Intelligent Design: Science Teachers Stunned by Bush

[sabra]

<<SNIP>>
http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/viewArticle.asp?articleID=1594

Intelligent Design: Science Teachers Stunned by Bush
Newswire Services

The National Science Teachers Association (NSTA), the world's largest organization of science educators, is stunned and disappointed that President Bush is endorsing the teaching of intelligent design -- effectively opening the door for non-scientific ideas to be taught in the nation's K-12 science classrooms.

"We stand with the nation's leading scientific organizations and scientists, including Dr. John Marburger, the president's top science advisor, in stating that intelligent design is not science. Intelligent design has no place in the science classroom," said Gerry Wheeler, NSTA Executive Director.

Monday, Knight Ridder news service reported that the President favors the teaching of intelligent design "so people can understand what the debate is about."

<</SNIP>>

[Beetwasher]

1. So Sad, So Pathetic and Frightening

I'm glad they are speaking up, but I fear that the damage is done...the loonies are going to be frothing at the mouth now...

Though I supposed this does have potential to backfire on Chimpy...I just don't know anymore...

[donheld]

63. It would be really quite amusing if it weren't so tragic

* has never came close to a modicum of intelligence, nor a speck of design in his miserable life.

[roguevalley]

69. Bush must have matriculated at Clown College. I hope the slide rule

people do something about this outrage. Bush gave support to all the radical fringers out there who are on or are trying to get on school boards.

[liberal N proud]

2. Why should they be "stunned"

Pissed off yes, but stunned, everyone knew where this ass stood on this stuff, He is regurgitating what ever the Falwell's of the world pump into his pea-brain.

[jobycom]

7. My thoughts exactly. How can anyone be surprised that a wingnut

is a wingnut. I'm still amazed when I meet people who voted for Bush or Nader who say they never expected it to be this bad. How little attention do people pay to this filthy dog? He lied to slaughter 100K innocent people to boost his political career. What would you think is beneath him? He'd sacrifice his own children for a political gain, and people are surprised he doesn't care about our kids' educations?

The worst part is, we deserve Bush, if we are that naive and stupid. (Not DUers. Just those who didn't vote against this beast either time.)

[alarcojon]

20. To be fair to NSTA

the reporter uses the word "stunned", but no representatives of NSTA used it in the article.

I agree that only an idiot who just came out from under a rock would be "stunned" at Bush's latest salvo against science and reason.

[gasperc]

56. well american churches are doing such a horrible job

about teaching about being created by God. I mean at my Catholic church it's only mentioned about a dozen times during my weekly mass. I'm sure this is the case all over the country.

Why who reads their money anymore"in God we trust"? or who's been to court lately and swear on the bible, or promise to tell the whole truth so help you God.

you hardly hear God anymore

sigh

[hyphenate]

89. The fact is there is supposed to be aSEPARATION of CHURCH and STATE

and what these fuckers are currently doing to our country is to bring the two together. Our founding fathers were wise enough to KEEP the fucking bible OUT of THE GOVERNMENT--so what these dickheads are doing is UNLAWFUL and REPREHENSIBLE. The things which you are talking about were added MUCH later, and only by pressure from a variety of religious groups through the last two centuries.

The GOD of our founding fathers is NOT the god these bastards are worshipping. An all merciful god--if you believe in one--would certainly not be showing intolerance for other people because of their race, color, creed or sexual preference. Doesn't it seem ODD that a GOD--all-seeing, all-knowing and all-powerful--would create all this wonderful diversity only to enable or encourage SOME to kill others that they don't look, act or agree with? If that's the kind of god these people worship, they should all be taken out and SHOT.

[slackmaster]

61. That was my reaction too

This is not a big surprise.

[blackhorse]

3. Stunned? Disappointed? WTF?!

If the massive re-election of Bush by the Moronajority wasn't enough of a 'memo to get' for these people, I don't know what would be. The USA's days as a scientific leader are OVER.

On reconsideration. Yes, I'm disappointed too. But not stunned. This is hardly surprising given the current regime.

Sheesh

BH

[redqueen]

15. "massive re-election of Bush"... are you freaking kidding?

:rofl:

That's funny!

http://www.truthout.org/docs_05/010605Y.shtml

[blackhorse]

19. Massive enough to make me sick ...

. . . although I suppose we could spar on the choice of words. And no, I'm not kidding. Far too many people legitimately voted for Bush and will continue doing so if given the choice.

