Evangelicals here, map agenda...rolled out their political goals

[Rose Siding]

With a mixed sense of triumph and urgency, some 900 Evangelical Christians from more than 40 states gathered at Fort Lauderdale's Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church Friday to hear prominent Christian conservatives opine on how to advance their political agenda.

''We used to be a minority, and now we've got to learn how to lead,'' said Dr. Gary Cass, the executive director of the Center for Reclaiming America, in urging the crowd to get involved in government by lobbying Congress and starting local political action centers.
...
From a pulpit ringed with red, white and blue banners, Land captivated the crowd with a Scripture-laced speech that was part sermon, part political pep rally.

''We've got God-sized problems in our country and only God can solve them,'' Land said, drawing frequent applause and occasional gasps as he lamented the nation's divorce rate and the advancement of ``the homosexual agenda.''
...
A potent symbol of conservative Christians' fight for a faith based government -- all 5,280 pounds of it -- sat locked to a wooden platform on a six-wheeled truck outside the church:
''Roy's Rock''....One fan of Moore's hoisted herself onto the platform and posed in front of the monument with her dog Baby as a security guard snapped a photo.

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/10939546.htm

[Haymare22]

1. All these years, all this bullshit......

I still do not have a clue what their GD agenda is.
What are they fukin talking about..........Do they just want to sing together? Clap together? Hug?

WTF are they talking about????

[physioex]

9. Come on that's BS.....

They went to the nudie bars, got drunk, and got more twisted sex than you or I could dream of.......(All on the parisoners tab)

P.S. You think we should convert?..... ;)

[Freedom_from_Chains]

13. Changing our govergment into a Theocrocy

That is their goal.

[mediaman007]

31. The "evangelicals" are going to be pissed now...

I just got back from church (Lutheran). The pastor's message was that Jesus chose to save all of us. So the evangelicals will not be exclusive members of the hereafter society. Everyone here at DU will be right there with them.

On another note, I hope those people can relax once they get to heaven. They are so angry I don't think they appreciate their life on Earth.

[hezekkia]

45. i dont want to spend eternity w/ the fundies!!!

:puke:

[durablend]

46. Don't worry...their elevator is going in the other direction

:evilgrin:

[LinuxInsurgent]

2. then she flashed the crowd!

the horror...the horror!

They don't want her...they want Jeff Gannon in a commando....the horror...the horror!

[saltpoint]

3. In a very related story --

-- I bet the gay bars of Fort Lauderdale were absolutely jammed with out-of-towners.

----

I'm all for letting evangelicals be evangelicals, but I could do without the gay-bashing and especially without the voting for Bush. A little critical thinking would go a long way in some quarters.

[MJP]

4. Jesus is a Liberal

It is so obvious...

[saltpoint]

5. Probably he was, but his campaign was cut short by --

-- Roman sentries.

I think I would like to talk with the young man in Mark 14:49-52 (c.) and see what he has to say.

[alfredo]

36. You mean this?

Mar 14:49
I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and ye took me not: but the scriptures must be fulfilled.



Mar 14:50
And they all forsook him, and fled.



Mar 14:51
And there followed him a certain young man, having a linen cloth cast about naked ; and the young men laid hold on him:



Mar 14:52
And he left the linen cloth, and fled from them naked.


Nambla uses these passages to justify their dirty deeds.

[saltpoint]

42. Alfredo, your smear at the end of your post is pure meanness.

Shame on you.

[alfredo]

47. No, that is a smear at NAMBLA not

at the bible.

The way I look at it, pederasty may have been acceptable at that time, but now it is not. In my opinion it should stay that way. Using the bible to justify incest, rape, war, murder, pederasty, and slavery is a great wrong.

[saltpoint]

48. I don't recall anyone in this post endorsing rape or --

-- any of the other things you list.

Have there been incidences on DU that have prompted your vigilance in these matters? Why bring it up at all?

My comment was a comment AGAINST the bigotry of those gathered in Fort Lauderdale, in specific response to the original post. My reference to the bars in that city suggests my hunch that some who rail against same-sex marriage, for instance, are themselves self-hating closet cases. This is borne out time after time in reports in the press and in studies.

I am familiar with the Greek in Mark, the first of the Gospels, and the reference to the mysterious young man is (probably) a gnostic reference, according to most scholars of the New Testament.

It is not, so far as I know, a sexual reference, and I have seen no scholarship dedicated to that aspect of the young man's appearance. The cloth in question may have been the ceremonial dedicatory white robe of the early gnostic communities.

