(Bush) Official: Torture not worse than Saddam

[sabra]

http://www.dailyindia.com/show/62533.php/Official:-Torture-not-worse-than-Saddam

Official: Torture not worse than Saddam

WASHINGTON, Sept. 22 (UPI) -- A Bush administration official has rejected a claim by a U.N. official that torture in Iraq is worse now than under former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein.

The U.S. State Department official was reacting to Austrian law Professor Manfred Nowak, who serves as the U.N. Special Rapporteur on Torture, The Times of London reported Friday.

"What most people tell you is that the situation as far as torture is concerned now in Iraq is totally out of hand," Nowak said. "The situation is so bad many people say it is worse than in the times of Saddam Hussein."

...

"How anyone could compare state-sanctioned torture under a dictator to the situation today is beyond us," the State Department official told The Times. "We don't agree with his assessment of the situation at all."

[BOSSHOG]

1. Yeah alot of stuff is beyond you all nowak

No doubt you can rationalize the debt situation as being better then it was 7 years ago.

Imagine the bush administration not agreeing with the truth.

[saigon68]

22. Manfred Nowak KOOL-AID DRINKER ignores these Murders

[Paranoid Pessimist]

34. At least we're not worse than Saddam Hussein yet -- are we getting close?

I have faith that if we try, with that good ol' American can-do know how spirit, we CAN get to be worse than Hussein. Give it the old college try.

[Solly Mack]

2. speaking of state sanctioned torture

The US sanctions torture....in Iraq, in Afghanistan, at GTMO...in secret prisons, with extraordinary renditions


America likes torture so much, it's legitimizes it with the cover of law.

[ninkasi]

18. Solly Mack

How long do you think it will be before Bush gets the bright idea of using torture in dealing with drug offenses? I fear that once Congress illegally gives Bush the right to use torture it's just a matter of time before the administration decides to use it on citizens accused of certain crimes, claiming that there is a "war" on drugs.

Watching our country die has been so very painful for many of us, hasn't it? The murder of America was planned long ago, and is being carried out now. I wish the patient put up more of a fight.

[daleo]

20. I have thought along those lines too

Perhaps a more salient example might be a "Jack the Ripper" scenario.

As I recall Jack the Ripper murdered about one woman a month during the summer and fall of 1888, in London. Clearly lives were at stake if he wasn't stopped, much like the "ticking bomb" scenario used to justify torture. If the ticking bomb scenario justifies torture in the case of a terrorist threat, why not in the Jack the Ripper threat?

Not that I am justifying torture in this case - quite the reverse. I am saying that once you allow torture for one "justified scenario", a slippery slope could lead to its use in all kinds of other equivalent scenarios. Reasoning like this takes us back to the middle ages.

[Solly Mack]

21. Maybe he already has...in places like Colombia

where the US is actively engaged in the "war on drugs" (whatever that means)..think of Negroponte.

Maybe we've always tortured there...maybe what the US does in other countries or has done is now coming home to us.

You're right - what's happening now is a door opener. If we can explain away torture now, torture can be explained away for any number of things.

Americans are being conditioned to accept torture as acceptable...and once accepted, it will not be hard to convince people that their neighbor must be tortured too...for the good of the whole.

I can't breath at times the pain is so bad. For all my anger, there exist inside me a deep belief in the ideas of free people governing themselves, with the rights of all protected, with justice and equality that allows for the greatest freedom.

I still believe in those ideas. I just don't believe in America anymore.

I can't begin to describe the pain that brings.

((((ninkasi)))))

I wish I had words of comfort to give you...but I don't.

That America is even debating to torture or not is a severe blow.

[Warpy]

3. Translation: It's not bad because WE are doing it!

Honestly, how bad does it have to be?

I am outraged that this is happening in my name. I despise these ignorant, violent men who practice sadism by proxy.

No amount of State Department rationalization will change the fact that they have become what they told us we were going to war to end.

[calimary]

13. "Sadism by proxy" - that's actually quite good. Good meme.

HIGHLY repeatable, I hope.

And sadly, it's accurate as hell.

[Warpy]

26. Steal it.

Please.

Spread it around.

[calimary]

29. Okay, Warpy, consider it stolen.

"Sadism by Proxy."

I'm trying to keep track of some of these in my journal, if anybody cares.

Needs to be said, read, and spread!

[Eugene]

4. It is so much better that militias are doing it rather than Saddam?

Also state sponsored torture apparently doesn't count
when the U.S.-backed Iraqi government does it.

[Demeter]

5. Doesn't Even Address the Civilian Death Toll

also worse than under Saddam. Nor the complete breakdown of everyday life.

[bemildred]

6. Good, make the bastards deny it. nt

[blogslut]

7. There's a statement I never thought I'd hear

Our torture is waaay less torturous than their torture.