So I iterate - in terms of understanding the distinction between science and faith, the USA is very far gone, and it seems absurd for anyone to be "stunned" by such decisions.

Cheers (and not laughing anymore, not for a long time, redqueen, the whole thing is just too disgusting)

BH

[redqueen]

28. The thought is laughable.

The thought that anyone on this site would believe that bush won anything at all ... let alone by any margin you could reasonably describe as "massive".

I agree... no one should be stunned. If they truly are then they just haven't been paying attention... and that being the case, they are part of the problem.

[blackhorse]

32. Redqueen ...

Find the thought as you wish.

Regardless of the degree of fraudulent voting, regardless of the degree of non-participation by registered voters, the fact remains that Bush is president -- and I am convinced the majority of Americans find that state of affairs to have been achieved legitimately. And personally, I believe that many of these people legitimately voted for him -- regardless of any votes stolen by the machines or achieved via other criminal methods.

Cheers

BH

[redqueen]

38. Are you saying you think he won either election?

Did you bother reading the link I so kindly provided?

[blackhorse]

55. We are discussing different things.

I have no doubt that plenty of documents or other proof can be produced that either suggest or even definitely prove that one or both elections may have been stolen.

My contention is this - despite the existence of such evidence, many of the American people apparently do not agree, or at the least, do not care. This, for me, is the crux of the issue. For by their disagreement with "the vote was stolen" concept and/or apathy towards the concept, American society ->is<- legitimizing the Repub victory.

It may not be legitimate in the mathematical sense of counting truly cast votes and determining that one party or the other won. It is "legitimate" because the bulk of the country apparently accepts it with little thought and they really don't give a damn.

I may be jaded because of my experiences with "popular opinion" in the last five years. And I freely admit all this is simply my thought on the matter.

If we disagree on this issue, then we disagree.

Cheers

BH

[redqueen]

57. I hear what you're saying...

and since the masses don't seem to like seeking out information, preferring instead to sit and soak up whatever the MSM spoonfeeds them... yeah it seems like the stolen elections are legitimized.

Ugh.

[blackhorse]

73. On edit ...

and after a day's reflection, the word "legitimized" was not well used by me. I meant to say that the apparent acceptance of the election's results by many of the American people confer a sheen of legitimacy to the official election results.

Thanks for the link, I'll take a look.

And yes, "massive" was an extreme adjective to use in this case. That was gut reaction to yet another infuriating headline from our beloved media.

Cheers

BH

[redqueen]

78. hahahaha... "beloved media"

You must be talking about Jon Stewart. Or Air America, maybe?

:hi:

[Imagevision]

72. Blackhorse, BUSH: I don't know where Osama is and quite frankly

I don't spend much time thinking about it.

[Uncle Joe]

79. Bush has kept one promise,

when he said " The terrorists never stop thinking of ways to harm America and neither do we" Freudian Slip anyone? Also if he believed in "intelligent design" so much, why did he not have anyone design an intelligent foreign or domestic policy for him when he was appointed to office by the five injustices?

[Xipe Totec]

58. Outsourcing Life Sciences is Next

The world is laughing at us, all the way to the lab.

[demnan]

4. Why don't we just teach the Bible

and only the Bible in K-12 thus making a public education worthless. Then we could be just like the idiots in Pakastan who want to kill us. :sarcasm:

[one_true_leroy]

30. like the burning of alexandria...

if it contradicts, it's heresy. burn it!!!

if it corrborates, it's redundant. burn it!!!

[Maat]

5. There are times when I'm glad my kid is in a small private school.

I know - I'm not proud of that sentiment; I'm being insensitive about kids who cannot afford to go to private school.

But I managed to hook up several years ago with the one private school in the area that is NOT of a fundamentalist religious nature, and not a snobby school either.

It's just a little tiny school (80-100) kids, with a great teaching method (Carden).

And, in that little school, SCIENCE is still SCIENCE.

The local fundies have begun their campaign ... and are making some success in the Charter public schools. It is making my friend crazy.

[damntexdem]

11. My son's public high school was so horrible that ...

we are sending him to an international school in Mexico as an alternative. Well, the international school is also a great opportunity for him. But it sure ain't cheap. Most kids still have to suffer from Dubya and his No Child Left Intact.

