Outspoken cleric murdered after backing Iraq vote

[ECH1969]

Like many of Baghdad's fiery Sunni clerics, Sheikh Omar Ibrahim al Duleimi was never afraid to stir things up at Friday prayers. When he urged his congregation to rise up and fight the American occupation, United States troops would routinely haul him in for questioning.

When he urged his congregation to register to vote in elections, the threat came from his compatriots - insurgents, who sent him warning messages that he ignored.

The sheikh has now paid the ultimate price for his defiance. Two hours before he was due to be interviewed by The Sunday Telegraph, armed men stormed his home in Baghdad and kidnapped him. His body was found in the capital yesterday with a single gunshot wound to the head.

The reason for his death was the subject he was about to discuss - his declaration that democracy, not the gun, is the best way forward for Iraq's Sunnis. Qassim al Janaabi, his assistant, said: "In the last two weeks he had been saying in prayers that all Iraqis should vote. He said if we get a government, president and constitution, the Americans will have no reason to stay.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/08/28/wirq128.xml&sSheet=/news/2005/08/28/ixnewstop.html

[wtmusic]

1. And that's exactly why the Iraqis will never have

a government, president and constitution: the Americans will have no reason to stay.

[Kagemusha]

2. Are you serious?

I may go after the administration for incompetence, but I find it ridiculous to proclaim that its intent was for this constitutional process that they have invested so much political capital in, to fail. So I am wondering if you seriously mean this and why...

[wtmusic]

4. If the Iraqis are capable of governing themselves

they will have no need for the US. A vast majority of Iraqis want the US out, period...so out we go. All of those billions of dollars of oil infrastructure will be wasted. And the Iraqis will be free to sell oil to whomever they like--Russia, China, and even the US (at a premium, of course). They will also be free to funnel all the wealth derived therefrom into a crack nuke development program.

It is far from corporate America's best interests to have a free and independent Iraq. Please explain why this seems ridiculous to you.

[bribri16]

5. What do you mean by "capable of governing themselves"

they did as good a job as any for the past 3000 years. These are the people that gave us our own model of civiliztion. Even under Saddam, they were governing themselves.

[wtmusic]

10. Of course they're capable of governing themselves

if we left tomorrow within a few years things would sort themselves out and some kind of stable self-rule would emerge. And they will be America's bitter, bitter enemy.

The Bush administration does not want that to happen, and will not let it happen.

[Igel]

22. No, they did not give us our own model of civilization.

They had a state that was dependent on slavery and the divine right of kings, as supported by a small caste of priests, strongly imperialistic, and with labor routinely forcibly rounded up for public works (that not infrequently benefitted the priests and nobility). And by slavery I don't mean chattel slavery, necessarily, as in the American South; more like the slavery that was feudalism.

In other words, if by "our own model of civilization" you mean the worst paranoid fantasies of what * and the "neocon Dominionist cabal" would have, you're right.

And I'm not sure the Iraqi Shi'a and Kurds were self-governing in 1988 in the sense intended. They were in a difference sense, in that they were Iraqis: but by that token, the Crimean Tatars and Chechens in 1944 were also self-governing, in that as Soviets, they were governed by a Soviet ... one who exiled them to Central Asia. But in another sense, the Chechens are still fighting for self-government.

[Kagemusha]

6. The government can't defend itself. For that reason alone

the US would be necessary. Or put in plain English, if the US got up and left tomorrow, all these Shiite leaders who are acting tough would DIE. Maybe the Sunnis would go down in the long run, even probably, but the current crop of national leaders wouldn't survive to see it.

The constitution amounts to the Iraqis LOOKING like they're capable of governing themselves, not actually being able to. I would have thought realists could make the distinction.

[wtmusic]

11. We're agreeing

and maybe I haven't been clear. They must APPEAR to be capable of governing themselves. But make no mistake--as soon as Iraq is stable we will get the boot. So you can count on the administration to keep violence at a low simmer, while touting all the "progress that's been made"...

[Kagemusha]

12. They could've done that with a signed constitution.

Now they don't have even that so obviously they have a problem now.

Enough said about that..

[anitar1]

20. And also , since we have built 14 very large military bases

in Iraq, I would say the administration is there to stay. In fact, I think they are backing a civil war, to serve their own purposes.

[FlemingsGhost]

8. Is Negroponte in still in Iraq?

You have so much to learn ...

[kodi]

19. so true.

