Pentagon Defies Order to Release Photos; 2,000 Veterans Call for Independe

[uppityperson]

http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=50803

WASHINGTON, July 25 /U.S. Newswire/ -- Veterans for Common Sense (VCS), a nonpartisan veterans' organization with 12,000 members, called for a commission to investigate torture allegations today, in response to the Pentagon refusal to release photos and videos from Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay.

In an open letter, signed by more than 2,000 veterans and supporters (including 5 flag-rank officers and more than 200 commissioned officers), the veterans urged Congress and the President to "commit -- immediately and publicly -- to support the creation of an independent commission to investigate and report on the detention and interrogation practices of U.S. military and intelligence agencies deployed in the war on terror."

Charles Sheehan-Miles, a 1991 Gulf War veteran and the group's executive director, said, "Once again the administration is fighting to prevent any possible public accountability for its policies, instead choosing to blame it all on the troops. To court-martial privates while high ranking officials get promoted is damaging to the very principle of command responsibility and undermines the U.S. military." Veterans for Common Sense is co-plaintiff in a lawsuit filed by a coalition of human rights and civil liberties groups, including the American Civil Liberties Union and the Center for Constitutional Rights. The lawsuit has generated thousands of pages of documents in the last year documenting torture, abuse and in some cases murder in U.S. detention centers.

Individuals who have seen the photos and videos, including some members of Congress and journalist Seymour Hersh, have reported they include scenes far worse than anything released from Abu Ghraib thus far, including rape and the videotaped beating of a prisoner. The courts had ordered the Pentagon to release the photos by Friday, July 22, but the Pentagon filed a last minute brief attempting to block their release.

More at link

[babylonsister]

1. BRAVO! I'm glad the vets aren't letting this drop. It's a

deep, dark stain on all Americans, and the truth should come out.

[lonestarnot]

52. Want Truth Out!

[bribri16]

54. How can the public ignore 2,000 vets and pay attention to Swiftboaters?

This has got to be HUGE!!! Do what you can to spread the word.

[barb162]

67. It's easy to ignore

The previous photos were so disgusting, why look at worse ones? I will be shutting the TV off, I think, if I hear when they will be released.

[HeeBGBz]

60. Yay, I think I signed that one

I don't really remember. I've signed so many petitions lately, it makes my head spin.

Kick ass!

[The_Casual_Observer]

2. The US taxpayers paid for what ever is in those pictures. They ought

to see what it is they are buying over there.

[BeHereNow]

8. They don't want that to happen-

They don't want Americans to see what they are
paying for because they know all hell will break loose.
The "Focus Groups" might just turn into torch and pitchfork
brandishing mobs if they ever see what is being
done in their names with their tax dollars.

I keep thinking about how the pictures
from Vietnam turned the public into a swelling
mass of resistance- I think that period of dissent would look fairly
mild compared to what would happen today
should theses images become public.

You know they must be fairly horrific since
they are fighting the release so hard.

The know it's over and no amount of spin
will hold back the public's outrage if they are
confronted with the full and ugly truth of the abuses.

BHN

[wiggs]

3. Remember how upset Joe Biden was re torture?

Seems like he would be a leader on this issue, but we're not hearing much from him.

[stevietheman]

7. Biden is a political coward... who doesn't know that? n/t

n/t

[ladjf]

14. Biden is total bad news. Please don't expect anything

of substance to emit from his lips. He is a self-centered, non-friend of the American people.

[wiggs]

16. Agree. Which is why I wanted to remind all of his duplicity. nt

[nolabels]

50. I still remember the expressions from the sniveling wimp

During the Iran-Contra hearings :mad:

An enabler in the truest sense

[Dr Fate]

19. Which DEMs are we hearing from on this?

???

[Burried News]

24. Not slippery Joe. He doesn't do standup.

Incompatible with his career path.

[WhiteTara]

27. you would think he would care because

his wife was a prisoner in the German death camps. But I guess that if you aren't from there, it isn't torture? Joe Loserman is a pathetic piece of pustules.
Why do they keep in Connecticut?

[Burried News]

30. The Greenwich area supports him.

New York bankers, broker etc. live right across the state line and have alot of money. Greenwich (pronounced Grenich) may be the most affluent area of its size in the US.
I don't know why they back him (because I sure don't)but I have heard others say he is very attentive and responsive to constituents.

[WhiteTara]

34. Ah he is an ass suck to the rich

he must have had a terrible childhood.

[Burried News]

40. Father was a liquor salesman.

And the household very religious - seems conflictual to me but then I try to reconcile paradox's in my beliefs. Perhaps the rationalization is those buying the liquor are not his people so there is no obligation to do what is in their best interest? I don't waste my time understanding him - he is the opposition period - no matter what his party.

[WhiteTara]

43. a drug pusher eh?

well no wonder Loserman is such a mess. But he is still a puke and I can't stand him.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

56. A mobster by the name of Carlos Marcello controlled....

...the alcohol business in Louisiana for a long time...I wonder if the elder Biden knew him?