[Maat]

17. Wow ... he will learn so much.

And, he will seem very sophisticated after words compared to these kids.

Thanks for making the sacrifice - for I know that he will contribute so much to the world after an international education!

[Moosepoop]

45. "Dubya and his No Child Left Intact" HAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

I LOVE that one!!! :rofl:

[TwentyFive]

6. Christianity is a cult - it must force Science into a subservient position

Bush most likely dreaded his Science classes...probably got poor grades too. Could this 'intelligent design' thing be his revenge on the wonderful field of Science?

[NYC]

27. Clever conclusion.

Evolution and genetics require study. Intelligent design is a simple concept. Just accept it, and there's nothing to understand, nothing to study.

I hadn't thought of that.

[ima_sinnic]

35. it's true--I have seen "evolution is too hard to understand and

too hard to believe" given as a rationale for why ID is preferred(sorry, could never begin to find the link).

Of course there was no concern that ID makes no sense at all, you just have to "have faith' or "believe in it."

[NYC]

47. And I naively believe that learning is a good thing.

Alas.

[elehhhhna]

8. Civics class should teach about the stolen elections.

"So people can understand what the debate is about".

[Journeyman]

42. Thank you, elehhhhna. . .

I was trying to think of something equally absurd that needs to be "taught" . . . your suggestion is perfect. I'll share that with a number of people.

[adnelson60087]

9. They shouldn't be stunned...

Bushco is the concept of anti-science in human form. Many of the teachers i work with are strong Bush supporters...I am sure they agree with him at some level...I am simply appalled.

[tavalon]

64. Welcome to DU

adnelson60087.

Good God, I remember when teachers were smarter than that.

[damntexdem]

10. Meanwhile, Dubya's science advisor, Marburger ...

has tried to say that Dubya didn't really mean it, ID is not science, and so on.

It looks like Dubya was let out without his meds again, so now it's damage control. Either that, or Marburger better be looking for a new job.

[Dudley_DUright]

21. Marburger has been a Bush apologist and a major disappointment

from day one. If he has not drunk the kool-aid, he at least is getting high on the fumes.

[proud2BlibKansan]

31. Yes Marburger will be out soon

if he keeps making comments like that.

[bowens43]

12. Make no mistake

if we don't get these lunatics out of office and soon, we will see the rise of the American Taliban. These idiots truly believe that our law should be biblical law.

Did you see Santorum say that sex outside of marriage shouldn't be tolerated? These people are far more dangerous then Islamic fundamentalists. Our politicians we afraid of being perceived as anti-Christan so they will allow these theo-cons to get away with anything.

[enough]

13. Arlen Specter agrees with Bush: "Teach everything."

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/local/12287688.htm

Posted on Wed, Aug. 03, 2005

Specter: Teach intelligent design, too

Agreeing with Bush, he said let students hear all sides. Though he also said: "I'm with Darwin."
By Thomas Fitzgerald
Inquirer Staff Writer


Sen. Arlen Specter said yesterday that he sees no harm in teaching intelligent design alongside evolution in the nation's schools as competing explanations for the origin of life.

"My own instincts are to teach everything and let people take their choices," the Pennsylvania Republican said, responding to questions on the topic. "My instinct is not to object to people hearing all sides of all issues, no matter how much I disagree with them."

Speaking in a wide-ranging discussion with editors of The Inquirer, Specter agreed with President Bush, who on Monday told reporters he believed schools should teach both theories.

But, while Bush declined to give his personal views, Specter declared, "I'm with Darwin," the British naturalist who in 1859 propounded the theory of evolution.

more>

[krkaufman]

49. Ok, Arlen, can we start teaching Communism and Socialism...

... as alternative economic models in entry-level economics courses, alongside all the capitalism supply/demand price curve pap?

[tavalon]

65. And, since we're teaching ID

let's add in the Native American beliefs around the origins of life, and the Eastern philosophies and the Muslim beliefs and we Wiccans* would like a few of our ideas thrown in and ...................

*Actually, as a Wiccan, I'd like my spiritual ideas to remain with my religion and I'd like the children to be taught science, thank you very much.

[truth2power]

86. "schools should teach both theories"...

ID is not a theory in the same sense that evolution is a theory.

[DBoon]

14. science teaches people to think for themselves

Evolution teaches that change is inevitable.

