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Memo urged Rice to meet on Al-Qaeda before Sept. 11 attacks (Clarke)

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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:17 PM
Original message
Memo urged Rice to meet on Al-Qaeda before Sept. 11 attacks (Clarke)
Edited on Thu Feb-10-05 05:17 PM by underpants
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/usattacksriceqaeda

WASHINGTON (AFP) - Eight months before the September 11, 2001, attacks, the White House's then counterterrorism adviser urged then national security adviser Condoleezza Rice (news - web sites) to hold a high-level meeting on the Al-Qaeda network, according to a memo made public.


"We urgently need such a principals-level review on the Al-Qaeda network," then White House counterterrorism adviser Richard Clarke wrote in the January 25, 2001 memo.


Clarke, who left the White House in 2003, made huge headlines in the heat of the US presidential campaign last year when he accused the Bush White House of having ignored Al-Qaeda's threats before September 11.

However, Rice wrote in a March 22, 2004 column in The Washington Post, "No Al-Qaeda threat was turned over to the new administration."

The document was released by the National Security Archive, an independent group that solicits government documents for public review.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
2. Well yeah, The USS Cole had just been bombed
didn't Bush give a shit about the sailors killed? Not much apparently.
Tax cuts and ANWR drilling topped the agenda.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Wasn't Clinton still in when
the Cole was bombed? I remember a father of one of the sailors on tv blaming Clinton.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Yes that was in October 2000
that was half way around the world under a DoD initiative began years before so of course it was Clinton's fault, had to be.

W takes credit for 9/11. Sleep well.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. Right! But I don't play
by their book. 9/11 was condi's and bush's fault. The evidence is mounting..if I were a family member of a victim of 9/11..this latest memo would have me calling for justice!
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Griffy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #14
70. LINK TO MEMO here
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #70
96. I just read the entire thing. Sickening. It was all there.
Many of my hubby's co-workers died in 9/11 at the WTC.

May these people rot.

Damn them, damn them.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. 8 months prior to 9/11 was in January
as in Inauguration Day Jan. 20th?

It is not exactly 8 months but this basically showed that Clarke was still on it but the Bushies ignored the threat (Paul O'Neill backs this up in his book) as it was something Clinton had determined as a priority. They reversed or ignored anything Clinton related.

BTW- W&Co's focus groups told them not to say "We had ONLY been in office 8 months" they said "We had ONLY been in office 233 days" this change was ironically made on W's 233rd day outside of DC during his pResidency.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. Well that's 33 weeks, 160 working days
160 working days! and that's taking out holidays!!!
that's over 1000 hours. 1000 hours!!!
These people were, and are clueless.
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #15
23. You forgot all those vacation days.
Hadn't Bush had at least 2 months vacation by 9/11? I think so. I think it was much more than that.
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reprobate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #15
34. Wrong! They were NOT clueless. They were complicit.

To have ignored all the warning they were given was not clueless. In my mind it would have to have been intentional. Even the most incompetent manager would surely have asked some questions about the fifty two warnings to the FAA, and the warnings from Clark, and all the others.

No, they were not clueless. I keep wanting to temper my cynicism and say that they Let It Happen On Purpose. But any group that could pull together all the political skill to steel a couple of elections would have to have been at least semi-conscious enough to have put some roadblocks in the path of the hijackers.

No, my friend, they were not clueless. They did exactly what they intended. Remember the PNAC documents that predicted that their goals would not be achieved without a "New American Pearl Harbor"? That was not a lament. That was a statement of intent.

OK, I'll stop beating about the bush and come out and say it clearly.

Everything they've done, from the 2000 election to 9/11 to the Iraq invasion to the 2004 election to this moment has been the BIGGEST CONSPIRACY OF TREASON by any group in government in the United States against it's citizens that has ever been perpetrated.

Sorry for the shouting but as an American who fought for his country I get emotional about this. And nothing is done about it

God Help America.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #34
60. LIHOP definitely and heavily leaning toward MIHOP
Really can't come to any other conclusion here. Everytime I think of ** using his 'Lucky me, I hit the Trifecta' sick joke, I feel like :puke:
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #60
67. There is simply too much evidence that they saw it coming!!!
The neoCONspirators were told over and over and over again that a threat of attack by AlQ was imminent.

Is it merely "complicit" to do nothing when you know it's going to happen?

That is why I am moving from LIHOP towards MIHOP!!!