And the reference is to a "young man" in the original Greek, not a "boy." Your NAMBLA reference appears to have come out of nowhere.

[alfredo]

49. You mentioned that passage in the bible

so I posted the text, then I posted the NAMBLA statement as a slam at NAMBLA for using those passages to justify pederasty.

My second post was to condemn those who use the bible to justify their bizarre ideas and behavior.


To tell the truth, if he was "comforting" Jesus, I'd rather not know.

[DuaneBidoux]

52. It did seem a bit of a non-Sequitur (sp?) but...

I got your point instantly. The Hebrew Bible (Old Testament for Christians) has a lot of pretty terrible things happening in it, some even justified by God. If you use the Old Testament to justify bigotry against gays why not hold true to all the scripture, where God "commanded" daughters to seduce their father...slaves were expected to obey masters, men were beheaded for cutting their beards, etc. etc. etc.--somehow the right wing religious groups always forget that stuff, but they have, in turn for the last thousand years, used these passages to fight against every progressive movement from integration, to allowing women to vote, to being the side that stuck up for the continuation of slavery.

I would love to find a compilation of all these verses that support these things that now even religious fundies find terrible. Do you know of such a website?

[saltpoint]

54. I don't know of a website on it --

-- but I guess I missed the point of the original post.

Maybe I didn't. I'm open to suggestions at this point.

I'm not really sure what I missed or didn't miss.

What I was trying to say was something like, Those gathered in judgment against gays and lesbians for example, are in Fort Lauderdale, one of THE gay cities of the hemisphere, and I hinted that some of these judgmental folks were closeted, and that the bars of that city would be jammed during the conference.

Next we were on nambla and whether a biblical verse justified something currently illegal. It felt like getting a telemarketing call from Egypt IN Egyptian. I honestly had to re-read my response to the O/P to see what I said and didn't say.

But surely the people at this conference are grown-ups, and I was thinking that only grown-ups could be allowed in bars anyway. Every once in a while I think I'm saying something and I guess it doesn't register, or I say it poorly, or the whole kit&kaboodle gets run down the rabbit hole.

But hell, what do I know? I'm a liberal Democrat!

---
(I loved your signature photo by the way. I am EXACTLY there with you on that issue. Right on & good wishes to you.)

[Maraya1969]

6. A really BAD cold front come into the South West Coast of Florida

last night. All that hot air over on the East coast created a very unstable weather system.

I bet the alligators are even running over to this side to get away from all the PRESSURE.

Actually I don't really think the movement is as big as they say it is. They just yell and faint and flail their arms around creating a general sort of havoc so it seems they are much bigger than they are. It is kind of like having one screaming baby in a store. It might as well be twenty of them for all the annoyance they cause. (Nothing against babies)

[sasquatch]

7. "Dr. Gary Cass" what the fuck is he a doctor of

Serpant handling?

[IndianaGreen]

8. Aaaaahhhh, the American Taliban at work!

Instead of crosses they should be wearing swastikas!

[physioex]

10. Doubt it......

As a matter of fact, they were actively cheering on AIPAC.

[IndianaGreen]

11. They need Jews to fulfill their apocalyptic prophesies

and what the AIPAC neocon crowd seems to ignore is that those Christian prophesies say that the Jews and Judaism will cease to exist for they will become Christian, or die in the fires of the Tribulation. A more literal reading would be to say that only 144,000 Jews will become Christian, all the others will meet the same fate of the infidels.

Such a loving religion!

[physioex]

12. True....

The are both using each other for their twisted reasons.

[jdj]

14. The homosexual agenda apparently is a hard pass and

access to the president.

[Mountainman]

15. Didn't we just have a thread this week telling us that Evangelicals were

not the bad guys?

Is the fundies not the evangelicals someone told us. Bull shit! all religions want to control the world! They all pray that the world will be one then the glorious end can come!

[Kimber Scott]

16. They think they're a majority? God should tell them not to believe all

those exit polls. They don't work.

[sam sarrha]

17. check this link on the christan Fellowship: Christian Mafia

the link is http://www.insider-magazine.com/ChristianMafia.htm

[kilgore65]

51. Wow, amazing...

This piece is quite long, but a must-read, folks.... more brilliance from Wayne Madsen....