Can't allow these in Bush's america.

[Dudley_DUright]

16. As a science teacher, I was stunned

but not surprised by Bush's ignorant statement.

[Maat]

24. Science Teacher,

sending you and your family positive energy!

This cannot be easy.

If you can think of a kid's book that describes evolution to an 8-9 year-old - in a decent manner - I would appreciate the suggestion.

I'm going to make sure she learns all about it.

[Dudley_DUright]

34. Here are some suggestions from the National Center for Science Education

http://www.ncseweb.org/store.asp?sectiontype=bookstore&bookcategorynumber=14&categoryname=Childrens+Books

[mtnester]

18. Why don't we just go ahead and teach these subjects as electives as well:

"The Evil Eye - its effect through the ages"

"Broken Mirrors - can you spin it enough to make it a lucky thing?"

"Odd numbers are more powerful than even ones. - analysis"

"Itchy nose syndrome - Company's Coming!"

"Left hand itchies - how to handle your soon to come windfall of cash"

"Right hand itchies - Meet your new best friend"

"Friday the 13th - what you need to know to survive"

"Menstruating Women - can you really avoid them in today's society? 12 ways to do just that!"


Add your own.

[jbnow]

53. Why do you hate mothers?

You ignored the important class.
The real crack danger: How to protect your mother's back

[tomg]

74. A new engineering class

putting wings on ships so that when they sail off the end of the world, they won't crash

[Miss Chybil]

83. How about, "Why Witches Float?" nt

[expatriot]

22. the more Bush loots and pillages this nation's resources, public sector,

national treasury, and the more he sends our troops around the world toi expand the reaches of empire... the more he has to feed his knuckle-dragging, anti-intellectual, anti-reason ultra-conservative orc armies here at home. His agenda of destruction to this country is a double-edged sword.

[City Lights]

23. I'm stunned that they're stunned.

This is _shrubling SOP.

[melissinha]

25. I want to my kids to be taught the Bible in school is

RIDICULOUS.

I think that the purpose of a school is to provide education to students that they can't get at home... Religion should be taught in Sunday School, Intelligence Design, well it belongs in the crapper.

It is my fervent belief that many parents don't really know whats best for their children when it comes to educational development. I support teachers and staff that have spent years in school studying child development. Its more than most parents can fathom. Not to say that the Educational system cannot be improved.

These right wing wackos should be thankfull that the educational system will provide their children with the knowledge to interact and participate in the world..... BEcause they benefited from the educational system themselves, they can't see that their children should have the opportunity to have a comprehensive education before deciding to ignore facts and chosing to subscribe to CHristo-Fascism.

[Akoto]

26. Welcome back to the Dark Ages.

I don't mean to insult anyone who happens to be more religious than I (and I do have my own beliefs), but spirituality has no place in the realm of science. The field is about facts and scientific proof, not ancient stories that can never be reasonably verified.

Next thing you know, we'll see people burning at the stake for knowing too much about how things work.

[Iris]

39. But actually, science can be looked at in a spiritual way.

It is essentially the unlocking of the world's mysteries.

[krkaufman]

52. Yes, but problems arise for the fundies....

... when the scientific facts contradict the writings in the Bible.

[Iris]

54. Yep. I forgot they were colorblind - can't see any gray.

What sort of faith is that?

[arikara]

44. Cramming their narrow beliefs down the throats of everyone else

is anything but spiritual. Their game here is more brainwash pure and simple... catapulting the propaganda as chimpy himself puts it.

They are not people of the light.

[proud2BlibKansan]

29. This is a highly respected organization

I am glad to see this. But I am also saddened that NSTA has to spend time on this nonsense.

[AlinPA]

33. Intelligent design - it wasn't too intelligent to design all the diseases

and all that suffering in Niger. Oh I forgot what Robertson and Falwell teach: its sin that causes that.

[grace0418]

51. So what "genius" created people like George Bush?

He seems to me like the perfect argument for evolution (in that he's a horrible mutation) and against "intelligent" design.

[hyphenate]

90. Awhile back

someone posted to a board far away in space and time with a great sigline. It read (and I paraphrase because I can't remember it exactly)

I believe in abortion: Barbara Bush should have been sterilzed to prevent birth defects!

You get the idea. It's a great one to throw back at those assholes.

