Cuba Vote Shows Bush's Waning Authority

[Osolomia]

by Jim Lobe
October 25, 2003

Thursday's unexpectedly lop-sided vote by the Republican-led U.S. Senate to end a 40-year ban on U.S. citizens travelling to Cuba marks another embarrassing defeat for President George W. Bush.

Less than two weeks ago the president announced new measures to make it more difficult for people who travel to the Caribbean island illegally.

The 59-36 vote to lift the ban also signals Bush's weakening hold on fellow Republicans in Congress, who are trying to assert greater independence from the administration as they have watched the president's approval ratings plummet from around 80 percent last spring to less than 50 percent one year before the 2004 elections.

... "This would have been inconceivable six months ago," said one Congressional aide after the Senate vote on Cuba. "But it's clear that more Republicans are willing to vote against the president."

... According to the authoritative 'Congressional Quarterly', the latest vote suggested that restive Republicans were increasingly prepared to resist Bush's directions in a series of legislative tests before Congress recesses next month.

More...
http://www.antiwar.com/ips/lobe102503.html

[MuseRider]

1. This is good news

in many different ways! Good news, maybe I can get there this summer.

[Osolomia]

3. Sunny Havana? Don't Pack Bags Yet

CBS News
NEW YORK, Oct. 24, 2003

"If for any reason, a bill to allow Americans to travel freely to Cuba passed and he signed it, then it is simple: The president loses Florida." - Joe Garcia

(CBS) CBS News Foreign Affairs Analyst Pamela S. Falk teaches law at the City University of New York. She regularly travels to Cuba.
---

Looking forward to weekends sipping Cuba Libres and smoking cigars in Havana? Well, don't book the flight yet, but this week, both the U.S. Senate and House voted to cut the funding that allows the U.S. government to enforce the travel ban to Castro's Communist Cuba.

... Nonetheless, the bill's passage sends a message to President Bush and his Cuba hands - Housing Secretary Mel Martinez and Secretary of State Colin Powell - that even the Republican-controlled Congress is ready to slug this one out.

... This is presidential election season, and a tough policy on Cuba is perceived to be good for any candidate looking to secure the Florida vote -- as predictable as Castro condemning the United States for imperialism.

... "President Bush could veto this and still win Florida," said Lissa Weinmann, Director of the project. "In fact, if you read the polls, it could actually help him, both with Cuban-Americans, who are split 50 - 50 on lifting the travel ban, and with other Florida voters, who overwhelmingly want to travel freely to Cuba."

... The showdown is set. Cuba is always a hotspot and always a tricky issue for presidential candidates and we will shortly see how the winds are blowing in the Florida straits.

More...
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/10/24/opinion/main579970.shtml

[Osolomia]

4. "other Florida voters who overwhelmingly want to travel freely to Cuba"!

Are the Dems listening? Not just in Florida but in at least 38 other states where even the Repubs are fed up with this crap!

[Judi Lynn]

7. They're watching in Cuba, as well as in Miami

Posted on Sat, Oct. 25, 2003

Havana praises U.S. vote against Cuba travel ban
Cuban officials said they know President Bush will veto easing of the travel ban to Cuba, but they're sure most Americans support such a change.
BY NANCY SAN MARTIN
[e-mail]

CONGRESS

Cuban officials Friday said the U.S. Senate vote on easing the ban on travel to Cuba confirmed that most Americans want to improve relations with Havana but acknowledged the initiative may be blocked short of becoming law.

''It's new proof that both chambers are in favor of a political change, just like the majority of North American society,'' Foreign Minister Felipe Pérez Roque was quoted as saying by the Spanish EFE news agency.

But Roque acknowledged that President Bush has threatened to veto the measure if it is approved by the full Congress. The president, in fact, recently vowed to tighten the restrictions on travel to the island. (snip)


In Miami, Spanish-language talk radio shows barely mentioned the Senate vote. Cuban-American groups opposed to any easing of U.S. sanctions expressed confidence that Bush would veto the measure while those that support an easing of restrictions praised the Senate vote. (snip/...)

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/7100373.htm

[robbob]

25. How could a veto help him

...with "other Florida voters, who overwhelmingly want to travel freely to Cuba." ???

I don't get it? Is this more happy media whore pro-B* bs? Sure sounds like it. The voters who want to travel to Cuba will NOT be pleased if he veto's the bill.

Is it asking to much for our media to make sense once in a while?

[Osolomia]

27. Is it asking too much for Dem Prez candidates to support the majority?!

Democratic Presidential Candidates on Cuba

Of the ten current democratic hopefuls, Representative Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) is the only one who supports an end to the embargo. Both his rhetoric and his voting record demonstrate that he would work for change in U.S. policy. As stated in his website: “Our policy toward Cuba has failed. More than four decades of a unilateral embargo and persistently hostile and aggressive rhetoric and actions from successive administrations have created only misery for the Cuban people and have hurt, not helped, U.S. interests at large. A Kucinich administration will work for repeal of the Helms-Burton Act and the immediate lifting of the trade embargo.”