[ausiedownunderground]

18. What the "FUCK" are Evangelicals meeting at a Presbyterian Church!!

I was "born" a Presbyterian and there is "NO" way, that religiously, these Evangelicals are even in the same "league" interpreting the "Book" as Presbyterians!!!!
This is about "MONEY"!
The Evangelicals preach its OK to be rich!!!!
The Evangelicals preach "individualism" not "Community"!
They preach Government "Tax Breaks" for their Business's
So, guess what, They appear to get "Rich"
Must be God's promise!!!
They "DON'T PAY TAXES" like the rest of us!!!!
We're poor and their rich!!! Easy!!!
These people are on a "Free ride"!!!
Other Churches aren't into "Capitalistic" business like the "Evangelicals" so they are "suffering"!!!
But "Jesus" didn't "Preach" this "MONEY IS GOOD STUFF" i was taught.
I thought Michael Douglas in "Wall Street" preached this!!!
In OZ we have this US lead "Christian Taliban" onslaught, but it is being "heavily" resisted, because most people in OZ, came from Britian,Europe and Asia, not America. The "Christian Taliban" have found a currently responsive conservative government who are giving their business's "Tax breaks" that are just outrageous, but unfortunately for the "Christian Taliban" other Christian churches are "actively" fighting their influence as "Christian" VS "Capitalist"! In Oz there will only be "one winner"!

[DemBones DemBones]

19. Want me to ask my evangelical Presbyterian relatives?

It's true, there are very definitely evangelical Presbyterians. And they are very, very conservative, judging from what my kinfolk have morphed into.

[DuaneBidoux]

53. Yea I've noticed in the last ten years or so that basically there

has been a growing movement withing the Presbyterians. It used to be a fairly mainstream church but a branch has definitely started embracing the whole right wing thing.

[LizW]

20. In the U.S., some Presbyterian churches are very much evangelical

There are several different types of Presbyterian churches, aren't there? And some of them are evangelical and fundamentalist.

[Bridget Burke]

22. There are different sorts of Presbyterians.

The conservative, Calvinist strain of Presbyterianism is strong in the Dominionist/Christian Reconstruction movement--the ones behind the politicization of religion that's occurred in recent years. The movement is strong in the US--but Australia has not escaped.

Many Australian religious organisations would like to see this country governed according to 'biblical standards'. They are distrustful of concepts like 'pluralism', 'multiculturalism' and 'tolerance' and would much prefer to see Australia run as a 'Christian country' with a 'Christian government', a 'Christian economy', 'Christian schools' etc. ....

In a full-blown Reconstructionist Australia, we would be governed by the Law of Moses. The death penalty would be freely applied for 'crimes' ranging from heresy and blasphemy to adultery, abortion and homosexuality. Striking a parent, incorrigible juvenile delinquency and, in the case of women, 'unchastity before marriage' would also be punished by death. Biblically-approved methods of execution would include burning, stoning, hanging and beheading with a sword. Gary North, a leading Reconstructionist, prefers stoning, as stones are 'cheap, plentiful and convenient'.

www.unbelief.org/articles/theocracy2.html

Most Presbyterians don't want to be part of this, I'm sure. Nor do all Evangelicals and/or Fundamentalists. But those who have this vision are quite strongly motivated.

[Magleetis]

21. Where is the religious left?

If I were a Christian I would not want these fundy a-holes hijacking my religion. Is there a religious left? Why do we never hear from them? Maybe this is what Christianity really is, a religion of bigots, killers and homophobes. Is this what Jesus wanted? Its baffling to me.

[Bridget Burke]

23. Do you ever watch the Daily Show?

Jim Wallis, a self-described Evangelistic Christian, made a recent appearance; watch it here:

http://www.comedycentral.com/mp/play.jhtml?player=realplayer&type=v&quality=high&reposid=/multimedia/tds/celeb/celeb_10009.html

"Now" on PBS also did a segment on the Christian Left. They have been slow to organize. Mostly, they've been living their lives & expressing their beliefs in works, while the "Christian" Right has been doing heavy PR & buying politicians.

www.pbs.org/now/society/faithpolitics.html

Just because something is not covered on the evning news does not mean it does not exist. Check things out before you damn all Christians.

[Magleetis]

34. No

I do not watch the Daily Show because I don't have cable. I do watch Now occasionally. I wasn't damning all Christians I used the word maybe. My point is that the Christian left better hurry up and get on the evening news because the right has hijacked Christianity and they are making it look pretty bad in my eyes.

[The Zanti Regent]

25. There is NO religious Left left in Amercia

The religious Left died with Dr King.

Religion has become the new Blob. It sucks up everything it can and threatens everything else.

[CatholicEdHead]

30. Religious left still around

but not as organized or as politicaly motivated, as the goals try to get accomplished through non-political means.

