Freedom Tower gets the bird

[emad]

Telegraph
By Tom Leonard, in New York
(Filed: 30/12/2004)

The developers of the building that will replace the World Trade Centre have hired a specialist consultant following complaints that it will be a "death trap" for birds.

The 1,776ft Freedom Tower in New York is expected to be the world's tallest building but it will stand directly in the flight path of migrating birds.

Ornithologists estimate that more than a million birds are killed every year in America by hitting windows or flying around lights on top of skyscrapers until they are so dazed that they crash.

The Twin Towers were regarded as particularly lethal because of their height and location close to the Hudson River, which migrating birds follow.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/12/30/wbird30.xml&sSheet=/portal/2004/12/30/ixportal.html

[jdj]

1. that figures

a great big bird-killing dick to replace the twin penises.

Why not a park, or a botanical gardens or something that signifies peace.

[quispquake]

2. I completely agree...

Who in the HELL would want to work in this building when it's finished anyways???

[Algorem]

4. Buh-buh-but they can't lease out 100-whatever floors if it's a nice green

park,you communisticals!

[jdj]

5. LOL

maybe they should call it bullseye tower.

[InvisibleBallots]

9. me

I would love to work there

[sweetheart]

12. Would you really?

I used to work in world trade, and i did not like it. Why? It was
a waste of time in elevators. It was a massive crowed pushing in and
out constantly, for even manhattan, a massive crowd... the area around
there is overrated, and only fun to live around if you make more than
150K per year. Otherwise, you'll be commuting on the subway from
brooklyn, canal street, alphabet soup or the upper west side.

It was nice for a while, but compared to office parks in silicon
valley, or off 128 in mass, there is no comparison. Too much commute
time, and when you get to your job, you'll be paying city, state and
federal income tax, with the new GOP plans to abolish the state/city
deduction... the net tax bill is around 50-55%.

Sure, you can rent an apartment in battery park city, and button hole
yourself up in downtown for a few years.... but it gets boring... and
the worst is in the super hot weekends of summer heat waves when the
whole of manhattan stinks like a garbage tip. Then, only the rich who
can fly out to the hamptons have the good life... whilst the others are
stuck on the internet wishing for some trees and fresh air.

[phylny]

15. I, too, worked in the WTC

many years ago


The only good things about it were 1) the stuffed monkey someone strapped onto the automatic window cleaners, and 2) that the water in the bathroom toilet bowls would move as the towers swayed (it was just weird, in a funny sort of way.)

[InvisibleBallots]

18. same here

I lived in midtown, a reasonably priced apartment, and my commute was about 30 minutes tops. I would rather live and work in Manhattan than some office park in Silicon Valley *any day* - you have to have a car just to go buy milk over there. I'm one of those "I'd rather die in New York than live anywhere else" types myself :) I never hung out with the rich yuppies in BPC.

You are right about the taxes though, damn!

Oh, and normal Americans who live in NYC don't go to the Hampdens during the summer - we go to the Jersey Shore! :)

[Massacure]

39. Gotta love air pollution! Thats one more reason Bush sucks.

[sherilocks]

41. Bored, in Manhattan?

Even when PATH wasn't running after 9/11, the ferry ride was from Jersey was less than 30 minutes to the financial district. The bicycle paths were safer than they are here in my little Florida city and you could bicycle, walk, train, bus, ferry to anywhere. No car needed. If I could afford it, I'd live there anytime. Parks, museums, theatre, shopping, doesn't sound too much like the bad life.

I'd rather be stuffed into a subway, than stuck on some smelly interstate, breathing fumes, for hours on end if we're talking about commutes. I've done both.

What I wouldn't want to do is work in something called the Freedom Tower. What a horrible name.

[sweetheart]

42. A decade tops

I lasted just over a decade in NY. Part of it doing the long commute
on the metro north to downtown from connecticut... 2.5 hours door to
door each way. 7am drive to train station, pay 5 bucks parking take
train 1+ hours to grand central... change to the 4/5 subway to fulton
street and walk to world trade by 9:30.

All because i wanted to see trees as i went for a monrning run and
hear birds. Then i finally got sick of doing the burbs and moved
downtown and had 4 24 hour sushi places within 2 blocks of my apartment... nice. But even that gets old. New York can be a very
isolated place for a professional, strangely in the middle of all those
18 millions of people, alone as if i were in remote alaska.

I finally left when the police started to become obnoxious for having
my dog off leash in battery park... a dog's gotta have some time outside
not on a tether and i owed it to my best fried to get her somewhere
where she can roam free.

