Minutemen Volunteers Find Body of Suspected Border Crosser

[NNN0LHI]

http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGB1KHLQUBE.html

PHOENIX (AP) - A volunteer border patrol group discovered the body of a woman suspected to be a border crosser less than a mile from a water aid station maintained by a humanitarian group.

The woman was one of at least two people found dead near the border over the weekend.

The U.S. Border Patrol confirmed that they were told about the woman's body on Saturday, though agents declined to identify the reporting party. snip

Pima County Sheriff's Office spokeswoman Dawn Barkman said another man found dead on Sunday died of some apparent trauma. An autopsy was scheduled for Monday.

[Lerkfish]

1. well, this explains why the organizer left town.

and distanced himself.

somehow I think he knew this had happened/was going to happen and wanted plausible deniability.


ok, lets' wait for the DU patriots to show up and defend vigilante murder.

:popcorn:

[Bridget Burke]

4. That was the Texas organizer who left.

This happened near the Arizona border. The woman probably died of thirst, which is all too common for those who are desperate enough to make the trip.

The Texan left because of all the racists in the organization.

[alarimer]

13. A lot of people die trying to cross the border

Because of the heat and lack of water. I have no idea of the numbers. dozens at least I would think.

[Lerkfish]

26. "said another man found dead on Sunday died of some apparent trauma"

or did you miss that part?

[alarimer]

31. Yes I did

But in general most people die of the heat or lack of water when trying to cross. It is also premature to blame the Minutemen for this because it does not say what the trauma was, if it appears accidental or not. I don't like the Minutmen either but I doubt their plan really includes killing people.

[Kali]

9. Not defending Minutemen or those like them,

but I suspect you have no idea what its like down here on the border. Or how harsh the conditions are for those crossing especially the western half to the line between AZ and Sonora. Nobody needs to murder anybody out there for there to be migrant deaths - besides, its my understanding those guys aren't even in AZ anymore, and they sure as hell were'nt working that section -its too harsh.

Try walking 20 or 50 miles in over 100 degree heat with a quart or two of water. No shade - even the plant life is scrubby short bushes with real small leaves - there is no escape. 1000's cross every single day. The policy of our government has forced them to cross way out in rural areas instead of near towns - it doesn't stop anybody, just puts them at greater risk for death and illness (which we get to pay for, by the way) Its stupid and wasteful and destructive. Oh that would make it the American way - welcome to a better life.

[Lerkfish]

18. when you assume....

I lived in Tucson for 3.5 years, and had inlaws on the border.

Your suspicions are incorrect.

sorry.

I've also lived in Las Vegas, which is a drier desert than arizona. I'm aware of the need for water.

doesn't change my opinion about the minutemen, though.

[Kali]

29. OK so you know something about the desert -

still think vigilantes need to kill migrants to have deaths in the desert? These guys are a bunch of fat white guys hanging around in their motorhomes going for a short ride on a atv twice a day - they probably couldn't find a migrant if one was flagging them down.

[Lerkfish]

33. never mind....

you're characterizing them as completely ineffective fat white guys who couldn't find a migrant if one was flagging them down.

I thought you were arguing for their effectiveness? or the need for them to protect our borders.....I might have you confused with someone else, though.

but lets say this current characterization is correct -- then why in the hell are we tolerating their existence at the border ostensibly to "help" the real border patrol?


on edit: I had you confused with someone else. still, what I said has validity so I'll leave it, just don't apply it to kali.

[Kali]

35. well I don't think they OR the border patrol are particularly effective

but I DID say below that I can understand why some folks welcome them - its pretty bad and people want a solution - as usual the fast bandaid is the one that gets the most press (vigilante groups) - and personally I wouldn't want these clowns running around on my place but I do see why others might fall for it.

[NNN0LHI]

2. I wonder what actually killed these people?

The article never says. They insinuate the woman died from thirst and heat but the writer never actually comes out and says so. I hope they are doing an autopsy on both of these people.

And if these bigots are stationing themselves on and around water stations to make these people not use them and therefore die of thirst they are murderers.

Don

[Teaser]

5. Chupacabra?

or the minutement themselves.

