State officials reject two-thirds of Florida's provisional ballots

[Judi Lynn]

State officials reject two-thirds of Florida's provisional ballots

The Associated Press
Posted January 3 2005, 3:05 PM EST

TALLAHASSEE -- Nearly two-thirds of provisional ballots cast on Election Day in Florida weren't counted, mostly because the people casting them weren't registered to vote, state officials said Monday.

Preliminary figures, culled by the state from county elections officials, showed that of 27,742 provisional ballots cast, 9,915 were counted and 17,827 were rejected. The number could be revised but isn't likely to change dramatically.

The federal Help America Vote Act, or HAVA, passed in response to the troubles encountered in the 2000 presidential election, required the distribution of provisional ballots even if people don't appear to be registered.

The ballots are held until officials determine whether they people were entitled to vote. If they should have been allowed to vote, the ballots count. If not, they are thrown out.
(snip/...)

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-provisionalvotes03,0,6256389.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines

[TxRoadHawg]

1. Duh, register before voting

Seems pretty simple to me. If you want to vote then register first. What's the problem here.

[unpossibles]

3. normally not a problem

but what about stories like the one in AZ where the people registered, and their registrations were tossed in the trash? Not saying this is what happened 100% of the time, but are you saying 2/3 of the people do not know they have to register? This seems awfully high to me.

[Cheswick2.0]

4. I am guessing that many of those people did register

and somehow their registrations were thrown out. :shrug:

It happened to democrats in all the swing states.

[oneighty]

5. Right

ALL votes done other then in person and on the voting machines are suspect. Absentee ballots including military are an open invitation to CHEAT and CHEAT and CHEAT.

There has got to be a better way?

Welcome to DU I think.

180

[mrbassman03]

29. I don't know about that...

Oregon has an all absentee voting system, and it worked rather well. A system needs to be implemented is a way to check that your voted was counted, and counted right. I know this isn't the central focus of the discussion, but it needs to be addressed.

[oneighty]

30. Sounds like a good system

in which every one votes the same way. There is then the one method to oversee.

180

[fob]

7. How about if you cast a provisional ballot and are otherwise found

qualified to vote, you are automatically registered, have your vote counted and sent a subsequent voters registration card with all necessary info for voting/registering in the future. What's wrong with that?

[Mika]

12. Why would anyone stand in line for hour after hour, if not registered?

"Duh, register before voting"

Do you really think that 2/3rds didn't?

[lenidog]

16. I hate to say this

but YES! I work customer service at a phone center and people have problems with the simplest concepts. Like the bank will charge you a fee for writing a check and not having money in there to cover it or if the payee sends it back a second time and there still isn't any money we will charge you another fee.

[ISUGRADIA]

18. They also could be registered in another county ut have moved

and did not know they needed to re-register. I worked in an Iowa election office and this was a big reason provisional ballots got tossed. I registered in Boone County but forgot to in Polk County.

Unless it's an in-county change of address the vote did not count. Sucks, and I contacted my state reps to get the law changed but guess which party is blocking it?

[leesa]

35. Not when you are dealing with the GOP. They steal them, trash them,

alter the tallies...don't play that voters are too stupid card. This was fraud.

[devilgrrl]

2. I was under the impression it was because they were votes for Kerry

eom

[FloridaPat]

6. Here in Florida you can register to vote when you get a drivers license.

Easy enough to get lost that way. Another thing is if you vote at the wrong precinct, it's thrown out. I bet that would be most of the rejections.

[TxRoadHawg]

8. Voter reg

That and if your not eligible to vote, such as a felon. Also double residence can be a problem if your not sure which precinct you registration is in.
Here in Texas you register with your drivers license. For some reason my first time didn't take, so I went to the local court house and registered again.
Because of the voter fraud in 2000 it looks like Floria is looking closer for irregularities. Good job Fla.

[rooboy]

20. Who did you vote for?

just curious.

[Liberty Belle]

10. In CA, the DMV takes a year or so to forward registrations.

My son was nearly disenfranchised becuase he registered to vote when he got his driver's license. 10 months later, he found by calling the Registrar's office that they never received notification from the DMV and so he wasn't registered. Luckily he made the deadline to register again, just barely in time for the election. We've since heard this problem is rampant in CA and probably other states, too.

[TxRoadHawg]

31. DMV Registration

Sounds like a common problem in many states. DMV registration needs to be improved so it might actually work. WAIT, what was I thinking, a DMV that works? Oh that's rich!

[alfredo]

27. I've worked the polls as a judge, and I can tell you that very few

people show up at the wrong precinct. We just told them where their precinct is, and sent them on their way. I can't see how a person can vote in the wrong precinct. Even if they had to use a provisional ballot, they were sent to their precinct to do it.

[Freddie Stubbs]

38. No, most were not registered to vote

TALLAHASSEE -- Nearly two-thirds of provisional ballots cast on Election Day in Florida weren't counted, mostly because the people casting them weren't registered to vote, state officials said Monday.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-provisionalvotes03,0,6256389.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines

[flordehinojos]

9. the press ought to be out there demanding to examine everyone of those

darn provisional ballots and the grounds for their rejection or acceptance by the bush HIT THEM WHERE IT HURTS government...however, the press ....the press doesn't seem to give a darn about democracy any more.

