44 Percent In U.S. Poll Say Restrict Muslims

[Placebo]

Nearly half of all Americans believe the U.S. government should restrict the civil liberties of Muslim Americans, according to a nationwide poll.

The survey conducted by Cornell University also found that Republicans and people who described themselves as highly religious were more apt to support curtailing Muslims' civil liberties than Democrats or people who are less religious.

Researchers also found that respondents who paid more attention to television news were more likely to fear terrorist attacks and support limiting the rights of Muslim Americans.

"It's sad news. It's disturbing news. But it's not unpredictable," said Mahdi Bray, executive director of the Muslim American Society. "The nation is at war, even if it's not a traditional war. We just have to remain vigilant and continue to interface."

The survey found 44 percent favored at least some restrictions on the civil liberties of Muslim Americans. Forty-eight percent said liberties should not be restricted in any way.

full article may be found here: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20041218/ap_on_re_us/muslims_civil_liberties

[ET Awful]

1. Notice how they phrase it as "nearly half of all Americans" are in favor

of it, as opposed to saying "The majority are opposed."

[aquart]

2. I sure did.

[Born Free]

56. Southern Poverty Law Center

http://www.splcenter.org/index.jsp

You are correct, the answer is to support the Southern Poverty Law Center, they have been doing work for years to promote to tolerance

[shayes51]

62. Absolutely!

[EFerrari]

100. Used to wonder about "good Germans" during Hitler. Don't now

[IowaGuy]

4. Your point is valid....

however; 44% are ok with that? WTF!! That's high of a number is kind of scary. I don't accept that it is "not unpredictable" or understandable at all. I'm not getting on your case...just frustrated with the increasing retardation of American society. There was a time when we aspired to be better...

[ET Awful]

6. I'm not discounting your point at all. . . if I had more evidence to back

it up, I'd say that this poll is probably a more accurate reflection of what the election actually should have looked like. That 44%, I can nearly guarantee, are ALL Bush voters.

[Stand and Fight]

24. My thoughts exactly.

The darkness surrounds us now because of the lies and deceit of one group of people -- and don't take this to mean JUST Republicans. Good men who stand by and do nothing in the face of evil are just as guilty, and a good number of them are Independents, Democrats, and third party.

[Just Me]

45. And those few are waging an evil psy-ops campaign against our people!

Without that highly-planned and executed mind-controlling bullshit being imposed upon our people,....that FALSE number would NOT EXIST.

Our people are being manipulated.

THAT really pisses me off!!!!

[IowaGuy]

30. Yeah....that sounds about dead on...

I'm still grittin' my teeth over it though, as accurate as this may be, its still just not right....such attitudes will only eventually turn around on us and hurt us worse in the end....but I guess I'm preachin' to the choir, here.

[Arkana]

46. That 44% is his base

If we can chip away at that other 7%, we can turn the tables.

[Stew225]

93. I wonder if any of these 44% have the

yellow ribbon magnets on their SUV's.

[w4rma]

8. That's a warning of things to come. Muslims are the Jew scapegoats for

the new Nazis.

[genieroze]

18. I guess I better get my attic ready to hide people. eom

[Just Me]

47. Bullshit. I don't even believe that 51% gave Bush "political capital",...

,...to become a full-strength neo-Nazi against Muslims.

Yeah,...the masses have been subject to the strongest propaganda campaign since Hitler. They have NOT followed lock-step,...will NOT follow that path. NO WAY!!!

As slow to warm to the truth as we may be (being convinced that we are forever the "good-will"),...there is no freakin' way the Busholinis will drag this strong and diverse people into that hell.

NO WAY!!!

[regnaD kciN]

48. That's the exact equivalency...

I was reading Leo Strauss and the Politics of American Empire (an outstanding book for anyone wanting to know more about the intellectual foundations, such as they are, of neoconservatism -- check it out at http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0300104367/qid=1103349395/sr=2-3/ref=pd_ka_b_2_3/104-4473567-4342349) this afternoon, and Anne Norton made the exact same point. As is well-known, Arab Muslims are Semites just as Jews are, and one of her points is that, over the past half-century, as anti-Semitism directed against Jews has been placed outside the bounds of decent political discourse, it has been replaced by anti-Semitism directed against Arabs and Muslims. Indeed, many of the same slurs are used, characterizing the Semitic bogeymen as both a sinister threat to America and somehow not-fully-human compared to us "Westerners." The distance between a Father Coughlin in the 1930s and a Pat Robertson in the 2000s isn't all that far -- merely the specific Semitic target has been shifted.

:eyes:

[Just Me]

95. This is a different world. "Strauss" was a lashing victim,...

,...there is no place in THIS world,...for the likes of him or his followers who have no capacity to deliver a "vision".

No one who is STUCK in "victimization" can EVER have the capacity to create a "VISION" for humanity.

Only those who have the capacity to stand outside themselves,...can deliver both hope and "vision".

Ask Jesus and MLK and Moses and Ghandi and Mohammad and Buddha and Anna Franks and the Dahli Lama and Sai Babba and the likes of those human beings.

They were surely "terrorists", too.

[CatholicEdHead]

11. 44% is "nearly"?

It is 6% below half. Hardly "nearly".

[w4rma]

12. A similar percentage supported curbing civil rights for Hebrews during the

Nazi build up to power.

[genieroze]

19. That's creepy. eom

[bhikkhu]

44. But that's less than the 48% who think we elected the wrong president

[ET Awful]

14. Remember, these are the same folks who think * has a mandate

Their math skills aren't exactly notable :)

[Zhade]

82. Neither is their penchant for self-restraint, though.

This really IS worrisome.

[carolinalady]

15. Well to put it in perspective--they also report 2% as a mandate!

It's all about the spin. :puke:

[RobinA]

35. It's "Nearly" Enough

to be damn scary.

[Osamasux]

40. Which gets the dominoes tumbling

as the too-lazy-too-really-listen-and-think-for-myself crowd let that immediately get shortened to "half", then soon after to just "most".

