Gov't (Gonzales) Seeks To Block Hallucinogenic Tea(one of his first cases)

[truthpusher]

http://www.clickondetroit.com/food/4188859/detail.html

Gov't Seeks To Block Hallucinogenic Tea

POSTED: 10:54 am EST February 11, 2005
UPDATED: 11:12 am EST February 11, 2005

WASHINGTON -- The Bush administration has asked the Supreme Court to block a New Mexico church from using hallucinogenic tea that the government contends is illegal and potentially dangerous.

In one of his first cases since taking over at the Justice Department, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales argued that a lower court was wrong to allow the Brazil-based church to import and use the hoasca tea in its religious services.

The church said the herbal brew is a central sacrament in its religious practice, which is a blend of Christian beliefs and traditions rooted in the Amazon basin.

The filing seeks to reinstate a temporary stay the Supreme Court lifted in December.

Story:

http://www.clickondetroit.com/food/4188859/detail.html

[THUNDER HANDS]

1. forget the terrorists, go after the tea-drinkers

cause, you know, priorities, and stuff...

[mudderfudder77]

2. So should we ignore

the other laws until we catch the terrorists. Personally I'd prefer it if we could enforce all laws.

[fishwax]

4. ignore laws like the first amendment?

[Bridget Burke]

8. It's a matter of priorities.

How many people have been killed by this tea?

Like Ashcroft sending an FBI team to New Orleans to investigate prostitution. (Result: They discovered that there are prostitutes in New Orleans!) Too bad his response to warnings about airline safety was deciding he should begin using private planes....

What is Gonzales ignoring?

[High Plains]

10. The government has lost at every level so far on this case

It's not a matter of "ignoring the law." The law so far has been on the side of the tea-drinkers, who are members of a Brazil-based church. It's a matter of Justice Department priorities. Gonzalez is demonstrating what he thinks is important, and apparently crushing the religious freedom of those he doesn't understand is right up there.

[PunkPop]

13. Nobody's ignoring any laws

A lower court in New Mexico ruled in their favor. This is not something that should concern the ATTORNEY GENERAL OF THE UNITED STATES AND THE SUPREME COURT.

Nobody's getting hurt.

No rights are being infringed.

Just idiot Republicans sticking their nose where it doesn't belong.

[Zuni]

47. This is a matter for New Mexico, not the US Justice dept

I though issues like this were handled in State Courts.

[PunkPop]

49. I believe they were

until the fascist neocons took over our country.

[fishwax]

71. yeah, so much for the repub's alleged devotion to federalism

states should make their own rules, they say, unless they make the wrong ones, like decriminalization or gay marriage. Then the feds should step in :puke:

[DrWeird]

15. The courts have ruled this is constitutionally protected.

I consider the first amendment of the United States Constitution to be one law worth paying attention to.

[HuckleB]

28. Since when does Gonzales give a rip about The Constitution?

It's clear that his goal is to destroy as much freedom as possible.

[silvermachine]

23. Priorities

But then again, we know what your priorities here are. I SO look forward to your eventual tombstoning.....

[PunkPop]

40. Hallelujah!

[Zhade]

56. You said it. This one couldn't BE more obvious.

NT!

[livinginphotographs]

57. Glad you said it and not me!

They should really start trying harder.

[w4rma]

41. I think laws that are unConstitutional should not be enforced. In fact

they should be overturned, as it appears this one may be.

Or better, folks shouldn't have even attempted to write, promote, vote for and defend these unconstitutional laws.

[Zhade]

55. This shouldn't even be illegal in the first place.

Ever heard of the right to self-sovereignty? Nah, probably not, you guys don't actually believe in freedom of the individual and all.

[TrogL]

3. You do realize the irony?

[Ilsa]

29. Incredible irony, isn't it?

While they're at it, maybe they'll require them to dismiss their other beliefs and start handling snakes like Asscraft probably does when he is at worship.

Attacking nonissues to distract he masses. What crock.

[oasis]

7. Ashcroft had his head up his ass and overlooked 9/11 intel. Gonzo is

Attorney General for window dressing purposes.

[Elidor]

5. More properly called ayahuasca

I've never tried this one, but it's on my list of something to do on a rainy afternoon.

