Ala. Judge Wears Ten Commandments on Robe

[Champ]

MONTGOMERY, Ala. - A judge refused to delay a trial Tuesday when an attorney objected to his wearing a judicial robe with the Ten Commandments embroidered on the front in gold.

Circuit Judge Ashley McKathan showed up Monday at his Covington County courtroom in southern Alabama wearing the robe. Attorneys who try cases at the courthouse said they had not seen him wearing it before. The commandments were described as being big enough to read by anyone near the judge.

Attorney Riley Powell, defending a client charged with DUI, filed a motion objecting to the robe and asking that the case be continued. He said McKathan denied both motions.

"I feel this creates a distraction that affects my client," Powell said.

McKathan told The Associated Press that he believes the Ten Commandments represent the truth "and you can't divorce the law from the truth. ... The Ten Commandments can help a judge know the difference between right and wrong."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=533&e=3&u=/ap/20041215/ap_on_re_us/ten_commandments_robe

[toymachines]

1. alright, so make up some sort of secular ten commandments...

oh wait isnt that kind of like our bill of rights. i mean its a living political cartoon. The separation of church and state has literally been bridged. the judge should at least understand that if he wishes people to respect him, he should respect them. that crazy old south.

[NAO]

57. Which 10 Commandments? Many versions, ones in the Bible later plagiarisms

We could have a granite monument of the Code of Hammurabi, or the Laws of Salon, etc.

People need to realize that many if not most of the things in "The Bible" are actually rip-off and plagiarisms of other religious teachings.

See the book "The World's 16 Crucified Saviors" for other "sons of god" who were born as men, "to a virgin", "in a stable"...it goes on and on. If people were to study comparative mythology, they would see very clearly what a colossal fraud Christianity really is.

Seperation of Church and State Webring
http://g.webring.com/hub?ring=churchstate

[catnhatnh]

72. How about these...

1.You better not pout.
2.You better not cry.
3.You better watch out,I'm telling you why.

4.Right wing nuts are going to town...

[lazarus]

2. This guy did my child support hearing!

Oy vey.

I'm so goddamned happy I'm not in his jurisdiction anymore.

I know that lawyer, too. This is bizarre.

BTW, this isn't from Montgomery, it's Andalusia, Alabama. Small town, maybe 10,000 people. More churches than bars.

[FDRrocks]

3. Disbarment!

Immediately! This is pure BULLSHIT. On the highest order. This "judge" is wearing Christian garbs in a secular court, and, ostensibly, enforcing the laws of his religion upon alleged offenders.

If this stands, I hope they never try anyone for incest in this court.

Disbar this asshole! I am a citizen of this democratic country, and I wholeheartedly oppose this kind of crap.

[LiberalFighter]

34. He was not put on the bench to be a minister

nor was he ordained by god or their representatives to be a minister.


Render onto Caeser what is Caesar and unto God what is God.

I guess he now wants to be the leader of his church and a judge.

[GiovanniC]

43. He Wants His Name in the Papers

He wants to grow up to be just like that batshit crazy Roy Moore. Looks like he's getting his wish.

[berni_mccoy]

4. Talk about wearing your religion on your sleeve...

Someone should challenge him to recit the 10 commandments without looking down at his robe. If he can recit them from memory, he gets to keep them on. If not, they come off. No hypocrit should be a judge.

[montana_hazeleyes]

12. Good line berni_mccoy

:D

[LiberalFighter]

35. But if he knows them by memory why does he need it?

And if he doesn't know them by memory it proves that he hasn't been reading his bible or listening to his minister.

[truth2power]

41. Best post on this thread! n/t

[purduejake]

5. Fine, then I get to wear a great big....

flaming rainbow shirt into court with political messages on it and argue that God told me to do it and that it should not be a distraction. If decency and professionalism is gonna be broken down, so be it.

Ugh, this is just too much =)

[Throckmorton]

20. How about a big pink triangle

after all thats what we had to where in the last time.

[Just Me]

61. We could suggest these people tattoo all the ones they have broken,...

,...have the broken commandments tattooed to their foreheads. That'll shut 'em up! It would be mighty hard to be preaching and persecuting if you have your own sins advertised on your forehead.

Honestly, I can't believe people like this actually serve as a judge anywhere in the continental "Divided States".

