Teen goes into cardiac arrest after cop uses stun gun

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-0502090253feb09,1,4835831,print.story?coll=chi-news-hed

A 14-year-old boy went into cardiac arrest Monday and was unconscious at a Chicago hospital Tuesday after police shot him with a Taser stun gun, officials said.

The boy, a state ward who lives at a residential group home on the North Side, became enraged Monday morning when he was asked to remove his baseball cap. He then broke four windows and battered three workers at the home run by Uhlich Children's Advantage Network, Chicago police said.

Police said the boy lunged at a sergeant, who shot him with the Taser, a weapon that applies a powerful electrical jolt.

Officials in the Cook County public guardian's office gave a different account. They said that when police arrived the boy was no longer violent and was sitting on a couch.

"It sounds really crazy," Public Guardian Robert Harris said. "To harm him even more they were called to help? I'm not trying to say this kid was some saint in the situation, but it just makes you wonder."

These stories seem to be almost daily now. I'm thinking the cops need to rethink their quick resolution to Tasers. While Pepper Spray can also be dangerous I don't think it's caused near the deaths and problems that seem to be happening with Tasers.

[thecai]

1. Deadly Tasers

From what I understand, these tasers are equipped to deliver as many jolts as the operator delivers. Perhaps the officers are somewhat "trigger-happy"?
It seems that as long as LE are allowed to abuse their authority, they will.

[WindRavenX]

2. re: trigger happy

Yes, indeed, a big problem is that because the taser is perceived to be "non-lethal", that can lead some to think it's harmless...

[GoddessOfGuinness]

3. I wonder if the kid had heart disease?

I despise the use of tasers on anyone...They seem to encourage mishandling of many situations.

My father was one of many people who suffered a violent, angry outburst a few hours before having the heart attack which ended his life. I know it'd be highly unusual for a 14 year old, and it's certain that the use of a taser did nothing to help matters; but I can't help wondering about the child's health prior to the incident.

[thecai]

5. The Fear Alone

Could trigger a cardiac-arrest.
I'm sorry to hear about your Dad. I worry about my Dad for the same reason. He's already suffered heart problems yet he's an angry, rage-addicted, hostile, extreme, rightwing republican who blows up at every opportunity.

[tom_paine]

6. Wups, I guess you're not a fan of DS9

And I got your monniker totally wrong.

My apologies and welcome to DU!

:toast:

[thecai]

9. I Don't Understand

your post, OR what a DS9 is, but thank you for welcoming me here!:D

[tom_paine]

12. Explaination: DS9 = Deep Space Nine

The Cai was the religious leader of the very religious (but in the good Buddhist or Christian sort of way rather than the anti-Christian Bushevik Way)

Wow! Just got back from a quick Googling. Amazing the stuff out there. The sheer volume.

The evil Kai Winn's "homepage" (found out I was spelling it wrong, too!)

http://www.littlereview.com/goddesslouise/ds9/kaiwinn.htm

In keeping with human nature, there are many fewer sites regarding the "good" Kai, and no homepages...

http://members.tripod.com/visitor_space/ds9list1.html

Then again, you probably don't care.

:evilgrin:

[thecai]

14. Thank You!

For explaining that to me, and for doing all that research. Interesting!
I'm just plain old The CAI - Coalition Against Injustice.
I also think these dangerous tasers are unjust, unwarranted, and uncalled for. LE are trained to restrain "perps" better than that. Especially children. Whatever happened to pinching that little neck muscle to restrain kids? That works better, without causing any harm.

[tom_paine]

21. Imperial Amerika, now rapidly transforming to full Orwellian Tyranny

cares little aboutthe rights of it's victims, beyond the stultified, ritualized motion that need to be followed to keep the Lie going that America is still a Free Nation.

[classof56]

18. Welcome to DU

I empathize with you regarding your dad. My father was a lot like that, made growing up pretty miserable, but he mellowed out as he got older and lived a fairly peaceful life until his death just a couple weeks shy of 86. I was responsible for a long time to make sure his life worked the way it should, treated him only with kindness and love, but always wondered just what caused all the anger, rage and outbursts that created such fear in the child I was. I may be figuring it out now, but just so sad he suffered the agonies that kept him from living the kind of life he could have if he'd let go of the rage. His heart served him well, with a stroke finally ending his life.

Take care!

Tired Old Cynic

[thecai]

20. Thank You, Classof56!

What a friendly and compassionate forum! I'm honored to be here.
I'm sorry to hear about your Dad, too. I've had a dreadful fear of men most of my life, and did not understand why, until counselling a few years ago. I also thought ALL men were abusive.
It sounds like you've done very well, being forgiving and taking such good care of your Dad. Anger is so dangerous and destructive. I think in MY Dad's case, his own Dad was angry and unLoving, so it affected everyone, even generations later.
You take care, too! Thanks again!

The 14 year old taser victim may have suffered from anger and rage, since he was a ward of the state. A lot of heart-ache accompanies foster children. Life is difficult enough already.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

23. "angry, rage-addicted, hostile, extreme, rightwing republican"

fits the description of my dad pretty well, though he was not as extremist as many.

Maybe expressing your concern to your dad would make him consider getting help for himself?

[thecai]

24. AAAHHHH!

Believe me, I've tried, but he actually thinks he's PERFECT, FLAWLESS, and that I AM the one with the problem! He hates it when he is unable to provoke me, it makes him ANGRIER!
We've all learned to just pacify him and not discuss religion or politics with him. It's really sad. He thinks Bush is God's gift to the planet.

[bullimiami]

4. a potentially deadly weapon

they have been waging a tv campaign about how they are safe.

just like guns they should be used only as a last resort and the police need to be under the same scrutiny they are after a shooting incedent.