[MisterP]

59. I think we're talking about Lieberman here--although both Senators

appear to have learned studied uselessness early on in their lives

[fooj]

4. Ya hear that, Shrub? These are actions of REAL PATRIOTS!!!

A true patriot defends the honor and integrity of their country.

A true patriot puts country before party. Geez...

Peace.

[goforit]

5. I salute all you veterans!!!.....Way to stand up to Tyrranny!!!

:bounce: :grouphug::bounce:

[wli]

6. kick

:kick:

[Karenina]

42. Punt!

:kick:

[ClayZ]

9. Sent link to my Veteran Son!

I will be proud if he adds his name to the letter!






:kick:

[staticstopper]

10. KICK

[QuettaKid]

11. KICK!! nt.

.

[gratuitous]

12. A nonpartisan veterans' organization, huh?

Anyone want to bet that Veterans for Common Sense are about to come under more scrutiny and more vituperation than the Swift Boat Veterans ever received? And if even one VCS member is behind on his child support, or has a parking ticket, or received a less than honorable discharge, you can bet that the entire organization will be discounted in its entirety.

That is, if they get any publicity at all.

[proud patriot]

13. We must get to the bottom of this

I commend these Vets

[katty]

15. Go VETS! Keep the pressure on the Fourth Reich

[Roy]

17. Woo Hoo.... I'm sure the Swift Boat Veterans will be signing on

to this noble patriotic call for accountability.....

Well... won't they????

Oh well......

[Dr Fate]

18. Which Top Democrats have the backs of these Vets?...

...and are on TV calling for the release of these photos?

Oh- thats right- if the "Star" DEMs did that, the media might make them apologize again. At least they are against video games.

[TankLV]

28. Hey - Dicky Durbin is preparing his apology right now!

Just in case it's needed - again and again!

[Burried News]

45. This message not approved by the ADL.

That's why we so highly recommend it.
Dick Durbin is a prisoner of war - his apologies imply his first statement was correct.

[nookiemonster]

20. Kick!

n/t

[mbperrin]

21. Why do vets hate 'Murika?

I mean, what would THEY know about what's important to troops??!!


I tell you what, these guys are the PROUD and the BRAVE; they're doing something that could turn really ugly and dangerous, and I salute them for it!!


Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ninkasi]

22. These vets know what's right

and have a sense of honor. The chickenhawks at the very top who authorized the torture have no honor, and no allegiance to our country or the Constitution.

I salute them for their courage, and their call for justice.

[Orion The Hunter]

23. You go, Vets!

Nice to see that those who served are not rolling over on this issue!

[Burried News]

25. Warning: This comparison is not ADL approved.

[Straight Shooter]

26. Very important that this is a nonpartisan organization.

That should shut up people on both sides of the aisle who think they have a hidden agenda.

I want those photos out there. What people are beginning to imagine is in those photos is becoming just as bad as what the photos depict. Soon, there will be rumors that will run rampant, and the Pentagon will have no choice but to release them. Then the sh*t avalanche will start all over again.

I can't wait until the grown-ups are in charge again. These spoiled rotten brats are driving me crazy.

[jazzjunkysue]

29. another example of the freedom we're fighting for......

Thou Shalt Not Think, or know.

[burrowowl]

31. HIP! HIP! HOORAH! VCS!

HIP! HIP! HOORAH! VCS!

and at least a 21-gun Salute!

[5thGenDemocrat]

32. This humble ex-private signed it

I figured my service time should count for something -- if only for signing something so democratic as a petition of grievance to our national leaders. Call me old-fashioned.
John
72E20, US Army(SigC), 1974-76.
And when I say "humble," I mean like Beetle Bailey. No talent for the military whatsoever. But there you are.

[uppityperson]

35. Thank you.

[ClayZ]

33. Kicking!

:kick: :kick:

[peacebird]

36. Keep this going - these images must be released

What is the next step? Since the administration refuses to follow judges ruling - what recourse is there?

[IndianaGreen]

37. Open Letter from Veterans for Common Sense

Open Letter from Veterans for Common Sense

As military veterans who have served in every U.S. conflict since 1941, and their supporters, we have worked for decades to defend the national security of the United States and to uphold the honor, integrity and effectiveness of its military. We have greatly valued the opportunity to serve, and we remain committed to this critically important cause.

The reputation of the U.S. Armed Forces and related agencies were badly – we hope not irrevocably – damaged when the Abu Ghraib photos came to light. The rising number of serious allegation of abuses and deaths in custody raise serious questions concerning U.S. detention policy.

Given the range of individuals and locations involved in these reports, it is simply no longer possible to view these allegations as a few instances of an isolated problem. Yet none of the purported major or comprehensive investigations have assigned responsibility to any individuals responsible for policymaking nor held any commanding officer accountable for these abuses, other than the demotion, by one grade, of a Brigadier General.

