Getting a driver's license to get harder (Real ID Act)

[UpInArms]

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=710&e=7&u=/usatoday/20060315/pl_usatoday/gettingadriverslicensetogetharder

The cost of obtaining a driver's license could double, and renewing a license by mail would end by 2008, according to state officials responsible for enforcing a federal law aimed at thwarting terrorists and discouraging illegal immigration.

The Real ID Act, approved by Congress in May and scheduled to take effect in May 2008, requires people seeking a license to prove that they are in the USA legally.

State officials from California to Maine fear that they don't have the technology, staff or money to meet the new law's requirements.

"Many are reacting negatively to it," Matt Sundeen of the National Conference of State Legislatures says of state lawmakers. "Real ID ... will have significant fiscal implications for the states."

...more...

[saigon68]

1. THEY REALLY WANT TO TATTOO A NUMBER ON YOUR ARM

But this will do for a while

[madaboutharry]

3. or make you sew identifying symbols on your coat.

n/t

[Brazenly Liberal]

7. May as well have the vet put the chip in us when he's doing Fido.

This country is like one big scene from the X-files sometimes.

[saigon68]

8. Yes they could have a field day with that one

Imagine all the tailors in action sewing on patches







(1) Star of David with the French word Juif (Jew). France, 1942. (1989.045.01)
(2) Star of David armband, General Government, ca. November 1939-May 1943.
(1990.051.08)
(3) Star of David with the German word Jude (Jew), Czechoslovakia. (1989.205.0 1)
(4) Star of David button, Bulgaria, 1942. (1991.135.01)
(5) Red triangle embroidered with black initial "T" for Tschechoslowakei (to indicate wearer was Czech). (1989.303.27)
(6) Star of David with the Dutch word Jood (Jew), The Netherlands, 1942. (1990.145.01)
(7) Identification tag issued to Bronia Eiger-Sitner, a Jewish forced laborer at a munitions factory in Radom, Poland, ca. 1944. Attached to identification tag with blue string are a 40 red plastic heart and a mezuzah (a Jewish ritual scroll). Gray paper background is used for photographic purposes, (1919.171.11)
(8) Yellow triangle with "U" (Ungarn or Hungary), Buchenwald, April 1945. (1989.295.07)
(9) Purple triangle with prisoner number 46436 issued in Sachsenhausen to Albert Jahndorf. (1989.240.02)
(10) Star of David used in Hungary, March 1944. (1988.064)
(11) Patch used to identify a Polish civilian laborer in the German Reich, 1940-1945. (1990.259.02)
(12) Purple triangle with prisoner number 1989 issued in Ravensbruck to Luise Jahndorf (1989.240.01)
(13) Pink triangle with the letter "B" (Belgium) from Langenstein-Zwieberge, also known as" Malachit," a subcamp of Buchenwald, ca. 1944-1945. (1991.198.08)
(14) Yellow strip of cloth placed above inverted triangle marking Jews in Monowitz, November 1944. (1991.198.04)
(15) Red triangle with "F" (France), Buchenwald, April 1945. (1989.295.03)
(16) Black triangle with "T" (Czechoslovakia) from Langenstein-Zwieberge, also known as"Malachit," a subcamp of Buchenwald, 1944-1945. Gray paper background is used for photographic purposes. (1991.198.12)
(17) Green triangle with "S," Buchenwald, April 1945. "S" probably meansSicherheitsverwahrter or preventive arrest prisoner. (1989.295.10)
(18) Red triangle with "I" (Italy), Buchenwald, April 1945. (1989.295.04)
(19) Armband embroidered with "L.P." (Lagerpolizei) from Malchow, a labor subcamp of Ravensbrück concentration camp producing ammunition and explosives, February-May 1945. (1988.082.03)

[TechBear_Seattle]

14. A bar code on your forehead or hand

Just as the book of Revelations predicted. And the extreme irony... fanatics who still treat Hal Lindsay (writer of "The Late, Great Planet Earth" and other apocalyptic classics) as God's Holy Prophet are aiding and abetting.

[sarcasmo]

25. Much more than a Tattoo. Time is near where putting that computer

chip in your forearm will be a reality.

[Richard D]

2. Jeeze . . .

. . . wonder how long until we have to wait in line for a couple hours to get our rationed load of bread?

[MadMaddie]

4. I am not sure about this...

It sounds like "Americans" are going to have to prove they are Americans....

This is kinda stupid isn't it...

Wouldn't it be easier to uber tighten the borders and actually monitor, limit and investigate those non-Americans who want to come into the country?

Perhaps for non-Americans trying to get DL they should get a different type of license that is monitored by the government?

[Brazenly Liberal]

5. crap! I renewed online last time

It was great! Took 2 minutes and I was done.

