Democrats Beat Quick Retreat on Call to Censure President

[Pryderi]

March 14, 2006
Democrats Beat Quick Retreat on Call to Censure President
By CARL HULSE

WASHINGTON, March 13 — Senate Democrats on Monday blocked an immediate vote on a call by one of their own to censure President Bush for his eavesdropping program.

They acted after Republicans said they were eager to pass judgment on a proposal that they portrayed as baseless and disruptive to the antiterror effort.

Minutes before Senator Russell D. Feingold, Democrat of Wisconsin, formally introduced his resolution reprimanding Mr. Bush, Senator Bill Frist of Tennessee, the majority leader, said Republicans were ready to vote by day's end or Tuesday.

"When we're talking about censure of the president of the United States at a time of war, when this president is out defending the American people with a very good, lawful, constitutional program, it is serious business," Mr. Frist said. "If they want to make an issue out of it, we're willing to do just that."

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/14/politics/14censure.html?_r=1&pagewanted=print&oref=slogin

[Craig3410]

1. Democrats: We're all spineless wimps and PROUD OF IT! -nt-

[Pam-Moby]

4. IMO this will give other Senators a chance

to review Russ's resolution and possibly sign on to it. Plus Frist is a ass wipe btw.

[saigon68]

59. DINO COWARDS IN RETREAT

STAMPEDING OVER EACH OTHER IS KISS THE ASS OF THE CHIMPANZEE

[KittyWampus]

55. It's a misleading title, if you go past it and actually read the quotes

[yurbud]

2. It's kind of sad when you cower before a milktoast like Frist

[Emillereid]

3. I was going to comment about these spineless creatures -- but I'm

too angry!

[info being]

101. No, you're just too spineless :)

[lovuian]

5. I love how at this time of war Bush was giving our Ports to Dubai

its so funny to see Republicans draw the war sword when they want... This President polls don't lie!!!

Sad to say the Democrats grow more and more passive...

[saigon68]

115. Kick

[Mythsaje]

6. And Frist is a lying sack o' shit...

Constitutional my butt...

[leftstreet]

7. What's our MASSIVE Dry Powder worth on the Arms Market NOW?

This must be the new Dem fund-raising strategy?

[pa28]

28. Good thought.

We've stored up a massive backlog of dry powder. Only later do we discover it has a shelf life of six months.

[SnoopDog]

8. Ah - the Dems want to discuss this first..

The Dems want to debate this - to discuss this illegal crime.

To immediately vote for this is to swiftly end the debate.


NO! we need more discussion on the floor to bring out the criminality of this evil administration.

Get it?

[sandnsea]

29. DING DING DING DING

Good lord I'm glad somebody around here can think. The absolute WORST thing that could happen would be an immediate vote, the whole thing would go right down the toilet.

Absolutely not an iota of critical thinking skills around here some days.

[goclark]

57. I agree sandandsea

Feingold was wonderful!

They tried to put him down but he will rise to the top anyway.

He came out at the right time on the right issue.

Others will have to step up to the plate sooner or later.

[leQ]

75. thanks for that insight.... i got it now and i hope you're correct

it's just that we're already used to the 'spineless' stuff from democrats on the hill

[OzarkDem]

91. So please enlighten us

What exactly have these yellow bellied Dem leaders been doing about Bush's crimes against Americans for the last few months? Nothing, not a thing. Nada, zero, zip, zilch.

Why would you expect them to do something now?

[Coexist]

96. Thank you - yes DEBATE IS A GOOD THING!!

We want the debate. Bring it all out! Air that dirty laundry.

[Swamp Rat]

39. Got it!

;)

SUPPORT RUSS FEINGOLD!!!

[Laelth]

46. What we need, imho ...

... is for several news cycles to focus on the censure resolution so that it can have its desired impact. We want to rip Repukes to shreds in the November elections for failing to protect the Constitutional rights of Americans. We want to force a commitment from Congressional Repukes on this issue. We want to get them on the record as supporting the pResident and supporting the illegal wiretapping so that they can't distance themselves from either of them in November.

