Study finds HIV weakens over time

[Algorem]

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/news/1127986229318330.xml&coll=2

Thursday, September 29, 2005
Regina McEnery
Plain Dealer Reporter

A study that staged a microbial version of a sports match suggests what many AIDS researchers have suspected all along: that HIV, which is expected to become the worst pandemic in human history, may actually be growing weaker over time.

Scientists from Cleveland and Antwerp, Belgium, pitted HIV specimens from 1986 to 1989 as AIDS roared onto the scene, against viruses from 2002-2003 in a series of competitions to determine which ones flexed more muscle, biologically speaking. They found that the 1980s specimens were fitter than their newer counterparts 75 percent of the time.

The Cleveland-Belgium study is the first of its kind to compare viral fitness between generations...

Arts said it would be wrong to presume that the virus, which has caused life expectancy to drop in some of the poorest countries, is drifting toward a benign corner of the microbiological ecosystem...

[rodeodance]

1. nature never ceases to amaze me.

[Kagemusha]

2. Why the surprise? It's just (gasp) evolution.

Viruses are trying to live, not to commit collective suicide. It's better for them to not kill the host if possible. So, nature (and medical science) has progressively "selected" this outcome, bit by bit, year by year.

[Bassic]

3. The surprise it's happening this fast I guess.

That's pretty cool in any event. Let's hope this proves to be the begining of the end for that damn desease.

[Baconfoot]

7. A virus replicates a wee bit more quickly than we do. NT

[Bassic]

8. Well, yeah, but I for one didn't we'd start seeing changes in under

20 years... I'm no biologist.

[CAcyclist]

19. Actually, it increases the virus's survival chances

If it can cause chronic disease without killing the host, it has a better chance of being transmitted to more victims over time, thus increasing survival of the virus.

There is a virus in cats, Feline Immunodeficiency Virus (not Feline Leukemia Virus - that's a different virus) that is in the same family as HIV , but because FIV has been infecting cats for a long time (humans discovered the virus relatively recently, but it's been infecting cats for a long time before it was discovered) the cat and the virus have a more benign relationship.

The cat doesn't die from the virus, but it is immune-compromised, so if it gets sick from a secondary infection, it takes longer to recover.

[Bassic]

22. As I said, I don't know much about all this but is it possible that

as the virus becomes adapted to humans enough not to kill us, it will start mutating more slowly, making a cure easier to find?

[CAcyclist]

23. Mutations occur when the environment puts pressure on the organism

If something is trying to wipe it out, it will change to adapt to survive. It just may not be as virulent.

The only virus that has ever been completely wiped out in humans was smallpox and thanks to some powerhungry and paranoid people, the last few examples of small pox continue to survive in laboratories as a constant threat to others instead of being destroyed for the benefit of all. No other virus has ever come this close to being destroyed.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

4. No, silly. It was intelligently designed that way. Sheeesh!

Don't you know that AIDS was an effort to get great deals on real estate in Africa, and in poverty stricken areas in US inner cities, especially in diamond, gold, oil and uranium rich areas, for the former, and near central business districts in the latter? That and god's will against non-believers.

Sorry, I had an extended discussion with a freeper last night, over evolution, politics, vodka, olives and ice.

He was willing to admit micro-evolution (changing colors in insects over several seasons) but felt that the initial start of life had to be create by god. He also literally thought that AIDS was a god-sent disease meant to punish anyone who does not read the bible literally. For him, preventing transmission of HIV by the use of condoms is worse than raping your sister. (he could not point out which verse mentioned condoms or AIDS, though)

Oh, i learned that there is a vast left-wing conspiracy targeting Cheney, Frist, DeLay and poor Georgie. The MSM is all involved secretly and all of the democratic owned publishing corporations are planning an anti-Bush coup. Oh, there was no hurricane in Louisiana - that was faked stuff caused by anti-Bush media. All the deaths were due to gunshots. THe so called flooding was bad hygiene.

I kid you not. Vodka was my friend.

[LibertyLover]

5. Vodka and Freepers

Somehow the words "I am so sorry." just don't seem enough to cover this situation. Indeed, vodka in copious amounts was your friend.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

6. the olives helped.

brought everything into a tart relief.
seriously, it was entertaining. I learned a lot about how some of those people think. OK, bad choice of words. Luckily, neither of us had a temper.

[Bassic]

9. This is serious?

This is incredible.

How can we say we're the most intelligent species on the planet when we've got plenty of evidence like that guy pointing to the opposite.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

10. serious.