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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #67
73. You and me both.
They weren't incompetent and being complicit leads to only one conclusion........MIHOP. I would like those here who can't wrap their minds around LIHOP in light of the 52 warnings explain why they don't believe in LIHOP, nevermind MIHOP?
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #67
98. It could have been stopped--easily. LIHOP/MIHOP no longer matters.
It's the ignorance, incompetence, and thwarting of anything Clinton that caused those people, some of whom were my husband's co-workers, to die.
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #34
97. They could have prevented it. That's all that matters.
This is the point we need to get out to the media and the public.

LIHOP/MIHOP is no longer important. We just have to stress tirelessly that they HAD ALL THE INFO THEY NEEDED.

If a bunch of us sitting on our asses in our jammies can see that action was called for, then these are the most incompetent fools on the planet.

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lefthandedskyhook Donating Member (340 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #97
107. That's right - - Here's what matters...
No credible case can now be made that Rice did her job. We can now rule out any case for competence.

Where is the oversight that is supposed to be built into our system of government through checks and balances? It is time to purge the filth out of congress and breathe new life into our democracy.
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HysteryDiagnosis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #34
111. It's like living in a Stephen King movie.... ain't it?? EOM.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
30. In fairness to Dick Cheney.
He was mighty damn busy with his Energy Task Force planning the Iraqi invasion and divvying up the oilfields to be worried about some small time criminal-terrorists. He had his priorities, afterall.
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PurityOfEssence Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. Not to mention killing all those small, confused farm-raised birdies
He's killed, for sport, more than eight hundred birds so far since he became consigliere. So sad to be so mean.

By the way, where the hell's Mary? She never spoke out about her abuse at the hands of the Democrats, but let her Mommy and sister do it for her. For someone whose professional career has been made through connections and SPECIFICALLY trading on the sexuality that she betrays, a word or two might be expected...

But I digress.

The deep greed and selfishness of this family is incredible.
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shaolinmonkey Donating Member (812 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. I believe Bush's response was something like:
"I'm not going to fire a million dollar missle at a $10 tent to hit a camel in the ass."

I remember Clinton actually responding to the fact that Iraq plotted to assassinate GHW Bush. Bush obviously didn't support the troops then. What a shitheel.
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Jawja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 08:01 AM
Response to Reply #2
47. Tax Cuts, ANWR, and
ENRON. That's when Kenny Boy's company was ripping off California. The so-called "Energy Crisis" topped the agenda - Dick Cheney's pet project.

Terrorism was not on their agenda. And ever since it was FORCED onto their agenda, they have used it to the max.
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Oreo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
3. Why didn't Clarke produce the memo during the hearings?
If he wrote the memo... could he release it if it had "sensitive info" on it? If not... why dind't he let people know about it?
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phantom power Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. well, nobody wanted to "bias the elections", with anything gauche
like, say, the truth.
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librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. it has only just now been cleared for release
I'll bet he was itching to do it during the hearings, but not allowed.
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Been Fishing Donating Member (161 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #3
21. Read Richard Clarke's book "Against All Enemies"
Also, visit the progressive site:

http://www.tcf.org/INDEX.asp
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #21
65. I read that book; it was great and Clarke tried many times to get
Condi to take the terrorists seriously. SHe kept demoting Clarke to lower levels. Then KERBOOM! 9-11.

I tried to get some conservatives to read the book and all they responded with was basically that Clarke was that liar.
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against all enemies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 10:11 PM
Response to Reply #3
77. The memos belong to the government, not to Clarke.
Remember the trouble Sandy Berger got into for reportedly taking classified memos from a government file room. Memos he had written.
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lefthandedskyhook Donating Member (340 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #3
104. It was classified at the time
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Osamasux Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #3
105. He is on record repeatedly asking for the release of all documents.
This memo was not Clarke's to release. Nor were any of the others. They were still classified. Clarke did everything he could to get the word out.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. So that proves con-rice
is a dirty little liar?
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sonicx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
9. wasn't this basically known already?


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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Yes just like the 52 warnings pre-9/11 and the mouse DNA story
I think the MSM is just clearing out the files of things they dared not report during the campaigns.
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Mike Niendorff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
13. rated a 5.

MDN


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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. I rated, too..and like
the girls said in "Barbershop 2" last night.."You'd think with all that money that condi could afford a makeover"!
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Osamasux Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #13
106. Good idea. Thanks for the reminder.
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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
16. They tried stashing these documents away in the dead of night.
Thanks to the journalists that showed them the light of day. The documents merely prove what Clarke told us already.