[noamnety]

3. disgusting

44% of Americans are blatant bigots.

I hope everyone being victimized by the right has the sense to band together without prejudice: muslims, gays, women, the poor, etc.

[Ian David]

63. Muslims, Jews and Gays

Those are the new scapegoats of Bushler's Jesusland.

It's convenient for the Talibornagain that Muslims and Jews are already fighting with each other.

And then there are the ultra-conservative elements of Jewish and Muslim Godwhacks who have joined the Xian Reichwing to persecute gay people.

You know, I warned the anti-gay muslims that THEY were next after the gays. Do you think that now they maybe believe me?

[wankawanka]

94. what has bush done to the jews

[Skittles]

79. men are victimized by the right too

it's just that most of them do not know it

[adolfo]

5. Garbage for the masses

What else would you expect? Just turn on any news channel and all there is to hear is .. terror, faux news, bush, killed, kill, islam, jihad,al qaeda abu..

Makes me sick. People actually watch this sh@t. It's basically a method of programming the populace. I rarely ever watch TV anymore.

www.recountflorida.com

[saigon68]

57. Its time to "BUST OUT" the old "TATTOO GUN"

[saigon68]

58. Maybe "SEGREGATE" these terrorists in a work camp.

[TomClash]

74. Some of these people don't just watch it . . .

they live and breathe it.

[Democat]

7. Most Bush voters are racist and ignorant? That's shocking!

Who could possibly be surprised by this?

Most TV and many churches promote racism and ignorance? Wow.

[meisje]

9. Which television news, Network or Fox?

Looks like they have a mandate.

[Protagoras]

10. Newsflash! Almost half of Americans

are ignorant and bigoted fools who will gladly give away essential liberties for the illusion of safety.

[NYC]

13. Is that based on the assumption that Muslims are foreigners?

I suspect it is. There are New York born Americans who are Muslim. You would not be able to pick them out of the crowd. Why should they have their liberties restricted?

I have a feeling the 44% are xenophobes.

[wildflower]

26. And not only that,

but many Muslims here are Kurdish refugees, who were originally brought here by the U.S., and are, for the moment, considered U.S. allies.

[Zhade]

83. And not only that, many African-Americans are Muslim, too.

I know, one of my friends is.

How convenient for this fascist government - black AND Muslim in one package for easy oppression!

How will they pick out Whitey McMuslim, though? Oh, wait, he's white, so he gets a pass. Never mind.

[Bragi]

16. The real message is getting through

Bush superficially claims his war on terrorism isn't a war on Mulsims, but beneath the rhetoric, the opposite message comes through. It looks like at least 44 per cent of Americans buys the message.

If you changed the word Muslim in the poll to "liberals", or maybe "atheists", I wonder if the numbers would be all that different?

It's not a pleasant thought, but maybe we've hit the point where 44 per cent of Americans are fascists.

- O

[Placebo]

17. That's a good point.

I'm sure if you did replace the word "Muslim" with either of those words the results would be close to the same. *sigh*

[Stand and Fight]

28. You've got it...

There is no doubt in my mind that the numbers would be just the same Bragi. In today's Amerika the Jewish of Germany are the Muslims, the inferior people are gays, women, minorities... I don't think people quite get it. Beneath all the rhetoric there lies a definite hatred of all things that do not fall in line with the leader's worldview. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the Liberals in this country are viewed by the right as the new Bolsheviks. The Reichstag fire happened in Germany in 1933. The Reichstag fire happened in Amerika in 2001. Funny, by the late 1930s the concentration camps were in full bloody swing. ... Pray tell, when shall we get ours?

In light of this article, it seems many Amerikans would be fine with it happening in about 2006... Who shall go first? The Muslims, the gays, the Blacks?

:scared:

[Bragi]

31. Falluja is a good model for the future

If you look at what the US is now planning for Falluja, they are building a model for the fortified hostile city of the future. It will work just fine at home or abroad.

See http://atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/FL18Ak04.html

I think any well-financed fascist government could probably pull this off without a lot of initial public support, as long as most people just rolled over. Having 44 per cent of the public onside from the outset makes it all that easier.

- B

[the_e]

98. We already do have concentration camps.

You don't have to wonder when we're getting the camps. During WWII, Auschwitz and the other camps were shrouded in secrecy and nobody really knew the extent of the atrocities going on. Sound to you like the stories coming out about Guantanamo?

[tavalon]

91. Well Bushco is, so

it certainly follows that some amount of his flock would follow along like good sheep.

[The Backlash Cometh]

20. And all 44% voted for Bush.

[Spiffarino]

41. You mean the whole 44% that actually voted for Bush...n/t

[The Backlash Cometh]

60. Big smiley

:-)

[TomClash]

75. Sicherheit fur Amerika!

http://la.indymedia.org/news/2003/03/39286.php

[Stand and Fight]

21. Either way you read it...

44% is a huge number of bigoted Americans. This is yet another sign of the sad direction our country is taking. This makes my heart very, very heavy. To quote David Bowie, "This is not America..."

:cry:

[Starlight]

97. Unfortunately this *IS* America and it's been that way

for a very long time. Discovery Times channel ran "500 Nations" last night & I tivo'd it. I watched 2 episodes today but I couldn't watch any more right now. :(

There has never been a time in our country's history that Americans weren't on a murderous rampage against some group of people. :(

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0002S65WC/qid=1103433714/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/102-3650337-3004926?v=glance&s=dvd&n=507846

[0007]

22. America should be ashamed of itself!

This 44 percent has to be the most ignorant people on the face of the earth.

"According to the survey, 37 percent believe a terrorist attack in the United States is still likely within the next 12 months. In a similar poll conducted by Cornell in November 2002, that number stood at 90 percent."

The U.S. is self destructing, that should be a bigger fear than another terrorist attack for Christ sake.

I'm ashamed to be called an American! Where are the so-called Christians?

[NeoGreen]

23. How about...

Restrictions on Radical Buddists,

or Terror Inducing Taoists,

and maybe Blatant Baptists,

or even Crazy Catholics?

