GOOGLY EYES (Snooping features at Google)-Let's complain!

[Liberty Belle]

** GOOGLY EYES

The company everyone loves knows more about you than you might realize. And that's just for starters, writes Dan Kennedy. "According to Lauren Weinstein, an Internet activist and privacy expert based in Southern California, Google keeps track of every search that's made, as well as the Internet location of the computer from which the search is taking place -- and then it stores that information for possible future use."

(Boston Phoenix)
http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/news_features/top/features/documents/04414489.asp
(Add Your Comments)
http://mediacitizen.blogspot.com/2005/01/googly-eyes.html
= = = =
Note: Here is an e-mail that I sent to Google's press office after reading the above:

Re: Publisher/Editor Needs Info on Opting Out of Google Tracking Features

Having recently switched from Yahoo! to Google to avoid anti-privacy snooping features at Yahoo!, I was disturbed to read an article (link below) stating that Google tracks and stores info on every search made by users. I wish to opt out of this feature. Moreover, as publisher of the Liberty Belle Log, a political newsletter with national distribution, I wish to inform my readers (who are very concerned over preserving privacy and civil liberties) how to opt out as well.

I would appreciate your prompt reply. Thank you.

[Rush1184]

1. WTF??? And I use to respect Google...

[Drifter]

25. Oh please ...

They have every right to record how their "FREE" service is being used.

It isn't like they are putting spyware on your computer and recording any habits outside of the use of their website.

Cheers
Drifter

[AllyCat]

2. Just installed a decent firewall on my computer with 2,000 + hits

in 8 days from outside sources trying to access my computer. I've run every spyware, adware, hijacker, and virus program known to geek-kind and there are more hits than ever before. Supposedly, I have a "cloaking device" on this computer, but the hits just keep coming.

Now I think I know why! And we wonder how DU people end up getting targetted in airport security searches.:mad:

Is Google Repuke?

[CoffeeCat]

18. AllyCat...

Allycat--are you saying that the hits to your site have increased since installing your firewall? And that your technology is raising red flags to those "watching"?

My husband is the uber geek of the family. We somehow hop onto someone else's Internet access. We pay for our own access, but we hook into access through an open, wireless router.

We have some kind of antenna thingee pointed at the door.

Speaking of DUers and airport security...I had to go through the security screening at the airport last month. I had to step aside and they did the wand. Then they frisked me, went through both bags and did chemical tests on my bags and items in my bags--to test for traces of explosives.

[AllyCat]

28. I don't think it's increased since installing it

just that I notice it more since the one on my computer (M$) was worthless. In fact, it's so strong a wall I can't even listen to AAR anymore (sad) since I was having trouble with RealPlayer and WMP loading crap on my computer when I accessed streaming sites.

What I've noticed increasing is how many hits I seem to get:

-at night
-everytime I change something to limit spyware
-last night after I disabled Broadjump (cleverly installed by SBC).

In eight hours last night, I had 97 hits, half of which were high-rated and 240 hits yesterday alone. Of course, the firewall stops them, but I'm still feeling like a sitting duck.

When I go to the airport, I am ALWAYS singled out for a search at both the checkpoints and the gate to the jetway. Drives my fiance nuts. I don't fly that often and haven't since I started blogging so I think it's going to get worse the next time I fly.

[snooper2]

3. ????

So they just have a bunch of terabyte servers sitting around??

Does anybody have any idea how much data that would be? Tremendous...

[sendero]

20. It's really nothing...

... compared to the size of the web that they have indexed (cataloged for searching).

Keep in mind, they have to basically store all the text from the web pages they have spidered. The search logs are nothing compared to that.

[Pale_Rider]

30. Yep ...

... since 500GB disk drives are just around the corner.

http://www.forbes.com/technology/feeds/general/2005/01/25/generalvnunet_2005_01_25_eng-vnunet_eng-vnunet_062509_5905001944752693152.html?partner=yahoo&referrer=

[KDLarsen]

4. Eh, you DO realize that every webpage does this?

IIRC, every webserver will log the IP (& event too) of its users. In fact, I'm sure that even DU have IP logging too. In fact, this post that I'm writing right now, will forever be traced back to Eightythree dot Ninetytwo dot Fortytwo dot Thirtyone.