[blondeatlast]

14. You and I both know there'll be no autopsy. As a Zonie, I could scream

till I'm blue and I know it won't happen.

Your idea about them stationing themselves by the water stations is sadly believable, too.

[The Stranger]

34. I really, really hate to think this, but don't predators nearly always. .

. . . set up near a watering hole? Especially in desert or dry climes?

You know eventually your prey is going to come by for a drink.

[Kali]

37. Most migrants never touch those waters because they

figure they are traps. The trails on our place are covered with half full water and pedialite bottle anyway. But I am in relatively easy country and a higher (cooler) altitued than the desert west of Tucson - where most of the deaths occur.

[radwriter0555]

3. The 'minutemen' still don't realize that MOST immigrants don't get here on

foot, and that it's not illegal to COME here.

It's just 'illegal' to overstay the visit visa... and most get here the old fashioned way, they FLY.

*sigh*

Dumb fucks never learn.

[MountainLaurel]

6. Why ruin their hatred with facts

And reality?

[Gregorian]

36. ^^^ This is brilliant.

Good thinking.

[Kali]

11. I don't know the numbers

Do you have stats? The Mexicans I know who come illegally can't get papers from their government - it can be a problem there, especially for rural poor to obtain documentation of birth etc. So I would say sure a certain number are overstaying visas, but judging by the trails, trash, numbers you can see waiting for night to cross on any day in any border town, numbers of apprehensions (MANY repeats) and the actual numbers of deaths, that "paperless" crossers far outnumber visa violators. I could be wrong but hey - I live smack dab in the middle of it...

[radwriter0555]

15. They don't bring suitcases, you're looking at the migrant workers.

They bring a sack lunch. Not exactly an indication of a long stay.

[Kali]

28. Huh?

Not what I'm seeing. Bus tickets from southern (Mexican) states, backpacks full of clothes, photos, bibles etc that the polleros make them leave behind, litterally TONS of this stuff every year - these are not migrant workers crossing the AZ border for day work - day work!!!! What the hell is there to do around the border for a day? No veg farms around here to speak of, its harsh desert, rocky mountains or rangeland - yeah that's it thousands crossing everyday for frigging picnics! Get a clue. They go in parts. Bus to border town, hook up with guide/coyote/pollero/whatever you want to call them, cross border in some remote area and WALK to a pick up point anywhere from a couple miles to 20 or even 50 to a road somewhere. Then a ride to Phx or some other "safe" big city for bus ride or even plane tickets to "destination" - Florida, Illinois, Colorado - whereever the construction, hotel/restaurant/housekeeping, meat packing or yes even agriculture jobs are (a lot of ag workers are actually legal now - too obvious)

A lot have to make the crossing repeatedly because they get picked up by the border patrol and returned to the border towns and dumped off.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

23. Anywhere from 25-40% of undocumented workers come here legally

and overstay their visas.

[Kali]

30. I guess that leaves 60 to 75%

crossing sin papeles.

[MrTriumph]

7. No evidence of wrong-doing by vol. border patrol. Bush loves open border

Hmm. Early mud slinging here at DU by proponents of open borders. Maybe it would be best to wait until there is some - ANY - evidence of wrong-doing.

Are some of the people participating in the vol. border patrol racist? Yes, probably some are. But are they murderers?

[Kraklen]

10. No evidence of wrong-doing?

Being a member of a racsit hate group is wrong-doing in and of itself.

[Kali]

12. Again, not defending these clowns

But will defend some of my neighbors who do "appreciate" them. What choice do you have when your home and business get overrun on a nightly basis by hoards of human beings - even benign folks just looking for a better life? (which not all are, by the way, there are plenty of assholes in any group of humans so be assured not every crosser is just a poor Mexican looking for work - there is the same share as any population of criminals and lunatics)