The well-developed system of national and international laws governing detention and interrogation was designed – and has long been followed by the United States – for critical policy reasons in the United States’ self-interest. Experience and common sense have shown that information gathered through physical torture or dehumanizing humiliation is notoriously unreliable. It has a demoralizing, dehumanizing effect not only on those subject to violations, but also on our own troops – those who may be directly involved, and those unfairly tarred with the same brush. Violation of basic rules of international law by those acting under U.S. control also puts U.S. forces at greater risk. It jeopardizes the United States’ moral and practical authority to promote democracy and human rights abroad. And it seriously undermines the United States’ ability to “win the hearts and minds” of the global community – a goal essential to defeating terrorism over the long term. Finally, it is damaging to military morale to punish subordinates, but not hold those in leadership positions accountable for policymaking and implementation.

We urge you to commit – immediately and publicly – to support the creation of an independent commission to investigate and report on the detention and interrogation practices of U.S. military and intelligence agencies deployed in the global war on terror.


Sincerely,

http://www.veteransforcommonsense.org/index.cfm?Page=Campaign&MemberID=0&subPage=MoreInfo&CampaignID=23

[leftchick]

38. kick

:kick:

[Karenina]

39. Rock my world!!!!

:woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:

[redqueen]

41. I've called Reid and Pelosi's offices.

It would be better for our Senators to stand up against abuses like this, and demand the release of this evidence so the taxpayers can see what they're funding, than to fight against the horrors of lewd video games.

877-762-8762

[burrowowl]

44. KICK!

[Burried News]

46. Senator Warner, look at the fine example Senator Roberts is

setting today. His committee is going to investigate the CIA proceedures for making agents covert so he can support the Busheviks. Things are getting to crisis proportions John - don't just stand there with your thumb in you butt ...

Well maybe after all that you've seen in those photos, that might be the next best thing to a chastity belt for self defense. But John they're just pictures after all. Just frat pranks. Just ...disgusting.

[lonestarnot]

47. kick

[Karenina]

48. Back to One!

:kick:

[QuettaKid]

49. KICK!!!

:kick:

[lonestarnot]

51. Release the PHOTOS! YOU BUTTWIPES!

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

53. Why aren't we hearing from the ACLU?

On their website, I can't even find the story of the government's refusal to turn over the tapes anymore.

Has anyone heard even one spokesperson from the ACLU in our media, describing what this means and what they intend to do about it? When is the government going to file their sealed motion to suppress with the court? Has the government turned over the redacted photos and tapes to the judge to make sure they complied with the order, even if they're objecting now to making them public? Has the ACLU responded to the government's new motion, opposing it? What? I'm completely in the dark here and I don't like it.

[The Night Owl]

55. Even more perplexing is that DU doesn't seem to care..

All the threads about the government motion to block the Abu Ghraib torture photos and videos seem to die quickly unless kicked. Perhaps when more is known, DU will wake up. In my opinion, the Abu Ghraib scandal requires the maximum attention from us as a collective.

By the way, did you know that Alberto Gonzales, torture's best friend, is reviewing the FOIA?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

57. "DU doesn't seem to care"?? I've seen quite a few threads, some....

...very long, on ALL of these subjects. After a while, nearly everyone that wants to chip-in has had their say and the threads understandably grow shorter. That doesn't mean that anyone on DU doesn't care.

[napi21]

61. Here's info posted on the ACLU site today.

A hearing has been scheduled in federal court in New York for August 15 to address two issues: whether the public has been improperly denied access to information as a result of the government's redacted briefs, and whether the government should be compelled to release photographs of abuse at Abu Ghraib.

http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/SafeandFree.cfm?ID=18842&c=280

You might want to read the whole article at their site. I just did a short clip with the hearing date.

[The Night Owl]

62. I still don't get it.

I thought the court had already ruled that the government would have to release the Abu Ghraib photos and videos.

The ACLU lawyers seem to be suggesting that the government is defying the court order to release the torture photos and videos. So, if the government is defying the courts, why the hell aren't people being arrested?

This is infuriating.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

63. Thanks for the heads up

This merits its own separate posting. The ACLU describes the redaction not only of the photos, but of the government's court papers themselves as "a new low".

[njdemocrat106]

68. I think we should also hear from Amnesty International

Of course the last time AI spoke out against Gitmo, Shrub and Darth Cheney villified them and basically called them liars.

[Orsino]

58. Anyone have a link to the actual order?

I'm hearing it only ordered redaction, not release? Could that be true?

[Orsino]

65. Anyone? n/t

[uppityperson]

66. try aclu website.

they might have it

[stepnw1f]

64. Our Vets Have Spoken

Let's see what the Bush Administration has done.

[Sunkiss BlueStar]

69. This is GOOOOOOD

and How will the Repukes react to the Veterans? Will they call them Unpatriotic?
They Hate us for our Freedom!

[lumpy]

70. Scenes of rape and murder.

Reportedly Rumsfeld said after viewing the tapes and pictures that "I mean, I looked at them last night and they're hard to believe. They show acts that only can be described as blatantly sadistic, cruel and inhumane". Some members of Congress have viewed the pictures. The pictures must be so damnning that they fear an outburst of public outrage.