

On Friday, Horne pleaded guilty to murder and was sentenced to three years in prison.

<snip>

[xchrom]

7. this is a war with no honour, and no humane purpose

these actions simply represent the reality of the bushco vision.
the rot that infects the white house and capitol hill and finally the country is simply and profoundly reflected in the actions of these soldiers, abu ghraib, guantanamo, etc.
there can be no other conclusion -- to say it is other wise, continues the delusional state gripping the country.

[teryang]

9. Why do they end on this fascist note?

<Some veterans criticized unit members who had alerted superiors, saying soldiers in combat should support one another, no matter what.

"What you see, you keep to yourself," said Rick Geike, 64, a Vietnam War veteran.

Fred Meyer, 69-year-old veteran who was helping Geike hang Christmas decorations at American Legion Post 45, said soldiers should not be punished for anything that happened in combat.

"You're trained to kill. Bingo," he said. "End of conversation.">

Totally contrary to everything the Army teaches.

[tabasco]

14. Fred Meyer is an idiot. This is America - not the Mongol hordes.

Some Vietnam vets deserve no respect and he is one of them. Anyone who condones criminal acts by American troops is without honor.

The Army trains soldiers to report war crimes. If crimes are allowed to happen without repercussion, the result will be totally undisciplined units. If murder of civilians is overlooked, soon the soldiers will be killing each other.

I am a combat infantry vet. People who lose their humanity in combat never had much to begin with.

[tired of bush]

10. They'll become cops when they leave the military....

A large portion of the ex-military gravitate to jobs in law enforcement...can't wait.

[Sara Beverley]

11. Now remember when Kerry returned home from Viet Nam and told similar

stories as he had observed and others had told him, he was smeared and is still smeared today for telling the truth. This shit happens all the time in war that is why a decision to go to war should always be tough and a last resort because we turn men into monsters and kill innocents. The decision to go into this war was made behind closed doors long before 9/11. The blood and the blackened souls of many soldiers is squarely on the hands of the Bush and his band of neo-cons.

[Paulie]

12. It's times like this you think the Romans had the right idea

They used to "decimate" their Legions when anyone screwed up.... :puke:

We need to bring our troops home now, before it gets even worse. Bring the torture, death, destruction HOME NOW, where it belongs. :nuke:

I don't know if I'm trying to be funny or not. Iraq is like a bad movie now...

[neweurope]

16. "This is America - not the Mongol hordes."

My Lai. Falludjah.

My Lai, Fallujah.


Fallujah.


When these guys are brought home and finally turned on you - do you not think they'll comply... ?

[TahitiNut]

15. Military units ROT from the head down.

It's no accident that such behavior is clustered within units ... following the "command structure." This is clearly a command attitude. Never underestimate the power of authoritarian indoctrination. It is, in fact, the greatest difficulty faced by veterans.

[jmowreader]

17. A war story about how proud the 1-41 is

The comment about how the Romans decimated their legions and the motto of the 1-41 brings back a little war story about this unit.

In 1989 we got a new watch officer who'd come from 1-41. He said the entire chain of command, the entire battalion staff, and all of the soldiers were being replaced. "Why's that?"

It seems that the 1-41 was on a month-long field exercise in Grafenwohr, which was one of the Army's big maneuver centers in Europe. About two days before ENDEX, two of the privates in the battalion saw a sheep herd and remembered that there's this big rumor going around that sheep feel just like women, if you know what I mean.

Well, one thing led to another and the perimeter guards caught these guys...look, I don't wanna turn this into a locked thread, but let your imagination run wild and you can figure out what these two assholes did. And yes, they did that--it was observed by the entire battalion.

The colonel called the general, who called Range Control at Graf and got the unit's field time extended by a week. Then he had defense attorneys, a prosecutor, and a judge sent to the woods. These two dipshits were tried, convicted and sentenced to 23 years at hard labor while in the field ("unnatural acts" was the main charge) then taken straight from Graf to Leavenworth.

Needless to say, the rest of the battalion was pissed that these two idiots kept them out a week longer than scheduled. So when they got back, they all went to the club to get really fucked up...and when their buddies from other units asked them why they were out so long, comments about "being locked down because two idiots got caught fucking a sheep two days before ENDEX" started flying fast and furious.

The division they were in had a tradition--when you salute an officer you have to sound off with your unit's motto. A lot of places do this. When the general found out that the troops in the 1-41 were sounding off "straight and sta-a-a-a-a-a-alwart, sir," he called the Total Army Personnel Center and had everyone in the unit reassigned. No one got punitive assignments--they found slots in good units for everyone, because after all it wasn't their fault two guys decided to go AWOL and commit bestiality--but they couldn't leave the unit intact after that.