[clydefrand]

36. I hope all the science teachers protest and refuse to teach

anything but science in their classes. If the idiot wants the Bible taught in school, so be it. But it should be taught along with all the other religions of the world. Mixing science with religion doesn't work in a classroom.

[callous taoboy]

37. I will not teach intelligent design:

I will defend my classroom science lessons against non-science, and when questions concerning a creator do surface I will continue to refer the questioner to his/her pastor.

[Laurab]

41. Good plan

when I was a child, my parents sent me to religious instruction - I'm sure that's available for anyone who wants their kids to learn about intelligent design. What's next - science teachers having to go back to school to learn how to teach intelligent design? I cannot wait until these idiots are GONE.

[Strawman]

40. Stunned? Haven't they heard of empiricism?

This kind of horseshit political move by him should have been entirely predictable to any scientist based upon observation of * over his entire political career.

[progressoid]

43. scarier still...

I saw on CNN that 2/3 of those polled also thought it should be taught. :silly:

[zara]

46. The issue is why teach in science class religious dogma.

...There is no justification. If Christianity is taught, why not ancient Greek myths? Or other religious creation myths?

[Rambis]

48. Indoctrination

I made the mistake of listening to am radio yesterday and the talking head (didn't recognize the name here in Iowa) was saying..
"90% of the kids that go to public school lose their faith" I was thinking damn thats low:) Home schooling is the only way to "save" your children blah blah blah, very scary.

[StuckinBFE]

50. From a slope to a cliff

How education system has been sliding back wards for a long time but if this passes watch it fall so fast. I know our public schools are not the best but at least we make an effort to educate everyone in the US, unlike some other countries. Screw it if this some how passes then I am out of here.

[bizkit]

59. I've wondered...

Do the intelligent design cheerleaders specifically pin the blame on a religious figurehead, or is our government supporting the idea that ET may be involved?

[DrFunkenstein]

60. Didn't Jefferson Say It Would Be Nice To Make All Schools Christian?

That way everyone can be taught the truth about our savior, and also so children can understand what the debate is about.

[Endangered Specie]

62. When you think about it, this is a good way to cut down on student visa's

:sarcasm:

Seriously, I wouldnt come to this country for an education from abroad.

[slay]

66. Christians SOOO desperately want to rule the world

that they'll support idiots and assholes as long as they hit the talking points of the day. Abortions = bad. Gay marriage = bad. Teaching religious brainwashing bullshit as science = good.

It seems the Bush people are fighting an undeclared war against intelligence. Is anyone really surprised? They need more idiots in the world to vote for them since smart people see right through their bullshit. It's no wonder they want to teach religion as science, that no child left behind was a total failure, they want school vouchers so every child can be brainwashed by some religious fundie nut-job, etc. We are now a nation held hostage by religious wackos. Welcome to America - the new Iraq. Thanks Bush - YOU SHITHEAD.

[Disturbed]

67. About two years ago I watched a

PBS Documentary about ID. I assure anyone that if a, say 6th grade Class, were shown that program and the teacher said nothing about it, most of the students would believe it. I predict that the Fundie Fascists will get their way on this and it will be in every public school and certainly in private Fundie schools across Amerika.

[Miss Chybil]

84. Christian fundamentalists aren't the only whackos who want to rule the

world with their religion. There are a couple of Muslim wackos out there right now who'd like to do the same thing. We are in the midst of a "Holy War." For some, however, the "holiness" is only a mask for their greed.

Why can't people learn to appreciate the earth we have, the life we have, as opposed to killing each other over the "next" one?

[DuaneBidoux]

88. The common denominator there however is "wacko." A wacko is a wacko

is a wacko.

[seleff]

68. State and Nat'l Standards leave no time for debate anyway

Meeting Georgia's Performance Standards for Biology in time for students to take their end of course exam after 15 weeks (on block Scheduling) does not allow much time for presenting/discussing alternative schools of thought on evolution, so now I can feel free to just spend 15 min in class dissembling Behe's Darwin's Black Box and save my students the trouble. I teach in a title I school and my students are pretty weak on critical thinking anyway. For many, Church every Sunday, however, does present a formidable amount of brainwashing I have to overcome. I have maintained a professional distance when politics has come up in class, but I'm feeling now that I'm just as well ready to let my guard down and tell my students what I really think and why. I was pretty discouraged last year when I brought up the Kansas Board shenanigans, one of my students in Chemistry class said that well, he didn't see how people could have evolved from monkeys in the last six thousand years, anyway. I tried to correct his thinking, but he really didn't get it. Some of the other students tried too, unsuccessfully. No surprise, he did not pass the Science section of the Georgia HS Graduation test--didn't pass Math either. I still believe that our crisis in education is a crisis in culture.