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/ayahuasca/ayahuasca_info3.shtml

[Bridget Burke]

12. As featured in The Yage Letters....

From William Burroughs to Alan Ginsberg. Order it now from City Lights Books!

www.citylights.com/pub/catalog/BCyageletters.html

Let's thank Gonzalez for this reminder of the Beat generation's researches....

[killbotfactory]

27. I'm sure they'll offer proof that it's harmful

You know... like alcohol...

right? :eyes:

[toymachines]

44. be careful man. i have done it.

it takes a lot of mental preperation. a week without sex, certain foods and drinks, and smoking. it scared the shit out of me, it was the most intense and controlling halucinagenic experience i have ever had. this tea is holy in a most profound sense, it allowed me to gain knowledge that the plant was willing to give me. if this isnt a sacrament, to be respected and protected, then i dont know what is.

[toymachines]

45. be careful man. i have done it.

it takes a lot of mental preperation. a week without sex, certain foods and drinks, and smoking. it scared the shit out of me, it was the most intense and controlling halucinagenic experience i have ever had. this tea is holy in a most profound sense, it allowed me to gain knowledge that the plant was willing to give me. if this isnt a sacrament, to be respected and protected, then i dont know what is.

[mitchtv]

61. thank you hardhead, I though I had missed something new

now I understand what it is

[Webster Green]

6. hoasca tea eh?

Boy, now I'm curious! Where can I get some? Must be good stuff if the U.S. Government is against it.

[Demcicle]

18. So much for freedom of beliefs or religion. Why did the

puritans come here again? oh, right. How long before they pass a law making the Christian religion the official religion of the US?

[d.l.Green]

30. Yeah, who knows how to get this stuff- links, anyone? Would definitely

help calm the hallucinations we're already experiencing under this administration...:crazy:

[KingoftheJungle]

64. google is your friend. check http://dmt.lycaeum.org

Good site for all the info you could ever want. Once you know what plants to use you can use google to find retailers, which are numerous indeed.

[Cocoa]

9. Bush AGs know their priorities

hallucinogenic tea, statue tits, New Orleans prostitutes. Nice start, Al! :thumbsup:

[mitchtv]

63. don't forget Calif's medicinal MJ and

Oregon's right to die with dignity

[smoogatz]

11. Hey, look!

Over here! At these nefarious tea drinkers! Not at Ken Lay--nothing to see there. And Halliburton's too complicated for you to understand. And the people who are torturing prisoners of war are doing that entirely on their own initiative, with no orders from anyone in the DOD. Hey--no--over HERE...

[papau]

17. You have to be a chem major to do drugs these days - Used in Ayahuasca tea

vs Ayahuasca tea vs Ayahuasca Analogues called yage

I do not have a clue as to what is legal or illegal in the US - but Google does give a few thousand places that will mail you what you want.

LOL - Thank God I am old - I could not pass the chem test for growing up today!

Buying Booze is easier!

Psychotria Viridis-Chacruna
Traditionally used in Ayahuasca tea ceremonies
http://www.ethnobotanysource.com/viridis.htm
We only have fresh whole Psychotria viridis leaves. No shredded leaves. Prices are the same for shredded or whole.25 grams = $12.00
--->50 grams = $22.00 --->100 grams = $40.00 --->200 grams = $75.00

http://www.shamanic-extracts.com/xcart/catalog/index.html
http://www.shamanic-extracts.com/xcart/customer/home.php

This brew, also called yage, or yaje, in Colombia, ayahuasca in Ecuador and Peru (Inca "vine of the dead, vine of the souls," aya means in Quechua "spirit," "ancestor," "dead person," while huasca means "vine," "rope") caapi in Brazil, is prepared from segments of the vine Banisteriopsis Caapi. Sections of vine are boiled with leaves from any of a large number of potential admixture plants (such as but not limited to; Psychotria viridis or Diplopterys cabrerana) resulting in a brew that contains the powerful hallucinogenic alkaloids harmaline, harmine, d-tetrahydroharmine, and often N,N-dimethyltryptamine. This medicine has been used for millennia in order to enter the sacred supernatural world, to heal, divine, and worship.

Ayahuasca Analogues

Information
Edible Lime
Calcium Hydroxide (Lime / Edible Lime). Most people don’t realize that edible lime needs to be mixed with the Virola resin to make snuff active. It is also u...