A terrible lack of judgment and failure by Rice. In a rational administration, this would result in termination. In the corrupt Bush administration, it results in promotion.

The nightmare continues as Rice now embarasses the US as Secretary of State.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. Yes! Because without 9/11 bush
would be scramblin' brush in crawford.
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SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
18. Condi is incompetent
She is locked up in a realm of her own ideas, and pays no attention to reality. Her brainpower consistently goes to waste.

She had every conceivable warning, yet failed the nation pathetically on 9/11. History will judge her harshly.
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. Condaliar with her hands in the Bushie jar.
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Robert Oak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
20. read "against all enemies", his book
It's quite shocking to see how badly the Bush administration bungled
this and amazing that they are considered "strong on terror"...
as well as read for yourself how a blow job keep Clinton from doing his job.
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
24. Good old Henry Waxman.
Henry Waxman and Carolyn Maloney:

... California Rep. Henry Waxman, ranking Democrat on the Government Reform Committee, asked for a hearing on whether the Bush administration played politics with the report's release. The letter, also signed by Rep. Carolyn Maloney, D-N.Y., said the committee should probe whether the report was delayed until after the November elections and the confirmation of Condoleezza Rice as secretary of state...
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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #24
55. Waxman is a hero for truth.
He looks like an accountant but he is as tough and relentless as a badger. Thanks to the People of California for putting him in Congress!
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Babel_17 Donating Member (948 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 06:51 PM
Response to Original message
25. Great post but here's the link .....
I think you meant to insert.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20050210/pl_afp/usattacksriceqaeda_050210221506

Took some searching but worth it. :)
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Osamasux Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #25
110. Gave it a 5
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 06:57 PM
Response to Original message
26. kick
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Blower Donating Member (195 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
27. Well...
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Massachusetts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
28. Impeachment.....When?
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Mel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #28
94. Democrats will have to take back the House
as Randi Rhodes says you gotta give me the House that's where we 'Democrats' can stop Bush* it's where the articles for impeachment start.
I'm not seeing impeachment happen in the Republican (which is full of filthy NeoCon Religious Right Wackos) controlled House doing a damn thing to stop Bush*.
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #28
100. For a trivial thing like an attack on US soil and the deaths of
three thousand people?

No, we need to save the people's business for a little stain on a blue dress. Perspective, perspective.

/sarcasm off/
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cal04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
29. Bush Administration's First Memo on al-Qaeda Declassified
Edited on Thu Feb-10-05 09:17 PM by cal04
Bush Administration's First Memo
on al-Qaeda Declassified
January 25, 2001 Richard Clarke Memo:
"We urgently need . . . a Principals level
review on the al Qida network."

Document Central to Clarke-Rice Dispute on Bush Terrorism Policy Pre-9/11
National Security Archive Electronic Briefing Book No. 147
Edited by Barbara Elias
February 10, 2005

http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB147/index.htm
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Lizzie Borden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 10:44 PM
Response to Original message
31. kick
:kick: :kick:
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-10-05 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. The CIA report of 911 was supposed to be released...
two months before the election. It has STILL not been released. Supposedly that report assigns accountabilty for the FAILURES.

We are living in a Fascist Amerika, folks.
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Sleepless In NY Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
35. January 2001 Memo Warned Bush of Al Qaeda Threat
January 2001 Memo Warned Bush of Al Qaeda Threat
Thu Feb 10, 2005 10:09 PM ET

By JoAnne Allen
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A newly released memo warned the White House at the start of the Bush administration that al Qaeda represented a threat throughout the Islamic world, a warning that critics said went unheeded by President Bush until the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

The memo dated Jan. 25, 2001 -- five days after Bush took office -- was an essential feature of last year's hearings into intelligence failures before the attacks on New York and Washington. A copy of the document was posted on the National Security Archive Web site on Thursday.

The memo, from former counterterrorism chief Richard Clarke to then-national security adviser Condoleezza Rice, had been described during the hearings but its full contents had not been disclosed.

Clarke, a holdover from the Clinton administration, had requested an immediate meeting of top national security officials as soon as possible after Bush took office to discuss combating al Qaeda. He described the network as a threat with broad reach. http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=7600332

Also on Yahoo if you wamt to rate it: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=615&e=6&u=/nm/security_clark_memo_dc


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UL_Approved Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
Here is the link from the picture link from the Reuters article
This is the scanned PDF of the entire memo from Richard Clarke to the White House:

Richard Clarke memo to the White House, January 25, 2001
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Toucano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 09:48 PM
Response to Original message
74. Thank you.
That's the most interesting thing I've read in quite some time.