Senator John Kerry (D-MA) has recently wavered in his positions on Cuba. In an interview with the Boston Globe in 2000, Kerry stated that a reevaluation of the embargo was “way overdue.” However, recently Kerry has opted to keep sanctions in place. (Cuba-USA.com News) “I think that people traveling in there weakens Castro” (Miami Herald, 9/1/03). He recently co-sponsored a bill in the Senate (S-950) that would end the travel ban to Cuba. This co-sponsorship is seen as a declaration of support for an end to that policy, but does not mean he is opposed to the embargo as a whole.

Vermont Governor Howard Dean has also wavered in his views about Cuba. Dean cites the recent crackdown on dissidents on the island and claims that Cuba has become a “political problem.” While he may have favored an ease of the embargo and travel restrictions in the past, Dean feels that now is not the right time (Miami Herald, 8/26/03).

Representative Dick Gephardt (D-MO), and Senators Bob Graham (D-FL), and Joseph Lieberman (D-CT) all strongly support current policy on Cuba. Both Gephardt and Graham have voted against easing the embargo in the past. One should not expect any of these candidates to seek progressive reforms with Cuba. Senator Lieberman has aggresively courted the hard-line Cuban-American vote in the past through his full-fledged support for the embargo and his support for harsher measures against Cuba. He is one of the major non-Florida, Democratic supporters in the Senate of the embargo.

Former Ambassador Carol Mosely Braun appears to favor an ease in the embargo according to her voting record (H.R. 927, 3/5/96); however, she has not taken a campaign position on Cuba. Finally, the Rev. Al Sharpton and General Wesley Clark have not taken a stance on Cuba.

More...
http://www.lawg.org/pages/new%20pages/Misc/prez-candidates1.htm

Btw, in the Senate last week Lieberman and Graham voted with the minority against your freedom to travel! The rest of the Dem presidential candidates were absent during the historic debates and votes in Congress on the travel ban and still have not put in their 2 cents worth. Go figure!

[diplomats]

2. And last week we had that amendment on the Iraq allocation

This definitely appears to be a trend.

[Osolomia]

5. A rebuff for Bush

Memphis
October 25, 2003

THE SENATE has taken a giant step toward recognizing the right of Americans to travel where they wish, voting this week to ease the ban on Americans traveling to Cuba. The House has voted to do so as well.

Previously, the House Republican leadership, at the behest of the White House, managed to bottle up an easing of the ban. But now the measure likely will survive, setting up a confrontation with President Bush.

... The President seems unfazed at the notion of trampling on his fellow citizens' basic right to travel freely. Bush's aides have said he will veto the bill, a $90 billion measure to fund the departments of Treasury and Transportation, if the amendment is attached.

... The President shouldn't expend the political capital to fight Congress on the Cuba travel ban. He's on the wrong side of the issue, and even if he succeeds, he's fighting a rear-guard action that he's ultimately destined to lose.

More...
http://www.gomemphis.com/mca/opinion/article/0,1426,MCA_536_2374660,00.html

[Judi Lynn]

6. Interesting points made in your article

also note, from the article:

(snip) Bush is in something of a bind. He needs the Cuban-American vote next year, but he also needs the support of farm-state lawmakers, many of them Republicans, who are the biggest proponents of easing travel and trade restrictions on Cuba. Since a ban on farm sales to Cuba was loosened in 2000, American farmers have sold $282 million worth of agricultural goods to Cuba.

Opponents of easing the ban say the money from American travelers goes to support Fidel Castro's regime - which has lasted four decades without American money. Estimates are that 25,000 Americans traveled illegally to Cuba last year.

But that number is dwarfed by the 140,000 people, mainly Cuban-Americans with family members on the island, who traveled there legally. They presumably still could do so, even under Bush's tougher rules. (snip)

Cuban "exiles" who are free to come from and go to Cuba are fine with keeping Americans out, while they use the Americans' taxpayers to fund their arrivals in the U.S. through free access to food stamps, section 8 housing, medical treatment, financial aid for education, etc., etc., etc. in a wide offering of benefits not offered to any other immigrant group. Fine way to show gratitude, you can be sure.

As a bonus, they corrupt our greediest politicians. Thanks a lot, Miami.

It's time to pry them loose, and encourage them to stand on their own, and stop playing these filthy games on the U.S. public. Cubans aren't harming U.S. citizens, but the Miami Mafia is doing us ALL a lot of damage.

[Osolomia]

9. So long as Dems continue to let the extremist rw minority dictate to them

and ignore the will of the bipartisan majority then Dems have no one to blame but themselves for the positions of the 2004 presidential candidates and even DUs silent complicity with the Bush Doctrine of regime change in Cuba.

Democratic Presidential Candidates on Cuba

Of the ten current democratic hopefuls, Representative Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) is the only one who supports an end to the embargo. Both his rhetoric and his voting record demonstrate that he would work for change in U.S. policy. As stated in his website: “Our policy toward Cuba has failed. More than four decades of a unilateral embargo and persistently hostile and aggressive rhetoric and actions from successive administrations have created only misery for the Cuban people and have hurt, not helped, U.S. interests at large. A Kucinich administration will work for repeal of the Helms-Burton Act and the immediate lifting of the trade embargo.”