Looney Latter Day Saints?

Jerky Jehova Witnesses?

Give me a break...

Atheism Stops Religious Terrorism.

[The Flaming Red Head]

25. Like Muslim Charities, Pro-life Charities do some good,

but funnel money to militant factions that kill and bomb US citizens, what's the difference between a Pro-Life Charity and a Muslim Charity that does some good, but has funds directed to groups that violently oppose our laws and citizens?

[realisticphish]

92. a reader of the dragon knight series

i see from your sig...


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[superconnected]

27. this is what their mentality is AIMING for

They want Americans to think like bigots. Sick, sick, sick. The news media has only helped.

[Stand and Fight]

29. If I were a Muslim...

"It's sad news. It's disturbing news. But it's not unpredictable," said Mahdi Bray, executive director of the Muslim American Society. "The nation is at war, even if it's not a traditional war. We just have to remain vigilant and continue to interface."

If I were a Muslim, I would be getting the hell out of this country at the first whispered rumors of "internment camps." History is a most excellent teacher if you are willing to listen to her.

[IndianaGreen]

32. Muslims should be required to wear a yellow Moon crescent on their clothes

Muslim businesses should be forced to post a yellow Moon crescent on their doors.

We should protect the real Americans from these Muslim rats!

History shall repeat itself!

"Gott Mit Uns" (God is with us)!



On November 14, 1939, the President of Lódz decreed that all Jews must wear arm bands or badges with a Jewish star.

[KingChicken]

33. I've peered into the thoughts of my conservative peers....

And they secretly seem to have disgust for Islam and Muslims, the hate email I see people send to each other is disgusting.

Personally I think "small town", conservative, white Christian America is secretly pursuing their support of this war in large part because of their own hatred of Muslims, and Arabs in general.

It's funny how before this war I too had a poor view of the Muslim world, however I have a new respect for their culture because I've seen so much of it in the last few years. Once you realize and understand the position of other people and cultures you begin to stop seeing what makes you different.

I can't believe how racist this country is after all these years, I really hope we can bring everyone back together after the shit hits the fan.

[kineneb]

39. They are afraid of differences.

The "small towners" also have small minds. They are looking for a simple answer to complex problems. So they beat up on those who are somehow different. Instead of seeing the cause of their problems (in the mirror), they just look for someone else to blame.

I personally have no problems with Islam or any other religion as long as they arn't trying to convert me. I lived in Iran for a year and the Persians are people just like you and me...put on pants one leg at a time.

[MARALE]

117. I am from a small town

They do not have small minds, they are misinformed. I also know a lot of bigoted people from Chicago. Small town people have the church as the center of their social life and that is where the problems stem from. All they see of other countries is what they see on the news and what they read and study out of the bible. They are more afraid and ignorant than anything else. The people I know from Chicago just have hatred for these people, they are just closed minded and not very smart. I went to college and met many people from other countries and got to know and enjoy the differences in our lives. I think many in the small towns would be that way if they had the opportunity to do so.

[bajamary]

34. a terrifying number

Cornell University's poll shows that we have among us a terrifying number of so-called Americans that are on the thin ice of the Third Reich. In fact, they are quite close to the uber-conservatives who put innocent Japanese Americans in camps, while stealing their propriety and businesses. Nice group.

Next step could also restrict the civil liberties of those who strongly object to taking away any America's civil liberties regardless of her religion or heritage.

[lovuian]

36. Its going to get ugly thats for sure!!!

I would be very uncomfortable being a Muslim American right now!!!

[yorkiemommie1]

37. Stones from the River by Ursula Hegi

excellent book to read. I can see it happening here.

Hmmm...think they're thinking of reactivating Manzanar? Would not put it past them.... intern the Muslims 'for their protection'.

[PurityOfEssence]

38. Ugly ugly ugly

Once you take a guess as fact, the big question is often: who do you hate more, those who don't believe or those who believe in some other guess?

Islam's somewhat worse than Christianity, but that's pretty much being damned by faint praise. Presumption of an understanding of the universe is folly by definition, and those who claim to know tend to be the first to shriek at others who disagree.

Letting guesses and superstition into the public forum on an equal footing with REALITY does not bode well for anyone, even those of the dominant assumption.

[mulethree]

42. U.S. Kneels to terrorist threats

They hate us for our freedoms! So we quickly get rid of our freedoms?

I prefer - They hate us for our imperialism and hypocrisy! so lets get rid of the imperialism and hypocrisy.

[bhikkhu]

43. Isn't that about the same percentage as favored slavery

at one time, and about the same as favored continuing to deny women the right to vote at another time?

[FDRrocks]

49. I seriously wonder what the number would be if you threw

Homosexuals and Communists into the mix.

[daleo]

50. Like Japanese-Americans during WWII

You think it can't happen again...

For the record, Japanese-Canadians were also put into internment camps.

[indepat]

77. Yeah, but only down to 1/16th including children: those less than 1/16th

Japanese ancestry were not mandatorily interred in those concentration-type camps, and only some 70,000 of the 120,000 or so interred were U.S. citizens, as I recollect.

[DavidFL]

51. Why is the religion correlation so surprising?

The survey conducted by Cornell University also found that Republicans and people who described themselves as highly religious were more apt to support curtailing Muslims' civil liberties than Democrats or people who are less religious.

<snip>

While researchers said they were not surprised by the overall level of support for curtailing civil liberties, they were startled by the correlation with religion and exposure to television news.

All these researchers have to do is watch any of the programs on "Christian" television stations -- there are a ton here in Central Florida -- and how they discuss the war on Iraq. These "Christians" don't care if Hussein never posed a threat, that WMDs have never been found, or any of the other shifting excuses this administration has offered for the U.S.'s invasion. They see the war, all the other events that have occurred since crackhead stole office, in a Biblical context; specifically, the Book of Revelations and their conviction we're living in the "end times." As has been repeatedly stated at this site that it's almost become a cliche, to them, there's a tacit understanding that George is fulfilling God's "will" and the war is hastening the second coming of Christ and the rapture. Although, if there ever is a rapture, I think a lot of them will be disappointed when they find out they've been left behind, if not sent the other way, where I'm sure some of them come from.