I have had pumps ruined by people fooling around with valves, I can't keep a fence up anywhere near the trails, livestock (and I have to assume wildlife, though I have yet to find a dead deer full of plastic) have died from ingesting plastic bags, backpacks, zippered jackets (will never forget that one - gross) Fences get cut on the interstate and people have been killed slamming into loose livestock, (thank god nobody had died because of any of ours, but there have been injuries and several serious crashes and we are just ONE spot along the interstate) Folks right on the border (I'm 50 -60 miles north) have their homes broken into regularly, yards trashed water systems destroyed - and this is in a rural county that can't even handle its own poor - it can take a sherrif's deputy over 1/2 an hour to get to you IN AN EMERGENCY, don't even bother reporting a ruined water pump! Just suck up the $500 or $1000 and go on or quit and leave, those seem to be our choices. So with my little rant you might be able to see why some might welcome a little help down here from these groups. I personally don't care for them, or even the border patrol who seem to mostly sit around in their vehicles watching MY comings and goings rather than actually doing what their name suggests - PATROLLING the BORDER, but I don't blame others for letting those guys patrol THEIR properties.

[wrlwnd]

17. Because you want to help protect the borders

from illegals of *all* races, including most likely some terrorist wannabes, you're part of a racist hate group?

Bush loves our open borders. He appears to have a lot of supporters here.

:shrug:

[Kraklen]

19. protect the borders my ass.

That's like saying the KKK is an honest vigilante group out to protect white women from being raped.

Bullshit.

[blondeatlast]

20. The first WTC bombers arrived illegally from CANADA,

and the second group arrived absolutely LEGALLY.

Welcome to DU--no beer for you, though.

[Kraklen]

24. Actually, they arrived legally in the U.S.

directly from overseas. The Canada thing was debunked.

This "mexican immigrants are terrorists" crap is the worst sort of racist scapegoating.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

22. No, appointing a known racist your president makes you a hate group.

Hell, one of their own leaders said it was full of racists. Don't pull that "you must be a bush supporter" crap here. I can give you good odds on who those minutemen supported in the election.

[MisterP]

32. just like the War Pigs who implied that opposing an increased army

size was PRO-RUMSFELD.
It's just cutesy neocon bait-and-switch attempts at playing "gotcha."
(And the fascist son of an SA man we call Governor here invited them over; so much for "defending the border" against the invading brown people).

[Greyhound]

21. I'm so glad we have you here to make these difficult judgments and

pronouncements. We are obviously far too stupid to understand these big complicated issues, and I'd like to offer my gratitude for your sage wisdom and deep understanding of our mis-guided efforts. Seig Heil! :banghead:

[thebigidea]

25. if you're going to call people Nazis, at least spell Sieg Heil right.

Sorry, that's the influence of my WWII-obsessed father speaking.

[Greyhound]

27. that whole i before e except in most german words thing cost me a

'C' in my high school german class. I see I haven't improved since then. :shrug:

[blondeatlast]

16. Interesting terminology. Did you come up with that one on your own? nt

[NNN0LHI]

8. Already more deaths this year than the record-setting total of last year

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0718desert-deaths-ON.html

13 dead in the desert since Friday

Susan Carroll
Republic Tucson Bureau
Jul. 18, 2005 07:33 PM

TUCSON - The bodies of at least six undocumented immigrants were recovered on Monday, capping a deadly weekend of triple-digit temperatures that killed men, women and children trying to cross into the United States illegally through Arizona's deserts.

Since Friday, the U.S. Border Patrol in Arizona has counted 13 migrant deaths, including a 13-year-old boy found on the sprawling Tohono O'odham Reservation southwest of Tucson. Since the start of the fiscal year Oct. 1, 175 migrant deaths have been reported in Arizona, compared with 112 during the same time last year, according to the Border Patrol's count. snip

Agents have tried to curb the death toll, logging more than 1,000 rescues since the start of the fiscal year, according to Tucson and Yuma sector statistics. But the deaths this past weekend pushed the Border Patrol above its record-setting total for all of last fiscal year, 172 .

http://www.kpho.com/Global/story.asp?S=3664121

Man found dead near Sasabe

TUCSON, Ariz. Border Patrol agents discovered the body of a suspected immigrant less than a half mile from the border yesterday. snip

The unidentified man died of some apparent trauma. Barkman says investigators initially thought the man had suffered gunshot wounds, but they were unable to confirm that because of his decomposed state.

[classysassy]

38. The hateful men and women

that call themselves minutemen,in my humble openion are a bunch of hate filled racist that do a diservice to this stolen land.THINK ABOUT THAT.