[AllyCat]

9. Okay so does a DSL router or something like ZoneAlarmPro

which makes a user's IP invisible work to stop something like this? Seems like it should.

[McKenzie]

12. you need a proxy or a shell account to be invisible.

Don't even bother ringing your ISP and asking for a shell account...once upon a time it could be done, but not now...sadly

Proxies are not reliable because they will sometimes forward your IP. Some are truly anonymous but they don't last long. And, the sysadmin of the server you bounce through might get suspicious if they spot odd IP's in the logs so your true IP gets logged there.

Really paranoid people chain proxies together to increase the "hops" on the route between them and the target site. Broadband is needed for that though unless you want slow surfing. The best proxies are outwith UK/US/Australia etc.

Anonymizer and related services will mask your true IP. However, their servers still know where you go and at least one is an LEA front company.

There are other problems such as the GUID in some M$ proggies. Shutting off ActiveX sometimes stops these being read by servers but not always. Some Pentium chips were also issued with a GUID until an outcry forced them to change.

To be absolutely and truly anon,you need to do something else but I'm not prepared to post the details.

BTW, I am not a hacker; I just know about these things.

edit: disclaimer!

[AllyCat]

14. Thanks MK..I don't know much about computers

what exactly is a proxy? I do have broadband, but actually ever since I got this ZoneAlarm "cloaking" device (that's what I call it), my surfing has slowed a little bit. This is a free trial right now. If I buy it, and put a DSL router on my system...does that do something of what you are describing? Feel free to PM me if you care to explain it without posting, but I don't know too much, so you might not want to waste your time.

Thanks for trying though.

On edit: just read the rest of your edit...what's GUID? How would I know if my P4 processor has it? What's LEA and what are they fronting?

[McKenzie]

15. some hurried advice

a proxy is a middleman. A surfer configures their browser so that it goes to the proxy site first before it goes to the site that is the intended target and it returns the IP of the target site through the proxy IP before you get the file on your desktop/laptop. The target site sees the proxy IP rather than yours.

An IP may be likened to a registration plate/number - it's unique to a computer or network and can be used to identify a specific computer or network. Note: a network could have hundreds of work stations all sharing one IP. A home pc has it's own IP. IP's come in two flavours - static and dynamic. Static means it's constant/unchanging and is used by one individual/computer/network. Dynamically assigned IP's are like pool cars - you get what's available at the time. Static IP's are least satisfactory for obvious reasons.

Can't comment on why your surfing is slow w/out more info. However, a hardware router is more secure than a software firewall. Zone Alarm is fine for 99% of users though. A firewall is a filter - it does not mask your IP. Totally different purpose to a proxy - latter isn't software anyway, apart from the multiproxy proggie and others like it.

Globally Unique Identifier. Represented by 32 hex numbers or a 16 byte number depending on what sort of GUID it is. Suffice to say it can be used to identify someone precisely.

Pentium 4 chips don't have GUID's as far as I know.

Law Enforcement Agencies - they set up a bogus anonymizing service a few years ago apparently. Wasn't reported much on the internet but it was widely discussed on Usenet groups.

Don't get too worried about being monitored. It's been going on since the begining.

I have to go. Post on the Computer Group if you need more info'.

[CoffeeCat]

19. My husband mentioned that about Anonymizers...

...he said that it's most likely that at least some of them are run by people who want to know who is trying to hide.

My husband is the head of network security for an ISP and he said it's extremely difficult to hide.

[McKenzie]

21. there is one foolproof way but it's not getting posted here!

and you are right about the commercial anonymisers. Besides, Carnivore, Echelon, Magic Lantern? Bet your husabnd knows about them...

