Writers issue cartoon row warning

[Mizmoon]

Salman Rushdie is among a dozen writers to have put their names to a statement in a French weekly paper warning against Islamic "totalitarianism".

The writers say the violence sparked by the publication of cartoons satirising the Prophet Muhammad shows the need to fight for secular values and freedom.

...

Almost all of those who have signed the statement have experienced difficulties with Islamic militancy first-hand, says the BBC's Caroline Wyatt in Paris.

They include Dutch MP and filmmaker Ayaan Hirsi Ali and exiled Bangladeshi writer Taslima Nasreen.

"After having overcome fascism, Nazism, and Stalinism, the world now faces a new global threat: Islamism," the manifesto says.

"We, writers, journalists, intellectuals, call for resistance to religious totalitarianism and for the promotion of freedom, equal opportunity and secular values for all."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4763520.stm

[wtbymark]

1. it should also include Christian extremism n/t

[Mizmoon]

2. With the exception of attacking abortion doctors

and the nearly incomprehensible (to me) situation in Ireland, I am hard pressed to think of any major violence that Christians as a group have caused in modern times. They try hard to make their values mainstream, but so do we in the secular realm. Am I forgetting some mayhem they've caused?

And Bush doesn't count. We all know he's the fakest Christian there is.

edited to correct punctuation

[Dhalgren]

7. When a three-star general, in the highest echelon of

Pentagonian power stands up in a Christian church and tells all the Muslims in all the world, "My God is bigger than your god!", I think that you can count Bush and his current crusade. This "war on terror" is a very thinly veiled war on Islam - and most Muslims "get" that... Christians can't site the "two-thousand" year existence of Christianity as a demonstration of its validity (as many Christians do) and out of the other side of their mouths say that the atrocities committed by Christians over that "two-thousand" year history don't count. Christianity is just as bloody a religion as is Islam - it's just in a relatively quiet period right now...

[Mizmoon]

10. Well, we live right now

not during the Crusades.

I don't think a general who talks out of his butt compares.

[Scurrilous]

12. George Bush:

"This crusade, this war on terrorism, is going to take awhile."

We live right now, during a crusade.

[Mizmoon]

18. *sigh* Bush is a moron who doesn't know what that means

and as far I know this isn't about Jerusalem.

For Bush it's about oil and money and whatever else it is that evil fucks think about.

For us it's about ... lordy, so much more. So much it makes me tired to even think about typing it. I want to say things about freedom for women, and freedom of religion (including the right not to practice one), and freedom from poverty for the downtrodden.

I'm going to go off on a tangent. You know what the most disappointing thing about this whole sitatation is for me? The abandonment of Afghanistan. I supported that invasion - yes I did. I admit it. It was because I had dreams of showing the ME what freedom and democracy could bring - rebuilding them, making them a real nation, a proud nation, a democratic nation even if they wanted their mullahs to run things. For me it's a total heartbreaker and I feel like a fool for ever having believed that our government would do the right thing there.

[unschooler]

8. Serbia, Rwanda, Germany, Italy, Hungary, Poland...

Lots of Christians have engaged in genocide during the past century, and their churches were, for the most part, pretty silent about it.

[Mizmoon]

11. Silence is a sin, but not an aggressive act

And as I recall Pope John Paul was pretty vocal about the violence that has gone on in the world.

As far as engaging in genocide, I am hard pressed to blame Christians alone for committing acts like certain Islamists are perpetrating on in Darfur, for example.

Rowanda was tribal, not religious.

What are you talking about with regard to Germany and Poland? World War II? Was that a religious war? As I recall that was mostly about race and power. Jews were killed for the same reason they have always been killed - they are easy scapegoats.

Serbia is the one I know least about. If there is an aspect to that that can be blamed on Christianity I'd appreciate if you'd enlighten me.

[seriousstan]

3. Yes, I remember the Monty Python "Life of Brian" riots well.....

I believe many shrubberies were destroyed in that riot.

[genie_weenie]

4. Don't forget all those MIGHTY TREES cut down

with......




A Herring!

[Mizmoon]

5. Now I'm going to have to post a quote

Brian: I'm not the Messiah! Will you please listen? I am not the Messiah, do you understand? Honestly!
Girl: Only the true Messiah denies His divinity.
Brian: What? Well, what sort of chance does that give me? All right! I am the Messiah!
Followers: He is! He is the Messiah!
Brian: Now, fuck off!
(silence)
Arthur: How shall we fuck off, O Lord?

[genie_weenie]

9. Follow the Gourd!!!!

:beer:

[unschooler]

6. It does. It's about a struggle between "democrats and theocrats."

"It is not a clash of civilizations nor an antagonism of West and East that we are witnessing, but a global struggle that confronts democrats and theocrats."

[funflower]

13. Here is the full text of the statement (from Jyllands-Posten)

After having overcome fascism, Nazism, and Stalinism, the world now faces a new totalitarian global threat: Islamism.
We, writers, journalists, intellectuals, call for resistance to religious totalitarianism and for the promotion of freedom, equal opportunity and secular values for all.

The recent events, which occurred after the publication of drawings of Muhammed in European newspapers, have revealed the necessity of the struggle for these universal values. This struggle will not be won by arms, but in the ideological field. It is not a clash of civilisations nor an antagonism of West and East that we are witnessing, but a global struggle that confronts democrats and theocrats.

Like all totalitarianisms, Islamism is nurtured by fears and frustrations. The hate preachers bet on these feelings in order to form battalions destined to impose a liberticidal and unegalitarian world. But we clearly and firmly state: nothing, not even despair, justifies the choice of obscurantism, totalitarianism and hatred. Islamism is a reactionary ideology which kills equality, freedom and secularism wherever it is present. Its success can only lead to a world of domination: man's domination of woman, the Islamists' domination of all the others. To counter this, we must assure universal rights to oppressed or discriminated people.

We reject « cultural relativism », which consists in accepting that men and women of Muslim culture should be deprived of the right to equality, freedom and secular values in the name of respect for cultures and traditions. We refuse to renounce our critical spirit out of fear of being accused of "Islamophobia", an unfortunate concept which confuses criticism of Islam as a religion with stigmatisation of its believers.

We plead for the universality of freedom of expression, so that a critical spirit may be exercised on all continents, against all abuses and all dogmas.

We appeal to democrats and free spirits of all countries that our century should be one of Enlightenment, not of obscurantism.

12 signatures

Ayaan Hirsi Ali
Chahla Chafiq
Caroline Fourest
Bernard-Henri Lévy
Irshad Manji
Mehdi Mozaffari
Maryam Namazie
Taslima Nasreen
Salman Rushdie
Antoine Sfeir
Philippe Val
Ibn Warraq

http://www.jp.dk/indland/artikel:aid=3585740/

[DemExpat]

14. I applaud this and agree with the essence....

We plead for the universality of freedom of expression, so that a critical spirit may be exercised on all continents, against all abuses and all dogmas.

We need to see more such response from writers and intellectuals to do something with this situation, and not let it go underground until a next outburst. IMHO.

DemEx

[funflower]

15. We should think about whether the current anti-intellectual, anti-critical

climate in the U.S. dampens our "critical spirit" here as well.

[DemExpat]

16. Absolutely......I see the same oppressive tendencies

via religious conservatism and right wing dogma working in the US.

DemEx

[Mizmoon]

17. I agree with that too eom

[Colorado Blue]

19. I think that's a good point.

In fact, I think we've had an anti-intellectual bias in the US for a long time now. But it seems to have surfaced in a big way since 2000.