This kind of bullshit would never have gone down when the Cold War was going on. Mr. and Mrs. America would have noticed how all the things we were supposed to find shocking in the Soviet Union were happening here.

it's one of the great ironies of the Bush Administration

[Longhorn]

6. It's already getting tough in some cases.

My daughter moved from Texas to Colorado last year. About two months ago, her purse was stolen and she lost her Texas drivers license. Since she has no ID, Colorado will not issue her a DL. She can't renew with Texas online because she has to have the verification code. So to get another Texas license, she has to drive to the nearest DPS office in Texas, which is apparently only open on Tuesdays (not to mention that it is at least eight hours away!) She works as a server in a sports bar and needs all the shifts she can get, especially with March Madness beginning.

Instead, she decided to apply for a passport. She has her birth certificate for proof of citizenship and her father and I were visiting last weekend so we could sign an affidavit as proof of identification. However, because her birth certificate doesn't have an "I" next to the registration code, it may be rejected. Apparently, Texas and California are known for birth certificate forgeries. In the meantime, we've ordered a state-issued birth certificate because Colorado won't accept a city-issued certificate.

When I applied for a passport in 2000, they would not accept my birth certificate because there was a place for shot records on the back, so the clerk decided it couldn't be legitimate. I had to order a new copy.

It's only going to get tougher, folks.

[DBoon]

28. But why would Americans want to go to other countries?

Everything great and wonderful is right here.

:sarcasm:

[AllegroRondo]

9. Which ties in nicely with the requirement for picture ID to vote

make it difficult to get picture ID, make it required to vote, and the poor, minorities, handicapped, and elderly wont be able to vote.

[arikara]

11. You need picture id to vote?

I worked in the federal election here in Canada and you don't need to show any id to vote. We use paper and pencils too and the votes are counted as soon as the polls close. If there are any problems, its an easy matter to recount them. I'm not gloating, I well realize how easy it would be for our gov't to go the way of yours, especially now that we have Harper in.

[AllegroRondo]

13. Missouri is trying to enact this by November

I believe several other states are as well.

The reasoning - it will reduce vote fraud, from people voting twice, dead people voting, people driving in from Illinois, etc. They would make a free state photo ID card available for people who do not already have one.

But - the poor, recent immigrants, elderly, etc. do not have the time to waste jumping through hoops to vote. They already have to register to vote, and take time off on election day to vote. Now they need another day to go get an ID before they can register.

[ccjlld]

26. Trying?

For all intents and purposes, they already have started to implement this. When I renewed my license in January, I had to have a certified copy of my birth certificate, a copy of my marriage license (because my name was different than on my birth certificate), and a piece of mail indicating I really lived where I said I lived.

I had to send off to Kansas for the birth certificate and it ended up making the total cost to renew my license around $40. It's going to be a real pain for folks, like my MIL who don't drive. She doesn't have a birth certificate and if that precludes her from getting an id, it looks like it is going to be near impossible for her to vote.

(edited after re-reading post I replied to)

[dragonlady]

32. Wisconsin GOP is trying hard to get this

Our governor has vetoed it several times already. It is, of course, a blatant attempt to cut into Democratic strength in Milwaukee and other places where many people don't have drivers' licenses or other ID, or they have to move around so much that it's hard to keep the ID address current.

[anitar1]

34. I remember working at my local polling place

when Kennedy was running. Easy. After polls closed, we counted the votes and double checked them.Easy. Took a little time, but we didn't mind at all.We were taking place in a very important process. At least, that is how we all seemed to feel.

[displacedtexan]

10. Everything is harder now. I had to show ID at the DR's office...

and I had a referral from my primary physician, an appointment, and an insurance card.

This is getting ridiculous.

BTW, I am a blonde woman, so it's not just veiled racism.

Hey! No blonde jokes!

[Missy M]

19. This whole country is getting out of hand....

why did you have to show your ID at the doctors office? Of course, they would tell you it is to prevent fraud. This insanity has got to stop and we Americans have to start doing something about it. I'm mad as hell over all of this nonsense and being treated as if we are all criminals or terrorists.

[Norquist Nemesis]

12. If they want a National ID, than they should at least have the balls

to be up front about it. This must be Senselessbrenner's ID act. AFAIK, driver's license requirements are the individual states' rights to regulate.

Hmmmm...is this the "message" that the Republicans are sending? They don't support states' rights.

[dragonlady]

21. This is Sensenbrenner's doing

He's very proud of it. Go here for my take on this awful act:
http://sensenbrennerwatch.blogspot.com/

And then go here to help us get somebody else to represent us in Wisconsin's 5th district:
www.bk2006.org

Go Bryan Kennedy! He has way more sense than Sensenbrenner.

[suffragette]

24. That's exactly what they didn't want to do -

be upfront about it. They knew there would be resistance against a National ID from both the right and the left, so they they carefully avoiding labelling it as what it was and insisted that wouldn't be National ID, even though it clearly is. They especially didn't want people to fully realize that the new cards would be National ID cards and went out of their way to make it so they wouldn't be visibly labeled in this way. By issuing something that still looks like a state licence or ID card, many people won't realize the shift to a de facto National ID.

