SAN DIEGO COUNTY BURNING EVERYWHERE - 10 DEAD SO FAR

[revree]

We are literally surrounded by massive, out of control wildfires here in San Diego county, and we have massive fires burning in neighboring L.A. county and San Bernardino. Just in San Diego alone, ten dead, hundreds of houses burned, over 98,000 acres so far...

I think Southern California is literally going up in flames. It's hard to breathe, ash is everywhere. Wonder if AHNOLD will come and save the day?

To my fellow San Diegans, Los Angelenos, and San Bernardinoans, stay safe!

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/fires/20031026-130-sdfires.html

[Nottingham]

1. OMG!!! Its out of Control

Other terrible fires in History the Burning of Rome

Wonder where bush is with his fiddle

Be Safe and get the Hell out of there :bounce:

[Whoa_Nelly]

33. Radar Image

http://www.weatherunderground.com/radar/radblast.asp?ID=SOX

[NashVegas]

36. Pics, too

[oceanpoetry]

38. crisco - where was that picture taken?

nt

[SoCalDem]

43. Fort Ord.. lots more here at this link

http://www.weatherunderground.com/wximage/viewimages.html

[oceanpoetry]

2. thank you -sending you well wishes too

The air quality warnings, stay inside as much as possible.
this is seems so catastrophic and widespread...I am wearing my tinfoil hat on this one. Could it be terrorism?

[revree]

3. AMERICAN TERRORISM MAYBE, lost hunter is being accused of

the fire nearest my home. News says he shot up a flare and that started the Valley Center fire, which is moving towards my area. Other fires are suspected arsonists - you know, the usual American born assholes.

[oceanpoetry]

7. drought conditions with Santa Ana winds

have made California a tinder box. At least one of the fires came from arson, I have heard. There is no sign of the fires being contained anytime soon, due to weather conditions. It is very depressing.

[alfredo]

123. Got a message from a friend. he is packing up and heading south.

Him and his lover are going to help a clinic that is dealing with respiratory problems.

I think he called it the cedar fire that is heading his way.

[ahimsa]

64. Either way, once again no planes around to defend us

You'd think it might have occurred to our Homeland Defense Agency that part of that might involve protecting us from massive fires.

:(

[flamingyouth]

4. I'm so scared for you all down there

My thoughts and prayers are with you. Oh, this is terrible.

[bluestateguy]

5. I remember the Oakland Hills fire in 1991

I was 15. We could see and smell the smoke from our house. Had the winds changed direction my parents house would have been toast. My grandparents nearly lost their home, and a house they used to live in was burned down. That whole fire was started by a discarded cigarette.

[Ratty]

122. Me too!

It was damn scary. It was even scarier because it wasn't something us Bay Areans were accustomed too. One can't help but think of wildfires like that being more common in Southern California. Which is why it took me so long to realize the scope of this catastrophe. SoCalers, stay safe, we're thinking about you all and hope for the best.

[flamingyouth]

6. Here's another link

The SD paper's site must be totally overloaded...

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20031026/ap_on_re_us/wildfires_deaths

[revree]

8. Thanks! News changing so fast down here...

new areas burning up by the hour, so the local news websites must be swamped.

[revree]

9. New fire jumps 8 freeway.

Yikes, the news just said there are so many fires they lost count...

[Howardx]

10. arnold is in las vegas

at the mr olympia contest

[0rganism]

89. You sure he isn't parachuting in with a crack squad of firefighters?

Californians were led to believe he was that sort of candidate. C'mon, he's the "Governator"!

[fishnfla]

11. Whats going on with the winds?

Are they letting up? forecasts?

Jesus this is horrible

[revree]

14. Strong Santa Ana winds expected through Tuesday,

although they predict today will be the worst day...

VERY WINDY here, hot dry arid. Perfect fire weather. Arsonists must be in heaven.

[shanti]

45. yes, i heard it was arson in a few of the cases

i have lots of family down there and pray that this doesn't get much worse!!!!

[Momof1]

12. Help, How close is the fires to Yucaipa ??

I have family there, and I haven't been able to get a hold of them.

[revree]

13. Yucaipa is far north of San Diego county,

it is more to the east of the San Bernardino area, which is on fire as well. Your family should be safe where they are because the fire is moving west, towards the coast. So far, their area is A-ok, as long as these winds don't change or another arsonist doesn't get any ideas.

I'll send a blessing out to Yucaipa!

[Momof1]

17. Thank you soo much

I've been trying to find maps, where the fires are... but I've had no luck. I've been very worried. Thank you again.