Those, I think, are the reasons the Dems. want to sit on this resolution for a while. I hope I am right about this.

-Laelth

[VegasWolf]

78. Don't believe it. I hear no clamoring for a floor debate by the dems.

On the other hand, a parlimentary requirement for a formal censure vote would certainly invoke debate as a prelude to the actual vote. I see dreamy eyes wishing that the dems had more balls, but I see no indication of actual balls.

[OzarkDem]

90. No, its a dodge

They've had months to debate it. All they've done is hide.

[SnoopDog]

94. This is the first time a Senator, on the floor, brought out Censure.

This is the proper time to debate it...

Dems hide? I have no idea what our Dem Senators are doing, but I do know that Feingold is the only one with guts right now...

[lumpy]

112. I got it

The more discussion the better.

[tatertop]

9. They hear that grown-up-voice and shit in their pants

we are so fucked because these common assholes will
not stand up to the bush crime family

[shanti]

10. barbara boxer hasn't even spoken up on this

argggh!!! :argh:

[rodeodance]

50. she and others have to have time to think about it.

[worldgonekrazy]

107. Think about what?

Think about whether Bush broke the law? No, because that is blatantly clear, no matter how muddled the Republicans try to make it look.

Think about whether they ought to do something about Bush breaking the law? I mean, we are talking a fucking censure here. Its purely symbolic and hardly a drastic move. Its not like any of them are holding out for impeachment.

Think about whether this is a smart thing to do politically? Bush's approval rating is at fucking 34%! If this were a Democratic President the Republicans would have ripped off his head and shit down his neck a long time ago!

So what do they need to think about?

[msgadget]

11. Imo, this misrepresents what actually happened,

Frist wanted an immediate vote with no debate today or after the budget. Iow, let him have his say and we'll use our majority to shut him up with no further criticism of the president being heard. Reid helped Feingold on the floor but has not committed to voting with him, nor has Pelosi... THAT'S what makes them spineless, not avoiding an immediate vote. I'd love a debate where senators up for election in '06 go on the record saying it's a peachy thing for the president to spy whenever he wants with no oversight.

[dweller]

16. ding!

more cowbell.

:thumbsup:

dp

[karynnj]

44. The problem is they won't say it that way

They will say that, in a time of war, you sometimes have to "cut through red tape" and do what is necessary. The statistic that Kerry and others have repeated - that the vast majority of requests were approved swiftly (I don't remember the numbers - but it was less than 10 rejected compared to something like 15,000 approved) blows this out of the water. The question is which view will get more media support.

I really wish that Feingold could have stayed and had a debate on the floor with Spector. It could have been very ineresting.

[Bridget Burke]

45. This matter requires considerable debate.

Let every detail of Bush's treacher be reviewed in public. Wonder if we can get some good Democratic speeches out of it? Let's hope for coverage in the media.

[rodeodance]

51. yes, Reid did help Feingold (at the moment)--but now what?

[ncanadianlee]

58. Censure

Pelosi is in the House. She can support Russ but can't vote.

[msgadget]

65. I know, I know but she's a 'leader' and hedged on her support of this

when asked. There may not be enough for impeachment but there is enough for a censure so I don't know why this is such a radioactive issue. Will they be beat up in the coat room or something?

[NoodleyAppendage]

12. MORAL COWARDICE. Plain and simple.

Somewhere the founding fathers are rolling in their graves over the INACTION shown in response to King Chimp BREAKING THE LAW and subverting our Constitution.

Chimp is SO WEAK right now. Democrats have nothing to lose by supporting the censure motion. But, failing to support the censure motion will PISS OFF the grassroots and may negatively affect 2006 mid-term election turnout. So, fucking stupid...

J

[bigluckyfeet]

17. The Whole Damn Bunch

Must be getting Blackmailed,at least that is an excuse.