Shipping restrictions: There are no restrictions, we can ship it worldwide 10 grams = $ 3.00 (€ 2.25) 20 grams = $ 5.00 (€ 3.75)

Banisteriopsis caapi (BLACK) Peru
(Clavo Huasca - Negro) Dried Vine. Very rare and potent black caapi vine, usually only consumed by shamans! Indigenous names - yagé, huasca, rambi, shuri,... 28 grams = $ 14.00 (€ 10.50) 112 grams = $ 45.00 (€ 33.75)

Huizo Oni Yage (Rojas - Red - Colorada Huasca) Dried Vine. Used almost exclusively by shamans to facilitate healing of others. Quality import from Peru. Indi... 28 grams = $ 8.00 (€ 6.00) 112 grams = $ 25.00 (€ 18.75)


Banisteriopsis caapi (White) Peru
(Clavo Huasca - Blanca) Dried Vine. Used almost exclusively by shamans to facilitate healing of others. Quality import from Peru. Indigenous names - yag&eacu... 28 grams = $ 8.00 (€ 6.00) 112 grams = $ 25.00 (€ 18.75)

Banisteriopsis caapi (YELLOW) Peru
Panshin Oni Yage (Cielo - Yellow, Heaven/Sky Huasca) Dried Vine Traditionally considered the best for Initiation. The most commonly employed in curanderismo in... 28 grams = $ 8.00 (€ 6.00) 112 grams = $ 25.00 (€ 18.75)

Diplopterys cabrerana
Fresh import from Peru 28 grams / 1 oz. Also known as Chaliponga. One of the most important principle admixtures of Ayahuasca or Yagé said "to heighten and length... Our price: $ 14.00 (€ 10.50)

Peganum harmala
(Syrian Rue) Frequently used in Ayahuasca receipes. Contains the Harmaline alkoloid. (seed package: 28 gram). The peganum harmala seeds germinate fairly reliably by sc Our price: $ 4.50 (€ 3.38)

Psychotria viridis
Fresh import from Peru 28 grams / 1 oz. Ayahuasca analogue. 28 grams/1oz of dried leaves imported from the Amazon. Psychotria viridis AKA Chacruna is found through... Our price: $ 10.00 (€ 7.50)

Virola callophyla
Dried vine sections imported from Peru. Ayahuasca analogue. Probably the most important species is Virola theiodora, a slender tree 25-75 ft (7.5-23 m) in height, ... 28 grams = $ 10.00 (€ 7.50) 56 grams = $ 27.00 (€ 20.25)

Virola theiodora
Dried vine sections imported from Peru. Ayahuasca analogue. Probably the most important species is Virola theiodora, a slender tree 25-75 ft (7.5-23 m) in height, ... 28 grams = $ 10.00 (€ 7.50) 56 grams = $ 27.00 (€ 20.25)

[Zenaholic]

14. "potentially dangerous"???

They've been doing this ritual for a thousand years or more. Maybe it is dangerous but it is a danger that only harms the individuals who drink the tea. It's not like they are pushing their tea on high school kids. Man, I just don't get the mentality of these people on their high horses. It's their fucking religion! Hello....first amendment?

Christianity never harmed anyone right?

[d.l.Green]

32. Uh, that's a facetious question, right? eom

[Zenaholic]

38. Absolutely!

Sorry I should have put my <sarcasm> tags on there. I thought it was kind of obvious.

[Triana]

16. is this all this torturer thinks he has to worry about as AG?

first, we had asscrust going after the marijuana smokers and now this idiot going after tea-drinkers.

Is this all an AG has to do? Does he really think that this kind of crap is among the most serious problems or legal issues facing our nation today?

HE HIMSELF is one of the most problematic issues (biggest legal problem) we in the US have. Mr. Torturer and Mr. Geneva Conventions are Quaint.

We PAY this dirtbag for THIS?

To be a torturing, terrorist-condoning (as long as WE are doing the terrorizing and torturing, it's OK) black cancer upon our legal system and upon our face to the world, whilst he then proceeds to PIDDLE about with stupid irrelevant issues like what kind of tea some religious group drinks?

WE PAY HIM FOR THIS SHIT? UNbelievable...of course I shouldn't be disgusted, shocked, or surprised, but I am, somehow.