Negroponte in Spanish stands for "Death-Squads-Are-Us"

[DaveT]

14. I think they expect the Iraqi government to fail.

This news story explains why there will be no Sunni participation in the campaign to sell the "Federal" Iraqi Constitution. Any Sunni leader with real credibility would paint a bullseye on his forehead by urging the "masses" to vote for the Constitution in October.

But once again, I suspect cunning beneath the surface insanity of Bush foreign policy. Yes, it looks bad now as the President and his minions fail to "broker" a compromise with "the Sunnis."

But "the Sunnis" for the most part did not participate in that heartwarming "election" last January, whose results were promptly ignored by the Americans and our collaborators. "Sunni leaders" who did not get elected were approached by the Occupation to "participate" in the "process." The weird Mainstream American Media found nothing odd about this, and portrayed it as a sincere gesture of conciliation intended to lead to "consensus."

Once again, you'd have to be stupider than most people think Shrub is to take that story at face value. There is a war going on in Iraq. Dozens of people are getting killed every month and the "insurgency" targets Iraqis who collaborate with the Americans.

So, big surprise, there are few if any credible Sunnis who will stand up to help "sell" the Constitution, which is portrayed as a blow to Shrub.

Well, what comes next?

A vote in a war zone. And if 33.4% vote in favor of the Constitution within any province, that province is counted as not rejecting the Constitution. If three or more provinces reject the Constitution under this supermajority scheme, the Constitution fails.

So, what would Rove do?


Yup, the Bush Team only has to deliver a third of the vote in three of the five Sunni Provinces to win this election.


Anybody ready to bet on how that turns out?


Looking ahead, that means that the new Central Government of Iraq will be a hollow shell without the bulk of the oil revenue. Regional "Federal" states in the Shiite and Kurdish areas will be recognized as all but sovereign independent states.

Which leaves the current military stalemate in the Sunni areas of Iraq as a permanent proposition, calling for an open ended American presence to protect the Fragile Iraqi State from the terrorists who hate freedom so much that they reject the Democratic Will of the People.

Stay tuned, folks.

[wtmusic]

21. Good analysis DaveT

and welcome to DU

:bounce: :toast: :bounce:

[Child_Of_Isis]

3. And that is exactly why he is dead.

For that little remark.

[Kagemusha]

7. Well say it for 2 weeks and say it out loud preaching at a mosque

and it's not THAT little...

Not that it's right that he be killed for it either.

[bribri16]

9. Do we really know who killed him? It seems to me that getting

most Iraqis to vote would mean that the Constitution would be voted down since so many in all factions disliked the provisions of the Constituion and then a new government would have to be elected.
So it seems that killing this man would ensure even more chaos but keep the Sunnis from voting, thereby leaving the voting to the Kurds and like-minded Shia. Now who does that benefit if not the US since the Bushbots want this constitution at all costs?

[Kagemusha]

13. You'd think if they were cops or Wolf Brigade that they'd know

But I await more information.

[ECH1969]

15. al-Qaeda and Ansar al-Sunna have promised to kill anyone

who participates in the political process period. That means voting yes or no on the Constitution Referendum.

Most other insurgent groups want people to go to the polls and vote no on the Constitution.

[bribri16]

16. Like a asked, do we really know. this smells to me. n/t

[Igel]

23. The problem is, we don't really know how the Sunni in the village

would vote. It's not like the leaders representing them have anything like a huge mass of constituents.

On the one hand, having al-qa'ida and ansar want to stop the voting is possibly heartening: they don't trust the voters. On the other hand, they view the process as wrong in principle, so it may be misconstrued opposition.

Having the ulema in favor of voting isn't very heartening, since the ulema and clan leaders dislike federalism. Gore others' oxen, just not theirs.

The entire affair strikes me as having a bag full of mosaic pieces, bright orange, green, blue, and pink, and hurling them in the air to let them fall on the ground. Then being expected to predict if it's the Mona Lisa or Cuernica, or at the very least if the mosaic will be all white or black.

Popcorn. Lawnchair. I'll wait for the photo.

[daleo]

17. So the Telegraph knew exactly what he would say?

It is too bad he didn't live long enough to actually be interviewed, so we could know what he really thought. I don't trust The Telegraph. Whatever really happened, you know they will spin it, and tell any whopper that's convenient.

[VegasWolf]

18. Bush will only leave when there is a government in place that is

sympathetic to Bush getting his oil.