Study finds speeding tolerated

[Gman]

June 13, 2005, 7:14AM
Study finds speeding tolerated
Some motorists are allowed to go 10 mph above the limit before they are pulled over
Associated Press

WASHINGTON - Authorities patrolling U.S. highways tend to give motorists a cushion of up to 10 miles per hour above the speed limit before pulling them over, says a survey by a group of state traffic safety officials.
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This practice creates an unsafe comfort level at high speeds and is a potential safety hazard, according to the report being released today by the Governors Highway Safety Association. The group found that 42 states allow drivers to regularly exceed the speed limit before they are stopped.

"This cushion truly exists across this country and in some cases is more than 10 mph above posted limits,'' said Jim Champagne, the association's chairman.

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/nation/3222360

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Fine with me. If you drive in Texas, you've got to make time. I drove 1,300 miles last week from San Antonio to Houston and back, down to Brownsville and various points between there and McAllen, to Corpus Christi then back to San Antonio. I can tell you driving 70 just doesn't get it.

In any event, if you're going to drive 70 between San Antonio and Houston you'd better get your butt in the right hand lane or you will get run over. Those people have got to be somewhere.

[RPM]

1. damn right

i drove 1000 miles this weekend, pretty much all at 75-85 MPH...

No fuz at all...

[Gman]

10. Seems to me much of Pennsylvania is 65 mph

I saw your profile and noticed you're in Pennsylvania. Is the PA speed limit still 65?

I once drove from Charleston, WV to Pittsburgh. When we got into PA, the speed limit dropped to 65 all the way to Pittsburgh. Nevertheless, I drove 75-80 most of the way. My wife told me to be careful because we had Texas plates and that they didn't like Texans up there. I said something like, "I don't give a s***!" She replied, "That's why."

We did see radar a couple of times, but didn't get caught.

[RPM]

11. Pittsburgh PA to Hartford CT...

... in just under 8 hours each way.

I have done Hoboken NJ to PGH and back routinely in 5:15 each way on a 360 mile trip.

[Barrett808]

2. Probably needs to be 10 mph above the limit to make it worthwhile

To make it worth Smokey's time.

[pokercat999]

24. You hit the nail on the head. In Va anyway. On a divided

highway 10 miles or less is a minimal ticket and fine. Over 10 MPH the fine gets much larger.

I have been making weekend trips from Richmond to Charlotte; once across the VA/NC line I hook-up the radar detector and run between 85 and 90 and as high as 120 when traffic permits. I am very safe do not weave in and out of traffic and only speed up when the way is clear. I saw two bouts of road rage this last weekend involving drivers blocking the passing lane at or below the posted speed limit. The strange thing was the drivers having the "rage" were the slow drivers. It's like they were out there trying to enforce the speed limit by blocking the fast lane. I saw some crazy driving at 80+ MPH by people that were probably not qualified to drive at 55 MPH. When that happens I just slow down and drift back making sure I have plenty of space and distance between us for when these clowns cause a wreck. The average speed on Interstate 85 seemed to be around 80 MPH that's 10-15 MPH over the limit in most places along the route.

[Barrett808]

30. Interesting -- thanks for corroborating. n/t

[mccoyn]

36. Those law abiding citizens...

They shouldn't be angry when following the letter of the law results in tailgaters?

I usually drive at the speed limit or 5 mph faster. Most of the time I can stay in the right lane, but sometimes there is a truck or some other slower vehicle that I have to pass. I use the left lane and since I'm going about the same speed as the vehicle I am passing it can take a while? Should I speed up? Should the other vehicle slow down? We are both doing what the law says. Some police cars are designed so you can't recognize them from up front. I had one of these cars tailgate me (while I was already speeding.) Not realizing it was a cop I responded to the pressure by speeding up so he could pass me and I got a ticket. I no longer allow other drivers to pressure me to break the law.

The bottom line is that highway traffic flows much better if everyone agrees on the same speed. All these people trying to second guess what they can get away with and the cops that let them only cause problems, potentially safety problems, definitely reduce the amount of traffic that a road can accommodate and slows everyone down.

[Gman]

39. Actually, the bottom line is

traffic flows best when slower traffic keeps to the right. That means if you're doing 80 and someone else is doing 90, you belong in the right lane, regardless of the law.