[KingoftheJungle]

19. The last thing they want is for people to become aware ...

Anyone who has gone through a powerful DMT experience can tell you that it is no ordinary drug, it connects you to a reality deep inside us that supercedes this dimention. It is the realm that connects everything, life and existance, and I truly believe that the future of the human race (if we survive) lies within that realm. I was a hardcore scientific athiest until I experienced this "drug" and I can tell you that what I found on the other side was enough to radically shift my entire belief system within minutes.

This is something that connected shamans in south america to the "nature spirits" (the highly advanced intelligences I witnessed on my own journies) for thousands and thousands of years, long before indians started using peyote. The courts ruled in favor of the church twice already and now Mr. Human McTourturer wants to do everything in his power to freeze our only connection to this realm.

For VERY interesting reading regarding this, check out "DMT: The Spirit Molecule" by Rick Straussman. He did the first government sanctioned DMT studies on people in the 90's and wrote this incredible book about it. I highly reccommend it.

[Southern Dem 2005]

33. Dude, are you stoned right now?

[KingoftheJungle]

36. No I'm not...I know I sound crazy but you have never seen what DMT shows u

Just read the book. "DMT: The Spirit Molecule" Very detailed book about the pharmacology of DMT, the history behind Straussman's medical studies with it, the various user reports, and his conclusions. This stuff isn't even in the same class as LSD or mushrooms or mescaline, they are fucking apple butter compared to this. Using this stuff I had CONTACT with alien intelligences, in a way that was more real than reality. They were NOT just something I imagined, I could never dream up what I encountered and they actively interacted and communicated with me as if I were a a ridiculous, unevolved lab monkey. I felt like an ant in the presence of Gods and everyone who has experienced this drug for the thousands of years it has been used all have the same general contact with this other side. EVERYONE. I do not believe it is a coincidence.

[Southern Dem 2005]

39. I was being facetious--Friday and all

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[KingoftheJungle]

54. Yes, it certainly does. Using the "Spellcheck" button is too hard for me

If you get the idea of what I'm saying then I don't really think spelling should matter. This is the internet we're talking about here.

[Zhade]

59. It's much like they are trying to criminalize Salvia Divinorum...

...another legal, POWERFUL (do not do this without a sitter!) plant that opens one's eyes to our connection to the natural world.

I know, I've smoked salvia many times (again, for the propagandized Drug Warriors here, it's LEGAL), and it's not a party drug. It's a meditation aid (though I haven't seen any 'smelves' yet).

IMIO, the criminalization of any naturally-occurring plant that connects us to Nature is a crime against humanity.

Interesting note: many researchers feel there is evidence that early Christians were actually a mushroom cult, and that's where some of the teachings came from. Don't know it it's true, but I can see it as possible.

[Beam Me Up]

62. HEAD-LINE: Brazilian Tea Opens Doorway Into HYPERSPACE

I'm paraphrasing Terence McKenna who once asked why we hadn't seen a headline to that effect. This stuff is beyond amazing and not for anyone who isn't ready to 'meet their maker'.

DMT is the first psychedelic compound I ever put into my body. I was 19 years old, 1967. I thought I was going to die. Needless to say, I've not been quite the same since. :)

REALITY IS A CONSTRUCT--this includes the 'reality' of "self" as separate from "everything else".

But the most important thing is A SENSE OF THE SACRED.

If you don't have that, you are blind in a profound way. Doesn't matter how intelligent you are or how gifted in any other respect. Without this faculty you don't know what it means to BE human--where we are on the scale of BEING. Without that, you don't really know what love is and from what its real power derives.

For those who are clueless, I recommend: A Sense of the Cosmos

[KingoftheJungle]

65. ^^^ this guy knows

Trust me people, this admin is close to shutting down our access to the only key we have to facilitate this level of awareness. DMT is sacred not only for some fringe Brazilian church but for every single one of us, it is quite likely that it is the "source" of true spirituality.

[lovuian]

75. I've read it King of the Jungle is right!!! There is a REASON WHY

Gonzalez wants to restrict access to this drug. It has the potential to reveal the spirit world the ancients saw.

