U.S. official: 5 Americans die in helicopter crash (Blackwater Mercenaries)

[saigon68]

U.S. official: 5 Americans die in helicopter crash

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16767353/

BAGHDAD, Iraq - A helicopter owned by the private security firm Blackwater USA crashed Tuesday in central Baghdad, and five civilians were killed, a U.S. military official said. A senior Iraqi defense official said the aircraft was shot down over a predominantly Sunni neighborhood.

The Iraqi official, who would not allow use of his name because the information had not been made public, said a gunman with a PKC machine gun downed the small helicopter of a private security firm Tuesday afternoon over the heavily Sunni Fadhil neighborhood in north-central Baghdad

In Washington, a U.S. military official said Blackwater representatives responded to the crash in central Baghdad, along with American military. The official, who demanded anonymity because the details have not been made public, said the cause of the crash was not known and that it was too early to tell if the crash was linked to the downing Saturday of a U.S. Army helicopter that killed a dozen U.S. troops

Official sources deny everything

The only thing to be said, is 5 more mercenaries were welcomed with a Rose Petal Parade


Photo of helicopter

[ShortnFiery]

1. As I understand it - MERCs don't increase our troop death count.

Gee, with all the money they're making you'd think that a death of a Merc should count twice. :eyes:

[saigon68]

2. No they are just "swept away" like leaves in the wind

Live fast, die young

These people are really scumbags---killers for hire $$$$$

[High Plains]

3. I think icasualties.org has the number of "civilian contractor" dead

at 770 or thereabouts.

[saigon68]

4. 770 is a mythical #

They don't mention the hundreds of quislings who are paid little or nothing.

Only the "Big Mercs" the $2,000.00 to $3,000.00 per day hotshots are counted

[Crunchy Frog]

13. Icasualties gives the current number as 387

though they admit that it's an incomplete count. Most of the ones they have listed are security type contractors, mostly US or western. They do include a bunch of Nepali cooks/cleaners who got executed. They do have a few truckdrivers listed, but not nearly as many as have actually been killed, I'm sure. It's a nice way to keep the official fatality stats down, anyway.

http://icasualties.org/oif/Civ.aspx

[maddezmom]

28. that is the number that have requested death benefits according to Dept of Labor

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2701382&mesg_id=2701453

[INDIA]

29. wow, a lot of hatred toward the deceased here.

yet whenever a thread comes up about Taliban/Al Qaeda or insurgents being killed, there isn't half the venom. In fact, most posters infer that they were probably innocent, or they just give them a free pass.

Why is that? These Blackwater guys were certainly in a controversial profession, but there is no evidence at all that these 5 guys ever fired a shot in anger while in Iraq. Everybody just seems to assume it.

What evidence do you have that these guys ever killed ANYBODY? And why is so much hatred directed toward them while the people blowing up marketplaces, cutting off heads, get a (relative) free pass?


ANYBODY?

[saigon68]

31. They are mercenaries are out get rich

The Resistance is there to eject the Invader

What part of "Killing for Profit" Don't you understand ?

Some one is not paying the Mercenaries $3,000.00 per day to sit around and Nap.

[INDIA]

32. Prove to me the deceased ever killed anybody. Prove it.

You can't.


"The resistance"???

That's a pretty nice term for people who blow up marketplaces, murder indicriminately, and behead muslims who are slightly different than themselves. This isn't a fucking resistance. It's a fucking civil war, and a dirty one at that.

Sorry to screw up your fantasy world view.

[saigon68]

34. adios

[INDIA]

36. Oh no! I've been put on "Ignore"!!!!

Seriesly!! Whats is I gonna do!!!!!!!!!!!!



:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

[geardaddy]

33. Um, they're getting paid with taxpayer money.

And they are getting better benefits than the military personnel. Why don't they just privatize the whole damn war!

[TexasLawyer]

5. RIP

Lord, I am tired of this war.

[Stella_Artois]

6. RIP ? They sure didn't live in peace

Soldiers i care about.

[donheld]

23. Maybe they meant

Rest In Pieces

[Lone_Star_Dem]

7. That's the risk you take when you're a hired gun.

It the nature of their business, kill or be killed. No morality or ethics to get in the way, just death.

[TankLV]

16. And they get played plenty - and that money comes at the expense of OUR soldiers...

Fuck the mercs - they get paid too much for these risks - it's part of their "job"...it's about time they paid the piper for their WAR CRIMES...

[Lone_Star_Dem]

25. I'm not clear if you understood my intentions

I harbor no respect for those who hire out to commit murder for insane amounts of money. If that is what they choose to do then they deserve no remorse when they pay for their decision with their lives.

I feel you and I are in agreement on this issue.

[opusprime]

8. Mercs got killed?

Thats what they are paid for.

Killing for the highest bidder has its fringe benefits.

[llmart]

9. I won't shed any tears over them.............

they know what they're getting into and they delight at killing others for money.

[teryang]

10. Not all USA Blackwater mercs are Americans

There is no explicit identification of the casualties as American citizens. The PMIs make more money with foreign recruits who work for a lot less than Americans to risk their lives.

I wonder what insurance company covers "mercenaries" in a combat zone.

[Crunchy Frog]

14. Icasualties has them all listed as Americans.

Their information is usually very reliable.

[sanskritwarrior]

18. State farm

seriously......