[revree]

23. Check your local news on this Big Bear fire, Momof1.

Sounds like there may indeed be a fire near Yucaipa. I will continue to send prayers.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

15. Actually the Big Bear fire is quite close to Yucaipa and the

roads down the hill were being evacuated last night. It depends on if they are up the hill in Oak Glen or in town..so far valleys have fared better than canyons.

[revree]

16. There's a Big Bear fire, too? Jesus, is the entire STATE on fire?

THIS IS SCARY. I went to bed last night thinking something would happen today - witchy woman's intuition and all. I didn't expect all these fires...

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

18. There are about 6 fires in the southland

Your fire in SD is due to two of them connecting

[revree]

19. That, and a bonehead hunter who shot a flare into a high brush area

according to our local news. Started the Valley Center fire, near my home. Also, we still have Camp Pendelton fire to deal with, and now new fires near the Mexican border, and along freeway 8...

It's really hot down here...

[shanti]

46. yes, and with our state's economy in the dumpster

the arson aspect hasn't been overlooked by me

*taking off my :tinfoilhat:

[Momof1]

22. I think they live in town.

But I'm not very sure.

[Deb]

20. Good God, Please stay safe

Just found a web cam of San Diego, live with news reports. A plane crash in Montgomery Field. We have friends out there and had NO idea it was this bad.

The man just said..."If you feel the need to evacuate do so, do not call the com center for advise on evacuation." WHAT??? Oh man, I gotta make a phone call.

http://www.sundiegolive.com/

[E_Zapata]

21. How many reservists/national guardsmen are in IRAQ (or KIA)?

Because these are are our domestic first responders to large catastrophes - natural or otherwise.

Where are our reservists????

They are hunkered down in Iraq dodging bullets and no ticket home.

THIS is what infuriated me the most about sending our reserves into war right off the bat. If our country and people were in such dire danger from terrorists, why send our first reponders across the ocean for anything?

Those reservists are also our police, fire fighters, emergency medical personnel.

If the US takes a big hit (natural or otherwise), we are lost in the water.

Thanks a lot George Fucking Bush!

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

26. Exactly..a friend just said..just think if there were a terrorist attack

right now..all our state resources are stretched

[revree]

24. Rancho Santa Fe and Fairbanks Ranch threatened -

ZILLION DOLLAR HOMES THERE. AND POWER OUTTAGES EVERYWHERE NOW.

I hate arid locales.

[bluestateguy]

25. Will white conservatives say "This is a time to rally around Gov. Davis?"

According to them, whenever there is a crisis we must rally around our leaders without question or hesitation...

I thank GOD Gray Davis is Governor during this crisis.

[revree]

27. DAVIS WANTED MORE MONEY FOR FIRE PROTECTION

But of course Repubs shot it down. I recall that from a few years back...And let's not forget how Bush and Co. cut pay to our firefighters...

[Divernan]

28. Feeral emergency relief already stretched very thin.

There's no news coverage of this, but FEMA full time and temporary workers are still in Virginia and North Carolina putting in 7 day a week, 12 hour days from the last hurricane (for nearly two months now). If Ahnold manages to understand the concept of "presidential declaration of disaster/emergency area" and gets Bush to declare it, it will place unprecedented strain/demand on FEMA.

I have a nephew in San Diego and cousins in Jamul. Stay safe, all you California DUers, and please check on any elerly people living alone.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

29. Arnold isn't the governor yet..the REAL governor has acted

to free all available resources...the national guard of course is busy.

[revree]

30. Just heard on police scanner - Evacuating parts of ESCONDIDO

We are next. Being asked to conserve electricity now, too. Oh well, gotta start packing.

[RevolutionStartsNow]

31. Good luck...stay safe...

From Northern California, our thoughts are with you!

[DeposeTheBoyKing]

32. Take care and be safe

Keeping you all in our thoughts...

[flamingyouth]

40. Take care, revree

You're in my thoughts. Try to keep us posted when you get a chance.

:hug:

[Lurking Dem]

90. Can someone give me specifics

on the situation in Escondido? I am caring for a friend who recently lost her husband and it looks like now she'll also lose their home. She's severely depressed and my concern is grave.

What parts of Escondido are threatened? She lives near The Meadows.

24 hour news is useless. We need info on airport closings/delays, road closings, and evacuation site lists. If you don't live in CA you are getting nothing but pictures of flames - no usefull info at all.

She doesn't know if she can get home or if she has a home to get to. If she manages to land at Sand Diego can she even drive to Escondido?

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

[Lurking Dem]

93. Anyone?

Please? Situation desperate.

[Gingersnap]

34. satellite link of fires in SoCal

I'm in LA and can smell and see smoke--I put laundry outside to dry that now has ashes on it.