Senator John Kerry (D-MA) has recently wavered in his positions on Cuba. In an interview with the Boston Globe in 2000, Kerry stated that a reevaluation of the embargo was “way overdue.” However, recently Kerry has opted to keep sanctions in place. (Cuba-USA.com News) “I think that people traveling in there weakens Castro” (Miami Herald, 9/1/03). He recently co-sponsored a bill in the Senate (S-950) that would end the travel ban to Cuba. This co-sponsorship is seen as a declaration of support for an end to that policy, but does not mean he is opposed to the embargo as a whole.

Vermont Governor Howard Dean has also wavered in his views about Cuba. Dean cites the recent crackdown on dissidents on the island and claims that Cuba has become a “political problem.” While he may have favored an ease of the embargo and travel restrictions in the past, Dean feels that now is not the right time (Miami Herald, 8/26/03).

Representative Dick Gephardt (D-MO), and Senators Bob Graham (D-FL), and Joseph Lieberman (D-CT) all strongly support current policy on Cuba. Both Gephardt and Graham have voted against easing the embargo in the past. One should not expect any of these candidates to seek progressive reforms with Cuba. Senator Lieberman has aggresively courted the hard-line Cuban-American vote in the past through his full-fledged support for the embargo and his support for harsher measures against Cuba. He is one of the major non-Florida, Democratic supporters in the Senate of the embargo.

Former Ambassador Carol Mosely Braun appears to favor an ease in the embargo according to her voting record (H.R. 927, 3/5/96); however, she has not taken a campaign position on Cuba. Finally, the Rev. Al Sharpton and General Wesley Clark have not taken a stance on Cuba.

More...
http://www.lawg.org/pages/new%20pages/Misc/prez-candidates1.htm

For those who want to learn more about this issue the following are some basic documents and analyses to understand US-Cuba relations:

http://www.lawg.org/pages/new%20pages/countries/Cuba/Explore-Cuba.htm

[9215]

12. Great post Judilyn

Bush has to choose between his Cuban Mafia supporter's or farm belt conservatives.

Man, he is in a bind, hee, hee.

[Judi Lynn]

16. Interesting, isn't it?

One way or another, those right-wing Miami "exiles" are eventually going to lose their political control of a mass of Cuban votes in Florida, and when that happens, they'll be up the creek without a paddle. They are definitely one-issue people. They have made NO attempt to merge with American society, to learn to live in this country as American citizens. They have lived it up at our expense, and their joy ride is going to come to an end, if not now, within a few years. The very END. They'll have to learn some new skills, other than jerking our politicians around.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

(snip) It will be a cold day in hell before this Administration changes course but it's a good issue for one of the Democratic candidates to take off and run with. Many Cuban Americans who traditionally backed punitive measures against Cuba are increasingly calling for dialogue between the two nations. The rightwing Miami Cubans who wag the dog of Florida's twenty-five electoral votes have less power, as polls show that most Cuban Americans (particularly younger ones) would like to take the first steps to heal the wounds of the past forty- three years by an increase in contact between the two nations. (And, the way this Administration's deficit is bleeding social security, Cuba may not be the big issue in Florida in 2004.)

There's also increasing bipartisan (as well as corporate) support for ending travel and commercial restrictions. Calling for a lifting of the embargo would be both politically savvy and the right thing to do.

So far, however, only Dennis Kucinich has come straight out and said he's for an immediate lifting. Dean was against the embargo, but now says it's the wrong time to lift it because we'll look like we're rewarding Castro; Lieberman is firmly pro-embargo; Edwards and Gephardt are against dropping it now; Kerry is in favor of opening up travel but not lifting the embargo; And the Clark campaign says that he needs more time to study the issue. (Neither Sharpton nor Mosely- Braun's campaigns provided information on this issue.) (snip/...)

http://www.thenation.com/edcut/index.mhtml?bid=7&pid=1013

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

8. I'm curious about this legislative dataflow

How much time does a President have to decide wheter to veto or not? What happens if he does nothing? Who overrides the veto, and how many votes are needed? Do the good guys need more votes than the ones who passed the bill in the first place?

Whew, that was a lot of questions. Forgive this furrinah. :dunce:

[Osolomia]

10. I'm no expert but my understanding is this

The Transportation and Treasury appropriations bill now goes to committee where they reconcile the House and Senate versions into a bill that they take a final vote on before sending it to Bush to either sign or veto. If a two-thirds majority vote for the final bill then that vote overrides a presidential veto. This is a bipartisan effort, it is actually Republican Jeff Flake from Arizona who has been leading the fight for your freedom to travel to Cuba for several years now. Many Dems still have their heads still firmly implanted deep in the sand as the positions of the presidential contenders and their supporters goes to show to this day.

[Osolomia]

11. Transcript of the Senate debate on freedom to travel to Cuba

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?r108:21:./temp/~r108eAfah8:: then click on the link to the page you want.

If the above link doesn’t work then go to http://thomas.loc.gov/ then click on This Congress by Date, then select the Senate for October 23rd, then click on number 21 . TRANSPORTATION, TREASURY, AND INDEPENDENT AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS ACT, 2004 –

Debate on the Cuba travel amendments begins with Dorgan on Page: S13079

[Osolomia]

13. NYTimes Editorial: Congressional Resolve on Cuba, etc. etc.

Congressional Resolve on Cuba
October 25, 2003
New York Times

Though normally inclined to follow their president's lead on foreign policy, many Congressional Republicans have now broken ranks on Cuba. By a wide margin, the Senate joined the House on Thursday in voting to ease travel restrictions to Cuba, just two weeks after President Bush vowed to toughen sanctions on the government of Fidel Castro and enforce them more energetically. The renegade Republicans apparently think that Mr. Bush's approach is dictated less by a coherent vision than by electoral concerns involving anti-Castro Republican voters in Florida.

