Storm Survivors Told To 'Expose Themselves'

[Lori Price CLG]

A group of female hurricane survivors were told to show their breasts if they wanted to be rescued, a British holidaymaker has revealed.Ged Scott watched as American rescuers turned their boat around and sped off when the the women refused.

<snip>

Mr Scott, 36, of Liverpool, was with his wife and seven-year-old daughter in the Ramada Hotel when the flood waters started rising.

"At one point, there were a load of girls on the roof of the hotel saying 'Can you help us?' and the policemen said 'Show us what you've got' and made signs for them to lift their T-shirts," he told the Liverpool Evening Echo.

"When the girls refused, they said `Fine' and motored off down the road in their boat."

<snip>

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/06092005/140/storm-survivors-told-expose-themselves.html

Lori Price
http://www.legitgov.org/index.html#breaking_news

[saigon68]

1. In other words "show us your "----"

NICE </SARCASM>

[RawMaterials]

9. Did they also get beads??

It is NOLA :evilgrin:

[theHandpuppet]

21. You find that funny?

I find it about as funny as your sense of humor.

[DRoseDARs]

51. Might want to pull that hand out of your ass...

...it's getting crusty. Oh boo-hoo, someone told an off-color pun. :eyes:

How about ignore them and focus on the "rescuers'" actions instead.

[iverglas]

52. there was no pun

Lord knows what you think a pun is ...

There was a one hundred percent inappropriate comment making light of someone's distress, purporting to derive humour from their distress and the sexist reaction alleged to have occurred to it by offering a further sexist reaction to it.

How about ignore them and focus on the "rescuers'" actions instead.

I would have thought that very appropriate advice ... had it been directed to the person who made the remark in the first place.

Had the person who made the remark in the first place given some indication in follow up that s/he was disgusted by the alleged incident, rather than saying

It is NOLA "evil grin"

which, unfortunately, indicates nothing but a willingness to exploit someone else's distress as an opportunity for sexist humour, it might have passed as gallows humour. As it stands, it was just crude, unwarranted and inappropriate.

And addressing snotty sarcastic lectures at someone who objected to it doesn't strike me as appropriate either.

[defiant1]

2. OMFG....

:puke:

What a bunch of goddamned assholes.

[JustSayNO 2 Sheeples]

3. Don't let this type of sensationlization media BS upset you.

There's going to be all kinds of BS stories coming out of this. After all, the Bu$h admin finds doing the same thing okay.

I have to believe this is a bullshit story. I cannot debase and defile those cops and firemen who were stuck like everybody else yet stayed and did there best to protect or help people.

[aion]

7. If they wore the deaths-head, would you change your thinking?

[Lerkfish]

8. ummm...riiight.

[klook]

10. I agree.

Maybe this did actually happen, maybe it didn't. But the fact remains that there have been many real heroes among the police and other authorities working day in, day out to save the flood victims. I'm not dragging them through the slop because of one uncorroborated story.

[Benbow]

38. It is corroborated - the family is back in the UK and telling everyone

who will listen.

[iverglas]

35. talk about sheeple

I have to believe this is a bullshit story.

You don't HAVE to believe anything that you don't have a reason to believe. And you don't HAVE to make public pronouncements calling people about whom you know nothing liars.

I cannot debase and defile those cops and firemen who were stuck like everybody else yet stayed and did there best to protect or help people.

Bully for you. Of course, what you're actually doing is accusing someone else of doing that, when no one did.

How nice it must be to live in a world in which no barrels have rotten apples.

[Benbow]

37. It is not bullshit - I heard the man himself this morning, in the UK

And he is white.

[mzteris]

4. makes one real proud

to be an Amurhkin, don't it?

:banghead:

[whatever4]

5. I hope this isn't true

Although there isn't actually any reason to believe it isn't true, having a UK yahoo link, I just wish it wasn't.

People were dying. They wanted to see body parts. Right. Kinda makes you wonder if the body had to be alive to make a good peep-show, doesn't it? I heard there were bodies floating all around, so it's a pity they didn't just peep-show the dead ones, and treat survivors like survivors.

Sorta like that joke, remember? A plane crashes on the border of, (fill in the blank) the USA and Canada. Where did they bury the survivors?


Answer: they didn't bury the survivors.

Usually.

[OKNancy]

6. One nice comment at the end of the article

He added: "Everyone talks about the National Guard in rather derogatory ways historically, but I've got to say that, but for them, and one man in particular, I may well have lost my family

[Skittles]

11. who trashes the National Guard?

I know they sometimes take heat from the "regular" military but I've never really heard them trashed in a derogatory way "historically".