[gauguin57]

13. Heeere puss puss puss ...

Yoo hoo! Democrats! Bush's approval rating is at 36 percent. Stop worrying what the world thinks of you! Quit d**king around and stand up for our beliefs, for God's sake!

Feet. Of. Clay.

[IndianaGreen]

14. I think of the Vichy French

who surrendered and then collaborated with the Germans.

Feingold is our DeGaulle!

[NoodleyAppendage]

15. That's a good analogy. Would that make some here the French Resistance?

Viva la America!

J

[Critters2]

106. It's "vive"

"Viva" is Spanish. "Vive l'Amerique" is French.

I studied French for 9 years, and never get to use it. Things like this grate on me.

Back to your discussion...

[NoodleyAppendage]

114. Thanks! I appreciate the correction....

Vive l'Amerique!!!

J

[Mojambo]

18. Fucking cowards.

36% approval rating.

How goddamn scary can that 36% be? What the fuck are they afraid of?

[AndyTiedye]

21. 36% + Diebold = They "Win"

[Mojambo]

25. Agreed. But that doesn't really speak to my point

The Democrats know that the polls show extraordinary disfavor for Bush and yet they still are unable to stand up to him.

It's shameful.

[AndyTiedye]

67. Their Ability to "Win" Elections No Matter What the People Think……

…is a major reason the Democrats in Congress cannot stand up to him.
There is also their ability to monitor all of our communications and use them for blackmail.
Biggest of all is their absolute control of the media.

[0rganism]

85. 5% + Diebold = They "Win"

This will always be a threat. How much are our reps going to cower in hopes that they will miraculously be spared from the DRE guillotine?

[Kierkegaard]

92. If we lose either way, why not go down swinging?

Why do they continue to sit on their hands and do nothing? There has to be an explanation for this incredible complacency and I have no clue what it is.

[Bhaisahab]

36. off topic, but man your sig line is so damn relevant n/t

[QuettaKid]

40. What are they afraid of?

They are afraid of finding an envelope with a "mysterious white powder" delivered to their offices. They never caught that anthrax "terrorist" ya know?

[JI7]

19. the REPUBLICANS WANTED the vote NOW

because they have the majority and they could quickly put it behind them.

the Democrats wanted time to actually discuss and debate the issue and what Bush has done.

[regnaD kciN]

20. I agree, for once...

I've been as critical of the congressional Democrats as anyone, but I can see the point here.

This is not unlike the way the Republicans handled the Murtha matter (in the latter case, of course, they also changed the motion to something other than what Murtha proposed, for good measure). In other words, call for a snap decision, unanimously vote against it, and move on to other matters. The end result would be that the whole event of calling for censure would be over and down the memory hole within a few hours.

Better to give it some time.

Although, I'd just as soon avoid a censure motion entirely, since, should it actually pass, it would have no tangible effect, and allow the Republicans to declare "fine...case closed" on virtually every complaint made up to that point against King George. Let's face it: what we really need is not censure, but impeachment -- and that can't happen until after the November elections.

[karynnj]

48. It also has a very risk of being trumpeted as a vindication for

Bush when it is defeated. I really don't understand why Feingold didn't make the same arguments while calling for an independent prosecutor. As Spector said there is still a lot not known. The FISA courts approved the vast majority of requests quickly. Were these not submitted because neither side had Al Qaeda ties - but rather Democratic ties?

I understand Feingold's (and other Senators) frustration, but I'm not sure this will work to our good.

[rodeodance]

24. Frist wanted to see which Dems would vote yes--knowing Dems would

cower. Guess i am glad that Reid stepped in to stop the vote yesterday.

[annabanana]

33. a delay on the vote is a good thing

It gives us a chance to rattle those pots & pans...

[TankLV]

66. I have to agree - no matter how impatient and angry I am & become.

Keeping this in the open is a good chess move.

Voting on it so it can be quickly forgotton, is not a good thing.

And voting on it now, with the repukes and some vichy dems controlling everything, it would get NOWHERE.