This Congressional resolve is commendable. Four decades of sanctions have allowed Mr. Castro to portray himself, both at home and abroad, as a victim of Yankee imperialism. Mr. Castro would probably be as disappointed as his adversaries in Florida to see the sanctions lifted.

That is one reason he has a knack for provoking a backlash anytime there is a chance of a change in the status quo, which may be the best of all worlds for Mr. Castro. The dollars sent home from Florida relatives and the money spent by European tourists have kept the rickety Cuban economy afloat since the Soviet collapse. At the same time, sanctions imposed by the United States have kept democratizing influences at bay and provided the regime with a justification for its authoritarian ways.

The proper response to such outrages as the Castro regime's roundup of dissidents and writers earlier this year is to seek to overwhelm the island with American influence — corporate and cultural — and with American tourists and other private visitors. This is the approach we take in trying to democratize other nations.

More…
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/25/opinion/25SAT2.html?ex=1067659200&en=bbebf80fa52a5c23&ei=5062&partner=GOOGLE


October 25. 2003 12:00AM
Terrorists, tourists, what's the diff?
Wilmington Star

President Bush seems to care more about winning votes in Florida than winning the war on terrorism.

He ordered a crackdown on Americans who violate the longstanding and seldom-enforced law against traveling to Cuba, whereupon his new Department of Homeland Security announced it would employ scarce "intelligence and investigative resources" to catch villainous vacationers.

That's on top of trying to get organized and obtain the people and money to stop fanatics trying to murder thousands of Americans on American soil. Good luck.

It's widely assumed that the reason Mr. Bush shifted his priorities from terrorism to tourism is that he wants to please the chronically irate anti-Castro Cuban immigrants in Florida. As some may recall, it is a state that can play an important role in presidential elections. Even many Republicans in Congress can't swallow the president's Cuba policy. The GOP-controlled House has repeatedly passed a bill easing the travel ban, which has been in effect since 1962 and, at last report, had not dislodged the garrulous dictator whose trademarks are a beard, a cigar and an obsolete ideology.

This week, the Senate followed the House's example. Nineteen Republicans were among the 59 senators voting to weaken the travel ban.

More…
http://www.wilmingtonstar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20031025/EDITORIAL/310250312

Saturday, October 25, 2003
Let the Tourists Descend
Bangor Daily News, Maine

The Senate's vote this week to join the House in ending the decades-old travel ban to Cuba was a nod to the reality that the prohibition did nothing to unseat Fidel Castro and instead allowed him to describe the United States as his country's oppressor. Though the White House is furious at Congress for the amendment, expanding travel in Cuba is consistent with its trade stance for another problematic country, China.

It is a fiction that Cuba and the United States are cut off from each other. Not only do some Americans go around the travel ban, since the Trade Sanctions Reform Act reauthorized direct exports of agricultural and food products to Cuba three years ago, the island nation has purchased hundreds of millions of dollars of goods from the United States, including $142 million this year through August. But the citizens of Cuba shouldn't see the United States merely as another place where trade is all one way. Maine Sen. Susan Collins , who voted to end the travel ban, said, "I do not condone Fidel Castro's repressive policies, but I believe the best way we can encourage Cubans to embrace a different government philosophy is to expose them to Americans."

.... Economic sanctions and saber-rattling haven't worked. Perhaps hordes of demanding tourists will do better. They couldn't do worse.

More…
http://www.bangornews.com/editorialnews/articles/410603_102503letthetouristsdes_.cfm

Saturday, October 25, 2003
Cuba travel ban outdated
Norwich Bulletin

… No, Castro has been picked out for special treatment. His forces defeated the U.S.-backed raiding party that landed at the Bay of Pigs in April 1961. In October 1962, the United States and Soviet Union went to the edge of the abyss when Castro agreed to place Soviet missiles in Cuba. In 1963, President Kennedy imposed the travel ban.

Is the United States still resentful of Castro for Kennedy's embarrassment?

That's silly. Kennedy has been dead 40 years and Fidel Castro today is 78 years old. Should we wait until he's dead to acknowledge a nation of 12 million people just 90 miles from Miami?

No, the Senate rightly followed the House lead in lifting the travel ban. The administration should acknowledge that the 1960s are over and acquiesce on travel to Cuba.

More…
http://www.norwichbulletin.com/news/stories/20031025/opinion/517139.html

[jonoboy]

14. what the hell has Cuba ever done to the USA?

[DUGA]

18. Your kidding, right?

While I'm all for lifting both the travel ban and the embargo against Cuba, it would be naive to believe that Cuba did nothing to cause the restrictions in the first place.

[Say_What]

22. 50 years of US terrorism against Cuba

Noam Chomsky's new book, Hegemony or Survival, America's Quest for Global Dominance describes the half century of terror against the island.