I ran across the following dramatic portrayal of the fires, from satellite.

http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/satellite/animation.san.1km.vis.html

Stay safe everyone.

[peterh]

132. NASA pics…impressive…

But of little consequence for those most effected….

<http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Newsroom/NewImages/images.php3>

[Timefortruth]

35. Anyone have any news about Poway?

Twin Peaks and Espola? The road closings don't make it look good, how bad is it?

[nini]

53. My brother is in Poway

with a small canyon behind his house.. He said the flames to the east are huge but as long as the wind keeps going to the south his area is ok... He's just NW of the high school - about a mile or so.

[Timefortruth]

55. That is good news!

I have a friend there, but I'm not sure of his location in relation to the HS. At least he hasn't lost his home.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

37. Stay safe down there...

my southern compadres! Asthmatics, seniors, and others with breathing difficulties be EXTRA careful, even if you are not in the immediate are, the air can be trouble for you.

[elfin]

39. Now Arnie has an excuse for why HE can't balance the budget

... will blame it on fire costs - his very own 9/11.

[shanti]

47. wow

exactly what i was thinking...

[cally]

41. I just heard that it will be 3 days!! until the winds shift

Hey those in Oregon and Washington, please turn all your fans southward. We need the cool air down here fast.

[Cassandra]

42. My parents are in La Jolla

I don't know how they can expect to sleep tonight; I would be too freaked out. Weird timing; they are preparing to move next week to LA.

[L.A.dweller]

44. Coming to Pasadena from San Fernando valley

and I have entered a giant dirt bubble. The air quality is horrible here and I will avoid going outside as much as possible. I feel sorry for the grocery picketers.
The fire in Simi Valley is out of control and has 0% containment.

[onager]

48. From the West San Fernando Valley...

...we can see Simi Valley burning. Went outside a little while ago and you can taste smoke and ashes in the air. Huge ugly black fire clouds cover the whole sky to the west.

I've lived in Southern California for many years, and I cannot remember another October when it was so brutally hot so late in the year. Ever!

[L.A.dweller]

50. The weather is extremely awkward for this late in the year.

And people deny that global warming is occuring while Europe's heatwave killed 15,000 + this year.
Hope new fires don't prop up in the SF valley. Take care.

[maggrwaggr]

61. It's always hot in October, i.e. "Shake N Bake" "Shocktober"

The hot weather is normal, the fires are not. It's the winds. Just nuts, out of control.

Hell, we always have a couple of fires in the fall and early winter.

But this is a doozy. I haven't seen anything like this since the Santa Barbara fires ten or more years ago.

[L.A.dweller]

65. I know that the Santa Anna's are normal for this time of year

and fires may get out of hand because of them. But S.A.'s are usually accompanied by cooler weather. There has been triple digit weather the past week and a half. I can't recall it being so hot this late in the year but then again it may have been before.

[RevolutionStartsNow]

71. We are HOT up here too

In the Santa Cruz/Monterey Bay area. In the 90s inland the past few days, and 80s by the coast. Unbelievably warm for this time of year, but no wind (we don't get Santa Anas up here), still there is plenty of fire danger. The big Oakland Hills fire was in October (1991) I believe.

Without fires or high winds, we call this weather "gorgeous." I was out by the cliffs this morning, watching a surfing competition, and I was thinking it was one of the most beautiful sights I'd ever seen, the waves breaking on the cliffs, the color of the ocean and the dolphins out beyond the surfers, just unbelievably gorgeous.

This is why we pay so much to live here, despite the fire danger.

[PlanetBev]

57. No doubt about it, onager

I have never experienced a more miserable October. Normally, October is my favorite month, but not this time.

[i have issues]

49. This is so fucked up.

although I live in L.A. proper, and it seems safe as of 4P.M.... Right behind our house is a huge park, (Elysian park, home of Dodger stadium) It's full of dead brush, and eucalyptus trees that burn instantly. Families picnic in the park, with BBQs. I've seen people walking the trails SMOKING!
Problem is, my wife and I are leaving tomorrow to close escrow on a new house in the Central Coast... Our house in Echo Park is for sale now, and I have these images in my head of the park burning while we're gone...Every penny we have is tied up in this house, I'm really, really woried....

[RevolutionStartsNow]

51. Hang in there...

where are you moving to on the Central Coast?

[i have issues]

52. Mid December, barring any disasters...

:scared:

[RevolutionStartsNow]

68. Actually, I was wondering where?

I live on the Central Coast (sometimes called "Northern California" because we are close enough to SF) -- near Santa Cruz. Just curious where you are moving to.

