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LiberalHeart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 03:55 PM
Original message
Black-Owned Firms Grow at Four Times National Rate
Black-owned businesses are among the fastest-growing segments of the American economy, the government said Tuesday. The number of black-owned businesses grew by 45% from 1997 to 2002, more than four times the national rate for all businesses, according to a report by Census Bureau.

Much more:
http://wtol.com/Global/story.asp?S=4785091
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 04:07 PM
Response to Original message
1. 1997 to 2002! Weren't those the Clinton years because *'s policies
could not have affected 2001 and only minimal effect in 2002.
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. There's a problem with what you say.
If *'s policies couldn't have affected 2001 and had only minimal effect in 2002, then what about the * recession during those years ...?

If Clinton's policies are responsible for 2001's economy and a significant share of 2002's, then Clinton has a post-term recession to his charge.
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Did we have a recession in 2001? n/t
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queenbdem87 Donating Member (233 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Yes we did
Also, it is very easy to illustrate how Bush's policies hurt the economy in those years. Also, any policy that affected the ability of minorities would take a bit longer to take effect than Bush's corporate budget-raiding tax cuts for instance.
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Please cite stats showing we had a recession in 2001. n/t
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. How's this?.....

The Business-Cycle Peak of March 2001
<http://www.nber.org/cycles/november2001/recessions.pdf>

QUOTE:

The NBER’s Business Cycle Dating Committee has determined that a peak in business
activity occurred in the U.S. economy in March 2001. A peak marks the end of an expansion and
the beginning of a recession. The determination of a peak date in March is thus a determination
that the expansion that began in March 1991 ended in March 2001 and a recession began. The
expansion lasted exactly 10 years, the longest in the NBER’s chronology.

A recession is a significant decline in activity spread across the economy, lasting more
than a few months, visible in industrial production, employment, real income, and wholesaleretail
trade. A recession begins just after the economy reaches a peak of activity and ends as the
economy reaches its trough. Between trough and peak, the economy is in an expansion.
Expansion is the normal state of the economy; most recessions are brief and they have been rare
in recent decades.
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Thanks. "The determination of a peak date in March is thus a determination
that the expansion that began in March 1991 ended in March 2001 and a recession began."

That suggests the economy reacted swiftly to Bush's lower taxes and neo-con policies and had a rapid and chilling effect on U.S. economic vitality.
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. Thanks for answering for me.
Called away from the computer.
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Radio_Guy Donating Member (875 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-19-06 08:39 AM
Response to Reply #7
14. the expansion that began in March 1991 ended in March 2001
Those dates are a little off. The expansion didn't begin until after Clinton took office. That is why Bush 1 lost. "It's the economy, stupid" was the battle cry. March of 1993 is probably more accurate.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:07 PM
Response to Original message
6. I wonder what the explanation is behind these stats?
These haven't been exactly boom times for tolerance and diversity.

The only thing I can see is that black consumers are turning more to businesses owned and operated by their own group.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. I personally think that black-owned businesses have suffered...
...the same problems as the rest of us.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. OK, but why are doing "less worse"?
That's what I don't understand. A four-fold difference means something.
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. A few guesses.
The government earmarked money for minority-owned businesses. Buy 20k extra-large widgets, you have to solicit bids from X minority-owned ones, and a certain percentage must come from minority companies. It would take a while before this actually yielded more, instead of more prosperous, businesses.

Small-number statistics. You start off with a relatively low baseline and it doesn't take much for a large increase. I knew a church that had a 200% growth rate one year, and a 300% growth the next. 10 people to 30 people to 120 people.

Education and entrepreneurship. I'm assuming the kicker wasn't blacks buying gas stations and 7-11s, but started things like accounting and consulting firms. It takes a while before the advantages of self-employment outweigh the 'diversity effect' where a black EE PhD is in high demand and gets a gazillion job offers, and at least a few years experience in the job market.

Confidence in the economy. After a sufficient number of boom years there's less perceived risk in starting your own company.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-18-06 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. I see your point
People want to see proof of financial advantages before they jump in to a risky venture.

But where are the "minority-based incentives" of which you speak? I'm not seeing any of that, certainly not from current business regulations.
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-19-06 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. Most have been curtailed.
The stats cover 1997-2002; many of the 'minority set asides' were rolled back in 2002 and later.
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noonwitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-19-06 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #6
15. Clinton's Empowerment Zone program
One of the goals was to encourage small business development in poor areas. Detroit used a lot of it's money on the southwest part of town. If you drive down Vernor through the mexican neighborhood, it looks better than it has in years. A lot of buildings were rehabilitated, some new stores and such were built, and a lot of small markets and other retail developments opened up. All the work started in the late 90s, with money from the Clinton administration.

That same program is what helped downtown Grand Rapids, too, despite Dick DeVos' claims of his own responsibility for it.
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