<clips>
Cuba in the cross-hairs:
A near half-century of terror
By Noam Chomsky

The Batista dictatorship was overthrown in January 1959 by Castro's guerrilla forces. In March, the National Security Council (NSC) considered means to institute regime change. In May, the CIA began to arm guerrillas inside Cuba. "During the Winter of 1959-1960, there was a significant increase in CIA-supervised bombing and incendiary raids piloted by exiled Cubans" based in the US. We need not tarry on what the US or its clients would do under such circumstances. Cuba, however, did not respond with violent actions within the United States for revenge or deterrence. Rather, it followed the procedure required by international law. In July 1960, Cuba called on the UN for help, providing the Security Council with records of some twenty bombings, including names of pilots, plane registration numbers, unexploded bombs, and other specific details, alleging considerable damage and casualties and calling for resolution of the conflict through diplomatic channels. US Ambassador Henry Cabot Lodge responded by giving his "assurance the United States has no aggressive purpose against Cuba." Four months before, in March 1960, his government had made a formal decision in secret to overthrow the Castro government, and preparations for the Bay of Pigs invasion were well advanced.

Washington was concerned that Cubans might try to defend themselves. CIA chief Allen Dulles therefore urged Britain not to provide arms to Cuba. His "main reason," the British ambassador reported to London, "was that this might lead the Cubans to ask for Soviet or Soviet bloc arms," a move that "would have a tremendous effect," Dulles pointed out, allowing Washington to portray Cuba as a security threat to the hemisphere, following the script that had worked so well in Guatemala. Dulles was referring to Washington's successful demolition of Guatemala's first democratic experiment, a ten-year interlude of hope and progress, greatly feared in Washington because of the enormous popular support reported by US intelligence and the "demonstration effect" of social and economic measures to benefit the large majority. The Soviet threat was routinely invoked, abetted by Guatemala's appeal to the Soviet bloc for arms after the US had threatened attack and cut off other sources of supply. The result was a half-century of horror, even worse than the US-backed tyranny that came before.

For Cuba, the schemes devised by the doves were similar to those of CIA director Dulles. Warning President Kennedy about the "inevitable political and diplomatic fall-out" from the planned invasion of Cuba by a proxy army, Arthur Schlesinger suggested efforts to trap Castro in some action that could be used as a pretext for invasion: "One can conceive a black operation in, say, Haiti which might in time lure Castro into sending a few boatloads of men on to a Haitian beach in what could be portrayed as an effort to overthrow the Haitian regime, . . . then the moral issue would be clouded, and the anti-US campaign would be hobbled from the start." Reference is to the regime of the murderous dictator "Papa Doc" Duvalier, which was backed by the US (with some reservations), so that an effort to help Haitians overthrow it would be a crime.

http://www.nationinstitute.org/tomdispatch/index.mhtml?pid=1027

[Judi Lynn]

38. Right wingers will ALWAYS try to obscure U.S. brutality against Cuba

It never fails to amaze. They can only successfully lie to Americans who refuse to learn personally, deliberately, through going to the library, bookstores, or simply starting to do searches, what is conveniently side-stepped in our history lessons in school.

Alert people are quick enough to recognize bizarre, illogical, unhinged propaganda.

[goforit]

15. When are they gonna finaaly wake up and refuse his authority.

It's gonna take alot more than one vote out of a thousand.

[Judi Lynn]

17. Worth studying

(snip) ...... congressional Republican leaders often are able to strip controversial language from bills during House-Senate conferences. That is likely to occur on the Cuba issue this time.

"We're going to try to pull it out," a House Republican leadership aide said. "Our general strategy has been to not have the president veto one of our bills. I don't think we want to embarrass him."

A Senate Republican leadership aide agreed. "Nobody wants a veto," this aide said. However, in a sign of the bipartisan backing for the measure, neither aide would flatly predict that the effort to shield Bush from a potential veto fight would succeed.

Before the Senate vote, the White House issued a warning against interference with its Cuba policy. "The function of the travel sanctions is to prevent unlicensed tourism to Cuba that provides economic resources to the Castro regime while doing nothing to help the Cuban people," the statement said. If the final version of the bill were to include an amendment to block the travel sanctions, the statement said, "the president's senior advisors would recommend that he veto the bill."

Nearly three years into his presidency, Bush has yet to put his veto pen to paper, though he and his aides have often brandished it as a threat. The lack of any recorded vetoes reflects the president's occasional willingness to sign bills he dislikes and, more often, his success at bending Congress to his will.

But one critic of the current Cuba policy said Congress should call Bush's bluff. "They threaten vetoes on a lot of things," said Sen. Byron L. Dorgan (D-N.D.). "But I'm not convinced they would proceed to issue a veto on an appropriations bill on something that was supported by both the House and the Senate." (snip/...)

http://www.latimes.com/la-na-cuba25oct25,1,2395487.story

[Judi Lynn]

19. Cuban ambassador welcomes lifting of US travel ban

Cuban ambassador welcomes lifting of US travel ban
Sees it as sign of dwindling support for embargo
STEVEN JACKSON, Observer staff reporter
Saturday, October 25, 2003



Cuban ambassador welcomes lifting of US travel ban

JOSE Piedra, Cuba's ambassador to Jamaica, yesterday interpreted Thursday's US Senate vote to lift the ban on travel to the communist Caribbean island as a sign of dwindling support for the US embargo.