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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
Of course: They knew- HE knew...
...but how could he 'hit the trifecta' without some type of national emergency? Besides, I think he threatened Afghanistan and some factions of alQueda with his 'carpet of gold or carpet of bombs' threat before it happened. It was all part of the plan, IMO.

Either MIHOP, or LIHOP, one or the other. No revelation there.

Now, when can we lock that sonofabitch and his cabal up someplace cold and dark, where they belong? That's the problem....the REAL terrorists are still out there, and they're running the US gov't.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
I wish they'd do the headlines up right!
IDIOT WASTED EIGHT MONTHS; COULD HAVE SAVED THOUSANDS OF LIVES AND BILLIONS OF TAX DOLLARS

ASLEEP AT THE SWITCH

IS R PRETZELDUNCE READING? APPARENTLY NOT!

On a more serious note, I guess Berger is feeling a little vindicated at this point in time.
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Sleepless In NY Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
Why is it they are never held accountable?
Fighting terrorism, was suppose to be bush's strongest point, yet after all we have learned, its his weakest. Yet he's allowed to continue the charade. I just don't understand it. Is there no one in office that will stand up to him and say "You neglected your duties and now we are going to hold you accountable for it." No one?? This report was kept under wraps so it wouldn't effect the election. And why shouldn't it have effected the election? You add this, and 52 warnings, warnings from other countries, high level of chatter, ignoring Richard Clarke & a PDB that said Bin Laden was determined to attack within the United States while he spends 45% of his time vacationing and looking to get tax cuts. And no one raises an eyebrow. The whole thing is obscene.
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
101. Our "great leader" is a hopeless patsy and incompetent to boot.
He's led by his nose by Rove and Co., he's really little more than a patsy mouthpiece.

They have to keep propping up that meme even though the evidence indicates quite the contrary.

Just keep saying he's a patsy and incompetent at that.
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Massachusetts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 08:07 AM
Response to Original message
48. Story buried on page A17 of the Boston Globe
but Charles and his babe get front page coverage.

Not enough Americans care, therefore no OUTRAGE.:mad:
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Cooley Hurd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
L-I-H-O-P ain't no pancake house...
It's now abundantly clear that the Bush Admin was repeatedly warned about the "who" and "how" of an attack. It's also abundantly clear that they did NOTHING in response.

As per the PNAC charter, they were just praying for an attack on the US:

http://www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf (Page 63):

Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some
catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor.


:grr::grr::grr:
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radfringe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
gee...
....we would have done something if we had their names, photos, finger prints, eye-scans, travel itinerary and seat numbers...

meanwhile -- the spin is blaming it all on the airlines
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
36. Old news to us traitors at DU...
ignored news by the media and the sheeple.
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BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
37. I know this, you know this, but so what? It won't matter.
The media and the Thugs have already immunized the Chimperor from any blame. The sheeple have closed their minds. Shrub-a-dubya gets a pass up to 9/11.
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fshrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
38. The only way this thing can fly
is if there is another memo, or an objective trace, of the Idiot's reaction, or lack thereof, to it. Which is way more difficult to obtain.
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GetTheRightVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
39. Way to go Mr. Clarke, I have his book, it is a good read
Against All Enemies

:kick:
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Blower Donating Member (195 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
40. Yawn, now let's hold them accountable--

www.ideamouth.com/politics
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Niche Donating Member (687 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
41. Try MANY MEMOS WERE SENT TO THESE CRIMINALS!!!!!
No RECON on 911, NON!!!!! "Because the guy in charge ON HIS FIRST DAY didn't know HIS JOB?????!!!" These murderers! BUSH testifies BEHIND CLOSED DOORS with CHENNEY -- NOT UNDER OATH!!! I CAN'T TAKE THIS ANYMORE - WHY ISN'T THIS CRIMINAL OUT OF OFFICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i'm losing it... just losing my mind...
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Cooley Hurd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
This was just another incident in a long line of traitorous activities....
...by the BFEE (Bush Family Evil Empire). If I had a few days, I'd post the entire list for you...;)
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brainshrub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
42. I think the Bush Administration was warned about 52 times before 9/11.
The successful attack was either the result of great incompetence or treason. I prefer to believe the former because the later is simply to horrible to accept.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #42
44. Funny, I've already accepted the latter.
This was their Reichstag fire. They're very well read in the matters that are important to them.