So after manhattan, it is really joyful to be living in quiet wilderness
nature where there is no light pollution outside, sounds of ocean and
wind... where the computer is the noisiest thing around for a kilometer.

I think new york is a place for 20's and 30's years olds.. maybe into
ones 40's... and finally, 24 hour sushi gets boring.

In a remote place, i've become a better cook and eat better than i
ever did in manhattan. Not having collars on dogs that they can be
free to bark and not be threatened by cops, is profoundly joyful. I
can always go to see the same movies, and the interet is equally far
away. I even have a garden, something that manhattan potted plants
can't possibly replace.

So much depends on what is interesting, but when you've eaten at all
the restaurants, shagged all the sexy people, and done the club
scene in soho.... if it doesn't get old as you get old, IMO, someone's
not growing up. Even madonna now has her country english estate, for
some country peace.

Its amazing how un-boring living in a wild place can be. :-)

namaste,
-s

[bpcmxr]

45. Well, to each their own.

I've lived in Battery Park City for almost 15 years, and I love it.

[leftynyc]

44. I agree - the worst thing about it is the name

Frankly, I'm tired of the hole in our skyline- my compass is gone and I can't wait till they start building. And yes, I would work there.

[TankLV]

20. Me too - in a heartbeat.

[bunkerbuster1]

22. Me three.

I will work my way out of this red-state hell one day.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

28. not me

i agree with the park idea. call it freedom park and put a statue of chimp in a flight suit, with a fountain shooting out of his codpiece onto a bronze sculpture of the constitution.

[Algorem]

38. imagine all the jumpy workers,it would be hilarious!"Ahrg!What was that!",

"UhOh!What was that?!"They could make a sitcom out of it,Jumpy Tower.I'd like to have the Freedom Tower Pepto-Bismol concession.

[InvisibleBallots]

43. ha!

Bring it on. I'd rather die in New York than live anywhere else.

[NYC]

50. What a wonderful memorial that would be.

I hope they choose you as the designer. I would love to see that.

As for the building, I just think it should be shorter. Why kill migrating birds? We don't gain from that.

P.S. Elevator rides in extremely tall buildings take too long.

[Laughing Mirror]

3. Or a cemetery

But they don't want anything that signifies peace. No way to cash in on it.

[Algorem]

6. peace-creepism has no place in our American national security empire

[prodigal_green]

8. Hmmm.

Wish there were some way to become a Peace Profiteer. We'd live in a conflict-free country for centuries to come.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

7. Is this overblown?

As an architect I rarely hear any complaints of buildings being hit by birds. You would think it would get a bit messy after a while- lots of carcasses lying around.
Also, I do know birds have very good eyesight, it is their most important sense. Perhaps some species of birds are more vulnerable than others?

[Laughing Mirror]

10. No it is not overblown

The article says that workers cleared up dead birds on the grounds of the Twin Towers every morning. Towers were in the path of migrating birds.

[TahitiNut]

13. While I'm probably in the 90th %ile of people concerned with the biosphere

... I can't help but regard this as a bit overblown myself. It's my impression that this is a reiteration of objections waged against tall buildings (and wind farms) for the past 80 years. I've heard this before. It's also my impression that it's been debunked, but I've not done the search to support this impression. I'm not aware that the sidewalks beneath any skyscraper have ever been littered with the carcasses of any vast horde of birds. Indeed, it seems to me that pedestrians can go for years without seeing the carcass of a dead bird. It reminds me of the mind game about the "immortality of birds" - i.e. given their vast numbers, how could it be that we see so few corpses?

At the same time, I'm pretty cynical about these high-rise monuments to man's narcissism. While I'd certainly like to see far less urban sprawl and a more conservative use of land, I fail to see the social pragmatics of these capitalist dildo competitions. I have little doubt that firms will flock to occupy such an edifice - if only for the psycho-patriotic bragging rights of participation in a "capitalist renaissance." Nonetheless, I don't get the impression there's any significant shortage of office space in the Bushoilini Enronomy.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

16. This article blames the glass

I do know the artificial lights can be a problem, and apparently the speed the birds can fly at is also a cause of the problem, they are going too fast to avoid the collisions if they even realize there is a barrier.

http://www.metropolismag.com/html/content_0401/ob/ob3.html

[XemaSab]

19. Overblown?

Seems like one of those things where it depends on how you look at the data, and what you consider a "significant" loss of migratory birds. The number of birds that are killed from hitting windows is probably a fraction of the birds that run out of juice crossing the Gulf of Mexico. Ditto for birds that fly into windmills, but I think the major concern with windmills is that many of those bird strikes are raptors, and windmills are frequently placed in windy, grassy areas that raptors use for hunting or migration corridors.

http://www.flap.org/new/nestegg.htm

[XemaSab]

17. Birds and tower strikes

Birds aren't good at seeing glass, the lights confuse them, and there aren't usually things sticking up that high for them to fly into.

