Sources: Bush Plan Won't Affect 55 and Up

[truthpusher]

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050202/D880I3K81.html

Sources: Bush Plan Won't Affect 55 and Up
Feb 2, 1:54 PM (ET)

By DAVID ESPO

WASHINGTON (AP) - Social Security benefits promised to workers currently 55 and older would remain unchanged under President Bush's call for voluntary personal accounts for younger Americans, Republican congressional officials said Wednesday, citing information provided by the administration. True for near-retirees of an unspecified age.

(snip)

The decision means those 55 and above would not be subject to a cut in their promised starting Social Security benefit when they retire, as younger Americans are expected to face.

In political terms, it also indicates a White House decision to ease the concerns of a politically pivotal group as it seeks to build public and congressional support for far-reaching changes in the Depression-era program.

In a recent survey taken for House Republicans, seniors expressed opposition to personal accounts, while younger workers favored them. Near-retirees are "clearly the demarcation point on this issue," pollsters concluded, urging the House GOP leadership to tread carefully out of political considerations.

more:
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050202/D880I3K81.html

[liberal N proud]

1. The thought there is they can get the support of that group of people

who are on Social Security or near it because, they don't have to worry about it.
It, I would suspect to be another bu$h lie, because if there is no money going into pay for those currently on the system, then they will be effected.

[MadisonProgressive]

3. From everything I've read - it's a total lie (as usual)

[MadisonProgressive]

8. Here is why this new story came out

This article reports on a recent USA TODAY/CNN/Gallup poll’s findings about support for President Bush’s privatization plan among different age groups of voters. In general, the poll found that voters over age 50 are opposed to privatization by 63% to 33% while those under age 30 support it by 55% to 42%. The article further notes that, while most older voters believe Social Security can pay them benefits, almost “two-thirds of those under 30 years old say they don’t think Social Security will be able to pay them any benefit when they stop working.”

[hector459]

My answer to younger gen favoring Bush plan: ENRON!!!

nuff said.

[roseBudd]

69. My answer to under 30s who favor privatization: Hope you don't go...

bankrupt paying for your mom's nursing home out of pocket because they are coming for Medicaid and Medicare next.

[Liberty Belle]

4. If the kids make bad investments, bye-bye granny's nest egg

[havocmom]

49. Yep. If you are 56 and the $ stops flowing into the system, you will be

SOL when you are 70 and really looking for that check. They are gonna pit generations against each other, just like they pit fundamentalist xians against gays, working men against women, and city against rural. bush* is a uniter alright; he unites everyone against their brothers.

They will tell the young the geezers are living off their efforts just like they have been working geezers up against the idea of paying taxes for schools for other people's kids for the past 30 years.

There are needs in society which are best met through civic effort. Schools and the care of elders and the disabled head that list. Too many in the GOP just want the $$ and fuck any sort of civic responsibility. They do NOT love America nor do they care for their neighbors.

When was the last time you heard of a high school student working in a "Civics Class"? It just isn't on the agenda anymore. Jingoism and pseudo-patriotic-pomp has replaced real love of country and fellow citizens.

[daleo]

2. The bulk of the baby boon just turned 45

So, this co-opting will only catch those born before 1950, which is only the leading edge of the baby boom. As usual, the latter half of the baby boom (the real generation x) and all those that follow are set for a royal screwing. David Foot's "Boom, Bust and Echo" goes into all this, although it is written from a Canadian perspective. I am sure there are equivalent American books, though.

[mom cat]

51. As a "leading edge" boomer, I am not at all impressed by the reassurances.

Even if the mob's motives were not crystal clear, the plan is unsafe at any age. What is to be the source of continued funding for retirees and the disabled? And for the younger people, what happens to them if they become disabled?

[daleo]

54. I wouldn't trust them either, regardless of age

As others have said, this has a divide and conquer mentality to it. Anyone who falls for it should ask themselves, "why wouldn't they renege on me in a few years too?"

This is kind of reminiscent of the way that unions have been divided, with one salary for current members with x years seniority, and a much lower starting salary for new employees.

[Ezlivin]

5. Bush plan won't affect Whites

How about a plan that treats us all as equals, with no distinction made for age, sex or political party?