They knew it was coming. They sat back and waited.

May they never sleep.
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thecai Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
"Their Reichstag Fire"
EXACTLY.
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Barrett808 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #44
45. But they're all on that Ambien, you know
Powell said it's "wonderful stuff."
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #42
102. No disrespect, but the former is an easier "sell," too.
The latter means you are just one o'them Bush-haters.

The former shows some intellect and thought.
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
43. Would this have been a fit subject to question Dr. Rice on?
Or would it have been more "badgering" to find out why she couldn't do her freakin' job?

3,000 people die in a terrorist attack, and the official snoozing at the switch gets promoted. There just isn't any other way to look at it, as far as I can tell.
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Rocky Top Donating Member (53 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
Government Insider Says bush Authorized 911 Attacks
We need to push for a special prosecutor to investigate
This is sick!!!

http://www.rense.com/general57/aale.htm
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Rocky Top Donating Member (53 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
Also see this post!!!!!!!!
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
Bush/Cheney/Rove et al should all be prosecuted for treason.
They knew the danger and did nothing to stop it. They were incompetent or complicit, or both. In either case, they are guilty.
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ashmanonar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
68. mother of the gods...
that's the scariest shit i've EVER seen. EVER.

i wanna leave. i don't wanna be here anymore. something bad is happening...at the same time, i wanna see * and the cronies walking the perp walk...going right down to death row. lining up for the noose.

anyone looking for a good christmas or birthday present for me, that's the one.
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Bridget Burke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 07:57 AM
Response to Original message
46. And why were cockpit guns banned in July of 2001?
They were initially allowed during the great days of "fly me to Havana" skyjacking. Apparently, by 2001, very few pilots were going armed, anyway. Personally, I'd prefer they concentrate on flying the planes. If guns are needed, let the government shell out for federal marshalls.

But--why July 2001?

The Federal Aviation Administration rescinded a rule allowing commercial airline pilots to be armed the same month it received a classified briefing that Osama bin Laden's al-Qaida network may be planning hijackings of U.S. airliners.

www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=27672

(About the same time that Ashcroft announced he'd been warned off commercial airlines.)




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Toucano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #46
75. The article says
"because not one airline took advantage of it."

No one took advantage of the rule so we remove the rule? That just doesn't make any sense.

It's like saying, "Since we haven't had any murders in our town in 40 years, we should remove the rule against murder."
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kodi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 08:11 AM
Response to Original message
49. It reveals the complete arrogance & lack of imagination of the Busheviks
They were warned about al Qada, but did not consider that the threat rose to the level of actionable response.

This gaggle of "board-room warriors" had no capacity for thinking in geurilla warfare terms, even when warned by world-class professonals in this area.

One finds the same ideologically driven value system when the Busheviks examine the global warming issues, environmental issues in geeral and finacial foreign policy issues in particular.

They are complete ostriches when it comes to having the capacity for dealing with things that disrupt their ideology.

By the time of 9/11/01, we now find clear evidence that they underestimated the enemy.

I find it equal to falling asleep while on sentry duty.

In times of war, such people are executed. and I believe George W Bush should be tried for treason, convicted and held in jail for the rest of his natural life, essentially for falling a sleep on sentry duty while occupying the White House.

Bush and his minions may not have LIHOP but they did not show the capacity for leadership in a time of clear and present danger.
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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
50. So KindaSleazyRice Lied? NO! She'd NEVER do that...
...and we just call her that 'cause all us commiepinkolibruls hate black women...

:evilgrin:
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Penndems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
51. Dick Clarke's 1/25/01 memo to Rice has been declassified
Newly released memo warned of al Qaeda threat
Document described during 9/11 hearings
Friday, February 11, 2005 Posted: 8:20 AM EST (1320 GMT)


WASHINGTON (Reuters) -- A newly released memo warned the White House at the start of the Bush administration that al Qaeda represented a threat throughout the Islamic world, a warning that critics said went unheeded by President Bush until the September 11, 2001, attacks.

The memo dated January 25, 2001 -- five days after Bush took office --was an essential feature of last year's hearings into intelligence failures before the attacks on New York and Washington. A copy of the document was posted on the National Security Archive Web site Thursday.