They migrate at night too.

[Art_from_Ark]

31. A few days after I had just moved into my new place

and there were still no curtains on the big glass door, I was startled to hear a big whump on the door. When I looked outside, I discovered that a pigeon had flown into the glass door. Fortunately for the pigeon, it was just stunned, but it took a good ten to fifteen minutes to recover.

[amazona]

32. no it is not overblown

Architects are notorious for being unresponsive to the problem when it is documented. Ever see those skyscrapers that are deliberately designed to be mirrors to reflect the sky and clouds? Many studies have been done showing the birds killed by those buildings. The stance of the architect's society or union or whatever it is ... is simply that they just do not care. The American Bird Conservancy has lots of material on this. I see dead birds just walking around skyscrapers all the time. People see what they are looking for and they don't see what they don't choose to see.

Having good eyesight is not very useful when some buildings, such as mirrored skyscrapers, are deliberately designed to fool the unsophisticated eye. Birds do not have experience of mirrors!

[DS1]

34. It's fucking bullshit

because they waited THIS long to say something about it.

And people wonder why these types of organizations have no credibility, they wait until the cornerstone of progress is made before going WAAAAAAH !!!

Fucking dumbasses deserve to lose because they're so goddamn unorganized.

Fuck em, build it.

[amazona]

36. they didn't wait, they've been speaking out for years

It is not the fault of Audubon or the American Bird COnservancy that mainstream media has refused to report on their findings of many decades. No one waited to complain. Our complaints have been ignored.

Should your causes be ignored and your ideas dismissed out of hand because some in the Democratic Party cannot get heard in the mainstream media? This argument simply doesn't make sense to me. Developers don't want to spend the money to make tall structures safer for birds, and developers have more money and power than birders, so does that mean that only developers' ideas should be heard and acted on?

Why try to right any of the world's wrongs at all then? Because most of the time, any problem that will cause the rich and powerful a moment's inconvenience will be ignored or downplayed in mainstream media...

Truly hope I am not reading your post right because otherwise I am truly puzzled by this kind of statement on a progessive board. Progressives are always going to be ignored or shouted down, doesn't mean their ideas are bull.

[KenCarson]

11. the birds are obviously terrorists.....we should ban birds!!!!

.

[maxsolomon]

14. roads kill just as many mammals as skyscrapers kill birds

lets ban those too.

i'm serious.

[quiet.american]

21. Good to see they're making an effort at least--

-- to address the problem by hiring a consultant.

On another note, as a New Yorker who worked at the WTC and at the
World Financial Center, I really hate the Kool-Aid drinker new name
of "Freedom Tower." It smacks of Bush's Orwellian take on language,
reminds me of how that scumbag (Bush) allowed the whole horror
of "September the 11th" to happen in the first place, and somehow
makes the whole project into a monument to the neo-cons.

[MADem]

23. One way to solve the problem

Is to use non-reflective glass at the altitudes that most migrating birds fly at. Architects don't like it though, because it impacts the aesthetics of their design.

Interesting article here: http://magazine.audubon.org/features0403/alert.html

That toll may not seem like much. But even such small glass kills can add up to big trouble, believes ornithologist Daniel Klem of Muhlenberg College, in Allentown, Pennsylvania. Between 100 million and 1 billion birds die in glass collisions every year in North America alone, Klem estimates. At the very least, that's an average of one bird a year slamming into each of the roughly 100 million homes, apartment buildings, office towers, schools, and storefronts that dot the American landscape. "Glass is one of the world's great bird killers," rivaled only by habitat destruction and perhaps cats, says the blunt-spoken, 57-year-old ornithologist.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

24. Very informative article, thanks

as an architect I am concerned. I can see there are various solutions though. I will forward that article to all of my colleagues.

[hughee99]

29. 1 billion birds die each year due to glass???

How many birds are there in North America? Since Glass is rivaled by habitat destruction and predators, then it would probably be safe to assume, based on these numbers, that at least 2-3 BILLION birds die in North America each year. Are more than 3 billion birds a year being born? If not, then we will fast be running out of birds. If so, then are there enough worms, grubs and other food to sustain them? I understand the sentiment of the article, but personally, I don't see how these numbers can be accurate even with the "range" of 100 million - 1 billion.