This is a smart chess move.

Patience on this one is correct.

[rodeodance]

22. Damm--what a terrible headline (and it is truthful which is the worst part

[rodeodance]

23. "The president may be wrong," "but he has acted in good faith" (specter)

.... Senator Arlen Specter, the Pennsylvania Republican who has expressed reservations about the surveillance, said Mr. Feingold had failed to make a case for censure over what amounts to a dispute over the legal basis of the program.

"The president may be wrong," Mr. Specter said, "but he has acted in good faith."

[tanyev]

47. Torquemada acted in good faith, too.

Doesn't make it right.

[rodeodance]

26. "The American people already made their decision," I hate it when

Cheney thinks he speaks for me!

"The American people already made their decision," Vice President Dick Cheney said Monday in an appearance in Mr. Feingold's home state, The Associated Press reported. "They agree with the president."

Mr. Feingold said he viewed his censure resolution as a reasonable way to hold the president accountable. He said it fell short of the push for impeachment that some critics contend is warranted by Mr. Bush's approval of the surveillance program and his strong defense of it.

"This is certainly more serious than anything President Clinton was accused of doing," said Mr. Feingold, who added that the grass-roots response to his proposal was strong after he announced his intention on Sunday. "It is reminiscent of what President Nixon was not only accused of doing, but was basically removed from office for doing."

[acmavm]

31. The American people have made their decision. That's why bush*=**

is at 36% (I don't believe it's even that high) and Cheney is at 18%.

Evil bastards.

[OneBlueSky]

27. Republicans = Chickenhawks . . . Democrats = Chickenshits . . . n/t

.

[madmark]

30. which ones retreated?

[truthisfreedom]

32. *yawn*

is this an issue? bush has destroyed himself and his party.

i think we have nothing to worry about.

[annabanana]

34. the Times is a sychopathic pile of dung

to put up a headline like that...
You'd think that they would have caught a clue...

And US!? We bow down and accept the lean & spin just like that? What up DU?

[bklyncowgirl]

35. Democrats you must stand with Russ Feingold.

Senators of the Democratic Party, they are frightened. Dick Cheney is slamming one of your colleagues. Deadeye Dick has lower approval ratings than OJ Simpson.

The only thing they have going for them is that they are perceived as strong. You on the other hand are seen as weak kneed, wobbly and afraid to stand up for what you believe. If you are unwilling to stand up to the likes of Dick Cheney and Bill Frist how in the name of God are the American people going to trust you to stand up to Osama Bin Laden and Kim Jung Il?

You're either for illegal wiretaps or you're for them. There's no middle ground. The president either broke the law or he didn't. You either stand with one of your own or you stand with the president. You either believe in the constitution or you don't.

[Joanne98]

37. Dems to the rescue. AGAIN!

[TankLV]

69. I agree, but I believe that this may be a good move.

Instead of letting the repukes defeat this measure quickly, and probably add a note of thanks and praise for this war criminal to add salt to our wounds (I wouldn't put it past them), this one time I believe it is prudent to keep the issue front and center.

But I just can't stand our spinelessness.

The DEMS always give the repukes what they want, every single time, and I am sick of it.

[LynnTheDem]

38. Maybe someday Dems will grow a set.

Nahhh.

[JNelson6563]

41. Spine-gold, leading the way.

I love this guy. :toast:

The rest I'm going to be calling. :grr:

[alcibiades_mystery]

42. Ridiculous NY Times spin

The reason the Dems put off an immediate vote is because they want debate on the resolution. The idea for an immediate vote was Frist's. The people on this thread screaming cowardice are fucking idiots, and aren't paying attention.

[rodeodance]

52. you are right. Yet, the timid "i am not sure' response from Dems is tellin

g.

[Orsino]

62. The evidence of cowardice is overwhelming...

...but I must agree that we need debate, and putting off a vote is exactly what our allegedly fighting Dems should do. For the moment.

