Frist Says Bush's Social Security Proposal Has `Long Way to Go'

[stevedeshazer]

link: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=ay5PBE.RHEus&refer=top_world_news

<snip>

Feb. 13 (Bloomberg) -- Senate Majority Leader Republican Bill Frist said President George W. Bush still has ``a long way to go,'' to win public backing for his proposal to revamp the Social Security program.

``I agree wholeheartedly you can't jam change down the throat of the American people,'' Frist said on ``Fox News Sunday.'' ``We need to first make sure the American people understand there's a problem, engage the American people.''

Frist is the second Republican congressional leader to suggest the president still hasn't sold the public on the idea of letting younger workers divert some of their Social Security payroll taxes into private accounts invested in stocks and bonds. House Speaker Dennis Hastert of Illinois told the Chicago Tribune in an interview published yesterday that the voters won't accept the change ``unless they perceive there really is a problem.''

===============================================

Is Frist making a play for 2008? Can * jam SS "reform" through Congress without the Senate majority leader on board? Hmmm...

[NYC Liberal]

1. And guess what?

When this fails, Bush can't blame obstructionist Democrats!

I will love watching him lambast Republicans in Congress. LOL!

[cthrumatrix]

22. REPUG TRAP --- Bush wants to raise taxes....Soc Sec is a trojan horse

do you think Frist and Hastert can come and say the above...hell no.

Shrub and Rove need to raise taxes...the Soc Sec scam is the tool.

[Rican1]

2. Even Republicans know this issue is a loser

[stevedeshazer]

3. Yup. It's DEAD.

And the longer the Elephants In The Room drag it out, the better.

I hope they drag this stinking dead carcass around for weeks, months, years.

These congressmen running on the SS fraud issue in 2006 are in for a rude surprise.

[Mountainman]

4. How do the rupubs make the connection that even if there is a problem

of underfunding, private accounts will solve the problem?

First the have to convince people there is a problem then they have to convince them that repubs give a shit about their lives.

All those who they convince should just bend over and assume the position.

[asjr]

12. Most of the FREEPublicans on the hill are already

so bent over they can't stand straight now. And I bet they have cornered the market on Preparation H. Up until now they have backed this WH on every occasion. Now, they have to worry about their relection campaigns so they are starting to sing a different tune. Of course there is Rick Sanctimonious to contend with. He may go down with the lame duck president.

[Kimber Scott]

5. Funny how they're all trying to distance themselves from this bull.

Too bad wars aren't such politically touchy subjects.

[stevedeshazer]

10. Ain't that the truth?

Cockroaches scurrying from the light.

Frist is running for President, and he's smart enough to know a loser when he sees one. He smells the smell.

[isit2008yet]

6. Frist is an idiot...

its not, " can't jam change down the throat of the American people," its the American people waking up and this isn't passing the smell test.
Frist should have said the American people don't want the current system GUTTED!!! But politics and truth don't go together for this administration.

[Itsthetruth]

9. Bush Has Other Options In Mind If This Fails

And what about the other attacks on Social Security being proposed by the Bush government outside of privitization .... like changing the benefit formula and increasing the retirement age?

Haven't heard a bit of opposition to those ideas by the political "opposition" yet.

Social Security benefits could be cut 60% under one proposal advanced by Bush. Why the silence in Congress?

[stevedeshazer]

13. Silence in Congress?

I've heard more noise from Congress on this issue than any other in recent memory.

:shrug:

[Itsthetruth]

26. Congress Is Silent

I haven't read anything indicating members of Congress are speaking out loudly against Bush's back up plan for cutting social security if privitization fails. For example, increasing the retirement age and calculating benefits based on price rather than wage increases. On the contrary, some Democrats have indicated a willingness to consider and reach common ground with Republicans on these other social security cut proposals. Please post links to your sources.

Thanks!

[isit2008yet]

14. you have a system that can't handle the current

baby boomer wave coming into it...after the current wave, many think the system will last for decades...so to fix it ...roll back taxes, increase the retirement age...or take the IOU's in the fund and monies and invest them in a way that pays back something like 10% (like a mutual fund) more than the current interest rate, to keep the system solvent...this was Clinton's idea and everyone scoffed at it.

The problem with Bush's idea is that it TAKES money out of a system they say is failing...so you do math...does that fix SS?

[TahitiNut]

15. Nonsense. The Social Security system is NOT broken and boomers ...

... will dead and buried before the CBO projection of Trust Fund depletion in 2052.

The 'problem' isn't with boomers or even the system. The problem is the steadily decreasing share of wage and salary income the 'bottom 80%' receive for their labor. That share has declined by about 20% over the last 25 years -- and has gone to make the already-wealthy wealthier.

[isit2008yet]

30. Its not depleted...

I think they said it would only pay out a portion like 70% if more money isn't introduced to SS fund...If you can't fund current programs then the tax cuts were STUPID. Taking funds out of the system for private accounts is also STUPID. It only depletes a system that is going to fall short of funding.

[TahitiNut]

34. Here's the definition of 'deplete'

de·plete tr.v. de·plet·ed, de·plet·ing, de·pletes

To decrease the fullness of; use up or empty out.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=depleted[/small>

---

The Social Security (i.e. OASDI) Trust Fund is currently accumulating a surplus (i.e. a reserve) which is estimated to be depleted by 2052 (CBO projection) or 2042 (Trustee's projection) based upon economic assumptions of less than full employment and a steadily decreasing share of national income earned by the "lowest 80%" of workers.

(sigh) :eyes:

[stevedeshazer]

17. If you seriously believe that

"something like 10% (like a mutual fund) more than the current interest rate" can be sustained with economic policies like we have now, you've already swallowed the Kool-Aid.