The memo, from former counterterrorism chief Richard Clarke to then-national security adviser Condoleezza Rice, had been described during the hearings but its full contents had not been disclosed.

Clarke, a holdover from the Clinton administration, had requested an immediate meeting of top national security officials as soon as possible after Bush took office to discuss combating al Qaeda. He described the network as a threat with broad reach.
**********************************************************************
Link:
http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/02/11/911.memo.ap/index.html

Link to the National Security Archive:
http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB147/index.htm

The Memo (.pdf file):
http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB147/clarke%20memo.pdf
**********************************************************************
America, judge for yourselves.

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elemnopee Donating Member (92 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #51
52. this is huge
IMHO,these was suppressed till after the election.

It is clear the administration had no foreign policy interest in Al Qaeda prior to 9/11. They only cared about disassociating and preventing international treaties.
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Toucano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #52
76. Did you notice it's Friday?
Watch this fall into the week-end news vortex.
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 10:43 AM
Response to Original message
53. kick -nt
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Penndems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:00 AM
Response to Original message
54. Notice in Dick's memo that he refers to a September 1998
working document on dealing with Al-Qaeda.

So much for those right-wingers who claim the Clinton Administration wasn't on top of this.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #54
56. Sadly that is probably why W and Dick ignored it
Rule Numero UNO for this crowd-anything that Clinton liked/did must be reversed or if that is not possible ignored.

O'Neill states in his book that on 1/23/01 Tenet brought a picture of some kind of industrial plant into the briefing room and Dick and Condi and Rummy (I think) were pouring over it and discussing how it surely was a WMD plant of Saddam's. O'Neill said the obvious "I have seen a lot of industrial sites all over the world (Alcoa) what makes you think this is used to create chemical and biological weapons?" Tenet just looked up and said "anecdotal evidence".

They ignored al Qaeda from day one having returned to their Cold War/1992 ways as if nothing had happened in the last 8 years.

Reverse or ignore.
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Penndems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #56
57. And 2,000 people lost their lives because the Bush Administration
played politics in the name of advancing a personal agenda.

(did you mean Rice vis-a-vis Dick Clarke in your subject line?)
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #57
63. All of them
but it all comes from Dick and Rummy and Rove figures out how to sell it and writes the scripts for Condi and W.
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ewagner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #56
61. Absolutely correct!
In addition to Al Queda on that list you can add.

Clinton's Middle East Initiatives
Clinton's Negotiations with North Korea
Clinton's Negotiations with China
Clinton's COPS program....

the list goes on and on and on and on.........

these are not statesmen....they're idealogues....

check that....

they're EVIL IDEALOGUES
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #61
64. Right----------on NK
I have yet to hear anyone other then the Clinton haters who DOESN'T think that the coal program stopped NK from have produced* ~100 warheads not the 4 or 6 they have.

*note "prodiced" does not necessarily mean that they would still have them now ($$$$$$$).
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zbdent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
58. I tried to find the document on the NSA.gov site
I wanted so much to see it.

Has anybody successfully found it on there? I want to be able to have a RW ass-head to be able to do this, instead of sending them a link that they would claim was a fake.

If someone can find it on the NSA web site, tell me how . . .
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Penndems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #58
59. It's at this link:
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Cocoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
62. picture
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Rocky Top Donating Member (53 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #62
66. The 9/11 Evidence that May Hang George W. Bush
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Griffy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 02:56 PM
Response to Original message
69. MEMO from Richard Clack to Condi Rice, Warning of Al-qida ...
and asks the questions that are needed to take further steps. The release is timed since Condi is "IN". It's perjury a crime ? What did she specifically say, under oath, in the 9-11 commission hearings?

""We urgently need . . . a Principals level
review on the al Qida network."


http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB147/index.htm


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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
71. The heat is on: Waxman and Maloney call for new hearings
condolences to all 9/11 victims... http://www.commondreams.org/news2005/0210-12.htm
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ignatius 2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
72. I read the memo at work today and my jaw hit my desk.
Even though I have read Clarke's book and he had mentioned sending a memo asking for a meeting, reading the details and knowing that for almost 9 months this was totally ignored by the arrogant administration sickened me,

I have suspected all along that the WH was involved in 9-11. For them to put off this meeting until September of 01, makes me even more suspicious. They could now say, as they have and worse, that if only they had known sooner what a threat Al Qaida was they would have done something.

Mass murderers on both sides of the ocean and hell will be too nice a place for them all.