They are cowards, almost to a man, as I'm afraid we'll see in any resulting debate and in the ultimate vote. But I'm crossing my fingers.

If we can't even censure for such a breathtaking array of crimes, American democracy is beyond hope.

[wtmusic]

113. More spin:

"Though polls on surveillance are mixed, Republicans say the public generally backs the idea of eavesdropping on people suspected of being in contact with terror suspects."

So

domestic surveillance = surveillance of "people suspected of being in contact with terror suspects".

:silly:

[lonestarnot]

43. So what were the expectations here anyway?

The videodiagnos'n doctor can make a rapid diagnosis of a vote when he knows the outcome of any vote before November. Tweet tweet.

[AndyA]

49. Message to Democrats

SUPPORT CENSURE
OF (P)RESIDENT BUSH

DO SOMETHING
***FOR AMERICA***
FOR A CHANGE!

[savemefromdumbya]

53. Wasn't Frist up to no good with fraud?

[Norquist Nemesis]

54. "a very god, lawful, constitutional program"????

Did this rubberstamp Congress change the Constitution and neglect to tell the American people? Only SCOTUS decides whether something is Constitutional, not Congress. As far as I'm aware, they haven't been asked about "the program".

[Jack Rabbit]

56. Is this the new emblem of the Democratic Party?

Portrait of Marshall Petain from a French website.

[saigon68]

60. no this one is better

Vidkun Abraham Lauritz Jonssøn Quisling (July 18, 1887–October 24, 1945)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vidkun_Quisling




was a Norwegian fascist politician and officer. He held the office of Minister President in occupied Norway from February 1942 to the end of World War II, while the elected social democratic cabinet of Johan Nygaardsvold was exiled in London. After the war he was tried for high treason and subsequently executed by firing squad. His name has become an eponym for traitor, especially a collaborationist.

[Pryderi]

64. Actually, a chicken was the original emblem of the Dems...granted it was

a rooster, but still...

[jsamuel]

61. Article is propaganda against censure

[ripple]

70. I agree

The headline is very misleading.

[VegasWolf]

63. It's time for a radical overhaul of the democratic party. no spine = no

vote for them come reelection!!

[Writer]

68. At the end of the day...

the Republicans will continue to lose their hold on the red-blooded American flag-waving vote.

They lost their chance to paint the Dems pink yet again. Poor things.

[Boo Boo]

71. Don't get spun by the headline

The last thing any of us should want is for there to be an immediate up or down vote without a debate. Republicans want the immediate vote in order to avoid debate, public attention, and any gain in support for censure. Frist would not have called for an immediate vote if he hadn't been dead certain that he had the votes, and lots of 'em. It would have been a totally lopsided embarrassment.

[primavera]

72. The Onion: Democrats Vow Not to Give Up Hopelessness

Democrats Vow Not To Give Up Hopelessness
The Onion - February 27, 2006

WASHINGTON, DC—In a press conference on the steps of the Capitol Monday, Congressional Democrats announced that, despite the scandals plaguing the Republican Party and widespread calls for change in Washington, their party will remain true to its hopeless direction.

"We are entirely capable of bungling this opportunity to regain control of the House and Senate and the trust of the American people," Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) said to scattered applause. "It will take some doing, but we're in this for the long and pointless haul."

"We can lose this," Reid added. "All it takes is a little lack of backbone."

Despite plummeting poll numbers for the G.O.P nationwide and an upcoming election in which all House seats and 33 Senate seats are up for contention, Democrats pledged to maintain their party's sheepish resignation.

<snip>

[saigon68]

82. From the article-- Joementum Losermann

Sen. Joe Lieberman (D-CT) cited the Bush Administration's bungled response to Hurricane Katrina as a model for Democrats.

"Grandmothers drowning in nursing homes, families losing everything, communities torn apart—and the ruling party just sat and watched," Lieberman said. "I'm here to promise that we Democrats will find a way to let you down just like that."