[VolcanoJen]

12. Who? The President, for starters.

:grr:

[OKNancy]

14. I read the whole article and it sounds fishy to me

Something about the tone of it doesn't sit right with me.

[Lori Price CLG]

15. Police violence vs. journalists

http://www.nppa.org/news_and_events/news/2005/09/hurricane2.html

By Donald R. Winslow, News Photographer magazine

AUSTIN, TX (September 1, 2005) – As photojournalists continue to document the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina’s violent assault on the Gulf Coast, today they also found themselves documenting new violence and death among the survivors, the refugees, and the looters and police and rescuers in New Orleans, while some photojournalists even fell victim to the violence themselves.

<snip>

Two veteran photojournalists - NPPA member Rick Wilking of Reuters and Getty's Mark Wilson - were robbed of cameras and computer equipment today while on assignment in a neighborhood in New Orleans, and a photojournalist and a reporter were confronted at gunpoint and slammed against a wall by police following a shoot-out between looters and cops that left at least one person dead.

Another photojournalist - Lucas Oleniuk of the Toronto Star - was knocked to the ground by police, his gear taken from him initially, when he photographed them shooting at looters and then beating one. In response to the growing violence and an increasing sense of despair among the stranded survivors, some television networks have hired armed private security firms to protect their journalists as they work to cover the story.

<snip>

(emphasis mine)

Lori Price

[Tomee450]

17. I am rather skeptical, also.

[Benbow]

47. I can't see why - civilisation has completely broken down in NO -

and today I have read personal accounts of far worse treatment by the police and military.

[Benbow]

39. Then you should have heard Mr Scott himself on the BBC this morning n/t

[progressivebydesign]

13. They didn't say who the rescuers were.. Did I miss that? n/t

[louis-t]

16. I think this may turn out to be...

"Mr. Scott" HEARD this from someone else. I cannot imagine anyone in that situation trying to play "Girls Gone Wild". Doesn't make sense. I'll believe it when the alleged perps are found.

[Benbow]

40. Look, I can understand some of you not wanting to believe this is true but

the NOPD - while it has many good officers - also has a reputation (before Katrina) for corruption.

[melody]

53. Was it established these were NO officers?

There were a lot of private folk taking boats around also.

Whomever it was, it was reprehensible, if it did happen. All those involved should be arrested.

[anitar1]

54. I had read about the corruption a few times through the years.

I do not believe this is all of them but a few go that road in almost every city. My God, look at Los Angeles.PLus they had the film of the 2 female NO police filling their cart with shoes ect. Too bad.

[Psephos]

18. Riiiigggghhhhtt.... n/t

[Kelvin Mace]

19. Questions about story

Were the people who made this demand actual officials or brainless Bush voters looking for fun?

[JustSayNO 2 Sheeples]

20. Can DUers be fooled by Moral Majority Propagand? DEBUNKED

Come on, take a look at the "facts" in this article. Is this just another way for the slimeballs to say, see, it's a sin pit even in the face of tragedy".

There are two Ramada's in NO, according to the Ramada web site.

The first is this one:
Ramada Downtown/Superdome
1315 Gravier St
New Orleans, LA 70112
Neighborhood: Central Business District
Number of Floors: 12 ; Total Rooms: 176 ;

News reports show Superdome not an island until what, Wednesday? So even if flood waters were "rising", these girls were on a roof 12 stories up, talking to police in boats? Not hardly.

And the second is:
The Inn On Bourbon
541 Bourbon Street
New Orleans
Neighborhood: French Quarter didn’t flood
Number of Floors: 5 ; Total Rooms: 186

From what I've seen and heard, the French Quarter never even flooded.

Don't buy into the minor "personal accounts" being reported. Can any of you that do see or even consider that it may be part of the spin?

[OKNancy]

24. and the part about the threatening black people

in the superdome was real suspect too IMO

[iverglas]

29. where exactly was that part?

I didn't see it in the Yahoo report. Oh, no, wait; there's this:

The family were also racially abused by other refugees in the stadium.

I dunno. The man made this statement, and I haven't seen anyone disprove it. Are we thinking that no African-American has ever verbally abused a white person because of his/her race/colour? Never mind what the reasons might be (and note that I am *not* calling it "racism"); it's never happened? It might not be expected that a few people out of several thousand who saw themselves being obviously victimized because of their own colour and class, seeing some evidently well-off people of another colour getting what may have looked like (and even been -- not necessarily unjustifiably, if they were foreign nationals) special treatment, might have engaged in a little of it?