[billie_]

6. HAHHA, Mike Malloy was talking about this on his show earlier

that is the best....and by best, i mean INSANE!!!!!

[UL_Approved]

7. Bush "mandate"

People wonder why we are pushing the voter fraud issue so damn hard. If Bush gets to keep the White House, we will be in a fundamentalist state that forms the Christianity-based twin of Iran. I'm not going to stand by and let that happen.

[Mike Niendorff]

8. Excellent

Bring 'em out of the woodwork for all America to see. I'd much rather have them making this kind of ridiculous spectacle of their activism than continuing to quietly pursue it under cover of judicial discretion.


MDN

[McKenzie]

9. I'd like to see him try that in a European court of law

oh boy, they are really crawling out of the woodwork now that the semi-literate one is at the helm. Isn't there a law against this sort of religous partisanism?

I'm gobsmacked that he can get away with it.

[anakie]

10. what number marriage is this guy on???

n/t

[lazarus]

11. I'm not sure about him

but I know he's got stepkids, so his wife is on at least #2.

[anakie]

18. therefore, according to Mark 10:11

he is an adulterer and by his own logic (lack of) is unfit to be a judge.

What's the bet that verse don't count.

[talk hard]

13. what a jackass

This guy is a living cartoon and the reason why BushCo should be blocked at every turn in his judicial nominations.

Then this fella should exchange his jesus robes for a straight-jacket and take a long vacation weaving baskets, preferably underwater.

I do believe the jesus freaks have gotten on my last nerve.

Lord, save us from your followers.

[jdots]

14. Give the dick weed some toy guns and Mickey Mouse hat

All these goobers come out now to flaunt the crap because the little bush and co. has prayer meetings in the white house.Why don't they read another book,they don't even understand this one.
You know this turd brain probably charged the embroidary to the tax payers.I don't want the jerk fired,just a few slaps to knock some sence into him would be a good start.

[TaleWgnDg]

15. Life is to laugh . . . what else can you do?

The other day, I was in court per usual -- it was my duty day -- and one of the judge's clerks was wearing a stud-earring.

Okay, nothing wrong w/ that you say?

But wait a minute. It was a pink triangle w/ two gold wedding rings intermeshed on it. Hhhhhhmmmmm. The judge called her to his side and she immediately removed it. Why? Well, hell. Because it was political speech worn in a court where that stuff taint allowed when you represent the judges.

Of course this is the northeast where we are damn proud to be liberal and educated.

[ISUGRADIA]

16. Dude must be planning a race for the state supreme court

taking the Moore route to higher office.

[fryguy]

17. what law school do these judges come from?

don't they teach them about the First Amendment, or were they skip that and go right to the Second?

[mbperrin]

19. OK, some lawyer needs to embroider this on HIS or HER outfit:

"As he taught, Jesus said, "Watch out for the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and be greeted in the marketplaces, and have the most important seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at banquets. They devour widows' houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. Such men will be punished most severely.""

[GiovanniC]

45. Fantastic

n/t

[sleepyhead]

21. I bet Rehnquist is jealous

that he didn't think of it first. Wonder if he has room on his robe between the stripes on his sleeves for some Biblical verse?

[Bozita]

62. How long until judges start looking like NASCAR drivers?

Rehnquist should have added some nifty golden epaulets to go along with those fashion-setting stripes.

[neweurope]

22. It's hilarious, it's insane and it is frightening.

There seems to be no hole in the country such a rat isn't coming out of.

We hear of two or three of such incidents every day now. It's very scary.

By the way: Can a judge in the US just wear what he wants? Could he for instance wear a yellow robe with embroidered sayings of Buddha? Or zebra striped pants?

[demnan]

23. Oh I think it's all right that he wear the robe

As long as he completes the ensemble with clown shoes.

[0007]

25. .....and with a shoulder patch that reads, "gimme head till I'm dead"

[trof]

24. And on the other side of the coin...

We have a local judge in Baldwin County Alabama who bars any clothing with logos or writing of any kind in his courtroom.
A defendant in a DUI case was made to go out in the hall and turn his shirt wrong side out.
He was wearing a golf shirt with a U. of Ala. logo on it.
The same judge told a convicted child molester, prior to serving his jail term, that he should go to his church and get down on his knees and beg forgiveness of the congregation and god.
We're doomed.