[CoffeeCat]

27. Yes, he's familiar with those...

He said Echelon monitors every phone call, fax, email that originates from the US/Britain and goes to another country.

Kinda...Orwellian.

He said Echelon is run by the NSA--which is bigger than the FBI/CIA combined--but their budget is top secret. So, we have no idea how much money their spending or what exactly they're doing.

My husband is pretty low key about stuff like this, but if I ask him questions, he'll talk for hours.

I just asked him about Echelon and Magic Lantern and he said, "What exactly are you and the kids doing today???"

LOL :)

[egoprofit]

16. i don't think you can mask your IP... but it changes w/ most DSL

most DSL modems give you a "DHCP" ip address (auto assign)... so unless you have a static IP it doesn't keep it...

[egoprofit]

22. web site stats track all kinds of stuff..

my web site stats tell me the ip, the o/s, the broswer type, the region, and even what site sent them to mine... ie what search engine they came from and what WORDS they searched to find it.

it's all about marketing. every site and company probably doesn't this. there are digital "paper trails" on the internet. you just have to live with that.

[scarlett1]

34. That is how google or any search engine directs you to the correct place

if you are on the hi-way, someone can follow you. Whether it is I-70 or the internet.

Good reason to think twice ot thrice before posting something. It lives forever.
KD is correct.

[TreasonousBastard]

5. Probably to boot ad revenue...

by analyzig browsing habits and targeting ads. Just like Amazon does.

If you really want to have a fit, think about what they're doing with those Gmail accounts...

[LiberalVoice]

6. what r they doing? nt

[TreasonousBastard]

13. It's not just what they might do, but...

what they don't seem to have a problem with:

http://www.google-watch.org/gmail.html

<...>

"After 180 days in the U.S., email messages lose their status as a protected communication under the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, and become just another database record. This means that a subpoena instead of a warrant is all that's needed to force Google to produce a copy. Other countries may even lack this basic protection, and Google's databases are distributed all over the world. Since the Patriot Act was passed, it's unclear whether this ECPA protection is worth much anymore in the U.S., or whether it even applies to email that originates from non-citizens in other countries.

Google's relationships with government officials in all of the dozens of countries where they operate are a mystery, because Google never makes any statements about this. But here's a clue: Google uses the term "governmental request" three times on their terms-of-use page and once on their privacy page. Google's language means that all Gmail account holders have consented to allow Google to show any and all email in their Gmail accounts to any official from any government whatsoever, even when the request is informal or extralegal, at Google's sole discretion. Why should we send email to Gmail accounts under such draconian conditions?

Problem 2: Google's policies do not apply

The phrasing and qualifiers in the Gmail privacy policy are creepy enough, but nothing in any of Google's policies or public statements applies to those of us who don't have Gmail accounts. Google has not even formally stated in their privacy policy that they will not keep a list of keywords scanned from incoming email, and associate these with the incoming email address in their database. They've said that their advertisers won't get personally identifiable information from email, but that doesn't mean that Google won't keep this information for possible future use. Google has never been known to delete any of the data they've collected, since day one. For example, their cookie with the unique ID in it, which expires in 2038, has been tracking all of the search terms you've ever used while searching their main index."

<...>

[mudderfudder77]

23. Google was upfront

about what it was doing with email and how it was cataloging them. And as far as storing ip's and tracking info, I'd like to know one major web site that doesn't track info about the users browsing them. This is old news...

[Ian David]

8. More from the Boston Phoenix article

http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/news_features/top/features/documents/04414489.asp

Perhaps none of this is particularly surprising. But Weinstein offers an additional wrinkle that ought to give anyone reason to pause: he claims Google is actually storing all this stuff so that it can go back and conduct, say, market research or develop new products. Or, you know, respond to that subpoena. This struck me as truly innovative and troublesome, so I asked Weinstein how he knows this. His response: "My source on this is a former highly placed Google person whom I have met with face to face. To protect him, I have not publicly stated his name. But I am satisfied personally, having known him for many, many years. He certainly would have been in a position to know. That’s as far as I can take that, unfortunately."