It's the law in Texas, and I'm sure other states, that slower traffic keeps to the right and the left lane is for passing, regardless of how fast everyone is going.

[drdtroit]

44. You should only use the left lane to pass!

It's not about breaking the law, it's about common courtesy.
That is why we could never maintain an "autobahn" type of highway in the USA.
Too many people here believes it's their right to drive in whatever lane they feel like.
Plus, if you're cruising in the left lane you're more likely to draw the attention of a trooper. He was probably originally just trying to get you to move over.

[LanternWaste]

47. I agree

I agree. If someone wants to break the law to suit a personal convenience, fine... go right ahead, but I'll be damed if I alter my own (legal) habits to help them achieve their goal of getting to the grocery store 90 seconds earlier.

Yeah, I live in Texas nine months outta the year and the time difference between driving 60 v. 75 on I-30 or I-20 in the Metroplex is simply negligible. And if one is out in West Texas (driving from say, San Antonio to El Paso) and that extra hour one gets by speeding is so damned important, might I suggest "Leave An Hour Earlier!"

There seems to be a pattern of "This is a morally acceptable law to break, so if you don't help ME break the law, then YOU become the problem"-- I think it's simply self-righteous justification and petty projection of guilt.

[barb162]

3. wasting gasoline... at those speeds

but I have done it myself

[aden_nak]

9. I actually get about 30 mpg whether I do 60 or 75.

Saturn: Shitty But Constant

[B3Nut]

12. Same with my ZX2...

Around 30-32, no matter how gingerly or maniacally I drive it. Which suits me, I hate going slow. :D

TP

[aden_nak]

16. It's more or less mandatory for NJ highway travel. :P

[RPM]

13. I get 33 MPG (31 with the AC on) doing about 80

German cars were build for that speed, efficiency wise...

[pnb]

4. They needed a study to figure this out?

I've known this since roughly 1 week after I got my drivers license.

[Goldmund]

5. I was just gonna say the same thing

[Ravenseye]

7. Seriously

My first thoughts reading this were "Can you say Government Waste?"

[daleo]

58. I don't see a problem with studies that verify what people think they know

Frequently this is the case, but sometimes the reality is not what people think it is, so studies like this don't bother me. For example, many of the common-sense treatments used in medicine have a very slim evidence base, and when proper experiments are done they don't hold up. The same is true in many other areas, especially in the social sciences.

My biggest concern about sporadic law enforcement is that it gives the police a huge opportunity to exercises their prejudices, along with their judgment. For example, drivers in nice cars might get a 10 mph cushion, while drivers in older cars get pulled over. There is obvious potential for race and class prejudice when laws are enforced inconsistently.

All that being said, I have exceeded the speed limit by quite a bit more than 10 mph on more than one occasion.

[eallen]

6. Few people calibrate their speedometers.

Unless you want to start ticketing people who are trying to obey the law, there has to be some cushion so that you get those who are flaunting the speed limit, rather than those whose speed control is set at 70, but who are really doing 73, because they just bought new tires.

[aden_nak]

8. In New Jersey, you rarely get a highway ticket for less than 15.

It has to do with the way the ticket penalties are structured. If you get a ticket for less than 15 mph over the limit, you can "argue it down" to a lesser offense, which carries such a small fine it's not worth the bother. Furthermore, you really only rack up the nasty insurance points for 15 or more over the limit here. So they hand out 15-20 mph tickets, people go to court and agree to pay a larger fine for no points instead.

[LisaM]

14. There were just two nasty fatal accidents on I-5 in Washington State

where the speed limit is 70, people regularly go 80, and the traffic is very heavy. They need to cut the speed limit down. They've just built a horrible complex of a Wal-Mart, Home Depot, casino, and outlet mall up there and the level of traffic is really too high to sustain those speeds. In the more gruesome accident, a truck pulling a camper was cut off in the left lane, lost control, veered across the (two narrow) median, and hit four cars, killing a family of three with a young child. We drove by later, and it was heart wrenching, there were personal possessions, including toys, all over the freeway, and all these smashed up cars, and the camper on its side. People local to the area complain about the speeding all the time.