[noamnety]

26. Nothing new for this judge

Christian conciliation: New use for old tenets

... Covington County Circuit Judge Ashley McKathan has nothing but good things to say about this "new old" means of dispute resolution, noting that "conciliation resolved two of the most difficult family disputes I've seen in my courtroom."

<snip> ... Other members of the bench and bar, many of whom eagerly desire to put their faith into practice, are taken with the notion of conciliation. ...

http://www.wallacejordan.com/publications/conciliation.htm

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[quaoar]

29. I think I speak for the entire state of Alabama

in saying, "Go fuck yourself."

[AlabamaYankee]

30. I second that emotion

We have to put up with enough ignorant bigoted crap from the wingers in this state without seeing it in a progressive discussion board. Chill out and save your abuse for those who truly deserve it.

[QC]

38. I second your second.

This self-righteous horseshit has gotten real old real fast, and it's why I'm not so sure it's still accurate to refer to DU as "progressive." Sometimes this place is nothing more than a mirror image of Free Republic, thanks to the abundance (and loudness)of posters like the one above.

[Dhalgren]

42. As ashamed of this backward "state" as I am,

I have to admit that I was born in Alabama and all of my family lives in the "state". I realize that you do not care for my opinion. That's fine by me, I don't care for yours.

When you say you hate Nazi Germany, you don't have to qualify your statement. Well, when speaking of Alabama no qualifier is needed either.

[TahitiNut]

28. Just another "Old Testament Christian"

He's a theological recidivist, a throwback. This is prototypical Pharisaical behavior - it bears no resemblance to the "good news" whatsoever and is diametrically opposed to the teachings of Jesus.

[arwalden]

31. What A Pile Of Steaming Horseshit...

>> McKathan told The Associated Press that he believes the Ten Commandments represent the truth "and you can't divorce the law from the truth. ... The Ten Commandments can help a judge know the difference between right and wrong." <<

Another ACTIVIST judge?? Or just a screwball Christian?

[ElsewheresDaughter]

32. what the hell is wrong with these Alabama judges?..is it in the water?

[Dhalgren]

47. It's in the ignorance, poverty, and greed -

all hallmarks of this great "state". And people who should know better will slobber at the mouth defending the "good" people of Alabama. Well, there are good people everywhere, that doesn't alter what the "state" represents - as demonstrated by its elected and judicial representatives. If it weren't so sad, it would be hilarious...

[VegasWolf]

49. I think its just centuries of inbreeding. n/t

[Cerridwen]

33. Which version of the 10 Commandments?

Ten Commandments - Same Words - but Three Versions

Jewish, Protestant & Orthodox, Roman Catholic & Lutheran

http://www.apatheticagnostic.com/articles/reflections/commandments/versions.html

Will he wear each version in a rotating format? Jewish on Monday, Protestant & Orthodox on Wednesday, then Roman Catholic & Lutheran on Friday?

[LiberalFighter]

37. Of course not

Definitely won't do the Jewish or Roman Catholic for sure. The Lutheran probably not either.

[HCeline69]

36. Seriously

Is this story is on the level, reality is moving faster than satire. In fact, if you wrote a scene like this for a satire, you'd be one hell of a clumsy artist.

[TexasLady]

39. I wonder if 'thou shalt' will be used

in the wording. I never understood why that old language is still being used. Does it make a person look more religious or something?

Boy its a good thing we have judges like this so the atheists and heathens will all get out or keep out of the jails and prisons(no religious people in em, ya know). Cant have morality unless the Ten Commandments are right there in your face. Maybe someone will decide on a conversion in the court room, and they can get the local Baptist preacher to baptize them right on the spot. yeah, thats it!

:eyes:

[nickfaldo7]

40. this is just the beginning

i think we all knew this was coming. The polarization of America has turned into a culture war, and the neo-cons are responsible.

[Straight Shooter]

44. I think he's looking for MEDIA attention. It's a big EGO FEST for him.

He's a Roy Moore wannabe. What a joke. I wonder who did the embroidery.