"I think that it is a positive move. More and more sectors in America are trying to establish normalcy in relations with Cuba and not to interfere in the internal affairs of the country," the ambassador told the media at Cuba's Kingston embassy.

However, he echoed the postulation of Cuban foreign minister, Felipe Perez Roque, that US president George W Bush would likely veto the measure.

"I am pessimistic that it will pass; the president has already said that he is going to veto it," Piedra said. (snip/...)

http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/html/20031025T000000-0500_50715_OBS_CUBAN_AMBASSADOR_WELCOMES_LIFTING_OF_US_TRAVEL_BAN.asp

[Osolomia]

20. Why no outrage over Cuba policy?

Letters for October 26
Reno Gazette Journal, Nevada

Why no outrage over Cuba policy?

It surprises me that there has been no public outrage expressed at President Bush’s recent speech in which he promised to more harshly prosecute Americans who travel to Cuba.

The right to travel freely has always been a source of pride for Americans. Can we celebrate our freedom when the president can deny citizens’ rights based on his political agenda? Never mind that an American tourist freely traveling overseas is outside the jurisdiction of America’s court system.

This progressive abridgment of constitutional rights and protections is now being applied to “foreign combatants” denied legal representation and due process of law. If President Bush implements secret military tribunals as an extension of his “pre-emptive strike” military policy, then the United States will have adopted many of the same totalitarian policies of the former Soviet Union that formed the justification for the Cold War.

Americans who care about preserving our constitutional rights had better start preparing to bring about regime change in 2004.

Dallas Smith, Reno

http://www.rgj.com/news/stories/html/2003/10/25/55070.php?sp1=rgj&sp2=Opinion&sp3=Opinion&sp5=RGJ.com&sp6=news&sp7=opinion

[Judi Lynn]

21. The author raises a point I've never seen spelled out

It's a damned GOOD one, too:

The right to travel freely has always been a source of pride for Americans. Can we celebrate our freedom when the president can deny citizens’ rights based on his political agenda? Never mind that an American tourist freely traveling overseas is outside the jurisdiction of America’s court system.

Thanks for posting this L.T.T.E. At least it shows some Americans are THINKING about the issue...............

[Say_What]

23. Cuba: Hold the veto pen

<clips>

We have sometimes alluded to the first law of holes: When you're in one, stop digging. At least with respect to Cuba, the Bush administration keeps digging a hole that has done nothing but get deeper for years.

In spite of growing resistance, even from Republicans, President Bush continues to oppose legislation that would make it easier for U.S. tourists and others to visit Cuba. So adamant is the president that he may veto the legislation, even though it contains other provisions that are near and dear to him. In fact, Bush said earlier this month that he wanted to tighten the travel ban.

The trade and travel embargo on Cuba was imposed in the early 1960s in an attempt to weaken and eventually topple the regime of Fidel Castro. Obviously, it has failed. Even some members of the Cuban expatriate community in Florida - Castro's most implacable enemies - have been forced to realize that the embargo is not working.

Recently, the dissenters have been joined by farmers and farm-state lawmakers, including Republicans, who recognize that the embargo also is denying them an export market. Other critics realize that, while lifting the embargo may help the Cuban economy, trade inevitably involves the exchange of ideas as well as goods and services. It would open up Cuba to political pressures that do not now exist, just as trade has begun to transform China and other countries.

http://www.jsonline.com/news/editorials/oct03/179898.asp

[Say_What]

24. Senate says F*ck you to Bush!!!

I was away for the weekend and typically when away I make it a practice to not read, watch, or listen to the news. Yesterday as I walked past a USA Today newsbox the following headline caught my eye: "Senate Defies Bush on Cuba". I was delighted!!

As some articles have pointed out, House and Senate Repuke leaders may still try to strip the language from the bill (as they have in the past), but if the amendment cannot be stripped out in conference committee, Bushie may be forced to either please the anti-Cuba screwballs in South Florida, or royally p*ss off many legislators and groups around the country whose road and bridge projects are contained in the transportation bill.

[Judi Lynn]

31. While you were gone

Mika left a post, probably the day after the Senate overwhelming vote to drop the travel ban, saying that he had listened as long as he could stand it to one of the Miami gusano radio stations, and "exile" Representative Lincoln Diaz-Balart actually was on, assuring his fellow gusanos that the thing is dead: they'll rip the stuffings out of it personally.

Sure would like to see Lincoln FINALLY get stomped flat on this attempt. He's wrecked so many important efforts in the past.


Lincoln's the rightwingnut "exile" politician on the right

[Say_What]

36. A pair that'll beat a full house

The Ditzy-Balistic brothers (Fidel's favorite nephews) as well as their sidekick, Ileana Ros-Lithium are all part of the one-issue-agenda crowd. When the embargo and travel ban get lifted they can all say goodbye to the very lucrative anti-Cuba industry that thrives in South Florida.

[Osolomia]

26. Bush Passes on Cuban Exiles' Right

By Ann Louise Bardach
LA Times
October 26, 2003

… … Perhaps the clearest signal of just how extreme the Bush policy is can be gleaned from the list of those invited to the Rose Garden. Amply represented were members of the Cuban Liberty Council, a group that broke away from the conservative Cuban American National Foundation on the grounds that it was too moderate. Also present was Alberto Hernandez, an exile known for his militancy who is profusely thanked for his support and friendship in the memoirs of Luis Posada Carriles, currently in prison in Panama on charges that he attempted to assassinate Castro.