And for Rice to say she hadn't gotten the memo is just another blatant lie for the standard bearers of lying bastards.

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Danieljay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-05 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
78. Link to the actual story...
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Original message
79. '01 Memo to Rice Warned of Qaeda and Offered Plan - NYT
February 12, 2005

'01 Memo to Rice Warned of Qaeda and Offered Plan
By SCOTT SHANE

WASHINGTON, Feb. 11 - A strategy document outlining proposals for eliminating the threat from Al Qaeda, given to Condoleezza Rice as she assumed the post of national security adviser in January 2001, warned that the terror network had cells in the United States and 40 other countries and sought unconventional weapons, according to a declassified version of the document.

The 13-page proposal presented to Dr. Rice by her top counterterrorism adviser, Richard A. Clarke, laid out ways to step up the fight against Al Qaeda, focusing on Osama bin Laden's headquarters in Afghanistan. The ideas included giving "massive support" to anti-Taliban groups "to keep Islamic extremist fighters tied down"; destroying terrorist training camps "while classes are in session" and then sending in teams to gather intelligence on terrorist cells; deploying armed drone aircraft against known terrorists; more aggressively tracking Qaeda money; and accelerating the F.B.I.'s translation and analysis of material from surveillance of terrorism suspects in American cities.

Mr. Clarke was seeking a high-level meeting to decide on a plan of action. Dr. Rice and other administration officials have said that Mr. Clarke's ideas did not constitute an adequate plan, but they took them into consideration as they worked toward a more effective strategy against the terrorist threat.

The proposal and an accompanying three-page memorandum given to Dr. Rice by Mr. Clarke on Jan. 25, 2001, were discussed and quoted in brief by the independent commission studying the Sept. 11 attacks and in news reports and books last year. They were obtained by the private National Security Archive in Washington, which published the full versions, with minor deletions at the request of the Central Intelligence Agency, on its Web site late Thursday.

more
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/12/politics/12clarke.html?pagewanted=print&position=

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radfringe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Original message
taking bets
the last time Clarke's name hit the daily spews-reports - the bushies went after him by accusing him of grandstanding to promote his book

didn't take long for the discredit machine to get rolling

then Clarke's name fell to the wayside

and here he is again -- so how long before bushies rev up the smear machine this time?

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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
80. "but it just wasn't specific enough" said in a whiney tone.
I would like to be around to read the history on this bunch of
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radfringe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-99 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #80
1. yep
didn't include names, photos, home addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, fax numbers, cellphone numbers, fingerprints, medical records, travel itinerary, dates, times and seat numbers of the hijackers

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paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
81. Clarke is looking more vindicated all the time
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 12:10 AM by paulthompson
Here's one little tidbit about him I missed until recently:

On July 6 <2001>, Mr. Clarke sent Ms. Rice a previously undisclosed e-mail message outlining a number of steps agreed on at the meeting, including efforts to examine the threat of weapons of mass destruction and possible attacks in Latin America. One senior administration official said Mr. Clarke wrote that several agencies, including the F.B.I., the C.I.A. and the Pentagon, had been directed to develop what the official said were "detailed response plans in the event of three to five simultaneous attacks." (New York Times, 4/4/04)

Of course, Rice and the agencies just sat on taking any action, but it wasn't for lack of Clarke trying to get something done.

Clarke is co-teaching a class on terrorism at Harvard this semester, and I'm proud to say that my Terror Timeline book is on the list of required readings. :)


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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #81
83. Congrats.
Your Timeline is indispensable.

:toast:


Too bad Clarke was ignored by our ignorant rulers.



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Fridays Child Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #81
85. And it damn well should be. Nothing else even compares to it.
Your timeline will be invaluable to history.
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bluedeminredstate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #81
90. Wow!
I can't tell you how much your work helped me to understand all the different things at play that day - the agencies, the responses, the mistakes, etc. Every American should read it and start finding out how the official story put out by the WH is implausible.
Congrats!
:)
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Massachusetts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #81
99. Tip o' The hat to you Paul
Ive been mesmerized by your web site for the last hour.

Why can't we educate the "average" American about these clandestine operations, subplots, lies etc.?

This has been the ULTIMATE GAME at the expense of the very people who this government is supposed to work for.