Rick Straussman got funding for the project by the Scottish Rite foundation
I find that very interesting too

Its interesting read and it seems Gonzalez is here to stop access. Its amazing to see how the Bush agenda is to control access to Americans. We are so asleep at the wheel its not even funny and thats exactly what Bush wants...

[NV Whino]

20. I wonder what happens

if you add "fortified" milk to the tea?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1230004

[ernstbass]

21. What a waste of gov't money

the only drink allowed is the repug kool aid

[underpants]

22. Well if you were looking for a good short term investment this is it

I see the demand for Hallucinogenic Tea shooting through the roof.

[HuckleB]

24. Priorities. Priorities.

Ashcroft put dozens of people away for selling bongs on the Internet. Now Gonzales goes after people with the wrong religion. We've now got brain scan studies that show probable changes to brain chemistry via evangelical Christian and other practices. Yet no one is sure how to control these changes, so they might be dangerous. Knowing this, why isn't he going after all religions?

[KingoftheJungle]

25. Did you known DMT is endogenous in the Human Brain?

By their standards every single one of us should be illegal too. DMT is everywhere; in frogs, grasses, trees, roots, fish, flowers...it is something that exists in us for a reason.

[98geoduck]

26. Next will be Pearl Jam!

[Ezlivin]

31. That's why it's called High Tea

[Mr. Sinister]

42. Look at those smiles light up the room

More lemon and honey and rainbow pulsating
shortbread Mom!

[Selteri]

34. Screw the terrorists, religios people who drink tea

to see God must be stopped at all costs!

Heil Bush Heil Bush!

Phuked uhp Lojik.

[d.l.Green]

35. He doesn't want anyone but the pResident using it!

[Bridget Burke]

37. No problem. Little Georgie doesn't like psychedelics.

Just old Houston folklore from 'way back when....

[paineinthearse]

43. I'm not a lawyer or a chemist, so please explain to me....

On what grounds has this case made its way to the SC? Does hoasca tea contain any compound or drug that is federally controlled? If not, there are no legal grounds for "blocking" its use. Gonzales has no legal leg.


Tea, anyone?

[KingoftheJungle]

52. Ayuhuasca contains DMT, which is scheduled. Humans also contain DMT

Funny thing is that most life on the planet contains DMT, even humans (most of which is located in the brain). Think about that one. Humans should be deemed illegal!

[Mr. Sinister]

58. so it's probably illegal to eat human brains huh?

not terribly fair to our zombie friends.

[High Plains]

53. The government argues it is regulated by the Controlled Substances Act

because it contains DMT. The government won that argument. But the church appealed on religious freedom grounds using the Religious Freedom Restoration Act (what delicious irony), and that is what the lower federal courts have upheld.

There is a parallel with the Native American Church being able to use peyote even though it is a controlled substance.

There is a gentleman who calls himself the New Jersey Weedman who currently has a case in the federal courts. He smokes pot at the Liberty Bell in Philadelphia and claims it is a religous sacrament. We'll see.

[Daphne08]

46. This is the most important thing

at present??? Unbelievable.

[alfredo]

50. My church served me alcohol beverages when I was a minor.

How can they get away with that?

[truthpusher]

69. and what about the Kool-Aid?

[alfredo]

70. wine tastes better, and

taking communion on an empty stomach will leave you with a little buzz. I always liked the Rose more than the red. I guess the sweet Rose was more appealing to a kid's taste buds.

Our priest would be stingy with the wine so he'd have more to gulp down after the ceremony. He would really knock it down. By the third service his sermons would be quite animated.

[geniph]

51. I'm so happy we've solved all the REAL problems

so we can worry about a congregation using a hallucinogen in their own church as part of their own sacrament. The world is a much nicer place now that we don't have war, famine, disease, poverty, hate crimes, or any of that nasty old stuff!

[bamacrat]

60. wow the war on drugs has taken a side road.

How nitpicky do some people have to be? I believe in an America that will one day discard the shackles of the right wing, and live in a new free America, a progressive one, where people are aloud to have a PRIVATE life.

[MADem]

66. Using a minority to go after minorities--classic BoyKing tactic

First up, the Brazilians with their tea. Next up, the American Indians with their peyote....

Who is on deck after that?

Incredible. What I'm seeing is freedom of religion is protected by this administration, but only if it is the "right" religion.