Though the president spoke of his intentions "to hasten the arrival of a new, free, democratic Cuba," it was the wind of political partisanship, not the spirit of democracy, that blew in the Rose Garden. Miami's three Cuban American Republican congressional representatives chatted with the president, but their colleague Robert Menendez, a fervently anti-Castro exile who represents a district in New Jersey, was left off the list. He is a Democrat. More stunning was the omission of representatives from the Cuban American National Foundation, a prominent exile group. The slight was viewed by insiders as part of ongoing punishment for the group's not having endorsed Bush (or any other candidate) in the 2000 presidential campaign. "These guys have no equal when it comes to revenge," says one foundation board member.

Members of the Cuba Study Group, an exile organization made up of the most influential Cuban business leaders in Miami, were also excluded. One of its founders, Carlos Saladrigas, who describes himself as a "lifelong conservative Republican," attributes the snub to the group's recent polling, which found that a majority of South Florida's exiles now favor a nonconfrontational approach to Cuba…

… One might reasonably ask, then, what the Bush administration believes it stands to gain by tailoring its policy to please only hard-liners. The answer may be that, though Cuban exiles have a multiplicity of political views, the extreme right wing still controls the political leadership and electoral machinery of Miami-Dade, along with the vitally important Spanish-language radio stations. Bush is unlikely to have forgotten that it was Miami exile radio that summoned rowdy protesters to the canvassing board during the 2000 presidential recount. And Miami-Dade County officials decided to shut the recount down.

More…
http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-op-bardach26oct26,1,7048091.story?coll=la-headlines-politics

[sarastro]

28. Laying aside the rightness or wrongness of the embargo.....

I'm just glad to see Congress wake the hell up! Congress has allowed the Executive branch to usurp far more power than is healthy for checks and balances. Legislative vitality is crucial to our survival as a republic, and for far too long our elected representatives have served as nothing but a rubberstamp for the ruling junta. Good on ya, Congressional Republicans with a sense of decency!

On the subject of the embargo, down with our self-serving Cuba policy! No objections to elevating China into the WTO, eh, Georgie? Thought not, you ideological half-wit. Way to ensure our staunch anti-Communism is a solid front, right? Good thing you're in favor of free trade, or that steel tariff thing would've....never mind.

[Judi Lynn]

32. The author of you L.A. Times article is one of the two

who was working at the N.Y. Times when they did that sensational interview with mass murderer/bomber/ex-CIA "exile Luis Posada Carriles. She really knows her stuff.

Thought it was great they touched on Bush's pathetic charges of sexual slavery flung at Cuba, and that they addressed that bunk directly, mentioning the Batista dictatorship is the government the U.S. SHOULD have been condemning, after all, on its "sexual" witch hunt. (This strange attack from Bush is almost unbearable, considering he represents a country containing one entire state where prostitution is BIG BIDNESS, and very legal. People need to be able to see through his lies. Articles like this are just what the doctor ordered.)

From the L.A. Times article:

The president's policies are not only at odds with public opinion on Cuba; he has squared off against his own party. In September, the Republican-controlled House of Representatives passed amendments to ease the embargo against Cuba. For the fourth time in three years, it voted to ease restrictions on travel. Thursday, the Senate for the first time passed the measure as well. The president has said he will veto such a bill if it comes to him.

Bush's hard-line policies are not without political peril. "It would be close to impossible for President Bush to carry Florida if he does not get the 80% or 85% level of the Cuban American vote," says pollster Sergio Bendixen, adding that the administration is "risking 15% to 20% of the vote by listening only to the most extreme element who favor a confrontational approach." Bendixen points out that more than half of South Florida's exiles are fairly recent émigrés "who are basically economic refugees and who have family in Cuba." This group, he says, no longer wants sanctions to be the focus of U.S. policy.

(snip)

[Osolomia]

29. If Congress lifts the ban on Cuba --- Will you go?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=105&topic_id=328631

[Osolomia]

30. Country's outstretched hands invite kindness, bewitch with beauty

Inside Cuba
Country's outstretched hands invite kindness, bewitch with beauty
Alice Lukacs
For The Calgary Herald
Saturday, October 25, 2003

I knew it would be an unusual holiday when, in preparation for the two-week trip -- billed as the Western Cuba Discovery Tour -- I packed not only bathing suits and suntan lotion, but a second suitcase filled with donations.

We were asked to bring items needed by the pediatric hospital, school and seniors' centre we would be visiting with Cuba Discovery Tours, a company specializing in cultural learning tours of the Caribbean country.

I was curious as to what the trip would be all about.

It wasn't long before I found out. Reluctantly leaving the inviting pool of the charming, colonial-style hotel in Matanzas, our first stop, we boarded our air-conditioned bus. It whisked us far into the countryside. In the main building of a sugar cane co-op, a warmly welcoming group greeted us with tables laden with tropical fruits. Children recited revolutionary poetry and we listened to speeches outlining the gains made by the 1959 revolution.

More...
http://www.canada.com/calgary/calgaryherald/archives/story.asp?id=3BFCF981-0B15-43C1-BAEB-C4D43BE25C8B

[joshcryer]

33. Wow, look at all those anti-Cuba DUers.

Man, isn't it awful!