I agree that Bush's system won't work, but don't buy the lie that's being spread that "piratization" of SS will deliver more $$ than safe Treasury bonds.

[isit2008yet]

31. If you think the 1-2% interest paid

to the current system is going to fix it, than you got the really BAD kool-aide.:bounce:

[TahitiNut]

32. (Ignoring the personal attack rhetoric for now,) If you think 5.8% - 12.2%

... is anything CLOSE to "1-2% interest paid" then you ought to change your beverages.

Here're the simple rates of interest credited to the OASI Trust Fund between 1984 and 2004. (Stick this in your smoke and pipe it.)


1984 *********** (11.5%)
1985 ****** (6.9%)
1986 ******** (8.6%)
1987 ************ (12.0%)
1988 ************ (12.2%)
1989 *********** (11.6%)
1990 ********** (10.6%)
1991 ********* (9.7%)
1992 ********* (9.1%)
1993 ******** (8.5%)
1994 ******** (8.1%)
1995 ******* (7.9%)
1996 ******* (7.8%)
1997 ******* (7.7%)
1998 ******* (7.6%)
1999 ******* (7.3%)
2000 ******* (7.2%)
2001 ****** (7.0%)
2002 ****** (6.6%)
2003 ****** (6.2%)
2004 ***** (5.8%)


I get really fucking tired of people constantly regurgitating the LIES they've "learned."

[isit2008yet]

35. It's irelevant...the point is it could be invested smarter

and its not being done!

[TahitiNut]

37. That's called a "false belief"

I guess few people comprehend the macroeconomic impact of "investing" $1.6 TRILLION dollars.

Try comparing those simple interest rates to home mortgage rates over the same period and I think you might discover something interesting. Do the research and teach yourself - whomever you've relied on for such a mythical perspective isn't doing you any favors.

[TahitiNut]

39. Let's try to make one more point VERY CLEAR.

When the Social Security legislation was passed in 1983 that intentionally created a Trust Fund surplus of around $2 trillion dollars that was to be intentionally "loaned" to the Federal government to cover part of the Federal Debt, the People of the United States (through our elected representatives) could have chosen to pay an interest rate to the Trust Fund that was somewhat higher than the market rate for T-bills.

We didn't.

We could still insist that some such legislation be passed.

We won't.

No matter what subset of people pay the interest on some mythical "better" investment, those people must choose to do so ... currently to the tune of $1.6 TRILLION dollars.

I'll tell you what: Show me where those people are. :eyes:

[oneighty]

24. My mutual fund

(Life time annuity) monthly stipend dropped 32 percent shortly after the Bush took over. Now four years later it still has not recovered.

So you do the math.

180

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[The_Casual_Observer]

33. Once more for the uninformed: SS isn't a savings account.

It is a social contract between todays workers and todays retirees. Your reasoning about potential rates of return have no meaning or merit.

[oneighty]

36. Nonsense

I have TIAA and CREF..The best of the best. I am locked in of course as are most such life annuities. And the way I read the Bush proposal that is what happens to YOUR investment when you hit retirement age. And no my family cannot inherit my annuity.

Also I resent your insult. You assume much know little. Please say you are sorry.

180

[happynewyear]

7. kick

kick for truth and hope ...

:kick:

[No Exit]

8. Meanwhile, I just caught a bit of "Meet the Press", where Chas. Grasseley

was dutifully toeing the party line, drumming up fear that "social security is crumbling, blah blah blah."

Tim Russert was also playing kiss-ass to the repukelicans, as he always does. Blech. BTW, I read today somewhere that Russert is a neighbor of Cheney's. :puke:

[No Exit]

11. "You can't jam change down people's throats the way you jam poison

down a cat's throat, when you set out to kill it so you can dissect it," Frist said. "First, you must lull them into a false sense of security, making them think you have their best interests in mind, just as you lull the cat into a false sense of security, making it and the Cat Shelter people think you are just taking it home so it can be your sweet kitty-pet."

[Colorado Blue]

16. Whoa - he really said that???????

[stevedeshazer]

18. First volley in his run for President

He wants to differentiate himself from Jeb for 2008.

[No Exit]

19. Helloooo! Are we talking about the same Frist???

Do you actually think Sen. Frist from Tennessee would include THAT MUCH honesty in ANYTHING he said?? What, are you crazy?

But he did indeed adopt cats from shelters, stating that he was taking them as pets--then got them home, slaughtered them, and dissected them.

AS IF his rich hospital-owning daddy couldn't have afforded to buy him some already-dead animals to dissect! Frist is a piece of shit.

[LynnTheDem]

20. "unless they PERCEIVE"...not "unless they REALIZE"...not "unless they KNOW

But "unless they PERCEIVE..."

The propaganda bullshit about the "SS crisis" ain't working well enough, I PERCEIVE.

[stevedeshazer]

21. I perceive that

you are right!

[Mark E. Smith]

23. Look Who Wants To Run For President!

Kitty Killer knows a 2008 electoral disaster when he sees one. Bush's SSI "Reform Package" is political cyanide for Republicans who still have offices to run for, and they are fleeing en masse.

The beating Bush is going to take over his Social Security scam will confirm his lame duck status.


Bush was here.

[0007]

25. American people have to know there's a problem with this administration

before any programs can be worth while.

Frist & Hastert should be thrown out of office along with junior.

[Pachamama]

27. Frist said that? It's DEAD...but in the case of dealing w/ Bush & GOP

there is no such thing as "beating down a dead horse"...

The Dems need to keep beating this down in case this "horse" does a Freddie Krueger and tries to get up....

:spank:

[Az_lefty]

28. Stupid Monkey

did he really think he would get away with this shit? Oh yea, I guess he did.

[Binka]

38. Bush is an asshat fucktard. His days are numbered.

n/t