[General Discontent]

86. I'm checking in from Santa Cruz

Born and bred in SoCal, grew up in "The OC." I watched the Cold Water Classic today from the bike path on west cliff, in 90 degree weather. I'm a POOR college student who pays my bills by tutoring math students. I'm one of many who live in SC and struggle for food and rent every month. And my heart goes out to my many friends and family all over SoCal. God Bless you all......



D Wolfman

[i have issues]

98. Oops, Idon't know how I read where,

as "when", A small town called Cayucos, close to Morro Bay. :)

[RevolutionStartsNow]

99. I know where that is...

beautiful...

Morro Bay is one of the world's more beautiful places, too. Good luck!

[meti57b]

54. in the South Pasadena area about 10 miles NE of downtown Los Angeles

somehow the air overhead seemed clear this morning ....as the streams of smoke curved around us and moved to the south then west, but now the sky above is dark and heavy with smoke. My best wishes and positive thoughts to the folks in the fire areas.

[PlanetBev]

56. Thousand Oaks weighing in...

Downwind from Simi Valley. Have to keep windows closed because of smoke, my car is covered with ash. My eyes are killing me, burning like hell. This is a bad one, folks.

It's been as dry as a bone out here for months. I knew we wern't going to escape this forever.

[catzies]

58. I'm up the road from you *cough* *cough*

Camarillo, choking on ashes since yesterday.

[GinaMaria]

59. OMG! this is horrible

Please get to safety. Report back when you can.

Peace

[gauguin57]

60. a freeper weighs in ...

Here's an outrageous post from the Freepside ...

"The more paganism is worshipped in the US, the more arson will be observed in the timeframe of Halloween. The breadth of isolated hot spots covered by the Santana winds makes me suspicious of this one."
posted on 10/26/2003 6:24 AM PST by Cvengr

Oy vey.

Now who could have started those fires. Whoooo could it be ... Could it be ... SANTA ANA?

[DS1]

62. well, in my books

That is equally nutty as our own Astro forum, and equally baseless. just with a different slant.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

79. Two white men in a dodge or chevy van, approximately 20 years old

suspected in the Old Waterman fire.

A HUNTER who got lost started a fire near Julian and that became the armageddon called San Diego....my friend got mad at me because I said an ass who went to go kill a poor defenseless animal started a fire in near triple digit weather to SAVE HIS OWN ASS and burned the fucking city down. 13 people dead in the San Diego fire so far.

(he got mad because I said THAT was the mindset that elected George Bush)

[htuttle]

91. Pagans don't destroy forests

Capitalists do. Look for someone wearing a tuxedo, a shiny tophat and an ivory handled cane.

BTW, Most new sources are acknowledging that it was probably arson in at least some of the fires.

But blaming it on 'pagans'? That's pathetic.

[belab13]

63. three separate fires - on the same day, coincidence?

I live in east SD county in the mountains and have been in San Diego for 30 + years. This is the biggest disaster I've experienced. My power keeps going on off. (i'm posting via my trustee I-book) Cell phones function intermittently. Lots of people west of us have lost their homes. My community without a single stop light is overrun with evacuees from Alpine. The winds are gusting at 20-40 mph. The mountains running from Palomar south to Julian through Cuyumaca and the Lagunas are a big tinderbox. many dead pine trees and oaks due to drought bark beetle and that insipid fungus. This is not over. Everyone be safe.

[MnFats]

74. Well, Belab...welcome to DU...

....are you safe?
.....do you have a route out of there if necessary?
this minnesotan sends consolation and wishes you well.....whew. I could not take it....i'll stick with the blizzards, subzero temps and the occasional tornado...

[villager]

66. the smoke really is astonishing...

...I've never seen the San Fernando Valley so hazy from fires elsewhere in the region... even during the Malibu firestorm of a few years ago...

[MnFats]

67. my cousin owns Rocky's Crown Pub in S.D....

...not sure if it's close to the fires.
Can anyone advise?
THNX....can't get through

[JasonBerry]

76. Rocky's should be fine

It's near Mission Beach - near the resort hotels off the Pacific. The fires are pretty much in east San Diego county - higher land with a lot of dry grass, trees, etc. Beach areas aren't threatened in SD county.

[JasonBerry]

69. Ranchos Penasquitos??

Any news on fires around Ranchos Penasquitos?

[aquart]

70. San Diego, Rancho Penasquitos

[RevolutionStartsNow]

72. Scary!

I have spent some time there, on a business trip (client in Poway). Beautiful area, clearly in fire danger zone.

[aquart]

73. More San Diego, Ranco Penaquitos

[JasonBerry]

75. Wow!!

I worked in RP and lived just west off of I-15. Be safe! God, it's terrible.