[CottonBear]

15. In the Metro Atlanta Speeding is mandatory, especially in driving rain.

Last night, I drove back from Chattanooga, TN to Athens, GA via I-75, I-285 (The Perimeter loop), I-85 and GA 316.

It was a terrifying trip that should have taken 3.5 hours and, instead took me 5.5 hours. Those motherfuckers tried to kill me. I was tailgated, passed on the wrong side, hemmed in by tractor trailers, cut off by enraged taxi cab drivers and not allowed to change lanes thus missing my exit onto GA 316.

There were two nighttime driving rainstorm events which dumped massive amounts of water onto to major interchanges on the perimeter. I drove into 100 yards of 6 inch to 1 foot deep standing water at over 50 MPH (I'd slowed down.) All the while, the idiot drivers around me were driving as if there was no tomorrow. I had to exit the interstate and sit out the first storm. I was shaking. When the rain cleared, I got back on the highway and BAM another flash flood storm at Spaghetti Junction.

I thought that I was gonna die. I may never drive through Atlanta ever again. I've been doing it since 1981 and I've almost used up all my luck.

edit: There was a fatal accident in that rainstorm last night. Not to mention, more teenagers were killed in accidents this weekend in Atlanta. Atlanta traffic is DEADLY. 6 lanes each way on the perimeter all going 80+ mph. Terrifying. :scared:

[toopers]

17. I have a question for you.

Why were you in one of the left hand lanes if you were moving slower than other traffic?

[LisaM]

21. CottonBear said there are SIX lanes each way

It doesn't follow that CB was in one of the left lanes. Plus, s/he clearly stated that s/he was hemmed in, cut off, and not allowed to change lanes.

[CottonBear]

26. Atlanta traffic is a nightmare. You literally get dumped

into the middle of I-85 and coming up on the right are a series of exit only lanes on the right. The GA 316 split comes up next after about 4 exits past the 285/85 interchange. Two lanes go right (GA 316) and the others go left (85 N). The pent-up traffic from the overpass-interchange rainstornm nightmare bottleneck came out of the rain and all six lanes drove like crazy trying to pass and tailgate and speed. These jokers all think that they are NASCAR drivers.

They just wouldn't let me over. They all pass on the left. I've never missed the exit before.
:scared:

[CottonBear]

25. Because when the giant I-285/I-85 overpass dumps you onto I-85

you are in the middle of the interstate. There are six fucking lanes! Immediately YOU must MERGE LEFT OR BE KILLED BECAUSE YOUR LANE ENDS! There are already lanes to the right when you get dumped onto I-85 North from the Perimeter. You really must drive it to believe it. It is a death trap. The tallest overpass is several hundred feet high. There's a reason why it's called Spaghetti Junction.

[CottonBear]

33. See this aerial photo:

(The Tom Moreland Interchange AKA Spaghetti Junction) :scared:

[toopers]

35. I live in Atlanta and I grew up in Athens,

so I am familiar with Spaghetti Junction as well as 316. Even if you moved over to allow traffic into the farthest right hand lane, you would still be in an exit lane for 316. However, I will grant you that driving in Atlanta sux. My point being that there are a lot of people who drive and do not understand the hierarchy of lanes, or just choose to ignore it. I am not implying that is what you were doing.

BTW, depending on which side of Athens you live on, you may want to avoid 316, stay on 85N until you get to the Jefferson/Gainesville exit (Hwy 129). They have expanded 129 that into 4 lanes and does not get the traffic that 316 gets. Plus it goes through Arcade, home of the coldest beer in Georgia -- so the legend goes.

[CottonBear]

37. Arcade is out of my way.

I was forced to the left by the traffic to my right. (someone pulled into my path.) I simply could not get back over. The rain was tremendous. Like I said, it never happened before that I missed the 316 exit. The other drivers were CRAZED from having to drive 45 during the rainstorm.

[kodi]

42. "Arcade, home of the coldest beer in Georgia " and a damn nasty spped trap

i live right off of rt 82 and 129.

you just have to love an area that has more liquor stores than churches.

btw: arcade voted last month to allow 2,400 single homes to be built along 129, just south of the arcade townhall. soon it will look like gwinnette county up here.