If anyone should have their activities restricted, it should be these "Christians" because they're in serious need of deprogramming from this cult mentality they have. And the scarier part is that even after crackhead leaves office, they will still be with us trying to stir up more trouble.

[Guaranteed]

52. This is just too much.

It's not that I can't believe that people think this, in the U.S., now (I lost faith long ago), but that the remaining 56% fail to see what this is.

[proudbluestater]

53. That would be the RED half, I presume

they would like to restrict anything that is not a middle-aged white male, last I checked.



From the article:

"Researchers also found that respondents who paid more attention to television news were more likely to fear terrorist attacks and support limiting the rights of Muslim Americans."

BINGO! THE PROPAGANDA IS SUCCESSFUL. WHEN WILL THE FCC BAN NEWS BECAUSE IT IS OBSCENELY ONE-SIDED AND FULL OF LIES?

[BiggJawn]

70. "When will the FCC ban news"???

Just who do you think is behind this bullshit?

[neweurope]

54. This is very grave. And I repeat: Get out while you can.

"The survey found 44 percent favored at least some restrictions on the civil liberties of Muslim Americans."

They are talking of taking away civil liberties now openly.

AND THEY'LL TAKE THEM AWAY.

And don't be fooled: They will start with the Muslims. It will be established then that it's normal to take away civil rights. Then who's next?

The Germans didn't only intern and kill Jews. They also killed

homosexuals

Gypsies

socialists

communists

churchmen

liberals

the physically and mentally handicapped

and generally everybody they thought was a grain of sand in the engine.

It's coming! See the writing on the wall!

"When they came to get the Jews, I didn't protest because I was no Jew.

When they came to get the communists I didn't protest because I was no communist.
...
When they came to get me there was nobody left to protest."

[LynnTheDem]

55. "Warsaw Ghetto" for Americans who happen to be Muslims

And if that's not enough to keep the religious and the republicans happy, they can line up all the Americans who happen to be Muslim, and mass-grave them.

They can tell themselves this is NOTHING like Hitler.

And we had to invade and occupy Iraq, killing tens of thousands, because SADDAM HUSSEIN OPPRESSED HIS OWN PEOPLE. 44% of Americans are willing to do the same.

[gottaB]

59. link to full report

http://www.news.cornell.edu/releases/Dec04/Muslim.Poll.bpf.html

Excerpt.

Table 7 Public Support for Restrictions on Muslim Americans

                                                       
Statement                                              % 
                                                     Agree

All Muslim Americans should be required to             27
register their whereabouts with the federal 
government.
 
Mosques should be closely monitored and                26 
surveilled by U.S. law enforcement agencies. 

U.S. government agencies should profile citizens as    22
potential threats based on being Muslim or having 
Middle Eastern heritage. 

Muslim civic and volunteer organizations should be     29
infiltrated by undercover law enforcement agents to 
keep watch on their activities and fundraising. 

Agreed with none of the statements                     48 
Agreed with one statement                              15 
Agreed with two or more statements                     29

Approximately one quarter of respondents agreed with each statement, with the infiltration of Muslim civic and volunteer organizations garnering the most support (29%). Overall, nearly half of all respondents (44%) supported one of the possible restrictions on Muslim American civil liberties, with twenty-nine percent of all respondents supporting two or more type of restrictions.

Support for restrictions on Muslim Americans also varies by party affiliation, degree of fear of a terrorist attack, and personal religiosity. In addition, support for restrictions also varies by level of attention to TV news.

[pinniped]

61. Wow, time for Executive Order 9066.1.

Who are these pukes?

[Ian David]

66. Jesusland is Stoopid

The survey also examined the relation of religiosity to perceptions of Islam and Islamic countries among Christian respondents.

Sixty-five percent of self-described highly religious people queried said they view Islam as encouraging violence more than other religions do; in comparison, 42 percent of the respondents who said they were not highly religious saw Islam as encouraging violence.

In addition, highly religious respondents also were more likely to describe Islamic countries as violent (64 percent), fanatical (61 percent) and dangerous (64 percent).

Fewer of the respondents who said they were not highly religious described Islamic countries as violent (49 percent), fanatical (46 percent) and dangerous (44 percent).

But 80 percent of all respondents said they see Islamic countries as being oppressive toward women.

---
20% said Islamic countries are NOT oppressive toward women?
Either they have not been paying attention, or else they are Southern Baptists who agree with how Islamic countries treat women.

But you know, the Muslims should still consider themselves lucky. Only 44% of Americans hate Muslims. 70% hate gay people.

And the Jews are next.

[TexasLady]

64. As much hatred as I see and hear

around here in the south towards Muslims, liberals, and anyone not towing the line, it IS getting scary! We have gotten 'jokes' in emails from people who think like this, and think nothing of putting down Muslims, wherever they are from.

And I certainly do see the correlation of Jews to Muslims. I also worry for family and friends that are Jehovah's Witnesses, because so many were in camps wearing the purple triangle in the 40s, along with soo many others that disagreed with the Nazis. They refused Army service, and remain neutral even today to any country or political stance.

I worry for all of us, because there isnt going to be mercy for sympathizers either. This isnt going to go away any time soon, and I think it will definitely come to a head.

[underpants]

65. Anyone whose faith contains the teaching ofthe prophet Jesus is dangerous

and need to be watched.

[Ian David]

68. I would even defend the Jehovah's Witnesses

But I'd knock on their door every Saturday morning and remind them.