[aquart]

77. Those are the shots my BIL just sent me.

They're sleeping in shifts so they don't miss an evac alert if it comes.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

81. Indredible pics

I was up at the top of a hill in Malibu this afternoon...we were several thousand feet up on a point and could see the flames from Simi...the GLOW from Ventura and the plumes from inland.

No camera (and the friend I was with is a PRO photographer..I SMACKED him for that)

[fizzana]

78. We're in Sherman Oaks

Not much here except for a hazy sky. I was up on Mulholland Drive earlier going to someone for dinner and we could see the smoke and fire in the distance from the Simi Vallye fires.

The hills above us have a lot of vegetation with houses everywhere so it could be diasterous in a fire.

[JasonBerry]

80. CNN says that Reagan Library is threatened

Know anything about that?

[aquart]

82. A silver lining?

[MnFats]

83. Aw, that would be just AWWWWFULLLL!

if the reagan library went up, huh? praying hard now...

[Cooley Hurd]

129. How many of the Iran Contra papers are stored there?

If the library goes up, wouldn't it be convenient for the papers (that Shrub signed back into hiding) to be lost?

:tinfoilhat:

[Tansy_Gold]

133. I thought the same thing

How convenient, if not for Unca Ronnie then for Daddy and Dim Son.

Ought to be interesting to see how much effort is expended protecting this depository of shame. Will they let it go, or put up a token defense?


Hmmmmmmmmmmmm..............


Tansy Gold, the EVER suspicious when it comes to the bushnazis.

[gauguin57]

84. i heard library mentioned

on the evening news tonight -- said officials were "concerned" about it.

Drudge is now bringing up a July USA Today article that reported an alleged al-Qaeda member in custody said terrorists were planning to start wildfires in the Western states.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2003-07-11-alqaeda-fire_x.htm

"PHOENIX (AP) — The FBI alerted law enforcement agencies last month (June) that an al-Qaeda terrorist now in detention had talked of masterminding a plot to set a series of devastating forest fires around the western United States."

Oh, are we gonna all get freaked out again? Code orange?

[spinbaby]

87. That is a point

If I were a terrorist in California, I'd definitely be paying attention.

[nolabels]

104. They shiped out both coloring books as a result

The wax in the crayons doesn’t hold up too well in the heat.

I'm still sitting in the middle of most of this shit, waiting for the hero/actor/governor elect to come save the day for us, should I hold my breath while I'm waiting.

Now that the bean counters have rode heard and made government agencies that operate essential services (police and fire) to the bone, should we privatize it like the rest.

It’s not said and they don't want others to know it, but this is politics in action. I have lived out here all my life and this has never happened like this before. I could draw a straight line that leads directly to this and what has happened here, from cuts in forestry service, to ignorant uneducated hunters, angry and alienated individuals. Rampant building with building codes relaxed or not enforced, could list many other things.

Mostly I would say it's about thinking government should work for rich people and screw the community. It will go on, just like when after the riots where over a decade ago. The days of being an individual that can do as they please is not that great an Ideal. As Jim Hightower says this will not lead to democracy but rather just a "Cock fight"

The most frightening thing other than the fire here, for me, is getting to understand the mentality of Arsonist, many who are life long losers who feel this urge to make their life important and do things that are un-comprehendible to normal people.

[aquart]

85. NBC is saying 13 dead now.

<http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/>

[Piperay]

88. It was literally a hellish day here in CA

even along the coast where I live. The sun looked like an orange ball of fire and the sky was so dark even in mid afternoon, fine ash was all over the place and in piles on the ground, ash has made everything filthy. The air was foul with the stench of burning, it hurt to breath when you're outside, the market employees on strike had to wear face masks to breath. I hope that the weather cools down soon before things get worse. :-(

[aquart]

96. Well, my sister is still in her home.

But many friends have been evacuated from their towns and at least one has lost his home, his new home.

She says many of the lost houses have "shake" roofs which are made of cedar. Very pretty and picturesque but highly flammable. Yet some communities INSIST on those roofs and even after a lot of talk about them after the last fires, they haven't been outlawed.

Her community was planning on having a yard sale this weekend. Now, she says it will all be donated because people have lost everything.

[slackmaster]

101. Looks like the planet Vulcan

In the old Star Trek where Mr. Spock went to Vulcan to get married.

The sun is so dim from smoke you can look right at it (briefly) and see sun spots.

[Polemonium]

92. Link and map for perspective

story 850+ homes this was a few hours ago

http://www.pe.com/sharedcontent/southwest/pecom/fireseason/vt_stories/PE_NEWS_n27afire.a0f77.html

map

[salin]

94. Today's paper said Arnie was in Las Vegas

celebrating the win of some body builder event (mr universe?).