[CottonBear]

49. In the early 1990s, I interviwed almost every household in Arcade

for a CDBG grant application. I met every bar owner, pit bull and dobermann in town. :scared: This was before the coming of the new suburbs.

Oh yeah, the cops sit right where the US 129 bypass/ old US 129 split occurs. I know to look for 'em!

[CottonBear]

28. In Atlanta, going slower means going less than 75 or 80 MPH.

:scared:

[CottonBear]

31. See this aerial photo:

[alarimer]

51. merging traffic

Where I live (in Texas) there are a lot of on-ramps where people are merging. even though they are required to yield to traffic already on the road, they almost neve do. And since there are on-ramps right next to off ramps, the right lane is often incredibly slow (try 45- 50) so I usually drive in the center lane if there is one (in some big cities there may be 2 center lanes). If not I am in the left lane if I am not planning on exiting, at lease until I am out of town.

[NoSunWithoutShadow]

18. What a driving nightmare. Glad you're safe.

I think I read that more accidents happen during rain than during snow. I hate driving in the rain at night.

[CottonBear]

23. Me too! I was never so glad to see my driveway!

:)

[msmcghee]

27. I remember coming down that long hill into Atlanta . .

. . from Tennessee a few years ago pulling a heavily loaded trailer behind my van.

I was in the right lane and trying to keep it at 60 or under but I was repeatedly blasted by 18 wheeelers pissed off and tailgating then passing me at least 20 mph faster than I was going. That was one scary ride.

[CottonBear]

29. Wow! I'm glad you made it.

No one can understand Atlanta unless you've driven it. The dark and rain make it extra deadly. People die all the time there.

[kodi]

41. one has to be crazy or desperate to travel Spaghetti Junction at rush hour

i live out in jefferson and have been to atlanta exactly once in 18 months. the traffic sux so bad i pity the fools who have to drive into atlanta on 85/77 every day to work.

[CottonBear]

48. Hello kodi! I have some friends who live in Jefferson.

I commuted to Decatur/Scottdale during the summer of 1986. I drove in on US 78 (before the bypass). Way too stressful. I pity all of the commuters too. I'm just PRAYING for a train from Athens to Atlanta to Chattanooga. We used to have passenger trains that went everywhere as late as the late 1960s.

I'm going to try and organize an Athens area DU meetup in July. Stay tuned to the GA forum for more info!

[newscott]

52. Wow, great Atlanta driving story

Reminds me of the "X" in Providence.

The southbound side of Rt 95 and the northbound side of rt 95 share 4 lanes at one point. GOING IN THE SAME DIRETCTION! Then the northbound folks have to move from the left to the right and the southbound folks have to move from the right to the left in order to follow their roads! All this while driving under an overpass that's like a tunnel!!! Try doing that while reading a map!!!!

And don't ever get off the highway in Providence. You will never get back on. Even if you know the roads, they tend to open and close exit and on ramps seemingly at random!!!!

I used to do the am drive into Boston. It truly sucked. 80 plus on the way in, bumper to bumper. 80 plus on the way out, bumper to bumper.

Now I work second shift and can drive any damn speed I want! Which is now slower, since I got sick of speeding tickets.

And in MA it works the same. The fine goes up substantially when you reach that magic number 10mph over the limit!

[barbaraann]

19. Dave Barry refers to the "national pretend speed limit."

Actually, I drive a lot and I think cops let people with rightwing bumperstickers get away with speeding most of the time and don't pull them over, but ticket people with leftwing bumperstickers. (anecdotal evidence from personal observation)

[DS1]

20. Speeding is hardly ever worth it. And yes, I suppose that

makes me officially old. I used to drive fast, but a few tickets here and there put a stop to do that, as did my old tires and now older car. I'd happier getting passed by everything else on the road, just cruisin at the speed limit and enjoying my coffee.

What ~IS~ more fun than speeding now is not slowing down for turns, and having the people following you in the SUV think they can follow a sports car with sports suspension and sports tires driven by an F1 buff :evilgrin: Watching the panic ensue in the mirror is classic.

[Boomer]

22. at only 10 miles over? In what reality?