[primavera]

93. It's so funny, but so depressing at the same time n/t

[drm604]

73. This article is totaly misleading.

The Democrats are NOT beating a retreat. :grr: Frist is the one calling for a vote, and he's doing so because he wants to kill the issue before it even sees the light of day. The Democrats are against an immediate vote because they want this to be openly and publicly debated.
The NY Times should be ashamed of themselves for this kind of blatant misrepresentation of the facts. Loot at this paragraph:

Democrats' hesitancy was a sign they remained reluctant to challenge Mr. Bush on some national security questions even as he was struggling in public opinion polls and set back on the transfer of some American port operations to an Arab company. Though polls on surveillance are mixed, Republicans say the public generally backs the idea of eavesdropping on people suspected of being in contact with terror suspects.

It WAS NOT "hesitancy" and it WAS NOT a sign of "reluctance". This is simply (mis-)editorializing. Notice also how they dismiss the polls and then highlight what "Republicans say" as if that is somehow a more reliable source than polls. :grr:

[VegasWolf]

74. Wow!! No wonder the public views the dems as weak on terror!! They

can't even vote to censure one of the most despised men in the history of the US!! Fucking jellyfish. If I had not changed my registration to Independent, I would be cringing to be considered a Democrat.

[drm604]

76. The article is misleading,

most likely on purpose. Frist is trying to kill the issue by bringing it to an immediate vote. The Dems don't want to vote just yet because they want this publicly debated. They DO want to censure him, but they know that they will lose if there is an immediate vote. Read between the lines and don't believe the NY Times' spin.

[VegasWolf]

81. I don't believe it. A parliamentary requirement for a vote for censure

would necessarily require and initiate a floor debate. I see many people wishing the dems had balls, but I certainly see no evidence of balls.

[drm604]

86. That's not what I see.

"I see many people wishing the dems had balls, but I certainly see no evidence of balls."

That's not what I see. What I see is people on here desperately trying to trash the Dems and convince people not to vote for them. I wonder why that is? :eyes:

Did you see this part of the article?

"To try to limit debate on this most important matter that Senator Feingold is going to put before the Senate is not appropriate," said Senator Harry Reid of Nevada, the minority leader.

So it's not wishful thinking. The Democrats are not backing down. Frist apparently is capable of limiting debate and the Democrats are trying to keep him from doing that. They said so themselves.

[VegasWolf]

109. Err, did you forget about Feingold's lack of support from the DINOs

over the Alito filibuster which will undoubtedly lead the overturn of Roe V Wade. Hey, what about the DINOs caving in on the Patriot Act? Lieberman jumping in bed with Bush. No action for censure other than one or two brave Democrats. Harry Reid is my senator, after all these fiascoes, I certainly won't be supporting him in any way.

"What I see is people on here desperately trying to trash the Dems and convince people not to vote for them. I wonder why that is?"

No deep dark mystery here! No conspiracy theories! What you see are a whole bunch of liberals abandoning the DINOs in the democratic party because we feel that the party no longer represents our viewpoints. Now there are a bunch of people like perhaps you who will vote for the stinkiest, slimiest politicians like Lieberman and Zell baby just because they have a (D) after their name. I propose that we have ample proof that this approach fails miserably and that all that comes out of this approach are a bunch of fat cat DINOs who spout "political expediency" for the sake of principle, spout "keep our powder dry!", and on and on; just so these DINOs can keep their cushy jobs. Well, screw them. I won't help them keep their cushy jobs.

[katty]

89. Absolutely-and they wonder WHY??!!!

[stepnw1f]

77. Did The Dems Retreat?

[drm604]

79. NO, THEY DID NOT.

See my other posts.

[stepnw1f]

80. I Know They Didn't

But boy are some here trigger happy to bash the Dems. I'm getting fucking sick of the anti-dem mentality around here.

[drm604]

83. They're falling for the media spin.

It's clever and it's insidious. If people here are falling for it, the general public doesn't have a chance.