[GiovanniC]

46. Great Minds...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1072769&mesg_id=1073869&page=

[Straight Shooter]

71. Simultaneously, too

;)

[Oldpals]

48. Here comes the judge

I think the next judge should have a Marlboro sign all across the front of his robes. Then when someone disagrees he should say he is challenging his first amendment right which has more weight than this freakish thing that this AL judge is up to. If this went on in Iraq would the holier than thous be as mortified?

[quinnox]

50. And he wants to be called "your eminence"

in court probably. Holy cow, this guy needs help, or is looking to host a talk show or be another right wing radio personality.

[VegasWolf]

51. Guilty. Thou shalt pick thee up trash on Saturday's. n/t

[The Zanti Regent]

52. I want a divorce.

It's only a matter of time before EVERY judge in Jesusland will wear this.

I'm in California. I want OUT of fucking Jesusland!

[iamjoy]

53. We're All Wrong Here

I mean, not in the principle of the fight, but the way we fight it.

First, stop insulting Alabama. I'm not from there, I don't live there, but don't condemn the whole state. When we insult people and use pejorative terms we only re-enforce their conception of us as liberal elitists who hate "real Americans"

When we make a big hairy deal about the Ten Commandments being displayed, we are seen as anti-religion and trying to force our views on them (even though they are forcing their views on us)

So What Do We Do?
When some one is convicted or receives an unfavorable judgement, they file an appeal on the grounds that they did not get a fair trial. They specifically state the judge was not impartial. For example, he is likely wearing the Protestant version of the Ten Commandments, so a Jewish or Catholic person could make a case that this judge demonstrated religious bias. An person of another religion or an atheist could make the same claim. "I felt the judge did not respect my views and was prejudice against me because of my religion"

We don't need to change our "battles" just the way we fight them.

[VegasWolf]

55. Why? A lot of us are anti-religion here. Who cares anymore, the

Democratic party has sold its soul. If liberals
fail to attack issues we think are unjust, then we are
just as culpable as the non thinking conservatives.

[Maraya1969]

64. Excellent!

Use it as a basis for appeal! Everyone who has been convicted under this nitwit should be calling their attorneys right now!


So What Do We Do?
When some one is convicted or receives an unfavorable judgement, they file an appeal on the grounds that they did not get a fair trial. They specifically state the judge was not impartial. For example, he is likely wearing the Protestant version of the Ten Commandments, so a Jewish or Catholic person could make a case that this judge demonstrated religious bias. An person of another religion or an atheist could make the same claim. "I felt the judge did not respect my views and was prejudice against me because of my religion"

[scarlett1]

65. I told several Lawyers and Judges about this 10 commandment robe

incident earlier today. All of them, Democrat or Republican, were appalled that a Judge would wear the Ten Commandments on a Judaical Robe. As attorneys we know this is more than just a liberal or conservative issue or Republican vs. Democrat issue. Separation of Church and State is paramount in this Country. Iran, Iraq and many other Countries the Church and the State is as one. That is one of many difference that makes the USA a Great Country.
If he wants to put the Ten Commandments on his Bathrobe that he wears at home- go for it.

[Deja Q]

54. There's only one commandment for our current deity-wannabe*

[VegasWolf]

56. Thou shalt not fuck thy mother? n/t

[Deja Q]

58. Did the image not show up? Here's the solution:

Right-mouse click on image, and left-click on "View Image".

It reads "God needs booze". :D

[Maraya1969]

59. He's better recuse himself from death penalty cases!

I still cannot understand how theses people can justify themselves with the death penalty and the Christian Ten Commandments.

It does not say, "Do do kill unless an appointee of the court says so".


Furthermore I think there is something in the law that says you are entitled to a fair and Impartial trial. These Judges are openly admitting they are not impartial since they are obviously siding with certain religious doctrine. Do we even have to question whether an Evangelical Christian would receive the same considerations as a Muslim under such a clown of a judge?


These judges are starting to look so foolish. I wish one would wear a turban just to make a point in the other direction.