[Judi Lynn]

34. Really refreshing to see a thread like that, joshcryer!

Untouched by rightwingnut ravings! I almost feel like sobbing!

Thanks a bunch. :hi:

I left links there to the only person in America thrown in prison for traveling to Cuba. Deadly bass-fisherman, Dan Snow! We might be thrown in the slammer just for knowing about him. You never really can tell.

[Osolomia]

40. Yup, they want the freedom to travel but wont stand up and fight for it

That’s why last week Senators Lieberman and Graham stood with the MINORITY and voted AGAINST your freedom to travel to Cuba!

That’s why, except Kucinich, NOT ONE of the Democratic presidential candidates supports lifting the travel ban now!

Time's up, Dems better get their act together fast if they want it don’t you think?

[Judi Lynn]

35. Bush should capitulate on Cuba

Bush should capitulate on Cuba
October 27, 2003

The Senate has taken a giant step toward recognizing the right of Americans to travel where they wish, voting 59 to 38 to ease the ban on Americans traveling to Cuba. The House had earlier voted 227 to 188 to do so.

Previously, the House Republican leadership, at the behest of the White House, had managed to bottle up an easing of the ban. But now that amendment likely will survive, setting up a confrontation with President Bush.

Bush's aides have said he will veto the bill, a $90 billion appropriation to fund the departments of Treasury and Transportation, if the amendment is attached. That means the bill, already almost two months late, would have to go back to Congress to be reworked.

The president is in a bind. He needs the Cuban-American vote but also needs the support of farm-state lawmakers, many of them Republicans, the biggest proponents of easing travel and trade restrictions on Cuba. Since a ban on farm sales to Cuba was eased in 2000, American farmers have sold $282 million worth of agricultural goods to Cuba. Some 140,000 people traveled to Cuba last year, mainly Cuban-Americans with family on the island. (snip/...)

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/opinion/article/0,1299,DRMN_38_2378804,00.html

[Say_What]

37. FLORIDA TODAY: Cuban travel

<clips>

For 40 years, Cuba has been a sure-fire way for presidents of both political parties to try to gain votes in the Cuban community of South Florida.

President Bush is no different, having recently stated he wants to tighten travel restrictions to the impoverished island as part of the trade embargo against Fidel Castro.

We have long believed the embargo is a failed and irrelevant relic of the Cold War that only hurts the Cuban people, and lifting it and travel restrictions would allow the winds of free trade and democracy to sweep over the island.

Increasing numbers of Republicans and Democrats in Congress feel the same, as shown by recent moves.

http://www.floridatoday.com/!NEWSROOM/opedstory1027WCUBA.htm

[Judi Lynn]

39. Jamaica braces for tourism competition from Cuba

It would seem Jamaica believes the Congress will get its way, this time!

Jamaica braces for tourism competition from Cuba

PETRE WILLIAMS, Observer staff reporter
Friday, October 24, 2003



JAMAICAN tourism interests yesterday predicted a temporary slump in visitors from America if the US lifts its 40-year travel ban on its citizens to Cuba, but said the Jamaican brand was strong enough to ensure an early recovery.

"There is no doubt that the novelty value and other considerations will lure visitors to Cuba whenever the travel ban on US citizens is lifted," said the Jamaican tourism minister, Aloun Assamba.

But Assamba said that Jamaica was accustomed to competition in the tourism business and was already preparing for the reopening of Cuba to US travellers.

"...Local hotel and airline interests have already established ties with Cuba," Assamba said. "... We wholeheartedly support the lifting of the US travel ban on our regional neighbour (and) we look forward to establishing strong tourism partnerships, at various levels, that can benefit both our countries." (snip/...)

http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/html/20031024T000000-0500_50672_OBS_JAMAICA_BRACES_FOR_TOURISM_COMPETITION_FROM_CUBA.asp

[Judi Lynn]

41. President on wrong side of Cuban travel-ban issue

Editorial: A rebuff for Bush
President on wrong side of Cuban travel-ban issue

October 27, 2003

The Senate has taken a giant step toward recognizing the right of Americans to travel where they wish, voting 59 to 38 to ease the ban on Americans traveling to Cuba. The House had earlier voted 227 to 188 to do so.

Previously, the House Republican leadership, at the behest of the White House, had managed to bottle up an easing of the ban. But now that amendment likely will survive, setting up a confrontation with President Bush.

Earlier this month, as part of an aggressive drive to court the Cuban-American vote, Bush used a Rose Garden ceremony to announce he was tightening restrictions on Americans traveling to Cuba and that he would use the Department of Homeland Security to target and punish those Americans who circumvented the ban.

The president seemed unfazed at trampling on his fellow citizens' fundamental right to travel freely.

Bush's aides have said he will veto the bill, a $90 billion appropriation to fund the departments of Treasury and Transportation, if the amendment is attached. That means the bill, already almost two months late, would have to go back to Congress to be reworked. This seems an unnecessary and petty use of what could be Bush's first veto of his term; certainly he's never used it to stop massive spending increases or legislation, like campaign finance reform, that he opposed while running for office. (snip/...)

http://www.tcpalm.com/tcp/the_news_editorials/article/0,1651,TCP_1033_2378632,00.html