NASA chief says agency 'goofed' on pre-launch safety checks (AFP)

[Up2Late]

(Woops!):blush:

NASA chief says agency 'goofed' on pre-launch safety checks

31/07/2005 16h39

HOUSTON, Texas (AFP) - NASA administrator Michael Griffin said Sunday that the US space agency had "goofed" on vital safety checks before launching the shuttle Discovery and that it was "lucky" the shuttle had not sustained serious damage during liftoff.

Facing down questions over a stray shard of foam which broke off from an external tank during Discovery's launch on Tuesday, Griffin told NBC's "Meet the Press" that pre-launch checks had fallen short.

"Our judgement at the time was that it was okay," the NASA chief said of the structural reviews of the external tank and other vital equipment that was examined before Discovery's liftoff. "As everyone has said without any attempt to hide it ... we goofed on that one," he said.

The shedding of foam debris during launch is alarming because it was just such a stray shard of foam that hit the space shuttle Columbia during liftoff.

<http://www.afp.com/english/news/stories/050731163921.kmq9x3bm.html>

[KeepItReal]

1. Is this the "My Bad" way of running NASA?

Damn. Hope those folks on the shuttle make it home safe.

[Cocoa]

2. that's why they put pencils on erasers

I'm sure the astronauts are ok with it. :sarcasm:

[phaseolus]

3. Unfortunate language, perhaps, but...

...sometimes surprises come up when you're dealing with engineering designs, no matter how careful you are. My guess is he's just trying to show that he's not passing the buck or something...???

[wtmusic]

4. We expect the shuttle flights to be as safe as an airliner

when there are 250,000 commercial flights every year, compared to 114 shuttle flights overall since 1981. The US has launched 455 men and women into space safely and without incident.

In the process of all the analysis and "coulda, woulda, shoulda" what is often ignored is the amazing accomplishment of putting people in space at all.

[kevsand]

7. I don't expect shuttles to be as safe as airliners.

It's an inherently risky business, using an outdated technology that may have been a poor choice even when it was new. Things are going to go wrong.

What I do expect is that when a problem causes critical failure and loss of life and grounds the fleet for two years, that those two years will be spent fixing the problem so it doesn't happen again the very first time out. This isn't a goof. It's an unimaginable fuck up.

[wtmusic]

14. The plastic foam insulating barrier

has been tested countless times in hypersonic wind tunnels, under varying conditions. It's impossible to predict exactly what forces are in play during an actual flight, and the tanks themselves sink to the bottom of the Indian Ocean after they are ejected.

I bring up airliners because a significant source of current knowledge re: jet airplane airframe stresses were the result of deHavilland Comets disintegrating in mid-air in the 1950's, with tragic consequences.

[kevsand]

22. All of that is true.

It was true for years before the disaster. And yet we also know that pieces have fallen off on several missions, and continue to do so.

Maybe it's time to change the technology. I know it'll never be 100% foolproof, but I think we can do better than this.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

26. But the piece that fell off

was from a part of the tank that an administrator admitted was NOT resdesigned. It's not like it came from a part that was fixed but is still a problem.

[dbonds]

5. Saying OOPS is better than what they used to do.

It used to be everyone did their job perfectly and this was some unforseen event that we didn't anticipate.

[rocktivity]

6. Haste makes waste.

You're more likely to forget things when you're rushed. And they were very likely pressured into getting the shuttle into the air so that it could also get into the headlines and replace Rovegate.

:headbang:
rocknation

[Hardrada]

27. That's what my wife thinks

and had it been another disaster we would have been very distracted from Rovegate and Shrub could have given another Reagan/Noonan speech about touching the clouds etc. Or am I being cynical?

[allalone]

8. let me see if I have this right

they want to send missions to mars and the moon, but they can't manage to work craft that used to be able to fly. Hm sounds practical to me.

[TahitiNut]

9. I've never understood why the belly of the shuttle was left unprotected

... during launch. From the very beginning, the ceramic tiles on the belly have been touted as extremely fragile, with an ablative reentry function that was critical. At the outset, there were several stories about the tiles and how each was uniquely-shaped according to its location on the belly. Those stories made it obvious that replacement of the tiles was essential between flights and orbital repair was impossible. It always seemed to me that it warranted at least a thin overall shield during take-off - one that might be jettisoned immediately prior to reentry. :shrug: Rube Goldberg.