They didn't want people to realize that the Real ID Act created a de facto National ID card by forcing states to adhere to the same process or risk making their ID cards invalid for federal uses. Not to mention the requirement that databases be linked and under DHS along with DHS requirements for digital ID methods in the cards, whether that ends up being RFID or biometric data on RFID chips.

And of course, it's yet another nonfunded mandate and the states have to bear the burden of the cost.

Rotten act pushed by a rotten guy - Sensenbrenner

[Cobalt Violet]

15. Maybe the detention camps will be ready by then.

For those who can't prove they are Murikins.

[coalition_unwilling]

18. I'm sure they already have my cell assigned (eom)

[no_hypocrisy]

16. In NJ, you have to jump through hoops of fire to renew your license.

Photo ID only.
Six pieces of ID to verify your name and address (Not as easy as it sounds. They tell which papers to bring.)
No mail-in renewals. You have to take the day off to visit the DMV.

[NJCher]

23. no kidding

My friend in Morris County tried to renew hers and ran up against some clerk who didn't believe her birth certificate was for real. She's in her 50s and had to order a new one--imagine the trip back in time that was. It took three actual trips to the DMV to do it and a lot of waiting and frustration.

[HockeyMom]

29. My official birth certificate was LOST

when I was a child. Thanks to the VA back in the 50s. There is no original record of it; only a few lines in the original book. Even over the past 40 yeas, I have had many problems with that, never mind NOW with our new "police state". I haven't gotten a passport in 30 years, but remember all the hoops I had to go through back then.

So now I won't even be able to get a driver's license renewed?

[NJCher]

30. It's coming....

You'd best contact the agency in charge of it for your state and start working on this now.

Another possibility would be to contact your state rep or senator to see if you can get some help there.

Good luck--but get started on it now. My friend, in the above episode, didn't have a license and did get caught driving while she was trying to get hers renewed.




Cher

[AllegroRondo]

35. If you lived in Missouri, you couldnt get a drivers license

although if you have a passport, even an expired one, you should be OK.

[MindPilot]

17. About the only thing you DON'T have to prove is that you

know how to drive.

[mwooldri]

22. Too true! NC driving test: 15 minutes. UK test: 40 minutes.

It was literally a drive around the block, a backing maneuver, a few turns right, a couple left - and before I knew it I was back in the parking lot of the DMV office!

Also another thing: with NC you can take driver's tests on demand; in the UK you have to book an appointment.

Mark.

[mwooldri]

20. Makes the UK look completely soft!

Well, my paper licence lasts until I'm 70! And yes, there is no photo on it! I filled in a form at the Post Office, mailed it with my birth certificate, and a week or two later - voila! I got a provisional driver's licence (same as learner's permit), my original birth certificate got returned to me too, and at the tender age of 17 years and a few days I was thusly permitted to go out on the roads of England (with an accompanying driver and L-plates of course).

Of course the requirements have changed since the early 1990's - the EU have dictated that driver's licences need to have photos, so they get renewed every 10 years now. Apart from sending in a birth certificate and a photo (taken at a photo booth) - and yes it's done by mail - it's a relatively uncomplicated procedure.

So for those in NJ who have to book a day off to get a driver's licence, it sounds like that it's gone to the level of a Communist regime - it's bureaucracy gone mad. I thought the British invented bureaucracy but it seems like the Americans are intent on perfecting the art!

Reminds me: I guess I need to replace my driver's licence - NC is one of the "easier states" to get a licence in. I need to show up with my alien ID card (I'm from Planet Ru4251 btw really - I just pose as an Englishman from time to time :> ), some proof of address and social security number... I have a little waiting and in minutes I get a license. (I've misplaced my license a while back. Jolly good job I keep my alien card on me most times otherwise the police officer that stopped me would have cause to take me in!)

Mark.

[Thor_MN]

27. Selfish, but I hope MN doesn't go earlier than they need to.

I have one of the last "Old" style licenses, expires December 2007. The new ones look much different, I get some double takes when I have to show ID. So I may again have one of the last Old/New licenses issued.

Last time my Aunt had her license renewed, it came back in the mail with all her correct info, but the picture of a 20's something woman on it. My Aunt showed it to me and said "I'm keeping it, I'm Hot!!" One of the last, best laughs I had with her, she died a year ago November.

[Danmel]

31. My license picture is ancient

It was taken in 1993 and my license expires in 2011

Now, I think I look reasonably young for my age, but really- should I have a picture license that has a picture taken when I was 33 still good when I'll be 51?

[TankLV]

33. Many states, like Nevada and Hawaii - require extensive proof for issuing

one since they use them as ID's.

Nevada no longer accepts DL's from states that do not do extensive background checks/proof.

This is only common sense, and I support it, except...

Of course, if the repukes said the sky is blue, I'd have to have independent verification first.

The fact that this is occuring under repuke control has me worried.