Roberts Backed Efforts for School Prayer

[quaoar]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/15/AR2005081500539.html

By HOPE YEN
The Associated Press
Monday, August 15, 2005; 12:57 PM

WASHINGTON -- As a young government attorney, John Roberts advised the White House to support congressional efforts to allow school prayer, arguing that a Supreme Court ruling striking down the practice "seems indefensible."

In a Nov. 21, 1985 memo released Monday by the National Archives, Roberts was responding to a move by Congress to permit "group silent prayer or reflection in public schools." He said he would not object if Justice Department officials announced that President Reagan had no formal role in passing an amendment to that effect, but said he would support such a move.

The Supreme Court's conclusion that "the Constitution prohibits such a moment of silent reflection -- or even silent 'prayer' _ seems indefensible," Roberts wrote in a memo to White House counsel Fred Fielding.

[TechBear_Seattle]

1. As long as there are tests....

... there will be prayer in school. And as long as all expressions of belief -- and disbelief -- are given equal treatment, I have no problem with having student-led (not adult-led) prayer in schools.

The thing is, equal treatment of all expressions of belief and disbelief is an impossible standard to meet. Therefore, not having student-led prayer is the only possible option.

[alkaline9]

2. well said! n/t

[DanCa]

3. The fine line however is this

what if you as a parent dont want your kid learning to practice a religion? I remember even when it was optional that it caused problems and the kids who had prayer groups and those that dont have conflicts with each other. I mean on ash wed you should hear the names that I get called and am not catholic.
I really think that religious - or non religious ed should be taught home with the child's family And let the adult comparative religion course be taught as an philosophy elective at the college level. Note I am not attacking any just expressing my opinion Have fun Danny.

[TechBear_Seattle]

9. That is why I mentioned belief and disbelief

And insulting kids because of what they believe or do not believe would not be honoring the "treated equally" requirement.

[MountainLaurel]

4. But that's the thing

Those who are supporting school prayer DO. NOT. want equal treatment and access for all faiths and expressions of disbelief. They want to turn the school day into an opportunity to proselytize children. They want to be allowed to tell six-year-olds that they're going to burn in hell because mommy's a heathen Unitarian. They want "their" side to be allowed to harass Jews with taunts of "Your people killed Jesus" and "Hitler was right". They don't mind if 13-year-old Wiccan girls hang themselves after the class breaks out into "Onward Christian soldiers" while the teacher says nothing. They want to treat the Bible as historical fact, while treating the Buddha as mythology.

Equal access is the last thing they want.

[BattyDem]

6. Exactly!

The people that support school prayer or any religious expression in government/public buildings DO NOT think that every belief system should be expressed! They are intolerant and they are very, very nasty about it! They harrass those with different religious beliefs and those who don't believe at all. They are not capable of simply enjoying the right to express themselves - they must also punish those who have different beliefs. They're not happy unless they are FORCING their beliefs on other people.

Bottom line:
Teach religion at home or in church. If you feel the need to have your child hear about your god every minute of every day, then send them to a Christian school or home-school them and leave everyone else alone! You have a right to practice your religion ... but I have a right NOT to practice your religion and that's where your rights end! :mad:

[TechBear_Seattle]

8. That "whooshing" sound above your head...

... is the point I am making :spank:

If all beliefs and non-beliefs are not treated equally in public schools, they should not be an allowed, official part of a public school curriculum. Period. If they are, then the fundies have far, far more to fear than anyone else.

[MountainLaurel]

10. Hey, no spanking

You have to buy me dinner first!

:evilgrin:

Actually, I gathered that was the point you were making, but as a nonChristian who has heard horror stories from friends raised in areas where public schools still send kids during the day to church study, and whose former high school just approved the addition of a bible in history and literature class, this matter raises my hackles.

[TechBear_Seattle]

12. Oops, my bad

I won't spank you again until we've been properly introduced. O8)

[Judi Lynn]

5. I've got a school prayer for them.

Heavenly Father, please show these malignant, twisted, hate-spewing, murderous, greedy, pompous, dishonest, selfish, frightened bogus Christans the errors of their destructive way?

[usregimechange]

7. It only prohibits it if the government directs it.

That is how myths are born.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

11. Two words:

Iran-Contra.

Sha!