[klyon]

21. good idea

thanks

KL

[Javaman]

10. I'm sure the Astronauts love hearing this...

I hope they brought their asbestos suits for reentry just in case.

Colossal Failure*

[Up2Late]

11. UPDATE: Nasa ponders fresh spacewalk trim (BBC News)

Sunday, 31 July, 2005, 18:50 GMT 19:50 UK

Nasa ponders fresh spacewalk trim

By Paul Rincon
BBC News science reporter, Houston

Nasa is considering whether to send an astronaut out on a spacewalk to trim two protruding gap fillers on the underside of space shuttle Discovery.

They are currently looking at the best option for getting a crew member to the underside of the vehicle safely. One option would be for a crew member to be ferried to Discovery's belly by the International Space Station's robotic arm. Gap fillers plug the spaces between shuttle heat shield tiles. The fillers are made of ceramic fabric.

Dangling materials

Shuttle managers hope to come to a decision over the gap filler issue on Monday. "We have a team of folks working aggressively to go and make that gap filler safe if we decide it's an issue. We have a separate team looking at the effects of leaving that gap filler protruding," said mission flight director Paul Hill.

They are also deliberating over which is the better option to repair the gap fillers. "We have various options from pulling the gap filler out to trimming it back to pushing it back into the gap," said Mr Hill.

<http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4733495.stm>
(more at link above)

[rocktivity]

12. A space walk, eh?

Why do I get the feeling that they are gradually working up to telling us something really really bad? Are they going to have to either make the repairs, make other arrangements to get the astronauts down, or risk a replay of the Columbia shuttle landing?

:shrug:
rocknation

[thinkingwoman]

13. NASA doesn't do impromptu space walks

they train and train and train and train.

If they are even considering an additional space walk mission, or a new mission folded into a planned 3rd spacewalk, there is something wrong...very, very, very, very wrong.

Seriously.

[rocktivity]

15. They'll get by with a little help from their friends, lol

Russia ready for shuttle rescue mission if needed

"We are ready to send three pilotable Soyuz capsules to the International Space Station by February 2006 should rescue of the Discovery crew be necessary," Nikolai Sevastyanov, head of the Energiya rocket construction firm that builds the Soyuz, was quoted by Russian news agencies as saying.

"We are hopeful and believe in the shuttle mission. But if our American partners need help, we can be of service," he said.

:headbang:
rocknation

[thinkingwoman]

16. NASA is too arrogant, I'm afraid

NASA won't admit defeat until there's another fireball in the sky. It would be easy to just let Russia bring them down safely...Russia says "hey, here we are"...NASA says "everything's fine, thanks anyway."

[Up2Late]

17. Sounds to me like they are underplaying the "problem"

Worst case, the added drag (or maybe I should say tug or pull on this filler fabric) could cause the fabric to pull off and start a tile shedding problem that, as they said in "Ghost Busters," 'would be bad.'"

[thinkingwoman]

19. love the Ghost Busters reference

"Nobody choosed anything!" ;-)

Sadkly, I think you're exactly right. I really hope this crew gets home ok, but I have a really bad feeling about this flight.

[bvar22]

18. Sounds like NASA was "being pressured" to

Sounds like NASA was "being pressured" to "Get that damned thing off the ground" and on to the Front Pages.
Now who would benefit from that?

[Digit]

25. Same thing I had been thinking....eom

[NNN0LHI]

20. Off to the moon, then Mars, and then on to er...ah...never mind n/t

[Disturbed]

23. I would fire that guy.

He is a poor PR person.

Flights hould be cancelled for at least two more years and a new model needs to be created. I sure as Hell wouldn't volunteer to be on any of their filghts!

[rfkrfk]

24. the best insulation foam has EPA problems

stop expecting the engineering dept. to make
spaceflight perfectly safe.

If you don't want to risk dying in space,
don't go there.

Getting into low Earth orbit is very difficult,
for a typical rocket,
98 percent of takeoff weight turns into
exhaust or useless junk.
Don't expect anything very 'new' in propulsion
or structure, these fields have been extensively and expensively
studied for years and years by both the military,
and civilian groups.
Don't expect the shuttle's replacement to do anything new,
shuttle's replacement --> warmed over scrambled eggs

I would suggest, a modern, US, version of the Russian Soyez.

[WhiteTara]

28. I wonder if "we goofed" means we will have

more dead astronauts? This is horrible.