Read the original source for the other part of the article, the part about the family in the hotel, the interview with the man who referred to the lift-your-shirts incident:

http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0100regionalnews/tm_objectid=15936007%26method=full%26siteid=50061%26page=3%26headline=i%2dwaded%2din%2dfilth%2dto%2dbarricade%2dhotel%2ddoors-name_page.html

Mr Scott said: "I could not have a lower opinion of the authorities from the police officers on the street right up to George Bush.

"But I have a completely opposite view of the American people.

"There were so many random acts of kindness - people would go without so my son wouldn't go hungry.

"The American people saved us. I wish I could say the same for the American authorities. George Bush and his government left those people to die.

"The only person who seems to be trying to do anything is the Mayor of New Orleans and that man is banging his head against a brick wall.

"The US can't rescue their own people better than they can rescue people in the Third World. They didn't seem to care about their own people, mainly for economic and social reasons because the people worst-affected were poor and black."

Things happen that we wish didn't, and are reported by people who see them. That doesn't make the people who see them the bad guys.

Acknowledging that a few people may well have reacted unpleasantly to the hell they were living in -- that they maybe took out their anger and frustration and sorrow and fear, some of it going way back before Katrina, on someone who was not the cause of it -- isn't going to turn George Bush into the hero of the piece.

[Benbow]

48. Oh, come on - in the Superdome, white skins were in the minority -

and the first Brits, Spanish, Aussies and New Zealanders to have been smuggled out have all talked of being threatened by the criminal element - who happened to be black, because this is NO and the people in the Superdome were the ones who could not afford to evacuate themselves (majority black).

[muriel_volestrangler]

30. The story holds up

From the link to the Liverpool paper in post #26: "At one point, there were a load of girls on the roof of the lobby of the hotel saying 'Can you help us?'". So they didn't have to be 12 floors up.

The water had reached the Superdome by Tuesday evening: http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050830/ap_on_re_us/hurricane_katrina

[Benbow]

46. Well done n/t

[Benbow]

42. Not debunked n/t

[louis-t]

49. Good work, you've convinced me.

My suspicions were correct.

edit: uh, oh...."roof of lobby"

Still have my doubts..

[Julius Civitatus]

22. I am speechless

:mad:

[DS1]

23. Corrupt pigs in NO?

Never happens :eyes:

[SomewhereOutThere424]

25. One thing to add

They were talking about how FEMA and other uniforms were stolen or missing. Perhaps it wasn't police officers, but sickos stealing costumes to get their rocks off on people like this kind of shit.

80% of the police force of NO allegedly quit because of this, so isn't it possible they'd discard their uniforms someplace? It's amazing what people will do in order to gain out of a disaster sometimes...

[JustSayNO 2 Sheeples]

27. No, 80% did not quit

That has been debunked here time and time again. Yes, there were officers who went AWOL and even two who committed suicide. But the numbers are not in the 80% range. And the reasons for not reporting for duty are not even known. They may be dead. They may have been stranded. They may have been working outside their normal assigned district. The police chief has stated there were a few cowards but the majority of his force stayed on for the duration.

Reporting this, in my opinion, is akin to us falling in to the hands of the Freepers who want us to believe it was all Nagin's and Blanco's fault.

[SomewhereOutThere424]

33. Ah, didn't know

Was just going based on what I'd heard on the news. Of course the emphasis wasn't the amount who'd quit, but the fact I'm sure during this that there were police/FEMA/many types of suits capable of being stolen. Be it this report is BS or not, I'm sure that it could have happened.

[Benbow]

45. Look - there are far, far more horrible first-hand accounts than this -

coming out all the time. You are straining at the proverbial gnat.

[Benbow]

43. Yes, that occurred to me too n/t

[iverglas]

26. There IS a credible source for this, and knee-jerk denial is not wise

I'll repost what I posted in reply to someone else who called it "fishy" in the Sean Penn thread.

The Liverpool Daily Post, which I'm not familiar with:
http://icliverpool.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0100regionalnews/tm_objectid=15936007&method=full&siteid=50061&headline=i-waded-in-filth-to-barricade-hotel-doors-name_page.html

THE SCOTT family booked a last-minute break in New Orleans, only to be plunged into a nightmare.

Once Hurricane Katrina struck the Gulf coast they, along with thousands of others, became caught up in a minute-by-minute battle for survival, first against the elements and then the indifference of the US authorities.

It's on the second page, amid a catalogue of complaints against authorities:

Asked what assistance was offered to people stranded in the hotel, he replied: "Nothing. The only information we got from anybody in authority was if a policeman walked past and we shouted to them out of the windows.