Now, it wouldn’t be fair to disparage Google on the basis of anonymous information once removed. But the thing is, the company doesn’t deny it. I sent an e-mail to Andrew McLaughlin, Google’s senior policy counsel and a person who had been described to me as the company’s privacy guru, someone who’s enlightened about such issues. But rather than respond, he forwarded my e-mail to the company’s public-relations staff. After several days of polite back-and-forth, company spokesman Steve Langdon sent me an e-mail statement that I quote in its entirety: "Privacy is an issue about which Google cares very much. In all the products we develop, we pay very close attention to how the products and their features relate to user privacy and we make design decisions and policies to protect privacy. Google also provides users with information about privacy in our privacy policies that are posted on our web site."

[MasonJar]

7. I thought I had read that the Google execs are Pugs.

[Chained in Guatanamo]

10. Safety

there are ways to stay invisible. In fact visible stayinvisible.com to learn more.

[kypper]

11. Use a proxy

Open proxy servers are often much safer (albeit they too might log)
Try www.antiproxy.org

[Xithras]

29. Proxies won't help you

First, the CIA is known to own a portion of SafeWeb and an interest in Anonymizer, so if you're looking for protection from the government they should be scratched off your list. Any other US proxy logs will be searchable at any time by law enforcement (thank you Patriot Act!), so they shouldn't be counted on either.

Using foreign proxy servers will get you beyond the reach of US law enforcement, but there are many that are anonymously run by everyone from MI6 to Russian and Chinese intelligence services as "honeypots" to catch everything from internal dissidents to foreign terrorists. There have also been reports of proxies in Russia being used to monitor the Internet connections of users and "sniff" for credit card numbers and other data useful within identity theft rings.

Unless you personally know someone who runs a proxy in a foreign country, and you know that their host countries laws prevent the proxy logs from being seized, then I'd be leery about proxies. Remember, using a proxy means that EVERYTHING you type and view on the Internet is being routed through someone elses servers. Unless you know that you can trust that "someone else", using a proxy is simply trading in one privacy risk for another.

[billyoc]

17. What's their motto, again?

"Don't be evil.", wasn't it? :eyes:

[spacedog]

24. Why are people surprised??

Perhaps I'm being naive but... Google is providing a service and it seems silly to me to think they don't know what people are searching for and wouldn't use that information to target their marketing. All sorts of web sites track who uses their site and their particular browsing habits. Supermarkets do it too with the little coupon card thingies. They are providing discounts through the card and, as payment, you allow them access to your purchase data.
It seems unreasonable to me to think that companies wouldn't use data we're freely providing to them.

Now... sending it off to the government so they can lock us up in gitmo is something else...

[grace0418]

26. Considering I'm one of those people who

make a point of searching "I hate George Bush" on a regular basis, I hope they do keep track. Not that I want to be sent to Gitmo, of course.

[Kolesar]

31. this is a scary thread...eom

[hunter]

32. Big Fucking Deal.

Live fearlessly and in the open. If everyone did this all the little weasel worm tyrants would crawl back into their dank little holes.

Pssssst, wanna know something?

I've seen pictures of naked people on the internet! I've seen pictures of... OMG ...people having sex!

I've looked at web sites claiming George W. Bush is the Anti-Christ!

I've posted pictures of myself at anti-war rallies!

I've conspired with gays and lesbians on sites promoting the homosexual lifestyle!

And worst of all, I OFTEN POST ON THE DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND!

What should I type into images.google.com next, making certain "safe search" is turned off?

Hah hah, one of the words I used was "Bush!"

[MADem]

33. Here's a way to complain

...everyone google "GOOGLE SUCKS" or "GOOGLE FASCIST PIGS" or "GOOGLE EVIL TOOL OF AMERICAN GOVERNMENT" or something like that. If they really want to know what we are looking for, we can let them know!!!

Or piss them off, and google DOGPILE!