So the Governor is in action - trying to get assistance, declaring emergency and trying to get DC (Bush) assistance (via FEMA).

The Governor elect is doing publicity for body building in Nevada.

I would guess that Arnie had already made the commitment to the event and was financially obligated (wonder how much dough he got for it). So the question is... how many things has he already committed to (before he knew he would be governor) that will take him away so he isn't available if/when an emergency hits? The comparison betweeen Davis and Arnie and how they spent the weekend, I hope, is not lost on California voters.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

100. Hey Arnie, let's talk about that CAR TAX now....remember it pays local

communities for services such as fire fighters.

[E_Zapata]

128. Mayer-elect Bloomberg was VERY helpful on 9/11 and the days following

before he took office.

There is no excuse for Arnie to be playing in the lights of Vegas.

But, like Bush, I imagine that Arnie will be conveniently 'out of town' whenever anything goes down.

Arnie needed a platform to work from other than the energy lawsuit he will derail and a host of other really bad policies that he wants to implement for Orrin, who will be handing him the presidency of the united states of merika.

[Tansy_Gold]

137. Bloomberg wasn't "mayor elect" on 9/11/01

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/DailyNews/WTC_giuliani010925.html

the primary election was, IIRC, scheduled for 9/11 and was postponed. Bloomberg won the GOP primary on 9/25, then the election in November.

Citizen/Candidate Bloomberg may have been helpful, but he wasn't mayor-elect. So maybe Bloomberg still had to make a good impression on voters. R-nuld doesn't have to do jack squat, and isn't.

[July]

95. Know anything about Cypress, Murrieta/Temecula?

I've got family in both places. Where can I get some real information?

[SoCalDem]

113. Temecula Valley High School is an evac center

try google.. They had lots of local stories yesterday..

just hit their news bar and then type ..fire temecula.. that should bring up lots of articles and some tv videos too ..

hope your family is safe :hug:

[northzax]

97. don't worry

Ahnold will call in the national guard to help out.

[hippiegranny]

102. any word on freeway closings?

my oldest daughter is on coronado island visiting my younger daughter who lives there. she is frantic to get home (phoenix), but i think she (and her 2 toddlers) should sit tight because i heard alot of the roads are already closed and the ones that are open are gridlocked. does anyone have a road report?

[TrogL]

103. CBC said embers blowing across highways

spreading the fire

[catzies]

105. Try this from SoCalDem in the GD forum...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=594718

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

106. The 8 still has portions closed and that is how she would get to Phoenix

from SD.

[hippiegranny]

107. thanks, you guys

i knew the 8 was closed in places, especially around the viejas casino and outlet area. i think she was hoping to go north for a while to hook up with 10. i still think she is best off staying put right there on the island.

[aquart]

109. People are being asked to stay put.

Employers were told to give everyone a day off. Schools are closed. Nobody should be on the road unless it's absolutely essential.

[David__77]

108. Taxes?

Interestingly, Schwarzenegger left "natural disasters" as his only pretext for raising taxes. Maybe that'll be his excuse.

[aquart]

111. I'd laugh for a week.

If there's anything California is known for, is its vast array of natural disasters: fire, earthquake, mudslide, drought, heat, insects......

It's a daily ten plagues.

[VermontDem2004]

110. Truly scary

I mean look at this pic. I could NEVER imagine seeing something like this from my street corner.

[aquart]

112. Or this:

[soleft]

115. that seriously looks like the end of the world

and I live a mile from the wtc, I thought that was bad

[VermontDem2004]

114. I thought Ahnold was the governor

Davis is the one I see giving press conferences and creating a state of emergency, I ask now what has Arnold done in the last 48 hours?

[hippiegranny]

116. i think he takes office in january

ahnold the neck is probably glad he isn't the one to deal with this mess. i heard he is in vegas for some bodybuilder thing. figures.

[VermontDem2004]

118. ok I understand

He shows leadership qualities when he is running but once elected he doesn't have to worry about being a leader. I bet the way Gray Davis is handling the situation makes people wish he was still the Governor.

[gardenista]

130. Rnold is doing it the Shrub way

When faced with a disaster, hide.

Then, when the smoke clears, get tough.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

119. He is scheduled to take office November 17

[amazona]

117. arnold too busy at mr. olympia event

Ah-nold will leave the trouble and worry of dealing with actual issues to Gray. We wouldn't expect him to put HIS heart and lungs at risk by visiting this area, would we?

People are being told, don't go outside without a mask. Don't exercise or allow children to play. The hotel where I'm staying, despite keeping windows closed, etc. stinks heavily of smoke on all floors I've visited. A miserable experience. There is a huge black/gray/sometimes even orange cloud over San Diego.