I drive to work on I-81 every morning and traffic routinely tops the 65mph speed limit by at least 15mph. I've rarely seen anyone stopped by the police -- best I can figure is you have to drive by at 85mph to get their attention.

And forget changing speeds to accommodate road conditions. Fog, snow, rain -- makes no difference to the maniacs on the road.

[bemildred]

32. Heavy traffic makes it's own rules.

Cops have to be careful or they get a REALLY big mess on their hands.

[Submariner]

34. We blow by Florida Highway Patrol doing 80 regularly

but they do not bother with speeders, there is no money in it. What they really salivate about is catching drivers in the HOV (commuter) lane with less than 2 people in the car. I've been told the fine is about $275!

[damntexdem]

38. Up in Kansas, it's officially the law:

up to 4 MPH over, it's totally legal;
5-9 MPH over, the driver can be ticketed (and pay a fine), but it doesn't count against one's driving record.
But I did get ticketed for exactly 10MPH over.

Down here in Texas, I think the cushion may indeed be about 25-30 MPH over the limit.

[speedingbullet]

40. Traffic Infractions

While most police do give speeders a "cushion" Motorists meeting a drug courier profile may find themselves pulled over for very trivial violations. I have had drug clients who were stopped in one case for driving 4 mph over on the Interstate and another for "following too closely." The officers look for vehicles from a "narcotics source state" This sometimes seems to mean that the occupants have brown skin.

[LeftyMom]

43. We got pulled over for driving the speed limit once

We were going through Davis on our way to the Bay Area one Saturday morning when we got pulled over. Apparently somebody thought that driving the limit was a sure sign LeftyDad was DUI. :eyes: The CHP officer was really nice, but frustrated that somebody had wasted his time and ours.

[renegade000]

45. i try to stay around 5 MPH above max

i'm a fairly new driver, plus my car isn't that fast.
of course i get passed all the time lol

[sendero]

46. IMHO...

... speed limits must be calculated the same way they were 40 years ago.

When cars took twice as far to stop from 60 mph as they do now. When cars would routinely overturn when faced with a tough manouvre at speed.

Simply put, most speed limits (except in residential areas) are too low IMHO, even the police in Dallas rarely drive the posted limit - it is just too slow.

Around here, speed is not near the accident factor as idiots who think a light is red 10 seconds after it turns red is.

[Xithras]

50. You're ignoring one important fact....

There are a LOT of 40 year old cars still on the road, and the laws have to accomodate THEIR safety requirements as well. If you raise the speed limit to 80 assuming that modern cars handle better, try not to be too suprised when my dads 1958 Bel Air shreds your car like tinfoil the first time you make an emergency stop in front of him.

[newscott]

53. Wow impressive imagery

of one car being shredded by another. I like that. :toast:

[Xithras]

54. It's actually happened to him.

About two years ago some guy made a left turn in front of him driving a brand new Toyota Camry. My dad was doing about 50 when he hit the car just behind the passenger door, and it turned out that the weight of the Camry wasn't enough to stop his old Chevy. The Toyota was torn in half and crushed to only three feet wide. The Toyota's driver had massive injuries, but DID survive, however, if he'd had anyone else in the car with him, they'd have been killed instantly.

And the Belair? It got a new bumper, a new grille, one fender, a little lead fill, and a paint job. My dad, who wasn't even wearing a seat belt, opened the door and stepped out without so much as a scratch...he later said that he never even felt the impact, just a hard deceleration as his car ripped through the other one.

Machines like that are a GREAT argument for keeping the speed limits reasonable.

[LanternWaste]

55. My dream car

One year off. My dream car is the '57 Bel Aire (Bably Blue/White).

Does he keep it cherry?

[Xithras]

56. Not really :-)

It's in good shape, solid and rust free, but it's more of a cruiser than a show car. He's been telling me that he's going to "restore it one day" for more than 20 years now. The only restorations it's ever seen are the three paint jobs it's received after each of its accidents. :)

[sendero]

59. By all means...

... let's gear all traffic laws to the worst possible scenario.

By that logic we might as well set all speed limits at 20, because I see cotton-tops every day who really cannot handle anything faster :)

[Gman]

57. In Houston...

Green means go, yellow means hurry up, red means step on it.