[Anakin Skywalker]

67. Hey Gonzoles, when are you

gonna go after piss drinkers, man? Heh heh. :)

[Beam Me Up]

68. A KICK for Sante Daime: Account of a Santo Daime Ritual

Account of a Santo Daime Ritual

As the ceremony began I was able to recognise the Dutch prayers as the 'Our Father' and 'Hail Mary' of my Roman Catholic background and - surprised at my lack of resistance - I said them quietly to myself in English. There were other prayers too which I could not catch. I was sitting in the first male row, directly behind the initiates at the table itself. The hymn-singing (all in Portuguese) began and I rapidly lost my place in the booklet that my friends had given me - so I just hummed along with the melodies. Quite soon - far too soon for me - everyone stood up and began to move in line, the women and men separately, towards a table at the rear of the room to receive the Daime. Feeling very scared I eventually found myself at the top of the line. On the table was a large jug of what looked like tomato juice. The initiate behind the table gazed at me for a moment and then poured a quantity of the Daime into a glass. I took it in both hands, raised it up in a ritual gesture and drank it in one swallow. All that I had read in other accounts of ayahuasca rituals had emphasised the absolutely revolting taste of the liquid. To my immense surprise it wasn't even remotely as bad as I had expected - not unlike tomato juice with an extra and unpleasantly acrid after-taste.

When I got back to my seat I was initially quite elated - if the taste of the Daime was so tolerable perhaps the rest of the experience wouldn't be so bad either. Very soon I noticed that the spatial relationships between everything in my field of vision had begun to take on a strangeness and subtle sense of significance. Then my body began to feel strange too. When I looked across the table at H. and at another woman - both of whom were singing energetically - I saw patterns of broad black lines on their faces and I had no doubt that these were tribal markings. For me, this was a deeply moving moment - a powerful message that this was not just a group of middle-class Dutch getting together to foul-up their brain-chemistry but a witness, a sign that there was something present among us which did go back, genuinely did connect with the era and culture from which the ayahuasca originated.

Now the visual effects began to get more dramatic My ability to judge distances became more distorted and I also began to see the edges of everything I looked at outlined by tiny little rainbows or little coloured fluorescent lights. Then, at one point, the colours in the room suddenly bleached out like an over-exposed photographic negative and all the people that I could see took on an ethereal lavender colour. I can remember being quite frightened at all this - but the effects themselves had no specific emotional content. Unlike the 'tribal markings' they were 'just' strange visual effects, no more.

From the very start the initiates at the central table - and most of the other participants - were singing the hymns almost non-stop and with great gusto and most of them continued to do so throughout the entire 6-7 hours of the ritual. The 'inner circle' initiates showed little outward signs of the physical effects of the Daime - I never noticed one vomit, for instance. Whether this is due to a chemical habituation or to some other effect is not clear to me. Two or three other initiates always remain outside the rows of participants so as to look after the needs of those going through the ritual - I think that these people take milder doses of the Daime. At this point I needed to urinate so one of these initiates took me out to the lavatory. I was surprised to find that I could walk reasonably steadily but when I got back to my place I begin to feel nausea for the first time. I remembered that Saunders had written that virtually nothing happened to him with the initial minor dose of the sacrament. 'My God, I thought, if all this is happening to me on the mild dose, the major dose will blow my head off'.

The singing is where it is at. The SONGS are what carry the goddess FROM THE JUNGLE into our world.

Ladies and gentlemen, it is THE END OF OUR WORLD, but the beginning of another most of you, unfortunately, haven't even glimpsed yet.

BMU

[KingoftheJungle]

72. bizump

[bobthedrummer]

73. Come get your kicks on Route 66...

:dem::kick:

[henslee]

74. Why prevent native Americans from performing religious rites

that they have been doing before any European showed up? Why not just control it -- like they do whale hunting aming arctic tribes?

[_NorCal_D_]

76. The war on tea has begun!

:eyes:

[applegrove]

77. Yeah - Don't get high on tea - but snuffing money is fine - ***holes!

[EC]

78. It's legal for American Indians

to use peyote for ceramonial rites. http://www.lectlaw.com/files/drg25.htm



I just cannot believe this is the most important thing that the Attorney General should be involved with...this is a state rights issue...but then again Asscroft stuck his nose where it didn't belong too...even overriding states laws...