[amazona]

35. this is a big country and there are 600-plus bird species

Birds are hatched, not born, but be that as it may, yes, in the United States we are expected to eventually (next century or so) lose one-third of our avian species, of which there are 600-odd in North America north of Mexico.

As far as numbers of birds, there are around 350 million Red-Winged Blackbirds alone -- probably one for every legal resident of the United States and all the illegal residents besides. I realize it is hard for the human mind to comprehend numbers that are in the millions, much less in the billions, but we have a very good handle on bird populations because of our large but well-organized network of bird watchers that census the birds during the Christmas Bird Count each year.

[theboss]

25. Amusing story about birds meeting technology

And is there any other kind honestly?

Anyway, a friend of mine, who became an engineer, spent her summers during college working for a jet engine company. Essentially her job was throwing frozen turkeys into the turbines to see how much damage they caused. Apparently, it's not good to be a goose near a jet.

[MADem]

26. The USAF actually has a manual

entitled BASH (bird air strike hazard). All services have some sort of bird strike protocol. It really is a serious problem, and it can screw up a craft if you take one up the intake.

But they should really THAW those turkeys before tossing them into the turbines!

[theboss]

30. They may have been thawed

This was a drunken story one night. And haven them frozen is far more amusing.

[THUNDER HANDS]

27. simple solution

just stick some cats at the top of the building.

(oooh, that'll piss off the Louge folks) ;)

[aikido15]

33. Does everything in America

have to be the biggest and brightest? It's like some sort of weird phallic symbol for those rich and powerful who's money can by everything but their dick size!

[amazona]

37. it won't be the biggest and the brightest anyway

Isn't some building in Dubai or somewhere going to be the tallest anyway? Or is that just a rumor?

[aikido15]

40. Tallest buildings?

1. Taipei 101, Taipei, Taiwan 2004 101 509 1,670
2. Petronas Tower 1, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia 1998 88 452 1,483
3. Petronas Tower 2, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia 1998 88 452 1,483
4. Sears Tower, Chicago 1974 110 442 1,450
5. Jin Mao Building, Shanghai 1999 88 421 1,381

[NuttyFluffers]

51. might as well paint it a nice flesh colored pink and get it over with.

the Freedom Phallus. and since it's flesh pink it'll stand out enough so the birds can see it and avoid it. problem solved, everyone happy except prudes (who are impossible to placate anyways).


(and none of you say a thing about the soap suds trickling down from window washers! for shame!) :spank:

[Goathead]

46. World's largest terrorist target

Two strikes against WTC, the second being successful in bringing down entire buildings. Terrorist seem to like to tear down symbols and this building will be one huge symbol, plus they like to return to scenes of previous attacks where they have had success. "Freedom Tower", 1,776 ft high, shaped like the outstretched hand of the Statue of Liberty, I have to agree with the previous poster who said that place will be paranoia city. I seriously doubt they will be able rent out all of that space.

[Uroboros]

47. The tower will be 1,776 ft high..

..but with only 70 stories (I believe) of living/office space. I'm sure they'll fill the place up. Though they'll probably have to offer some good rental rates to do so.

Having said that; the concept that the building had to be 1776 ft. high (1776 being the founding of this country) and that it should mirror the Statue of Liberty; had created one ugly building IMHO. Also the name of the place just makes me :puke:

[elsiesummers]

49. You've got it.

Between the history of attacks and Bush bravado and the name "Freedom Tower" it's like they are saying "bring it on" to terrorists.

My husband worked at WTC#7 - (by the way that building is nearly finished and will still be called WTC#7) after the first attack and before the second.

He's back with that office and they are currenly looking for new office space and fortunately it will not be WTC or Freedom Tower. I was all about how no job should be a death sentence - time to either transfer or find a new job if that was the case.

I was actually a little paranoid when he first took the job, previously, about a year after the first attack. But that attack was small enough it did seem sort of silly or paranoid to be worried then, so brushed off any fears.

I do think the number of cops on the street in NYC is way out of hand compared to back in '96 - and the bulletin boards "Stop terror one cell at a time" around the Lincoln Tunnel, it's sort of over the top - not like it's going to change anything - just makes it seem like a police state.

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

48. I have heard that several times, but I worked all around the

twin towers for a long time and never saw a dead migratory bird on the ground.
And I worked off-hours and walked endlessly around the area, so sanitation did not scoop them up before me.
So, I don't buy it.