[Ian David]

71. Islamic, Christian, and Jewish Fundamentalists- vs Gays and Each Other

Queer allies
By Evan Gahr
The little-noticed alliance between gay marriage opponents and alleged terrorist sympathizers
http://www.jewishworldreview.com

The Massachusetts Supreme Court decision to legalize homosexual marriage in the Bay state re-ignited the culture wars. The Religious Action Center of Reform Judaism, perhaps the preeminent liberal Jewish organization in Washington, DC, applauded the ruling. Religious-minded conservatives, however, were horrified. They are determined to stop the gay rights movement in its tracks. At what price?

JewishWorldReview.com has discovered that prominent religious conservatives — Jews, Catholics and Evangelical Christians — are allied with a radical Islamic group to stop gay marriage. Pushing a constitutional amendment that would restrict marriage to heterosexuals, they work with the Islamic Society of North America. What is ISNA? According to terrorism expert Steve Emerson, ISNA:

* has held fundraisers for terrorists (e.g., after Hamas leader Musa Marzuk was arrested, it raised money for his defense, claiming he was innocent and not connected to terrorism)

* has condemned US seizure of Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad assets in the United States after 9/11

* has consistently sponsored speakers at their conferences that defend Islamic terrorists. Recently, a leader denied in an interview with an NBC affiliate that ISNA took any Saudi money but that was a brazen lie as evidenced by a recording of an ISNA conference in which it was revealed that money came from Saudi Arabia.

"ISNA," says Emerson, "is a radical group hiding under a false veneer of moderation."

The rest:
http://www.jewishworldreview.com/1203/marriage_terrorists.php3

----

"Alliance for Marriage claims to represent several of the largest black denominations and millions of Latinos, Orientals, Jews and Muslims. Its board of advisers includes Bishop George McKinney of the huge Church of God in Christ, a black denomination; Patricia DeVeaux of the African Methodist Episcopal Church; and Vernon Shannon of the African Methodist Episcopal Zion Church.

"Other members include Sayyid Sayeed, secretary-general of Islamic Society of North America; the Rev. Richard John Neuhaus, president of Institute on Religion and Public Life; Diane Knippers, president of Institute on Religion and Democracy; Episcopal Bishops Peter Beckwith of Illinois and Stephen Jecko of Florida; Catholic Bishop William Murphy of Rockville Centre; Steve Chin of Boston Chinese Evangelical Church; Grand Rabbi Y.A. Korff, and Rabbi Daniel Lapin."

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/5/14/150134.shtml

----------

Vatican Warns Catholics Against Marrying Muslims
Fri May 14, 2004 12:43 PM ET

By Shasta Darlington
VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - The Vatican warned Catholic women on Friday to think hard before marrying a Muslim and urged Muslims to show more respect for human rights, gender equality and democracy.

Calling women "the least protected member of the Muslim family," it spoke of the "bitter experience" western Catholics had with Muslim husbands, especially if they married outside the Islamic world and later moved to his country of origin.

<snip>

When a Catholic woman and Muslim man wanted to marry, it said, "bitter
experience teaches us that a particularly careful and in-depth preparation is
called for."
http://www.reuters.com/printerFriendlyPopup.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=5150255
----

James Dobson and pals warn that gay marriage will turn America Muslim

During the FamilyNet "Battle for Marriage" national telecast on July 11, viewers were told, "if the battle for marriage is lost, your grandchildren will grow up hearing the call to prayer from minarets."

FamilyNet to broadcast ‘Battle for Marriage’ rally, TBN may also
Jul 6, 2004
By Staff

NASHVILLE, Tenn. (BP)--FamilyNet television and three radio networks will carry the “Battle for Marriage” rally live July 11. A second television network, Trinity Broadcasting Network (TBN), will carry the broadcast live if some last-minute technical issues can be ironed out.
<snip>
The rallies are the result of a partnership between the ERLC and FRC, in association with Focus on the Family and the National Association of Evangelicals. A similar simulcast was held May 23
Information on the broadcast is available online at www.ivotevalues.com and www.wevotevalues.com. The websites also have questions and answers about same-sex "marriage," promotion flyers and resources that can be used for pastors in sermon preparation.
--30--
For more information about the national debate over same-sex “marriage,” visit www.bpnews.net/samesexmarriage.

http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?ID=18634

------
Yes, they want to "protect" society from gay people, but they want to do so because they feel that if they do not, we will fall prey to the even greater and more evil threat of Islam.

Isn't it telling that they see the evil of homosexuality as the harbringer of the ultimate "collapse" of the world into Islam?
-------

Muslim charity Holy Land Foundation indicted
http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/ny-bc-ny--holylandfoundatio0727jul27,0,2653952.story?coll=ny-ap-regional-wire

By CURT ANDERSON
Associated Press Writer
July 27, 2004, 4:51 PM EDT

WASHINGTON -- A major American Muslim charity and seven of its officers were charged Tuesday with providing millions of dollars in support to Hamas, a Palestinian terrorist organization blamed for dozens of suicide bomber attacks in Israel.




The 42-count indictment, returned by a federal grand jury in Dallas, alleges that the Holy Land Foundation for Relief and Development provided more than $12.4 million to individuals and organizations linked to Hamas from 1995 to 2001. The U.S. government froze the charity's assets in December 2001.
www.newsday.com%2Fnews%2Flocal%2Fwire%2Fny-bc-ny--holylandfoundatio0727jul27%2C0%2C2653952.story%3Fcoll%3Dny-ap-regional-wire
-----

WND Goes Inside 'Mainstream' Muslim Conference


Extremist leaders who support terror stir up crowd at Florida event

Today WND features the first of a three-part report by Sherrie Gossett, who went inside a recent "mainstream" Muslim conference in Florida to discover the true attitudes and ideas of the leaders of the Islamic movement in the U.S. Gossett attended portions of the conference after all other media representatives had packed up and left the event.

