Navy getting back into the riverboat patrol business in Iraq

[ECH1969]

For the first time since the Navy patrolled Vietnam's Mekong River delta with 500 swift boats, the service is getting back into the river patrol business, this time in Iraq.

The Navy is about to float a so-called "brown-water" fleet to take over from the Marine Corps, which has patrolled Iraq's Euphrates River since the war began. The Navy is using North Carolina's Cape Fear river to train high-seas sailors to move upriver and into up-close combat as part of a new riverboat squadron.

Sailors like Michael Huggins expected to be cruising the high seas but he's getting ready to deploy to Iraq as a gunner on a river patrol boat.

Huggins says it's a big difference from swabbing a deck but he likes it. In his words, "It's something exciting."

http://www.wbay.com/Global/story.asp?S=5416222

[SpiralHawk]

1. Calling all republicon chickenhawk swiftboaters

Commander AWOL needs you to enlist today...

[IndianaGreen]

2. Add to this the plan to surround Baghdad with a series of moats

and there are more parallels to Vietnam.

Meanwhile in Afghanistan...

[formercia]

3. I volunteered for small boat service in 1965

I wasn't selected because they were looking for boatswain, gunner and machinist mates. Of the 9 people that were selected from my ship, 7 had been killed or wounded within 6 months. Lucky me.

[Lost4words]

4. self delete

self delete

[blm]

8. That's scary. It had the highest death rate of any duty, yet RW radio

turned it into a GLAMOR job that Kerry wanted only to show off. Yeah - show off while dead, or show off his one leg or arm - THAT was what a swiftboat warrior expected in his future.

It shows that you are made of stronger stuff than most of us. Salute, sir.

[DavidDvorkin]

5. It worked so well in our previous quagmire

We can see the light at the end of tunnel now!

[Shipwack]

6. Actually, this is one of the few things they are doing right...

A good portion of the smuggling (fuel, among other things) in and out of Iraq is done via small boats along the rivers.

Now this is a whole separate issue over whether or not we should be there at all, but if we're going to do this, we should do it right. Of course, it would have been better doing this "right" when we first got there, or not gone in at all.

[formercia]

9. Looking for smugglers is a good thing.

Parading the Flag up and down the Euphrates in order to draw fire is not.

[DavidDvorkin]

10. Speaking of drawing fire

This time, the enemy doesn't heavy forest along the river to hide in, but their weapons are of much greater range and accuracy. Countering that is US air support, much more effective both because of modern technology and the lack of forest, but countered by the cityscape.

In other words, will the boats be in significant danger?

[formercia]

11. Palm Groves

and other cover lie along the river. With overhead helo backup and artillery fire support helps.

It's that first burst from someone who would just as soon you killed him anyway.

Those who have nothing have nothing to lose.

[DavidDvorkin]

13. Interesting point

I was thinking about someone who expected/wanted to get away. Projecting my own attitudes onto the enemy, I suppose -- a classic error!

If the attacker doesn't care if he lives or dies, then all that matters is getting set up properly in the first place and having the chance to launch the attack. If they get their hands on the right kinds of reasonably small missiles . . .

[formercia]

14. They are using sagger wire-guided anti-tank missiles

or eqivalent for long-range shots, RPG's midrange, small arms and IED's in close.


Pretty much like Vietnam.

It's ok if the patrol is in the middle of a big estuary, much more dicey in canals, especially when the shooter is just waiting until you're in point-blank range. Before air support can even make a turn to engage, the battle will be over, one way or another.

[sofa king]

20. The Royal Navy fought an interesting campaign there

During the First World War. Unfortunately it's somewhat obscure and there isn't a lot of detailed information about it available online. For those who like to use the past to see the future, though, here's a sampling:

http://www.firstworldwar.com/battles/nahralkalek.htm
http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t11741.html
http://www.gwpda.org/naval/euphgb.htm
http://www.ccc.nps.navy.mil/si/2005/Jun/aboul-eneinJun05.asp

My recollection is that the Insect-class gunboats of the Royal Navy allowed British forces to maintain a nominally successful shoestring campaign against the Turks, but several of those vessels were badly damaged.

Iraq seems notable for people of various nations at differing times being willing to surrender to just about anyone or anything. In the first Gulf War, Iraqi troops surrendered to helicopters. In the First World War, Turks surrendered to gunboats.

[blm]

7. He must be planning to run for office - only showoffs take dangerous duty

like swiftboating where they increase their chances to get killed. RW radio told me so in 2004.

[IndianaGreen]

12. I wish the best to Seaman Huggins

and I look forward to his return from Iraq, as changed a man as Kerry was by his Vietnam experience.

[me b zola]

17. I had a similar thought

Was going to say that woohoo the government sure will appreciate his enthusiasm for the job...so long as he doesn't survive and come back to serve his nation as a Dem.



:cry:


I weep for what this nation has become





:cry:

[daleo]

15. I wonder if "insurgents" will just mine the rivers now

In some fashion similar to roadside IEDs?

[formercia]

16. Let's not give them too many ideas......

they're pretty smart people anyway.

I once asked an Afghan commander if new technology was a help. He thought it was nice if available but a gomer dug into the side of a road with a pull initiator worked just as well.

[drdtroit]

18. In his words, "It's something exciting."

It'll be damned exciting when that first RPG whistles past his ear!
Be safe and pack lots of depends.

:patriot:

[genie_weenie]

19. Well, The Marines have been doing this since

April 2004. I gave regular intel to the Riverine Marines who operated around Ramadi, Habbinyah from Aug 2004 thru May 2005...