Parts of it is getting organized again, but it will take some time.

[Lerkfish]

32. I guess I don't exist, then.

and my UCC denomination, whose tv commercials claiming how inclusive they are of all diverse worshippers got canceled by MSM...I guess I was dreaming that, too.


Just because you prefer to remain willfully ignorant, does not mean ignoring facts makes them untrue.

[The Zanti Regent]

38. The Southern Fried Baptists and the ASSemblies of Gawd will come for you

Sorry but the UCC is just an insignificant pip compared to the two major components of American Xtianity. It's only a matter of time before they and their millions use the power of the government to stamp you out.

[Lerkfish]

41. first you deny we exist, then you say we're insignificant.

Is it any wonder there can be no valid respectful adult discussion of religion in this forum?

Don't look now, but its only a matter of time before the govt. stamps out ALL OF US that don't agree with them. Does that make any democrat invalid or insignificant because they are targeted by fascists?

[mommajo65]

24. This is getting ................

really scary. Where's the color coded terror alert for this crap?

[booksenkatz]

26. Their agenda wouldn't include, by any chance,

feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, healing the sick, sheltering the homeless, etc.? You know... the things Jesus commanded his followers to do?

No?

I didn't think so.

Carry on.

[VirginiaDem]

27. These are NOT Evangelicals...

They're right-wing Christians or fundamentalists. Let's not fall for their game--the fundies have started using the word "evangelical" because it sounds less polarizing. I know many Evangelicals who are not right-wing. This meeting was of the right-wingers. The wording change has caused a lot of confusion exactly because it is such an illogical choice, except for the above political reasons.

[mommajo65]

28. I am a Christian here in the left and......

it's not easy being that here in the South. And this is not what I was taught, this is crazy. This is hypocrisy at it's best. I feel it's all in the name of power and money that this is being done. It's frustrating and confusing. The love, compassion, understanding and mercy that Jesus taught hasn't been mentioned or shown as far as I have heard. It is heartbreaking.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

43. Welcome to DU Mommajo!

It is sad that there are people who twist religious texts around to dupe people and satisfy their greedy agenda. Jesus warned about this. The following text could apply to any religion as easily as Christianity:

Matthew 7:13-29 (21st Century King James Version)
21st Century King James Version (KJ21)
Copyright © 1994 by Deuel Enterprises, Inc.


13"Enter ye in at the strait gate, for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there be who go in thereat.


14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.


15"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.


16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thorns, or figs from thistles?


17Even so, every good tree bringeth forth good fruit, but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.


18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.


19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down and cast into the fire.


20Therefore, by their fruits ye shall know them.


21"Not every one that saith unto Me, `Lord, Lord,' shall enter into the Kingdom of Heaven, but he that doeth the will of My Father who is in Heaven.


22Many will say to Me in that Day, `Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Thy name, and in Thy name have cast out devils, and in Thy name done many wonderful works?'


23And then will I profess unto them, `I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity.'


24"Therefore, whosoever heareth these sayings of Mine and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, who built his house upon a rock.


25And the rain descended and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat upon that house; and it fell not, for it was founded upon a rock.


26And every one that heareth these sayings of Mine and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, who built his house upon the sand;


27and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell, and great was the fall of it."


28And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at His doctrine;


29for He taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes.

[BikeWriter]

29. Take away their Tax exempt status now!

[DU GrovelBot]

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[Demeter]

35. Your Orders Were to Lead By Example

if I remember Christ's words accurately. His example--not Hitler's!

[Redstone]

37. ''We've got God-sized problems...only God can solve them''

OK, if only God can solve these problems, then why don't you shut and leave him alone so he can concentrate on solving the problems?

Redstone

[CO Liberal]

39. Any Evangelical With A Polical Agenda....

...should forfeit all tax exemptions.

Immediately.

[VegasWolf]

40. I wish these evangelicals would stick to the zoo.

Christian Evangelical trying to convert lion at Taipei Zoo

[dmallind]

44. Divorce rate?

I find it strange they mention the divorce rate, since research by Barna (an evangelical Xian polling company) shows that evangelicals have a far higher divorce rate than liberal denominations.

The lowest divorce rate? A tie between Catholics and atheists. Yep those damned godless swine and their amoral ways!

Speaking as an atheist married to a Catholic this is reassuring :-)

[modrepub]

50. And

They wore $1000 suits, ate caviar, stayed in the best rooms, talked about their million dollar churches and generally spared no expense. I wonder how much it cost to move that monument around...