In Part 1, Gossett analyzes the words and backgrounds of some of the keynote speakers at the conference imams and sheikhs who openly voice their disdain for America, Jews and "unbelievers" in general, and who defend the practice of suicide bombing. In Part 2 we will further explore who the heroes are in the world of U.S. Muslim activists and what kind of activities they fund.
<snip>
Now, even as a handful of Islamic groups holding themselves out as the true "mainstream" have come to dominate the media landscape, critics contend the groups are little more than white-washed extremists, equipped with PR savvy, an intolerant political agenda and a knack for marginalizing the "real" moderates.

http://www.ifapray.org/NFOW/NFOW2004/Jan%20-%20June%202004/WND%20Goes%20Inside%20'Mainstream'%20Muslim%20Conference%20-%20January%205,%202004.html

-----

The Washington Times
www.washingtontimes.com
Islamic society's ties fuel concerns
By Robert Stacy McCain
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
Published January 8, 2004


Some Jews and conservative Christians are questioning a pro-family group's
association with an Islamic organization.
Rabbi Marc Gellman, a syndicated columnist who makes frequent TV appearances
as half of "The God Squad," resigned last month from the advisory board to the
Alliance for Marriage (AFM) because it includes a representative of the Islamic
Society of North America (ISNA).
Steve Emerson, author of a book about terrorism, accused ISNA of links to
extremist groups, a charge the Islamic group's leaders strongly deny.
In a statement published by the Jewish weekly the Forward, Mr. Gellman said:
"My moral conscience cannot allow me to be associated with an organization,
ISNA, that terrorist experts like Steve Emerson, whom I respect greatly,
consider a front for Hamas and other hateful terrorist groups."
Sayyid M. Syeed, secretary-general of ISNA and the AFM board member, said
"it's very unfortunate that some people might have been misled" about the
Islamic group.
"We are celebrating our 40th anniversary and we have a record of
credibility, trustworthiness, balance and moderation," Mr. Syeed said.
Matt Daniels, director of AFM, said that the organization's attorneys had
advised him against commenting to the press. But he released a copy of a letter
from attorney Chuck Allen, citing "many nationally respected experts and
scholars on Islam" -- including University of Maryland professor Charles
Butterworth and Georgetown University professor John Voll -- who deny that ISNA
has terrorism ties.

-----
12 July 2004
Religion / Islam / Dr al-Qaradawi

Livingstone sidelines liberal Muslims, women and gays
Mayor plans to embrace homophobic cleric again in October
By OutRage! News Service

“Ken Livingstone has sided with male Muslim misogynists and homophobes against
women and gay Londoners,” said human rights campaigner, Peter Tatchell of
OutRage! who was one of a group of protestors outside London’s City Hall this
morning, 12 July 2004.
He was commenting on the Mayor of London’s decision to host controversial Muslim
scholar, Dr Al-Qaradawi, and to invite him to a further conference at City Hall
in October.
“By kow-towing to Islamic fundamentalists like Dr Al-Qaradawi, the Mayor has
betrayed liberal Muslims who are already isolated and terrorised within
sections of British Muslim society,” said Mr Tatchell.
“Young Muslim girls in some parts of London are pressured by their families and
religious leaders into wearing the hijab. Gay and lesbian Muslims have been
threatened with violence by Islamic activists. Progressive Muslims who speak
out in support of gay and women’s rights are intimidated and cowed into
silence.“
http://www.outrage.org.uk/pressrelease.asp?ID=202

-----
Gay Marriage And Terrorist

heard the liberals complaining that Republicans brought the Marriage
Amendment up for a vote to divide the electorate. Excuse me? I thought we were
already polarized with the Red State-Blue State maps. Perhaps forcing the
Democratic Duo to actually take a side with an absolute yeah or nay vote going
to give clarification to that fraction of undecided “liberal but not willing to
admit it” voters that Kerry is a thin margin away from Government Mandated Free
Love. Hence the vote would lead a percentage point or two of undecided folk
into finally deciding once and for all on Bush.

What does this have to do with terrorism? Quite a bit. These Muhajadeen – mad
Muslim Men – hate us. Their real reason is that we refuse to roll over and cry
Mullah. Their stated reasons are our evil vice and our support for Israel. How
does the failure of the Federal Marriage Amendment play into their hands? Not
only do we allow our women to go unveiled. Not only do we allow our daughters
to have sex outside of marriage. Not only do we allow abortion. Not only do we
allow women equal rights. We dare to allow homosexuality to exist.

http://www.bushcountry.org/news/columnists/tamara-wilhite/c_071504_wilhite_gay_marriage_terrorist.htmI’ve
------

On The Difficulties With Islam
http://www.thewandererpress.com/b2-7-02.htm

By ARTHUR E. HIPPLER, Ph.D.



One of the most difficult things to understand for people, who are not religious
or are indifferently so, is how those who are seriously religious think.
Americans who, mostly, are either irreligious, only vaguely religious, or
indifferent, usually can’t begin to understand serious Catholics or Protestants
or Jews. That is simply a fact. Islam, which is even more foreign to American
tastes, is nearly incomprehensible to almost anyone who has not studied it.
That is not to say many people don’t think they know something about Islam.
They are, however, mostly wrong in their imaginings. Islam is as malignant now
as it was 500 years ago. The difference is that then Christians understood it
better.
http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thewandererpress.com%2Fb2-7-02.htm
-----

Hijacking Tolerance: Radical Islam’s War with Christianity
http://www.cbn.com/CBNNews/News/030512a.asp
By Dale Hurd
CBN News Sr. Reporter

Although Saudi Arabia is the geographical heart of Islam, less than one fifth of
the world's Muslims are Arabs.


CBN.com – All over the Muslim world, conversion to Christianity can mean more
than prison. It can be a death sentence.

In countries where Islam reigns, Christians struggle just to stay alive. But
Muslims in the United States and other western countries are protected and free
to proselytize. And Islam is thriving here in America, aggressively taking
advantage of western religious tolerance.