[prolesunited]

6. Bush is encouraging seniors

to tell the younger generation, "Screw you. I got mine."

[Cocoa]

9. yep

that's exactly what he's doing. And at the same time, fomenting a resentment among younger people toward older people.

That's what Bush does, that's how he wins, he divides.

[LiberallyInclined]

30. the Repuke mantra!

I once heard the difference between Repukes and Dems stated this way:

with the pukes, it's "I got mine, you get yours!"
whereas with the Dems, it's "I got mine, how can I help you get yours?"

although I don't think it applies to the DLC...

[katinmn]

67. I agree. He's good at creating little pockets of special interests

[TimeToGo]

7. He's right . . . sort of . . ..

But, it is because his plan will not pass.

[kohodog]

10. HaHaHaHaHaHaHa, and there are WMD's in Iraq!

Be nice to your kids or they may feed you catfood down the road.

[LiberallyInclined]

11. but what if you're 45, and already collecting due to disability?

I know several people in that boat.

[kohodog]

26. They'll need to choose between catfood and dogfood.

This is totally fucked.

[teakee]

31. I am one of them, too.

Does anyone know what Bush's plans are for people like us? It is not like we can work, I worked since I was 14 and was disabled at 42. Personally, I don't think (being poor will probably do it) I'll live to 'retirement' age, but on the off chance--what happens?

Please don't think you are exempt from being coming disabled either--and trust me, you will lose everything before the process is over.

[zanana]

33. I'll be watching for information on this. I'm disabled, too.

Disability is the one thing I'm not hearing anything about. Alot of people are disabled, so you know we'll be targeted, too. Since Republicans tend to believe that alot of disabled people are "slackers", I think we have alot to worry about.

[kohodog]

45. This is why we need to keep the pressure on all the Senate Dems.

Privatization won't help those who outlive their savings either. But it sure will help the fat cats on Wall Street. We need to hang tough together and fight them with all we've got.

[rocktivity]

12. ALTERNATIVE REALITY ALERT!

These officials said they had been told of the decision during a preview of Bush's State of the Union address...They spoke on condition of anonymity, saying they did not want to pre-empt the president on the subject.

But that's EXACTLY what they're doing, and they're doing it because the plan has been getting such a negative reaction. If they didn't want to pre-empt President Mightymouse, why are they leaking the story?

:crazy:
rocknation

[mbperrin]

13. "Citing information provided by the administration"

Isn't that the same as "We just make this shit up!!??"

Other information provided by this administration:

mushroom clouds
Nigerian yellowcake
cakewalk in Iraq
WMDs
45 minute launch capabilities
reconstruction so easy it pays for itself
and 1 million (and counting) other FUCKING lies!!!!

[0007]

64. You forgot, "The war plan isn't on my desk"

[peacebird]

14. younger folks can expect a 40% reduction in benefits

now my question is - what are the "younger" folks. Everyone under 55? Just asking because I'm 47....

[Robbien]

56. Yes. People in the range of 44 to 54 who have been putting their money

into SS for twenty to thirty years, will have their benefits cut by 40%. Sounds good. Right? Starting to build up that 40% cut in a retirement account all over again at 44 to 54?

[Celeborn Skywalker]

15. What's up with the press

using Rove's frame of the situation. They used to correctly call it privatizing social security, now they call them personal accounts. This shit bugs the hell outta me and it's one more reason not to pay attention to the US media.

[Cocoa]

25. Frank Lunz said it wasn't fair

for the press to use the term Bush didn't like.

Josh Marshall explains Frank's reasoning:

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/004538.php

<snip>

Luntz said that it is okay for Democrats to use these terms but not the press since that would mean they were taking sides in the debate. When I asked why this was so since these were words the president was using only a few weeks ago, what emerged in the course of the conversation is that it is apparently inappropriate for reporters to use a given term after the date on which the president stops using it.

<snip>

So whereas it was okay two months ago for reporters to use the term 'private accounts' they must now refer to them as 'personal accounts' because the president has now decided that that is the proper word.

Hopefully, Air America will post the exchange in question so that you can listen to or read it yourself and not have to rely on my (personal) account of it.