[Strelnikov_]

70. Isn't The Chimp A Living Contradiction Of Intelligent Design

What more proof do they need?

[grace0418]

92. Not to mention absolute proof of mutation and therefore

evolution.

[truth2power]

71. Oh for heaven's sake!! "stunned and disappointed?

Four and a half years the worthless little creep has occupied that office and the NSTA is just now getting a clue that he doesn't value science and has zero critical thinking skills? Please! :eyes:

They should have been screaming to high heaven when he cooked the books on global warming.

How bad are things going to have to get before people wake up and realize what that little shit is doing to this planet?




edit> Sorry. didn't read the thread before I posted. I guess others here are also amazed that NSTA didn't know what was going down.

[pauliedangerously]

76. Ah, what else can they say?

Given the average mentality, they can't really delve too deeply into the issue. The obvious long-term goal of allowing this debate in schools is to keep the average idiot off balance. The same thing applies to the upsurge in Christian fundamentalism, which is spearheaded by conservatives.

They are doing everything they can to keep people "divorced from reality" and are doing a good job of it.

The good old days when anyone could just get a job, but a house, and support a family are gone. Those times existed because of cheap energy and because we were the main producer/supplier of manufactured goods for the rest of the world.

The way of life here is changing for the worst for the average person. The thinking is to keep as many people as possible in Lalaland; make them into sheep willing to be herded.

I'm sure most of these science teachers realize this, but if they were to proclaim it they would be branded as heretics.

It's just a game. Enjoy the spectacle.

[SoCalDem]

75. Canada probably needs science teachers

:)

[emad]

77. Evolution row reaches new heights as Bush backs 'intelligent design'

Evolution row reaches new heights as Bush backs 'intelligent design'
By Geneviève Roberts
Published: 04 August 2005

The evolution versus creationism debate in the United States has escalated after President George Bush said the theory of "intelligent design" should be taught alongside evolution in public schools. Then, "people can understand what the debate is about", he said.

"First of all, that decision should be made local school districts, but I felt like both sides ought to be properly taught," Mr Bush said in an interview with five Texas newspapers.

"I think that part of education is to expose people to different schools of thought. You're asking me whether or not people ought to be exposed to different ideas, and the answer is yes."

Intelligent design, advanced by a group of academics and some biblical creationists, disputes the idea that natural selection fully explains the complexity of life. Intelligent design proponents say life is so intricate that only a powerful guiding force, or intelligent designer, could have created it.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article303559.ece

[Miss Chybil]

85. Bush backs lying, steroidial baseball players, too.

What does that tell you?

:crazy:

[GracieM]

80. As if anyone cares...

My opinion: Intelligent design has a place somewhere in school.

Reason: I believe in Evolution and that Jesus Christ was a cult leader. I believe in the Big Bang yada yada yada. However, I've never heard an adequate explanation of where the matter came from in the "beginning". I don't believe in God or that the Intelligent design theory is true.

Now, what is Intelligent design's proper place in school. A footnote added to the end of the lesson on evolution and the big bang. "While nobody knows for sure what happened before the big bang or where it came from, the following are the most common theories: (1) ...., (2)...., (3) intelligent design.

[Ksec]

81. So what gives dikweed the power to change the curriculum ?

Do we allow one insane man to change hundreds of years of science for his own selfish reasons.

He doesnt have the right to do that? This is a democracy, one man doesnt rule all

[robertarctor]

82. You're wrong there.

America is now a dictatorship. And the dictator has decided that religious bullshit deserves to be taught on an equal footing with science.

[atommom]

87. If you look at the things BushCo has been doing, it's pretty clear

that religious bullshit, and the profit motive, will trump science and logical thinking every time. They've done everything they can to discredit logic and people who use it. :(

[kestrel91316]

91. I'll support the teaching of ID as long as they also REQUIRE

that students read Carl Sagan's "The Demon-Haunted World". Teach them critical thinking skills and they can filter out the BS all on their own!