How does that old song go, "those were the days my friend ???????? those were the days?" I can't recall the lyrics...

[Igel]

17. lyrics

http://www.barynya.com/russian_lyrics.stm

edited to add: I especially like that the Russian (which is in no way related to the English "translation") mentions a 7-string guitar.

[flordehinojos]

28. thanks for the lyrics. i appreciate it.

[Liberty Belle]

11. Forward to FL Senator Nelson, who is thinking of contesting.

Suggest he contest Florida, too, not just Ohio.

[kcass1954]

15. Any evidence that he might stand up?

[Just Me]

13. So be it. A storm's brewin'. n/t

[maduroftime]

14. This just underscores the need to be registered and to

verify you are registered according to the laws of your state. I was a poll watcher for the election and we were told the difference between casting a ballot and a provisional ballot.

Basically, the answer was this: your ballot is the GOLD STANDARD, if you require a provisional ballot for whatever reason as indicated by HAVA and your state laws, there is NO guarantee it will be counted. There are many reasons for this (and I know they have been detailed in other posts so I wont waste anyones eyesight listing them)

My suggestion, get involved, get registered and make sure you and ten thousand of your closest friends are registered properly!

[fatherjohn]

21. Registration

maduroftime is right. Whenever a major drive to register people to vote gets underway it includes bringing in a number of people who are not really up to speed on voting (and if truth be told on a lot of other things). I've worked in a number of such campaigns and became accustomed to the ineptitude of many of the people I was trying to register.
You tend to develop patience with people who are a bit lacksadaisical about life.
It is certainly true that this is not an argument against the existence of fraud, but both things can be happening at the same time and from my experience since the "get out the vote" drive was so huge
I was not at all surprised to see many provisional ballots disqualified.

[SoCalDem]

19. Didn't we all really "know" they would be?

When registration is "in doubt" on election day, and an unfamiliar "special ballot" is given to angry/tired/upset/unprepared people, what else could the result be??

EVERY August should be "Voter Awareness Month". In years when an election occurs, they will have ample time to verify their status, correct address changes, and if not registered....to REGISTER.

I hate the fact that people even HAVE to register, but if the rules say we must, then every August is a good time to do it. Most states have a 30 day cut-off, and by doing it in August, there is plently of time to reconcile errors and make sure things are in order.

[DoYouEverWonder]

22. I guess everyone has forgotten the 58,000 absentee ballots

that got sent out late and were never delivered.

The college students in my town (UF & SFCC) who never got their absentee ballots went to the local BOE office to vote, but since they were in the wrong county their votes didn't count. According to the SOE, it wasn't the SOE's fault that the Post Office screwed up.

[Pretty_in_CodePink]

23. I suppose this is many of those whose registrations were not

accepted because boxes were improperly checked. There were thousands of those here in Florida. Many people didn't check the citizen box and others indicated they were felons or crazy because of double negative wording of the question. In Orange County the SPVR of elections accepted them anyway saying that the signature indicated registrants were eligible to vote. Not the case in most other Florida Counties per instructions from Sec of State Glenda Hood.

When I worked with the Kerry campaign and registered voters there were many, many improperly filled out forms. We called the voters to clarify and get the forms completed properly. Still many were unreachable. I attribute these errors to lack of training. When managing market research data collection I learned that interviewers needed to be briefed on filling out the forms. Lots of anxiety and heartache could have been prevented if this sort of training had been done. I also felt that way about other aspects of data collection completed by the campaign.

I also talked to lots of people who said they registered at DMV or did name changes and there was no record of it with Spvr of Elections.

Regardless that seems like a lot of provisionals to discount.

[goforit]

24. I smell a rat!!!

[punpirate]

25. How many were on...

... the previous (erroneous) felons list and the newest, latest one, who were never notified that they'd been dropped from the rolls?

[The Judged]

26. How many were "previously registered," but not "currently registered?"

[soup]

34. not very many

>An analysis by the Tallahassee Democrat, which polled counties about rejected provisional ballots, found that slightly more than 7 percent were tossed because voters had been purged from the rolls either because they hadn't voted in several years or were found to be ex-felons.<

17,827 were rejected, approximately 16,579 because they simply weren't registered?

Have to wonder how many of the 16,579 are stories waiting to be told.

[KayLaw]

32. Do a Google search

Florida voter registration, Voters Outreach, etcetera. They were down here ripping up registration from Democrats. No tin foil, it was on our local news station.

[Catfight]

33. Why nothing about the missing 50k absentee ballots? I never received

mine in Florida. You'd think there would be a bit more stated about that, but this is Florida, home of Bush Brother and Katherine Harris.

[soup]

36. That and the ones sent out that were missing a second page.

Catfight, were you able to vote? Did you vote a provisional ballot?

Remember reading an article - Miami Herald, I think - of a woman who actually flew down to FL to vote because she hadn't received her absentee ballot.

[Catfight]

39. Yes, they let me vote after they called the elections office to cancel

the absentee ballot, but still, how many didn't get to vote. No, I voted with the touch screen and proudly for Kerry.

[w4rma]

37. Obviously there is a problem in Florida. I believe it is intentional.

And the agenda should be obvious.