The New York Times seems to understand the new rules of the road. In the piece on the White House's emerging phase-out strategy, Edmund Andrews and Richard Stevenson are careful only to refer to them as "personal accounts."

[CindyDale]

16. So if you're 54 you have 11 years to save for your retirement?

[Misskittycat]

17. Bummer. I just turned 54 on Sunday. n/t

[Gunit_Sangh]

28. And have your benefits cut

We haven't heard about what will happen to those of us in the 50-55 range. I'll be 52 in a few weeks. Have they mentioned how much my benefits, that I have been paying into for the last 20 years, will be cut?

I betcha this is how they plan on eliminating the need to raise taxes on the wealthy when benefit payments start exceeding payroll taxes. Instead of paying back the money they borrowed from us all these years to keep taxes artifically lower on the wealthy, they are sticking a knife in our back.

[Jazzgirl]

35. I'll be 51 in two months.

Even though I'll draw Railroad Retirement, I expect them to try to do the same thing to it as well. This is really f**ked up!

[kohodog]

48. I 'm in the same boat, but have no pension.

I'm on the 401k plan that went to a 101k. Social Security would be the same. Besoides, I don't want to invest in Wallmart and Haliburton. Who gets to decide the funds, Cheney?

[Ganja Ninja]

37. It's our money and we're getting fucked.

These mother fuckers won't stop either. If it gets shot down this year they'll be back next year and the next year and the next year untill they get our money.

[chelsea0011]

43. Same boat here. The Screwed Generation they'll call us.

Too young to enjoy the 60's and too young to enjoy SS during retirement.

[A Simple Game]

75. Sorry to add to the bad news.

I turned 54 in December. I'm too tired to look it up but, if I remember right, I won't be able to draw my early SS until I am 63 years and 7 months. Not sure about full SS, but probably the same additional time.

[DavidDvorkin]

18. Divide and conquer

Or as people say nowadays, "wedge issues".

Gotta give the bastards credit. They're good at this.

[gulliver]

22. Bingo.

My sentiments exactly. I've never seen a group so willing and able to divide people. It's unethical and immoral IMO. If I were 55 and they did something that messed up Social Security for my 25-year-old, I would consider myself "affected."

[underpants]

19. Oh yes it will

it will afeect everyone including those not yet born.

[AnnInLa]

20. A deliberate attempt to neutralize AARP

Hoping AARP will back off a little bit? All of my latest AARP publications just blast the bush plan.

[Bridget Burke]

21. But even the biggest fans of privatization ....

Say those much younger than 55 will be the only ones to benefit. Leaving those in the middle IN THE LURCH.

Not that I have any faith that we "oldsters" will be protected.

[Malva Zebrina]

23. Bush does not understand

that an indication of maturity is that one is concerned about the following generation. Most all of the seniors I know, are not so concerned about themself as they are about their children, or the next generation coming up. Bush can only see selfishness as the worry of seniors that he is going to take away their SS. He can placate them all he wants, but he is missing a very important point.

Of course, he is out of that loop of mature thinking, having never had to worry about his retirement or his daughters' retirement throughout his whole failed life and it is obvious he never developed the mature habit of thinking of others outside of his wealthy have more loop.

[fob]

24. Is this the Iraq war version of "we never said imminent"?

[Beetwasher]

27. We're NOT Giving ANY Details, We WON'T Release The Plan, JUST TRUST US!

:eyes:

[KayLaw]

29. Wonderful!!

I'm 51 and started working in 1971. I thought SS was bad back then, but in the '80s, Reagan and Greenspan put their heads together and created at fund that would INSURE the money for my retirement would be there when it was time - 11 years from now. DON'T WORRY, YOU CAN TRUST US, WE'RE THE REPUBLICANS!You should have seen my pathetic paychecks then, and I did go to college and have a true career. Now, I'm not even working but taking care of my disabled child. I trusted these monsters--now what?

Lying God damned thieves! Don't trust any Republican -- ever!


:grr: :grr: :grr: :grr: :grr:

[David Zephyr]

32. But Bush Will Cut Benefits to Those Currently Under 55.

Many of us have been paying into Social Security for over thirty years and now will have our benefits cuts...

to pay for Bush's war.

There was a Social Security Surplus when Bush became President.

Trillions of dollars in surplus. Remember Al Gore's "lock box" that everyone laughed at.

Well, this just is outrageous.

When will boomers who became yuppies and reactionaries catch on that Bush is not their friend, but has robbed their retirement security just as Ken Lay, his buddy, robbed his employees.

All for his war and tax cuts for his billionaire friends.

[Massachusetts]

34. F.U georgie boy

I'm 55, and I say keep your stinkin, stubby, clammy, little hands off of OUR Social Seurity System.

See you in hell dickhead!:evilgrin: O8) :evilfrown:

[OKNancy]

36. This sucks in so many ways

For my 52 year old husband and for me because what I think about is all the extra bookkeeping for me as an employer. I guess not only will I do the regular FICA deposits, but I'll have to keep track of the other percentage for each empolyee's separate plan. Sounds like a nightmare to me. Big companies will hire people to do it, but the little guys will just have one more piece of crap to mess with.

[Carolab]

38. This is crap because 1/3 of benefits are paid to widows and the disabled.

How many kids/families would be affected? Countless.

[Corgigal]

46. disabled

I wonder if they are going to screw around with current benefits to disabled people under the age of 55?

[Melynn]

39. I believe that

I also believe that there are WMDs in Iraq and that tax cuts for the wealthy help the economy. End of sarcasm.

[BiggJawn]

40. How much "younger" is a "Young American"?

45? 50? 33?

Ah, who are they trying to bullshit? I KNOW I'm gonna be eating cat food and heating 3 days a week and using slut-lamps fueled with grease stolen from behind Burger King for light...

Only the grease that's too rancid for even a HUNGRY old man to eat, that is....

[PlanetBev]

41. Swell

I'll be 55 this November. Looks like I'll be part of the crowd taking it up the ass.

[BiggJawn]

50. Yeah, I'm 47...

I'll be taking it further up the ass than you...

Need any good "Slut-Lamp" construction hints?

[Sandpiper]

61. You'll be joined by my Mom, Mother in Law, and Father in Law

Who are 48, 49, and 54 years old respectively.

My dad's the only one who will make the cut at 55.

[bmbmd]

42. I say never retire-

keep our good jobs and let those under thirty work at Mickey D's.

[Bryn]

44. Democrats - Kick Bush's SS Plan Out of Door!

I will be 55 in 6 months and plan to retire this October. Looks like I'd be screwed! I've paid into Social Security for 36 years. I will be very shocked if Bush manages to get it pass. I still believe SS should be there even for younger people. Many people will be subjected to Predatory Markets/Stock Brokers, etc. etc. What about widows and the disabled?? This is so unAmerican! :(

Bryn

[Itsthetruth]

52. Those Under 55 Will Have Their Social Security Benefits Cut!

Here's another way of presenting it:

WASHINGTON (AP) - Social Security benefits promised to workers who are currently under 55 years old would be changed under President Bush's call for voluntary personal accounts for younger Americans. Republican congressional officials said Wednesday, citing information provided by the administration.

The decision means those 54 and under would be subject to a cut in their promised starting Social Security benefit when they retire.

Think that idea will fly amound younger workers? That's the message that must get out. Under Bush's plan, if you're under 55 years old now you will have your benefits cut. Bush promises that!

The fund is not broke. Don't "fix" it!

[Roland99]

47. And they've been flat-out wrong on...

WMDs
Cost of Iraq War
Cost of Medicare Prescription Drug program


Why the hell should we believe them now?

[RebelOne]

53. I'm not worried about my benefits because I filed for social

security in April 1994. I am receiving the maximum benefit and just received an increase. I am now collecting $1200 a month, plus I am still working because I can't afford to live on just that amount every month. Even with the social security payments, I cannot afford to quit work. Looks like I will probably be working until I die. I have a 401K, but that will not cover my living expenses for too long if I retire. But I am worried about my children who may lose out if the moron's new social security overhaul is passed.

[LibDemAlways]

55. Chimp will not get this passed in

the current Congress. He's floating a trial balloon which will sink like lead. There are millions of baby boomers of all political stripes who are never going to stand for this, and even repukes will be under tremendous pressure to shitcan it.

[AngryWhiteLiberal]

57. Call it hard-hearted, but I secretly hope for another stock market crash.

How soon we forget the lessons of the Great Depression.

Dems should be running ads and talking points showing families affected by the late 20s stock market crash, which brought on the Depression.

Private accounts are great as long as market volatility isn't a factor...which is IMPOSSIBLE.

JB

[AirAmFan]

58. Doesn't the term "no cut in STARTING benefits" raise concerns

for everyone, incuding those 55 and older?

The AP headline, "Bush plan won't affect 55 and up", is A BALD-FACED LIE!

Rethuglicans have proposed changing the way in which annual increases in monthly benefits are calculated to compensate for inflation. This would provide an incentive for inflating the dollar that would become irresistible as the bills for Dubya's spending spree and income tax largesse to the very rich come due.

Within ten or twenty years, even those now 55 would suffer substantial loss of spending power, compared to what they are guaranteed now under current law. Those younger than 55 woudl suffer a double cut, including a lower starting benefit as well as incomplete compensation for accelerated inflation.

Also, Republicans might eliminate the early-retirement option most rational people choose: retirement at age 62 with a reduced benefit, compared to what they'd receive at "normal retirement age". Elimination of the early retirement option would be especially unfair to African-Americans, who have a greater tendency not to live long enough to afford waiting until "normal retirement age".

[SoCalDem]

59. Thanking my lucky stars that I am 56

How sad for people who are between 45 and 54.. They are in for a rough road.. The trend these days is for "downsizing" of those people and their wages can actually decline.. In past times, the prime earning years were the last 10-15 of one's career...and now it seems as those are the prime years for layoffs and walmart :(

[Sandpiper]

60. That sucks for my 54 year old Father in Law

After paying into SS for over 30 years, he now has 11 years to save for his retirement.

[FreeStateDemocrat]

62. Sucker born every minute no matter what your age.

Repukes are divisive so it is divide and conquer. When the chimp and the repukes get done with this legislation we will all have our collective ass hanging out. What they say and how the final bill will be written will not be known to after it is passed and worked over by the house-senate conferees. The Democratic Party cannot allow them the opportunity to dismantle Social Security. This is only the beginning. Anyone over 54 that thinks they are safe is both selfish and really delusional. If they don’t get you today they will eventually squeeze everyone out in the near future. No surrender, no compromise on Social Security.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

63. I guess that I'm screwed then. I'm 53. n/t

[katinmn]

68. I'm 48. Sucks from here, too.

[GHOSTDANCER]

65. Then 55 and older shouldn't be able to vote on it!!!!

[2Design]

73. don't worry - we are not all stupid - the only ones who will believe

this are repubs - and there are a number of them in the over 55 range - they are the ones who own the stocks that they want to rise using younger people as fodder - they are the ones who own two houses and their second home is 300,000 and more -

they cheer when people are laid off and their stock goes up -

[yorkiemommie1]

66. as a leading edge boomer

i do not believe a word the GOP says and i resent their trying to screw the younger generation, ie; our kids.

i firmly believe that this is an administration that believes in a take it or leave it, sink or swim philosophy; they plan to disembowel
everything that the middle and lower classes can cling to for survival.

it's lies, all lies.

[GOPBasher]

70. My source says his plan will be the BEST THING EVER!!

My source is the psychic friends network.

[Megahurtz]

71. So he doesn't care about the millions people in the middle

who are stuck in a giant Fuck Sandwich???

Eat your OWN sandwich you LYING THIEF!!!:argh:

[DainBramaged]

72. May the framers of this shit brained scheme get genital warts

[MasonJar]

74. Most of us in that category are more concerned with the future of

our children and grandchildren.

[Mari333]

76. So much for my widow's benefits ..Im 53

and my husband paid into SS for years. Bush policies already killed my husband, will I lose my SS widows benefits also?
Bush can rot in hell.

[jdj]

77. they don't trust you dumbass. you just killed their grandkids in iraq.