[GCP]

60. The Ten Commandments as they relate to *

"Thou shalt have no other gods before me" Unless it's oil

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Unless it's of me

Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain." God put me here in the White House, nothing more to say

Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy Unless we're bombing anybody

"Honour thy father and thy mother I answer to a higher father

"Thou shalt not kill." That doesn't apply to me at all, never did, never will

Thou shalt not commit adultery." That's one I did manage to keep

"Thou shalt not steal." Unless it's selling off shares in a company I was a financial officer of, and I knew the company was going down

Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour. WMD WMD WMD

"Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's." Unless we're talking about oil again

[Just Me]

74. I printed out your succinct list. Although, God's name has been vained,..

,...by Bush and all those who hold out God as an excuse for their horrific actions. I view using God to rationalize destructive causes,...as the unforgiveable sin,...or, at the very least, taking the Lord, thy God's name in vain.

Representing, explicitly or by implication, that God is the justification for any human's action is,...just,...beyond reprehensible.

[yellowcanine]

63. Impeach the fundy nut. Did he take an oath to defend the Constitution?

Why do I feel like the rest or the world is laughing their asses off at us?

[VegasWolf]

68. I guess because we elected the clown. n/t

[GOPBasher]

66. So he doesn't believe in freedome of religion?

Why don't they ask these people outright: "Do you believe in the freedom of religion?" If so, why do you tell people what god to believe in? The first two commandments tell people what god to believe in. If you believe in the freedom of religion, you wouldn't put those commandments in public.

[Kimber Scott]

69. The big problem with that question is he has his right to freedom of

religion, as well. The question should be, "Do you believe in the right to freedom FROM religion?" I'm sure his answer would be, "No," but, I believe I have that right as a citizen of the United States of America.

If he is so concerned he may forget the Ten Commandments without having them spelled out and close by, he should type them up and tape them to his bench - where he can see them and nobody else can.

I can't remember the passage, but I know there is a story in the Bible where Jesus mentions the people who stand on the corners, saying their prayers, or reading their verses, loudly in order to ensure other people know how pious they are. Jesus was not impressed by these people and said something to the effect you should practice your faith in private.

This type of behavior will eventually marginalize the Christian religion in this country, as it has already elsewhere.

[bamacrat]

67. Why, why all the right wing fundamentalists,

why do they have to be from Alabama, as if we needed anymorevidence that we are a red state.

[QC]

70. Let's see what the Gospel of Matthew has to say about this, shall we?

"1": Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.

"2": Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

"3": But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth:

"4": That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

"5": And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

"6": But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

[Oldpals]

73. Judge

Maraya hit the nail on the head. By advertising what his beliefs are this judge has already declared his partisanship.
I am really appalled and wonder if the country has gotten worse in the past couple of years or are we more aware? Look at Fox. Apparently last night Hannity was spewing about the fact that the Gibson movie did not get a Golden Globe. He claimed the reason is because of liberals and their desire to remove Christianity from the screen and our lives. I mean, who is this guy really talking to? This is such crap. One moment they say that they hate Hollywood yet they want to have the awards they like. Then they say that Hollywood is elitist yet they want a actor Governor. Then they say that actors have nothing to contribute yet they have Ron Silver, Bruce Willis and Silver preaching their ideology.

That these people think that a judge, a man charged with adjudicating and doing so fairly would be so outrageously radical and for it to be tolerated is amazing. I wonder what would happen if a Jewish judge or a Muslim or even a Buddhist were to wear their religious garb to the bench?

[RuleofLaw]

75. This is ridiculous

Judges are government employees. They are paid by the government, work in government buildings, fulfilling a government function.

He has no say in how he should be dressed. If he wants to wear the 10 Commandments, he can do it on his own time. While the judiciary must remain independent, they are never the less part of the government, paid for by the tax payers. What would stop a judge from wearing a robe saying "Barry Bonds is juiced"? I mean, its the truth!

[VegasWolf]

76. I figure that Alabama Judges know they are above the law.n/t

[MADem]

77. One of these days....

Some clever American will ascend to the judgeship, be a practicing shi'a mullah who is a descendant of the prophet, and will turn up in his black turban in court ready to hear that DUI case. And the right wing will go flat-out INSANE....

It's only THEIR God that is "OK" in our justice system. Of course, their God is not the God of Abraham, obviously, because they don't think THEIR God is the same as the Muslim/Jewish/assorted Christian denominations one.

Sick folk. Stupid, too. They can parrot the text, but they have no idea what it means.

[VegasWolf]

78. But, maDem, you are enlightened. The message is spreading slowly. n/t