Post-Saddam Iraq recently provided a vivid example of the worldwide double
standard that Islam enjoys. It seems some people would rather let Iraqis suffer
than see Christianity offering hope in the midst of a Muslim population. Iraq is
in desperate need of necessities like water, food, and medical attention, and
Christian charities have offered to help with lifesaving aid. But instead of
being applauded, the effort has been attacked as a cover for Christian
evangelization.
http://www.cbn.com/CBNNews/News/030512a.asp

---------
INVESTIGATIVE REPORT
Official heading AIPAC probe linked to anti-Semitism case

By Edwin Black
WASHINGTON, Sept. 20 (JTA) — David Szady, the senior FBI counterintelligence
official currently heading the controversial investigation of the American
Israel Public Affairs Committee, is well-known to senior Jewish communal
officials, who assert he has targeted Jews in the past.

Now, an investigation reveals that Szady was involved in a well-publicized case
involving a Jewish former CIA staff attorney who sued the FBI, the CIA and its
top officials for religious discrimination.

Although not named in the suit, Szady headed the elite department that former
CIA Director George Tenet admitted in 1999 was involved with “insensitive,
unprofessional and highly inappropriate” language regarding the case of the
attorney, Adam Ciralsky.

http://www.jta.org/page_view_story.asp?strwebhead=A+pattern+of+cases+against+Jews%3F&intcategoryid=3&SearchOptimize=Jewish+News

[IndianaGreen]

73. Religious extremists of all religions are a threat to us all

Religious extremists are found in every religion. Hindu extremists have burned down mosques and murdered Muslims in India. We are bombarded by the MSM about stories on Islamic extremists on a daily basis, such as today's LBN story about the upcoming stoning of a 17-year old girl in Iran. Jewish extremists murdered Israeli Prime Minister Rabin, with rabbinical sanctioning no less! Christian extremists are trying to turn the US into a Jesusland version of Afghanistan under the Taliban.

Religious extremists of all religions are a threat to us all!

[PsychoDad]

69. Thank you Underpants

The teachings of the prophet Jesus can be a dire danger to the current Mammon worshiping anti-christian teachings of the fundimentalists like Robertson and Falwell.

In greek yhe word "anti" can mean a replacement or subsitute, as well as the normally accepted meaning of against.

The real followers know who they are, and what Jesus taught, that being Social responsibility, Kindness, Forgiveness, Tolerance, and the importance of community to help others in need.

I'm pretty sure the powers that be will also seek to curb the influence of any Christians who do dare to practice the socialist teachings of the Prophet Jesus.

[RetroLounge]

67. and 49% (and probably more) said restrict bush*

to one term.

RL

[Carni]

72. Most Americans wouldn't know a Muslim if they bit them in the ass

This is just ridiculously ignorant- sickening in fact.

[daleo]

89. And a real Christian would turn the other cheek. n/t

[mdhunter]

76. I object to the terms "religious" and "television news" in this article.

It's a sad day when those terms need qulifiers, because they're not longer employed as blanket terms. Religious people don't hate Muslims - though fundamentalist Christians might, and Fox isn't news, but surely those were the extremes to which the poll was tending.

[indepat]

78. What do the 44% favor for the enemy within?

[SOS]

80. Timothy McVeigh's religious beliefs

don't seem to interest anyone. Wonder why that is?

[ExclamationPoint]

81. Only 6 % of Republicans are against curtailing Muslims civil libs!

(liberties)
This is going to make uniting impossible. If they think that is even a half sensible idea they not only are insane, but pure evil and deserve to be arrested.
Oh and if one of those people who was for restricting muslims civil liberties was a democrat I will personally write a letter to congress telling them to kick them straight out of the party.

[tx_dem41]

84. Please cite a source that says...

only 6% of Republicans are against curtailing Muslim's civil liberties?

I just read the report and cannot find that data.

[mike_c]

85. yellow crescent armbands coming to Jesusland....

All hail christian purity and the fatherland! :puke:

[Tight_rope]

86. Bullshit...This is promoting racism...We have the makings of a Hilter!

If the 59 million who voted for Bush* don't wake up soon we may find ours selves in a civil war.

[lumpy]

87. The WH destroyers

and their supporters have little or no regard for the Constitution of the United States.

[Zhade]

88. Remember: Silence = Consent.

Apathy = enabling the horror.

When that innocent Muslim family comes to your door, WHAT WILL YOU DO?

[aikido15]

103. Protest...make your voice heard

Fifth C-Span broadcast of
A.N.S.W.E.R. January 20 Press Conference

Sunday, December 19
1:27 pm pm ET on C-Span 1

Click here to check the C-Span schedule for additional times and changes.

The press conference sponsored by the A.N.S.W.E.R. Coalition regarding the January 20 Counter-Inaugural Protest in Washington DC will be broadcast on C-Span 1 for a fifth time on Sunday, December 19 at 1:27 pm ET. Please note that all times are subject to change - so please check the C-Span website schedule. The program is called "Inaugural Parade Protests - Act Now to Stop War & End Racism (A.N.S.W.E.R.)". It can also be viewed on the C-Span website and heard on the radio.


www.answercoalition.org Join us...Silence IS consent, we need to make our voices heard...watch the C-SPAN broadcast today and go to website.

[tavalon]

90. Hey I've got an idea (sarcasm on)

let's put them in camps, not concentration camps per se, but let's call them internment camps. We've never tried that route before, right? :shrug: (sarcasm off)

[WillieWoohah]

96. Actually, you can possibly count me in that 44%

I disagree strongly with 3 of the 4 suggestions, particulary racial profiling and forcing Muslim Americans to register their location with the government, but I would lean towards agreeing with this one:

Muslim civic and volunteer organizations should be infiltrated by undercover law enforcement agents to keep watch on their activities and fundraising.

From the wording it's a little ambiguous whether it means "all" Muslim organisations or just "some", and whether simply being Muslim in character should be enough to warrant inflitration, or if not, exactly what the criteria should be, so it's a little unclear exactly what you would be agreeing to.

However, it's an unfortunate fact that some Muslim civic organisations DO provide a front for terrorist fundraising (often without the knowledge of those giving money, who believe they are donating to legimate causes). Infiltrating these organisations to track and then stem the flow of money to terrorist groups, working in a multilateral fashion in conjunction with overseas law enforcement agencies in sypathetic countries, seems to me like an ideal SANE way of fighting terrorism.