But I suspect that his bible beating comes from guilt.

He kept trying to convince the bartendress (who was admittedly cute) to go out with him, insisting that he was single, even while his cell rang, and while he talked to someone obviously his wife and the mother of his children.

he did try to talk me into joining his bible study group, as he stiffed the bartendress of her tip.

[Bassic]

12. Unbelievable

Actually, I wish it were unbelievable, this sort of shit is all too common.

[Spangle]

14. You should have taken him up on his offer

Then during bible study you could keep asking "why?" and "what about this?" I don't understand this?.

Asking questions makes them explain, what they have never really thought about. Makes them study and think. In a sheeple envirment, they hear it, believe it, don't question it, don't study it, etc. They think that because their "friends/paster/etc" is saying it, that THEY researched it, etc. So alot of stuff goes "assumed" in that group. Everyone "knows" so it muct be correct/factual.

Don't talk about your point of view. Don't bring it up. Just ask questions about theirs.

My big kids got stuck in an envirment of fundies recently. And that is exactly how they survied their "time." LOL! My kids don't deal with well with that kind of ignorance. And since they are kids, it's assumed they have no knowledge of bible, history, etc. BAD mistake.

Questions seems like your intrested and not making fun, etc. It gets them motivied, etc. Were other wise they wouldn't care what you think, your opinion, etc.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

24. yeah, but I recognized that my liver was being exercized at that point,

and now, with my blood-alcohol levels being in need of some serious balancing, i wish I would have accepted. Amazing how much you can hear just by nodding, and asking, what do you mean?

[Hobarticus]

13. Are you serious? This person actually said those things?

What the FUCK is wrong with this country?

[Spangle]

16. What until it's explained to you

how racism is TAUGHT in the bible.

I had a night like yours once. I met a fellow from this white freak CHURCH group. Not from our area.

Instead of getting pissed, I was very intrested in how they screwed up the bible to get that load of crap. I all ready figured out that his ignorance was so deep, that it wouldn't effect him if I gave him "what for." So I decided to do research instead.

I did what you did. Got him talking. It was hard not to show how much of an idiot I thought he and his ideas was. I think he thought my "Oh my GAWD" expressions was one of "excitement." LOL! And that I was really "getting into" what he was saying. But in reality, I just couldn't believe I was hearing/seeing, etc.. comeing from this man.

Yep, he pointed to scripture in the old and new testment that backed up their beliefs. I could have pointed out the real meaning right then, but he would have stopped talking to me to soon.

[GOPAgainstGW]

11. BS - HIV is mutating into stronger strains. Well Published/Documented-eom

[northzax]

15. it depends, of course

on your definition of strength in a virus.

Is a virus stronger because it kills the host faster? because it shows symptoms faster? because it can survive slightly longer in a hostile medium? because it replicates faster? because it is more resistant to chemicals and anti-virals? because it lies dormant for a longer period of time, allowing for greater transmission?

all have different answers, and any one could be used to say "this is stronger" or "this is weaker" The research I have glanced at implies that HIV is mutating, in the western world, into more of a chronic disease, in the developing world, where transmission remains rampant, it seems more aggressive.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

17. If left untreated

over time, it would have to weaken, in order to survive. Killing the host leaves it a ineffectual virus, just like Ebola.

But, we are providing a great deal of treatment, many of them quite effective at holding it at bay. Perhaps, we are forcing it to evolve faster, and therefore weaker.

[northzax]

18. not neccesarily

if left untreated, HIV can take, in an otherwise healthy person, 5-10 years, or more, to being to be symptomatic, which leaves plenty of time for transmission. It's quite weak, in terms of transmission, because it needs fluid contact, so it needs a long hibernation time, to find new hosts. Ebola, for instance, dies out quickly in human populations, as you point out, because it kills people too fast, but it also is more resiliant than HIV, in that it is transmitted more easily. so the terminology is all strange.

[CAcyclist]

20. Becoming more resistant to diffent antivirals doesn't mean its a stronger

virus. When a virus or any other species has to evolve to fit its new environment , it inevitably loses ground in other areas its not being selected for.

[iconoclastNYC]

21. WRONG. Mutating into DRUG-Resitance strains

Which doesn't mean STRONGER, only means DRUG RESISTANT, and that doest not challenge the findings of this study.

If you are refering to the so called superstrain you should look into it. The story was unwarranted alarmism. The case was an "outlier", and there were previous reported "outlier" cases. There is no superstrain of HIV.