[VegasWolf]

84. Well, let's see, caving in on Alito, the Patriot Act, etc. I'll believe

the DINOs have changed their stripes when I see proof, not just words.

[drm604]

87. Nobody is claiming they're perfect

and I certainly have my disagreements with them, especially on Alito and the Patriot Act, but you seem to be actively looking for and pointing out fault, and I think you're missing the mark on this censure thing which is, after all, what this thread is about. That article is purposely and completely misleading and people need to learn to recognize when that's happening.

Yes, there are problems with the party, but let's give them credit where it's due and not fall for propaganda!

[sendero]

97. "Problems in the party"?

That's like saying Bush makes "an occasional error in judgement".

There aren't "problems in the party", there is a "problem Dem senate with only a handful that aren't part of the problem".

I've never seen such a pack of useless pussies in my entire life. No wonder that the country, even as they become suspicious of Republicans, see the Dems as no better.

[VegasWolf]

110. ROFL!!!!! "useless pussies" damn well describes the DINOs that are

running today's democratic party!!!!

[Pacifist Patriot]

99. It's as good a headline as the one claiming Dems were indicted.

[katty]

88. Spineless, Worthless, wussies!! Go home and hide!

[Rex]

95. Frist said this after eating a deep fried cat.

He developed a taste for them back in college. Democrats heard his bluff of insanity and they fled. Sad. Even poll numbers can't sway Dems. I guess they need their mommy to tell em when it is okay to vote against a fascist, war criminal. Oh well...maybe next time.

[Pacifist Patriot]

98. AAGGHHH!!! This is a good thing.

Immediate vote with a Republican held Senate would bury the matter. This keeps the ball in play and allows us time to contact our senators, be they Democrat or Republican. It keeps the debate going. The headline is total and utter bullshit! There is no retreat here. They blocked an immediate vote. This is political savvy, not cowardice. Geez oh Pete, stop swallowing the right wing talking points!

[IndyOp]

102. Pacifist Patriot SCORES!!!

Y'all are drinking the Kool-Aid if you are not clear that delaying the vote IS support.

:kick:

[Pacifist Patriot]

103. It's about damn time I got something right today.

Five year old misplaced my wallet, two year old is making messes faster than I can clean up the last one and I don't have any chilled wine in the house.

[NoodleyAppendage]

104. Wimpy and apologistic bullshit...I ain't buying it, Pacifist...

Censuring Bush would be a historical event that would FOREVER tar his name and would serve as a blemish on his legacy. Political calculus aside, Bush BROKE THE LAW and our representatives have a DUTY to hold him accountable for his CRIME. Period.

J

[Pacifist Patriot]

105. No kidding. Nothing has been killed so why are we whining prematurely?

[NoodleyAppendage]

111. Care to bet on the survival of the censure motion? I'll bet it's killed.

I'm willing to put my money where my "premature whining" is. How 'bout you??

J

[Rebelry]

100. I read the article and the title of the article is misleading

The republicans want to bring this to a quick vote so it can be buried, the democrats are wisely insisting on more discussion. This is good, since there isn't a snowball's chance in hell of passing this in a Republican dominated senate. The more discussion, the more it's in the news. THIS IS GOOD.

Do I wish all the democrats were rallying around Feingold and agreeing with his motion to censure the president, YES! But they are smart not to allow a vote on this today, because it will fail as a motion and immediately be buried.

I don't LIke that the MSM is misleading the public on this. The title is misleading to say the least... it should say

"Democrats block Republican effort to end debate on censure"..

THAT's what they are really doing. Smart move on their part.
REb

[wordpix2]

108. * "may be wrong but acted on good faith." (Specter). Try that in court

as a defense and see where it gets you:

"I know stealing from my employer was wrong, but I acted in good faith because I wanted a better home and vacations for my family."

"I know child molestation is wrong, but I acted in good faith because I wanted to teach the child about sex firsthand."

Such a defense of * would never hold up in court and that's what repukes are afraid of.

:thumbsdown:
:puke: