Popes should retire at 80 for the sake of the church, cardinals say

[emad]

The Times
By Ruth Gledhill


FUTURE Popes will have to retire at a fixed age, under secret plans being discussed by Roman Catholic cardinals, ending a tradition of service until death that has lasted two millennia.

According to senior Church sources, cardinals who will meet in conclave to elect the next Pope have discussed among themselves the need to choose someone who is open to a retirement age, probably 80.

They do not want a repeat of the past few years, when the ill-health of Pope John Paul II, 84, has forced him to take an increasingly light hand in directing the Church, responsible for the spiritual health of 1.1 billion believers.

The Church has, in effect, been run by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, the ultraconservative head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, whose nickname is John Paul III but who, at 77, is considered too old to succeed him, and Cardinal Angelo Sodano, the Secretary of State.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-1468211,00.html

[emad]

1. String pulling?:

Also at the heart of every decision is Joaquín Navarro-Valls, the celibate Opus Dei member, a qualified doctor who is the Pope’s press officer and most-trusted adviser.

...

“Although the Pope by his suffering has given witness, everyone knows that in terms of hands-on operation, he has not been hands-on for quite a bit now, for 18 months to two years.”

...

“There is a large body of opinion among the cardinals that there should be a retirement age of 80 for the next Pope,” the source said.

...

Popes can abdicate, but hardly ever do. When the Pope’s health went into serious decline, there was speculation in Rome that he might invoke Article 332 of the Code of Canon Law and retire early, to Poland. But the Pope, like most of his predecessors, did not consider it his right and believed that it was up to God to decide when his papacy should end.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-1468211,00.html

[shadowknows69]

2. Amen to that

let the poor guy retire already. I don't think God is going to hold it against him.

[rayofreason]

13. Maxwell silver hammer

I thought that there was only one way for a Pope to retire.

[emad]

3. Possible successors: The Times

Dionigi Tettamanzi, Archbishop of Milan, 70: small and rotund, bears passing resemblance to the much-loved Pope John XXIII (Tettamanzi was once referred to by a Scottish cardinal as “that wee fat guy”). Conservative on doctrinal issues but has reputation as social reformer with concern for underdog. Milan, Italy’s largest diocese, is traditional springboard to the papacy.
Odds from Paddy Power: 5-2

Francis Arinze of Nigeria, 72: The most likely black Pope. Urbane, astute and charming, acceptable to both Third World and West. Impeccable English (he studied in London). Expert on Islam, formerly longtime head of the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue. Is now head of the Congregation for Divine Worship, a move designed to give him experience of inner workings of Church.
Odds: 3-1

Claudio Hummes of Brazil, Archbishop of Sao Paulo, 70: One of strongest Latin American candidates. Born in southern Brazil of German parentage. Reputation as progressive, sympathetic to labour movements and poor, but theologically traditionalist. A Franciscan, episcopal motto is “We Are All Brothers”. Admired by Pope. Brazil has one of largest Catholic populations.
Odds: 3-1

Oscar Andres Rodriguez Maradiaga of Honduras, Archbishop of Tegucigalpa, 62: other leading Latin American contender. A Salesian. Brilliant linguist, plays piano and flies planes. Fierce defender of downtrodden and noted for first-hand acquaintance with Third World poverty. Personally charming, noted for dry humour. Said criticism of Church paedophilia scandals exaggerated.
Odds: 10-1

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-1468045,00.html

LOUSY ODDS: bet Shrub is sliming for a US Cardinal to be given the top job.

[Az_lefty]

9. Cardinal Francis Arinze gets my vote.

[happyslug]

15. Background

Cardinal Francis Arinze, Prefect of the Congregation of Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments, was born on 1 November 1932 in Eziowelle, a city of the Archdiocese of Onitsha, Nigeria. At the age of 15, he began his secondary studies at the All Hallows Seminary (Ognissanti) of Nuewi, studies which he concluded in 1950 at Enugu. For the following two years he taught at the same seminary until 1953, when he took up philosophy studies at Bigard Memorial Seminary at Enugu. In 1955 he began to take courses in theology at the Pontifical Urban University. Only three years later he was ordained to the priesthood during a ceremony which took place at the church of the Pontifical Urban University in Rome on 23 November 1958.

From 1961-1962, he was professor of liturgy and also taught logic and basic philosophy at Bigard Memorial Seminary at Enugu. He was then appointed regional secretary for Catholic education for the eastern part of his country. When transferred to London, he took courses at the Institute of Pedagogy, earning a diploma in 1964.

On 6 July 1965 he was appointed to the titular church of Fissiana and named coadjutor to the Archbishop of Onitsha. On 29 August 1965 he was consecrated bishop. Only two years after he was asked to take over the pastoral government of the archdiocese, and on 26 June 1967 he was named archbishop.