Sadly the "average" American doesn't want to believe that they can be "hood winked" so easily and despicably by THEIR OWN government.IMO
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
82. "No al-Qaeda threat was turned over to the new administration". lied Rice
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 12:14 AM by LynnTheDem
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
84. "Richard Clarke had plenty of opportunities to tell us in the administrati
that he thought the war on terrorism was moving in the wrong direction and he chose not to."

LIAR.
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slor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
86. Rice: "No one could have imagined...
that the truth would have come out like this and shown myself, and the rest of my vulcan friends to be lying sacks of shit".
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Toucano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #86
112. "We didn't want our pink slips to come
in the form of a mushroom cloud!"
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commissure Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
87. National Security Archive web page
http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB147/index.htm

Here is the link to the National Security Archive. Lots of great stuff from Senate and Congressional hearings. Rice's testimony as well. All the primaries at the time had their heads up their butt.
And they get re-elected and promoted. Clinton gets some sex and lies about it and gets impeached. Such political power Bush has. It is like he wears this robe of impenetrability that he can do no wrong. It is so sickening.

This archive web page should be on all all the news pages.
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TacticalPeek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #87
88. Welcome to DU, commissure!
:toast:

And thanks for the link to - the context? - the framing?


The facts.

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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
89. Sign on door: Only "traditional hijackers" need apply.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #79
91. Clarke testified to this...
he was on MTP. Tweety's Show and many others saying CONDI WAS NOT INTERESTED IN TERRORISM!!! We knew this! Why is this making news now that she is head honcho of the State department? To rub our noses again in what incompetent people we have running this country??
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:32 AM
Response to Reply #79
92. Neocons pundit would not admit Rice's lies on Crossfire
Neocons pundit would not admit Rice's lies on Crossfire. The Conservative Pundit just sat there as Paul Begalia showed him a copy of the plan, quoted an OP-ED piece Rice wrote and a declarative sentence where she stated "she was not given an al Qaeda plan from the Clinton White House", and refused to answer the question: "Did Rice Lie". Again and again. Will all sorts of smoke and by saying virtually anything else the conservative guest pundit blew smoke.

As long as nobody catches them on film admitting to having made any mistakes - I guess they haven't made any.

***holes!
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Fridays Child Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:01 PM
Response to Reply #79
114. The interference O'Hanlon is running for Condi, on this, is despicable.
From the article...

"Mr. O'Hanlon called Mr. Clarke's memorandums a set of "very dry data points. There's not a heightened sense of, 'Now our homeland is at risk."

I ask you, Mr. O'Hanlon, should the memo have been splattered with the as yet unshed blood and tears of the 9-11 victims? Only a card-carrying neocon would be cynical enough to offer such an excuse.

And, as for the statement that the submission was "short of a plan," Mr. Clarke was asked for nothing but he gave Condi a 13-page proposal for dealing with al-Qaeda. And the best excuse she can come up with for ignoring it was that it wasn't a plan?

How do these people even sleep at night?
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keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:45 AM
Response to Original message
93. Kick Kick Kick
Once in a while, we get to hear the truth in the MSM.

And, I am going to kick this ..rrr

I am kicking this post because it has come out on a Friday night.

This is a death knell blow legally to Secretary Rice. Lying in sworn testimony before Congress is certainly enough to impeach and remove the officer, is it not? The decision sits in Congress. And, the Executive is Constitutionally forbidden from the ability to Pardon in the case of an Impeachment.

Will this story have legs? Will someone use this information wisely?

Keo
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Rocky Top Donating Member (53 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #93
95. Kick!!!!!!!
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keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #93
109. Kick
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
103. Time to get Richard Clarke back on the talk shows.
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 10:42 AM by blondeatlast
It won't be easy, with no book to promote, but does anyone have some idea how this might be done?

Surely DU has some media-savvy types out there who can offer advice about this?
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snoochie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
108. Kick - another story published today.
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Toucano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #108
113. Rice makes me really angry.
"No Al Qaeda plan was turned over to the new administration," Dr. Rice wrote in an op-ed article for The Washington Post last March. She wrote that Mr. Clarke and his team "suggested several ideas, some of which had been around since 1998 but had not been adopted."

That's why he wanted you to schedule a principle's meeting so "several ideas" could be developed into a fucking PLAN.

She has too many degrees on the wall to be playing as dumb as she's playing it. And America is giving her a pass when she should be hauled off to the gallows!

But alas, those were Clinton-era "ideas". A blue dress casts an awfully long shadow.
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Rocky Top Donating Member (53 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #113
115. Kick!!!!!!!
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