I don't think I'll choose to vacation in sunny California again. The San Diego website neglected to mention that one needs to wear a damn mask to visit the area! I get the impression that the county and perhaps the entire state does not have anywhere near the manpower or the equipment to fight something of this magnitude.

A news report about an hour ago on CNN said that they were seeking "two white men" in a "white vehicle" in connection with one of the fires. Doesn't sound like they have much of a lead.

They are trying to blame the huge Ramona fire on a hunter. No idea of the truth of this story as fires were also started simultaneously or near simultaneously elsewhere, such as the fire in the Otay Lakes near Chula Vista which apparently hasn't impacted any buildings but which has interfered with the power supply.

Some TV reporters say that the huge fires will eventually link up. I don't understand how they can allow things to get this out of control. If the fires link, this would literally be a circle of fire around the city of San Diego, causing untold property damage, loss of life, and no doubt future heart and respiratory trouble that will follow many people for many years.

I feel sorry for people who actually live here. This state is indeed a disaster area. I hope everyone on the board stays safe. We just rebuilt our home after tropical storm bill, and it is NO fun re-building, but stuff happens I guess. My heart goes out to everyone affected.

[Nottingham]

120. Found this interesting article in the Archives?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2003-07-11-alqaeda-fire_x.htm


FBI: al-Qaeda detainee spoke of fire plot
PHOENIX (AP) — The FBI alerted law enforcement agencies last month that an al-Qaeda terrorist now in detention had talked of masterminding a plot to set a series of devastating forest fires around the western United States.
Rose Davis, a spokeswoman for the National Interagency Fire Center in Boise, told The Associated Press that officials there took note of the warning but didn't see a need to act further on it.

The contents of the June 25 memo from the FBI's Denver office were reported Friday by The Arizona Republic. Davis declined to share a copy of the memo and an FBI spokeswoman in Denver didn't immediately return a telephone call.

The Republic reported that the detainee, who was not identified, said the plan involved three or four people setting wildfires using timed devices in Colorado, Montana, Utah and Wyoming that would detonate in forests and grasslands after the operatives had left the country.

more....

Does the FBI just NEGLECT EVERYTHING :bounce:

[Timefortruth]

121. No, not everything.

There are no stone breasts showing in the lobby anymore.

[hunter]

124. "The bleeding always stops"

One way, or another... that's an old saying in medicine.

My brother's family lives on the very edge of the suburbs, next to a eucalyptus forest, a few miles from one of the big fires. Work is closed, school is closed, and he and his wife and their daughter have packed up their car, rounded up their pets, and they are ready to leave.

I hope this bleeding stops sooner, rather than later.

[nolabels]

131. The eucalyptus trees are a known fire hazard, drought tolerant and.......

often grow well in floods and standing water.

These trees have very combustible foliage and shed bark and branches, fall over and have other enhancements that breed fire production. The bigger trees with varying degree depending on species survive the fires to reproduce in barren but fertile soil. They do it naturally just like the Sequoias and big coastal Redwoods. Many other trees do this also but some trees like these seem to do it as a means of survival.

Also here in So Cal the Eucs are under assault from the Australian bug from the place they both came from, this also makes them create even more fire material. These trees are easy to grow or raise but their fire hazard is not often advertised to home owners or landscapers.


http://www.ecotopia.com/webpress/co2/fire.htm

CornerHouse Briefing 18
February 2000

Fire Planet -- The Politics and Culture of Combustion
Fire and Life: A Necessary Symbiosis
(snip)
Fire and life form a symbiosis.

In breaking down the matter that organisms have assembled from captured sunlight, fire releases stored chemical energy and delivers organic and inorganic chemicals into an ecosystem. In temperate zones, where growth rates generally exceed rates of decomposition, fire is especially essential to liberate nutrients otherwise locked up in a reservoir of biologically inert litter. Fire maintains a biochemical equilibrium rather as lightning does an electromagnetic equilibrium. Much as lightning releases stored electrical energy leaked to the atmosphere, so wildland fire releases stored chemical energy gradually accumulated in the earth's vegetative cover. Only in extreme cases or in certain fire regimes does fire destroy standing forest or the soil.