"The only information we ever got off them was negative: Don't go here, don't go there. There was no 'Are you OK? Are you safe? Have you got water?'.

"I couldn't describe how bad the authorities were - just little things like taking photographs of us, as we are standing on the roof waving for help, for their own personal photo albums, little snapshot photographs.

"At one point, there were a load of girls on the roof of the lobby of the hotel saying 'Can you help us?' and the policemen said 'Show us what you've got' and made signs for them to lift their T-shirts.

"When they said no, they said 'fine' and motored off down the road in their motorboat."

Direct quotes from a named person who appears to be an eyewitness, although it's possible that he's repeating something he was told (which would not necessarily be false). He doesn't really seem to be making it up himself, or to be having words put in his mouth.

It's a long one, so here's a bit more:

Mr Scott said: "I could not have a lower opinion of the authorities from the police officers on the street right up to George Bush.

"But I have a completely opposite view of the American people.

"There were so many random acts of kindness - people would go without so my son wouldn't go hungry.

"The American people saved us. I wish I could say the same for the American authorities. George Bush and his government left those people to die."

... "The US can't rescue their own people better than they can rescue people in the Third World. They didn't seem to care about their own people, mainly for economic and social reasons because the people worst-affected were poor and black."

He doesn't sound like a Republican.

It is not uncommon, in third-world countries, for ordinary people to see the police as their enemy and the rank and file of the military as on their side. The police have chosen to do a job that largely, from the people's perspective and in reality, involves enforcing the laws that keep them poor and miserable, and doing it with unnecessary cruelty. The young people in the military are their children and neighbours.

[JustSayNO 2 Sheeples]

28. Yup, let's get on this

Let's get on with all the sensationalized reports of how one person did this or three people did that. Let's make sure we not deny these terrible reports of people who were on the front line. It will aid and abet in absolving those responsible for the major fuck-up here: the BuSh admin

[iverglas]

31. let's save your patronizing and insulting attitude

Or maybe you weren't speaking to me, even though your post was written in reply to mine.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, shall I? Maybe if I set the good example even if it isn't deserved in this case, you'll learn something.



If anyone here had read a report of New Orleans police declining to help someone in need, or engaging in degrading behaviour, a year ago, would s/he have pooh-poohed it and accused the person relating it of having a right-wing political agenda?

I doubt that there was anything that the police in this situation, if it did occur, *could* have done to assist the people in question. I don't doubt that some of the police in New Orleans after the hurricane were distressed beyond bearing by what they were seeing. I also don't doubt that some of the police on the street were the same hostile, bigoted, sexist assholes they had always been.

[JustSayNO 2 Sheeples]

32. Who's insulting you?

I firmly believe that we ought to focus on this. It must have cost at least 10,000 lives. Let us get bogged down by these sensational reports. It will take the heat off the BIG problem.

[iverglas]

34. you need to find another playground

Get yourself a gold star (they're cheap), and when the search function is back on line tonight, check for my posts in this forum in the last few days.

Here, I'll save you what would undoubtedly be just too much trouble -- having a clue who you're talking to before you accuse him/her of getting bogged down by sensational reports and yada yada yada. No, your attempt at sarcasm isn't cute or charming.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1755275
reports of Canadian aid offers and provisions -- following up on the information I and other Canadians have posted about how *our* government had been pressuring *your* (I assume) government for a week to allow us to assist, while your government fiddled and our media expressed disbelief

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1756362
information I have posted in several places here about the long warnings that US authorities had regarding *exactly* what was going to happen in the event of a serious hurricane striking New Orleans, and about exactly what they did not do about it

The "BIG problem" is that those authorities did not do what was necessary to protect the people of the region -- from hurricane, from flood, and also from abuse at the hands of other people once their failure to do the other things led to the situation in which people were vulnerable to abuse.

[JustSayNO 2 Sheeples]

36. My sincerest apologies.

"I'll save you what would undoubtedly be just too much trouble -- having a clue who you're talking to"

I had no idea that I was going up against God's gift to DU. My sincerest apologies. I'm sure there will be medals for you.

Forget everything I said.

[Lori Price CLG]

50. The reports are not sensational - the facts themselves are 'sensational.'

And no, I'm not giving the Bush regime a pass, by toting the GOP line of 'not passing blame.' LOL. This is the same party that spent $70 mllion of taxpayers' money to find out if Bill Clinton had an extra-marital affair.

Lori Price
http://www.legitgov.org/

[Benbow]

44. Hear, hear n/t

[donheld]

41. So maybe these were the guys doing the raping

It fits doesn't it?