In 1979 his brother bishops elected him president of the Catholic Bishops’ Conference of Nigeria, which post he filled until 1984, when John Paul II asked him to head as pro-president the Secretariat for Non-Christians (now the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue).

He remained Archbishop of Onitsha until April 1985, while awaiting the nomination of his successor to assume the pastoral administration of the Archdiocese. In addition, in 1982 he was elected vice-president for Africa of the United Bible Society.

Created and proclaimed Cardinal by John Paul II in the consistory of 25 May 1985. Titular church, S. Giovanni della Pigna (diaconia elevated pro hac vice to title of cardinal priest, 29 January 1996).

President of the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue, 27 May 1985 - 1 October 2002.

On 8 May 1994, he presided in the capacity of first President Delegate at the solemn closing of the Special Assembly for Africa of the Synod of Bishops at the altar of the Chair of St. Peter’s Basilica.

On 24 October 1999 he received a gold medallion from the International Council of Christians and Jews for his "outstanding achievements in inter-faith relations".

He was also a member of the Committee of the Great Jubilee of the Year 2000.

On 1 October 2002 he was nominated Prefect of the Congregation of Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments.

Curial membership:

* Doctrine of the Faith, Oriental Churches, Causes of Saints, Evangelization of Peoples (congregations)
* Laity, Christian Unity, Culture (councils)
* International Eucharistic Congresses (committee)
* Ordinary Council of the General Secretariat of the Synod of Bishops
* Special Council for Africa and Special Council for Lebanon of the General Secretariat of the Synod of Bishops

http://www.catholic-pages.com/hierarchy/cardinals_bio.asp?ref=53

[sam sarrha]

4. Why ?? God doesnt care how old or sick you get.. no problem

[flordehinojos]

5. does the cardinal have a secret wish to become pope?

[Bridget Burke]

8. Since only cardinals are in the running.....

(not by actual Church law but by custom) their concern about the Pope's health may not be the only reason they want him to retire.

[happyslug]

6. Previous Thread on this subject, slight different topic

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1203707

Some background on the Cardinals:
List of Today's Cardinals
http://www.catholic-pages.com/hierarchy/cardinals_list.asp

List of All Cardinals 1903 till present:
http://www.fiu.edu/~mirandas/a-z-all.htm

Background on the College of Cardinals:
http://www.catholic-pages.com/hierarchy/cardinals.asp

[phasev]

7. 1.1 billion

They do not want a repeat of the past few years, when the ill-health of Pope John Paul II, 84, has forced him to take an increasingly light hand in directing the Church, responsible for the spiritual health of 1.1 billion believers.

If that's the case then 1.1billion are screwed. It's really sad that 1.1billion rely on one man for spiritual guidance. The world is just filled with unimaginative fools.

[noonwitch]

10. Are they saying that people over 80 are not capable of being pope?

I'm not a catholic, so I ultimately could care less, but I don't like the attitude that people ove 80 are not capable of performing the job of pope.

I rather like JPII. Because I'm not a catholic, he has no authority over me, but I repect the fact that when he was younger, he travelled greatly outside of the Vatican, he has always been an advocate for peace, and he is consistent in his beliefs. I don't agree with all of them, especially those regarding the ordination of women, but again, the pope does not write US law and I'm a protestant.

[Sgent]

11. Its kind of iffy.

The cardinals can pass any rule they want; however, its up to the then sitting pope to either abide by it or ignore it.

Only a pope (JPII) can bind a future pope, and even then only on matters of Catholic dogma.

[Zynx]

12. Well, the issue is how long someone can be kept alive these days

It used to be a slam dunk that you would die before your brain fell apart.

Nowadays, you can keep someone alive for a LOOOONG time. Some age limit makes sense.

[egoprofit]

14. uuuh STOP DRIVING AT 80!!!

[noonwitch]

17. My 92 year old grandpa still drives

Not distances or anything, but he lives 15 miles or so from the nursing home grandma is in and he drives to visit her every day.

He knows his limits-he doesn't drive at night, because of his vision, and doesn't drive long distances, because he doesn't want to fall asleep. He has no signs of senility, is in good health, and could live another decade. Hell, he still changes his own oil, fixes furniture for people and keeps up with his interest in science. He recently got a computer and unfortunately it's only a matter of time before he finds the Free Republic.

I don't ride in the car with him, he drives too damn slow for me.

[flordehinojos]

19. my 96 y/o father does too ... to his part-time work every morning,

and up until she died the beginning of this year, to the hospice where his wife spent the last THREE YEARS of her life...and then back to his ACLF.

[brainshrub]

16. I agree. (eom)

[GoddessOfGuinness]

18. Popes should start living in the 21st century for the sake of the church