(As opposed to the completely INSANE method of invading other people's countries on a false pretext, creating a recruitment bonanza for Al Quaeda and deepening resentment against America and the West in general, for example)

Does anyone here seriously believe that these organisations SHOULDN'T be infiltrated by FBI agents?

P.S. I should add that I am equally in favour of government monitoring/infiltration of Irish American groups that provide funding for the IRA.

Just my thoughts, flame away.

[neweurope]

99. I don't quite understand...

Maybe it's ok wanting to infiltrate ANY extremist group (let's keep in mind however that this government's view of "extremist" must not necessarily be ours)
BUT
you you said "count me in those 44 percent". So ARE you for restricting civil rights for muslims or aren't you?

AS TO THAT "terrorist" thing: Your government says a Palestina leader is terrorist. A US-based group says he isn't and collects money to help this guy in court. Promptly this group is now declared to be "terrorist" also. And "terroris" now is probably everyone who speaks out for this group, too. Where will this lead to? And haven't the Bushistas proven that their view of the truth isn't ours?

[Learning2Fly]

101. Don't be so naive

"Muslim civic and volunteer organizations should be infiltrated by undercover law enforcement agents to keep watch on their activities and fundraising."

What makes anyone think this isn't already happening?

[pdxmom]

112. Of course it's already happening here

Look at Brandon Mayfield here in Portland. The affidavit used to justify his arrest listed his attendance at his local Mosque as one of the reasons to support his arrest.

That such a large percentage of people would suggest liimitations on anyone's civil rights, especially because of their religious affiliation, scares the hell out of me. Just because it's less than 1/2 doesn't give me much of a reason for hope. Those are only the ones that are willing to be up front about it.

[WillieWoohah]

102. Check the survey details

Maybe it's ok wanting to infiltrate ANY extremist group (let's keep in mind however that this government's view of "extremist" must not necessarily be ours)
BUT
you you said "count me in those 44 percent". So ARE you for restricting civil rights for muslims or aren't you?

The participants in the survey were not asked directly if they favoured restricting the civil rights of Muslims. They were asked which if any of the following 4 statements they agreed with:

1. All Muslim Americans should be required to register their whereabouts with the federal government.

2. Mosques should be closely monitored and surveilled by U.S. law enforcement agencies.

3. U.S. government agencies should profile citizens as potential threats based on being Muslim or having Middle Eastern heritage.

4. Muslim civic and volunteer organizations should be infiltrated by undercover law enforcement agents to keep watch on their activities and fundraising.

44% of those surveyed agreed with one or more of those statements.

I would have answered yes to number 4, since I agree with government investigation/infiltration of any organisation that is suspected of supplying funds to terrorist groups, Muslim or not (e.g. Irish-American IRA sympathisers).

So to answer your question, I am against restricting civil rights for Muslims, but from examining the survey questions I would would have been included in the 44%. My personal reaction to this survey is that while elements of it are disturbing, the publishers are being a little misleading in the way they present the results.

AS TO THAT "terrorist" thing: Your government says a Palestinan leader is terrorist. A US-based group says he isn't and collects money to help this guy in court.

Well, tough titty for them. I guess Mr Terrorist goes to jail. There will always be people who disagree with labelling any given organisation as a terrorist group. At a certain point you just have to make a judgement call. The only way to avoid this is to throw your arms in the air and decide not to go after any of these groups, and what will be the result of that?

And haven't the Bushistas proven that their view of the truth isn't ours?

I don't trust the Bush administration to implement such a policy in good faith, but I'm still for it in principle. After all, fighting terrorism by breaking up terrorist financial networks was part of Kerry's anti-terrorism strategy, and it's infinitely better than going and bombing/invading a sovereign country in the Middle East.

[tx_dem41]

104. I agree with the spirit of what you are saying.

And thanks for adding the reference to the IRA, because I was thinking of that as I began reading your post. I think you have to acknowledge though that we Libs are vary wary of this administration's handling of an issue that thrives on the edge of a slippery slope. Trust of our Government is required to accept question 4, and thus, a lot of us are very squeamish when considering it.

[CTLawGuy]

118. actually you DON'T agree with the fourth statement

the Fourth statement says:

" Muslim civic and volunteer organizations should be infiltrated by undercover law enforcement agents to keep watch on their activities and fundraising."


and you say "I would have answered yes to number 4, since I agree with government investigation/infiltration of any organisation that is suspected of supplying funds to terrorist groups, Muslim or not (e.g. Irish-American IRA sympathisers)."

that is not what the question asked. It asked whether Muslim groups should be infiltrated, regardless of whether it is suspected of terrorism or not. It did not specify that the group has to be suspected of terrorism.

Unless you agree with either of these statements...

"muslim groups NOT suspected of terrorism should be infiltrated and monitored by the government"

"all muslim groups are involved in terrorism."
... you don't agree with statement 4.

[Name removed]

105. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Placebo]

107. Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[Hand]

108. Yes, as your other posts attest...

Say goodbye, asshole.

[Name removed]

109. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

111. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[IHeart1993]

106. Faux 's "report" om this, courtesy, Newshounds

http://www.newshounds.us/2004/12/18/restricting_muslim_rights.php

I wonder if more Muslims will flee to Canada- a tolerable country.

[ckramer]

110. "it's internment time" the rednecks shouted

[caligirl]

113. 48 % said they shouldn't, thats the half the headline should say

[Placebo]

114. HEY EVERYBODY, Paula Zahn will be talking about this poll tonight...

@ 8pm EST on CNN

[shawn703]

115. I bet these people would like to modify the Pledge of Allegiance

It's funny how the same people who kick and scream when people think about removing "under God" from the pledge seem to forget that it ends with "liberty and justice for all." Think they'd support adding "(except Muslims)" to the end of the Pledge?

[sui generis]

116. maybe we can use this to our advantage

restrict ALL forms of extremism. Neocons everywhere BEWARE! You're next.