[ima_sinnic]

8. U.S. state-sponsored torture is Good Torture. Saddams's was Bad Torture.

Excuse me while I :puke:

:nuke: :grr: :nuke: :grr: :nuke: :grr: :nuke: :grr: :nuke:

[Supersedeas]

9. Lots of general denials out of the Bushist Regime lately, eh?

[radfringe]

10. heh...

reminds me of that question:

"Yes or no - are you still beating your wife?"

in this case --

Q: "yes or no are you still torturing detainees?"

A: "ummm...errrr...not as badly as Saddam did...." :eyes:

[tanyev]

35. Or this one:

"Would you sleep with me for a million dollars?"

"Well, I guess I might."

"Would you sleep with me for five dollars?"

"Sir, what kind of a woman do you take me for?"

"Madam, we have already established that; now we're merely haggling over the price."

[xchrom]

11. my torture is better than your torture.

what? you don't believe me?!?!

[yellowcanine]

12. Nixon said he wasn't a crook also. Pathetic is what this is.

[bamacrat]

14. Thats a crappy defense, yeah we do it, but he did it worse.

Not acceptable.

[warrens]

15. I'm less of a fascist dictator than Saddam Hussein was!

Wow, that's something to aspire to. A real model to emulate. "I don't hate niggers as much as Hitler did." These nazis have to go.

[Karenina]

33. NOT.

[gratuitous]

16. The article takes pains to say Nowak has never been to Iraq

I wonder if the anonymous carping State Department official has ever been to Iraq, either? Or if that official has ever been tortured? It's like two eunuchs debating the pros and cons of doggy-style vs. the missionary position.

[sabra]

17. sorry, the article is from UPI, but it's all I could find.

[daleo]

19. But Bush's torture is in support of human rights

Bad old Saddam's torture was in violation of human rights. Surely, anyone can see the distinction.

Failing that, you know - fraternity pranks.

[saigon68]

23. The Chimp's torture done to aid Corporate Profits Therefore its OK

According to Chief Thug and War Profiteer. Liebermann and Cheney

[stepnw1f]

24. "GOP Raping Children"... all I Have Say (nt)

[nmliberal]

25. And I thought the info obtained by torture is not good info nt

[NOLADEM]

27. Very telling they felt the need to respond

Since they only respond to things that are true in order to distort or discount them.

All you have to do is look at the morgue numbers to see that, in a disgusting failure of post-war management, more people die now due to violent causes than when Saddam was in power. Not saying he was a good guy, but facts are facts.

Damn sad we have an administration that is having to answer such comparisons with anything but a laugh shared by the rest of the press corps.

We truly have lost every last shred of moral credibility as a nation.

[Rex]

28. Of course you don't agree, assholes like you love torture and think

it is okay. As long as it is in the name of 'fighting terrorism'. :eyes:

Stupid people should never be allowed to run our country. Never.

[ShortnFiery]

31. Some of them are not stupid but EVIL - they are the ones who should

be arrested and put on trial for CRIMES against HUMANITY!

[ShortnFiery]

30. Why, because one of Dear Leader's cronies says it's not true?

Bullshit! Just like Iraq is NOT in the middle of AN ACTIVE AND ONGOING CIVIL WAR. :grr:

Now This Criminal Executive Branch is basically stating, "Are you gonna believe your stinkin' eyes or what WE tell you to be true?" Evil Ghouls! :puke:

[truthisfreedom]

32. "we don't care what the people say. isn't it obvious?"-bush administration

"we've never given any sign that we care what anybody feels, thinks, experiences, or suffers. that should be clear from our past actions."-bush administration

[upi402]

36. BS = Bush Says (CSM link)

The United Nation's special investigator on torture said Thursday that torture may now be worse in Iraq that it was during the regime of deposed leader Saddam Hussein. The Associated Press

http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0922/dailyUpdate.html

[samsingh]

37. they're effing comparing themselves to saddam?!!

[Ravy]

38. I have to agree with the State Department on this.

Comparing state-sanctioned torture under a dictator to United States-sacntioned torture under a president *is* well beyond them.

[newspeak]

39. if it's not as bad as Saddam

then show us the fekkkin pictures!!!!!! Since they're doing all of this allegedly fraternity pranks in our name, show us the rest of the pictures!!!! We, the American people, have the right to decide!!!! I am tired of the secrecy of this administration--we are a democratic republic, we have the right to know what our government is doing behind our back!!!!

[LiberalFighter]

40. US Torture is BETTER than everybody else's torture

Torturer's don't strive to be worse than others. They strive to do it better than everyone else. Or at least enough to get the job done.

[MountainLaurel]

41. Now, there's a ringing endorsement

"Hey, our torture is better than that of the evil despot whose country we invaded to oust."

[TankLV]

42. So now he ADMITS that we are torturing people there!!!!!!!

I thought we didn't do that sort of thing?

Oh, of course, the COMPLETELY INDEPENDENT Iraqi government is SOLELY responsible for this, right?! - of which the US has absolutely no control over...