However shifting and unstable in its extent and characteristics, fire has shaped and regulated biotas for hundreds of millions of years. Threads and lenses of fossil charcoal are found in all kinds of coal and in all geologic eras, reflecting fire's ancient role in maintaining the carbon-laden vegetative landscapes out of which the coal was formed. The close interdependence between fire and life is no less evident today. Some organisms have adapted defensively to protect against fire's energy, developing thick bark, storing food in tuberous roots, or resprouting soon after a fire passes. Others have adapted to seize the nutrients and opportunities that fire releases. Sequoia seeds, for example, seem to germinate best in a sunny, ashy soil, while many grasses sprout phoenixlike into luxuriant growth from the ashes of their dead stems. Legumes occupy burned sites readily, enjoying a temporary advantage because of the volatilization of organic nitrogen by a hot fire. Ash discharged into the air, meanwhile, can often retard aerial-borne parasites. This whole process, moreover, is self-reinforcing: the type of growth that occurs on a burn helps to determine the frequency and intensity of subsequent fires, as well as their biological effects.

Human Institutions and Fire Ecology

Fire regimes have long been influenced by the activities of humans. Like many other organisms, humans promote burning as a means of eliminating competitors and favour environments, particularly grasslands, for which fire is as basic as sunlight or water.
Humans are unique, however, in that they can control the source and timing of ignition. From the time of Homo erectus, they have competed with lightning over the biomass that serves as fuels. What one burns the other cannot.

Humans are the greatest modifier of the fire environment, particularly its fuels, tinkering constantly with the timing, frequency, size, intensity and seasonality of fire regimes. They have inserted fire into every conceivable place for every conceivable purpose for so long and so pervasively that it is impossible to disentangle fire from either human life or the biosphere. In Australia, for instance, aboriginal burning beginning at least 38,000 years ago ensured not only the pervasiveness of the fire which has shaped the continent's tough and unique biota, but also its permanence. Even the fabled botanical biodiversity of southern Para in Brazil, recent studies have suggested, is perhaps 40 per cent attributable to anthropogenic disturbance, an impact not possible without fire.<1>

(snip)

Fire is sometimes part of the ecology, but the hand of man seems to be messing things up a little

[Palacsinta]

125. Heard from my niece in SD

She was in tears. They are confined indoors....not that they can go outdoors, anyway. She has asthma and terrible allergies and she is suffering from the smoke and ashes. They are supposed to conserve water, too, or not use any so that the water pressure is at max. Her friend's apartment is about two blocks from a beach, but my niece doesn't know in what district, but she takes comfort that she can jump in the ocean if the fire comes........obviously, she is very scared! She has no idea when she can leave. Her flight out to Philly, PA is scheduled for tomorrow evening.

[meti57b]

126. Question to San Diego ...what is happening there? Is anything improving?

I can't find any news up here (LA area) about current status in San Diego. If any one has information about the fire in the area of Poway, please post. Thank you very much.

[amazona]

134. 5 PM update from San Diego -- little progress

The large fires such as Cedar Fire are not contained. Otay Lakes is 17 percent contained. There is no expectation that the fires will be contained for days, say the TV. Ah-nold is supposed to be dragging his good happy ass back into California to meet up with Gray Davis about the fire and the transition but sounds like he will then be fleeing to D.C. to "lobby" with Whistleass -- something he could do just as well over the phone but in this way he can prevent being exposed to the horrible smoke plume that the rest of us are being exposed to.

Gray Davis has shown real leadership and visited Scripps Ranch, a large area with 150 homes, about an hour ago.

The Democrats are expected to get out in the foul smoke and fight, while the GOP runs tail and hides...business as usual.

Winds are changing, and near the ocean (as you believe your niece to be) should actually have safe air to breathe by tonight or tomorrow morning.

I've always enjoyed Ah-nold's films for what they are but I feel he has shown himself to be a bit of a physical coward in this manner. He could have had a legacy of being a fun person who brought laughter to the world, instead, he will leave a legacy of being a GOP tool. OK, enough of my ranting.

[meti57b]

135. thank you very much for the update....

I'm deeply sorry to hear that things have not improved. I'm not the person who has a niece there but I am sure that person will see your post and read it. Thank you very much again.

[Palacsinta]

136. Thank you, Amazona

I'm the one with the niece in SD. I haven't heard from her and her mom can't get through to her. Took her hours this afternoon to reach her. She'll keep trying, and in the meantime, I will rely your message about cleaner air.....I think that will make her feel a little better about her daughter. Thanks again!!!

[okieinpain]

127. well now that's what they get for supporting arnold.

hey don't yell at me, you know the freepers would be saying the same thing if gray was still in office. by the way what's the official count now. just curious to see what was in those absentee ballots.

[jsw_81]

138. Maybe God exists after all

...and He's punishing all those GOP-voting, SUV-driving, McMansion-living idiots for supporting Schwarzenegger.

[jiacinto]

139. Please

I don't take pleasure in those peoples' misery. And not everyone there is like that.