As for the ID Blackwater, Open Canopy and Custer Battles employ Americans and foriegn national from countries where there have been recent conflicts.

Like i previously posted I have done some work with these guys, they were additional security for some of our convoy's. Talked to some of them in the past, most of the non-Americans were South Africans (White and black), Irish, Brits, Fijians, Colombians, and Yugoslav civil war veterans. Interestingly, they don't appear to hire former USSR or SE Asians........

[Frank Cannon]

24. Custer Battles is the name of a merc firm?

I thought you were kidding, but by God, you're right.

[mitchum]

11. That's so $ad...and I will grieve for a fee

[Zhade]

21. ...

:spray:

That was awesome.

[Blue_Tires]

26. well said

and a taxpayer-funded fee, as well

[seemslikeadream]

12. Dogs of WAR

http://media.pbs.org/asxgen/general/windows/media4/frontline/2315/windows/ch2_hi.wmv.asx

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/warriors/view /
CHAPTER TWO
Citizens In a Combat Zone
The brutal killings of four Blackwater contractor brings home the daily dangers contractors face. It also raises the issue of regulating a private security force of tens of thousands that is not part of the military command structure.


In "Private Warriors," FRONTLINE correspondent Martin Smith travels throughout Kuwait and Iraq to give viewers an unprecedented behind-the-scenes look at companies like Kellogg, Brown & Root, a Halliburton subsidiary, and its civilian army. KBR has 50,000 employees in Iraq and Kuwait that run U.S. military supply lines and operate U.S. military bases. KBR is also the largest contractor in Iraq, providing the Army with $11.84 billion dollars in services since 2002.

Historically, there is nothing new about the military's use of private contractors, but the Iraq war has seen outsourcing on an unprecedented scale. The policy change came after the Cold War when the Pentagon was downsizing under then Secretary of Defense Dick Cheney. Cheney first hired Halliburton as a consultant and later became the company's president. Halliburton subsidiary KBR is now one of the largest recipients of government contracts.

FRONTLINE visits the biggest Halliburton/KBR run base, Camp Anaconda, in the Sunni triangle. Behind concrete walls 28,000 soldiers and 8,000 civilians live in bases that offer Taekwondo and Salsa lessons, movie theatres, fast food courts, and four meals a day. The amenities are impressive, but some argue that there is a price to pay. Says a former base commander Marine Colonel Thomas X. Hammes, "it's misguided luxury … somebody's risking their lives to deliver that luxury."

And while KBR was glad to provide Smith with a tour of the facilities, they weren't able or willing to answer some basic questions about how much certain services -- like feeding the troops -- cost. Smith eventually finds some answers from the Army base commander, but numerous audits are underway to determine just how the contracts are being fulfilled. In response to allegations of overcharging in the tens of millions of dollars, KBR's Vice President of Worldwide Military Affairs, Paul Cerjan says, "the only thing we can do is stand up and give a true and honest evaluation of what we've done. … And let whoever is making the assessment make the assessment. We are not afraid of that process."

[superconnected]

17. Mercs are put to work by haliburton, this is especially scary

knowing cheney is helping fund a private army, considering he and bush need to exit the white house in 2 years.

He's funding it with out tax dollars. How are we going to get that junta out...

[Taoschick]

27. Those guys

were on a routine protection detail in Baghdad, using their helicopters to monitor an official convoy traveling by road, American and Iraqi officials said. The company has a major contract with the State Department to protect officials traveling outside the protected Green Zone.

An Iraqi military officer said that the convoy being escorted also came under attack, but American and Iraqi officials said that no one in the convoy was killed.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2007/01/24/MNGOBNO1L81.DTL

[Casablanca]

30. Update: Iraqi shooters found to be mercenary contract employees of Custer Battles.

Hypercapitalist competition at work, ensuring our way of life.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Imagevision]

19. If the mercs weren't there? Cheney would order US. troops to protect Halliburton

[Zhade]

20. No loss.

Sad for their families, though (assuming their families didn't exactly enjoy the 'rewards' of their war-profiteering - if they did, and support this illegal war, then I have zero sympathy).

[Name removed]

22. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Doctor_J]

35. Two Blackhawks in a week

the insurgents seem to have gotten their hands on some new weaponry.

[saigon68]

37. Looks like the worm is turning

[Doctor_J]

39. When did you & your comrades in Saigon know the mission was doomed?

Was there some moment or period when it hit you that you probably weren't going to win? If so, that must have been some deep despair. I hope our soldiers aren't going through tht now.

[saigon68]

40. We were winning when I left in 1969 (/sarcasm)------ But then

This happened.




I never thought we would win, there was too much corruption and laziness on the part of our clients the south vietnamese

[FastHorizon]

41. This wasn't a blackhawk n/t.

[ellisonz]

43. They'd need some serious RPGs to do that on the quick and cheap ala Mogadishu.

Here's to creativity! I hope they don't succeed but the faster this ends the better.

:(

[saigon68]

44. They apparently are learning from experience

Or as the Chimp says, "BRING EM ON".

[yellowcanine]

38. Seems the Sunnis have acquired a supply of stinger missiles from somewhere. Not good.

Those choppers are sitting ducks for a shoulder fired rocket.

[saigon68]

42. They are dropping like flies

[saigon68]

45. The identification posted by Ansar was that of Arthur Laguna, 52, a pilot for Blackwater.