[thecai]

8. Deadly, Not Safe

Original stun-guns were advertised as "capable of rendering the victim a helpless, quivering, mound of flesh", which was simply a sales pitch. LE quit using them because they were ineffective, and felt no worse than a bee-sting. These new tasers ARE powerful and dangerous, and IMO, should NEVER be used on children, and should NEVER be used in excess.

[makhno]

7. This was supposed to be a substitute for lethal force

Not a substitute for forcefully subduing an unarmed suspect. Would the police have shot the kid had they not had a Taser? It seems unlikely.

[Ezlivin]

10. Next Taser model: The Taser Defillabrator

The police can stop and start your heart from a safe distance.

Don't want to cooperate with law enforcement officers? They shut down your heart.

Being a nice, cooperative "perp"? They start your heart.

It's really the next wave in law enforcement: Total Cardiac Control.

[CBGLuthier]

11. Tasers should be used instead of guns

Not instead of hands and nightsticks.

And I am not saying a cop should never use a gun. Sadly it is a fact of life that such things have to happen.

But the cops have been sold a pack of lies that the taser is safe.

[ernstbass]

13. This madness has to stop

[ticapnews]

15. This was all the kid's fault...

He was a ward of the state. He should have chosen to be born into a wealthy family. Then he wouldn't have to leech off us decent, hard-working folk and he might have some respect for authority.

Damn kids.

Signed,
Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh

[MadHound]

16. Geez, don't these cops get any instruction

On how to take down a person without resorting to weapons? This simply apalls me. I mean really now, even if the kid was behaving as they say he was, he is still a fourteen year old kid, and can be controlled without having to resort to tasers, guns, or excessive force.

This is just lazy police work. Rather than take the kid down with their hands, bodies and knowledge of martial arts, they just pull their taser out and zap him.

And cops wonder why they have such a bad rap, well it is because of shit like this.

[sendero]

17. this bullshit..

..... is not going to stop until someone wins a multimillion dollar lawsuit against a big city. And from the looks of things, it won't be long.

[Gman]

19. No offense, but...

from the cops I've known over the years, there is very little difference between cops and common criminals except one wears a badge. I've drank beer, laughed and talked with many cops. The common thing among them is that these fucks get a kick out of the things they do and are able to get away with because of their badge. I've heard it all.

Ever know or heard of an ex-cop. I guarantee you one thing, where there's an ex-cop, there's one hell of a story why he's an ex-cop. I know of one and only one exception to the ex-cop rule. That's a guy that quit the San Antonio police force to become a priest. He now works at the San Antonio Archdiocese office.

And as for cops in suburbs of big cities, its safe to assume that 1)they couldn't do enough pushups to get on the force of the bigger city or 2) they failed the background check. Generally, these are the cops with the biggest attitudes.

But you're not supposed to say any of these things publicly as the reason we see all these tasering stories. The police force spokesperson will talk about all the fine men and women that serve their city honorably ad nauseum and how you were attacking these fine public servants. Bullshit! That spokesperson knows the real truth but would never say it publicly either. City, state and other officials will never acknowledge it either. To do so would destroy the facade of credibility of public protection and cause widespread anarchy which is arguably worse, but I'm not sure why.

It just so happens that the police will do some good things like capture a crook or shoot a bad guy that is shooting other people. What they don't talk about publicly is how much fun they had beating the crap out of the crook or the kick they got out of shooting the bad guy. So in an application of the law of unintended consequences, cops end up doing some good too. Don't think so? Ever heard of the "course" they laughingly refer to as "Creative Report Writing"? Usually these creative reports refer to incidents like "suspects face struck the officer's fist" and crap like that.

So tasering is something cops do then go drink beer later and laugh among theirselves. You could overhear a conversation that goes something like, "...and you shoulda seen the look on the kid's face when I hit 'em with the taser! BWAAAAHAHAHAHA!!!". None of this shit surprises me. It's typical.

[thecai]

22. I'm Sorry To Say...

That's very truthful, Gman.
Don't get me wrong, I believe UPRIGHT Law Enforcement are HEROES. Unfortunately, those who abuse their authority are the most dangerous criminals of all.

[thecai]

25. Pepper Spray

DOES seem like a much safer alternative.
But I wonder why the witness accounts do not match the LE's?

[sendero]

26. Let me ask you something...

.. if you did something stupid and knew you put your entire career, the cities budget and your public reputation, would you lie?

Because please explain to me the possible motive for the bystanders to lie.

[thecai]

27. Motive

Good question! I cannot think of ANY motive for the witnesses to lie, but I can think of a few good reasons the LE would lie. Namely, putting his entire career, the city's budget, and his public reputation on the line for doing something stupid.:hurts:

[MrSlayer]

28. Sounds like the cop did the right thing to me.

The kid was acting like a maniac and should have been tasered. Acting like that for simply being asked to remove his hat is ridiculous and completely unacceptable. Lunging at a cop is also not a very smart move, I don't fault the officer at all for protecting himself.

[genieroze]

29. But

Officials in the Cook County public guardian's office gave a different account. They said that when police arrived the boy was no longer violent and was sitting on a couch.

[MrSlayer]

30. Did he lunge at the cop?

The story says he did. If he did he deserves the taser, if he didn't I'm sure there will be an investigation.

[thecai]

31. An Investigation

Sure, there's a possibility there will be an investigation. How thorough, we will never know, will we?
Prison guards where I live were just given tactical training on ways to subdue inmates, WITHOUT using weapons. Why aren't police trained to subdue children as well? Is it because they CAN use weapons?

[BiggJawn]

32. Saw a cop with one in his belt today...

"Ooooh! Is that your Cattle Prod?"

He just glared at me.

Guess I'm a Marked Man, now....