Chavez Says Attacks on Bush Not Personal

[951-Riverside]

:loveya: :hug:

CARACAS, Venezuela -- Hugo Chavez has called President Bush a devil, a donkey and a drunkard. But on Wednesday the Venezuelan leader said his comments were "nothing personal."

Chavez, who had stepped up his verbal assault during Bush's Latin American tour this week, suggested that the two adversaries might eventually overcome their differences and even play a game of dominos or baseball together.

"One day, if maybe George Bush and I survive all of this, we will reach old age, and it would be good to play a game of dominos, street baseball," Chavez said on his weekday radio program.

But he said his comments about the American leader were "nothing personal" and that his opposition to Bush was due to "deep ethical, political, historic and geopolitical" reasons.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/14/AR2007031402789_pf.html

[flyingfysh]

1. that's OK

We in the US can supply all the personal attacks needed. :-)

[truthisfreedom]

2. What a goofball.

[carla]

9. Deep, intellectual response...

NOT!

[Orsino]

35. Chavez is not a deep intellectual...

...and his attempt at disingenuity is clumsy. His insults have been profoundly personal, and he should own them (as they are also accurate).

In many ways, Chavez is well-intentioned, but is is sort of a goofball--which in no way disqualifies him from passing judgment on *.

[rman]

40. Anyone who's not a warmonger is in a position to pass judgment on Bush

In the mean time, Chavez reads Chomsky, Bush reads My Pet Goat.

[1932]

3. "...his opposition to Bush was due to "deep ethical, political, historic and geopolitical" reasons"

I've just watched two documentaries about Venezual from Google videos, and they explain those ethical, political, historic and geopolitical differences.

One was The Revolution Will Not Be Televised & the other was Venezuela Bolivariana.

They're excellent.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

4. .

[1932]

5. Indeed it is!

Cheers.

[majorjohn]

6. Don't worry about it Mr. Chavez, you're fine! n/t

[David__77]

7. I sincerely hope Bush can reform himself.

Like the old Chinese emporer in "The Last Emperor." But it would probably take penal remedies to facilitate Bush's reform.

[anotherdrew]

18. if he can't he can always become the american version of roman emperor Valerian

he's make a good foot stool wouldn't he?

Persians that time too, go figure.

[Bonobo]

8. They forgot my favorite..."More dangerous than a monkey with a razor"

[gorbal]

10. "Democracy Now" has some great coverage

http://www.democracynow.org/index.pl?issue=20070312

I also like John Stewarts take. (If you watch the recent "Daily Show" Vids)

[UTUSN]

11. Shoot!!1 The dude can't do anything correctly by me: I *liked* that they were PERSONAL!!1

& his wanting to hang out with Shrub is EXACTLY what's wrong. What he really wants is ACCEPTANCE. I've said before, I detest BOTH of them!!1

[Judi Lynn]

12. What evidence do you have that he wants to hang out with the thing?

I think he was showing he's not getting bogged down by hatred toward someone who tried to destroy him several different ways, unlike _Bush who kept yammering "He tried to kill my daddy" about Hussein, while he brutally savaged the children, young and very old people of Iraq.

What evidence do you have he wants acceptance? I'll bet he wants support from his own country, and others in Latin America. It's also plain to see _Bush couldn't be more hated and despised there than he is now.

Could be they're all having a good laugh at the reception _Bush got almost universally during his trip. No one really seem to warm to him anywhere, even in Colombia, Guatemala, and Mexico.

[UTUSN]

14. What part of playing dominoes & baseball together is not seeking acceptance.

You know me: You know I will never be converted to St Hugo's cult following, so let's just stop here.

[Judi Lynn]

15. And you believe he actually thought Venezuelans will take from his remarks that he WANTS

to play dominoes with _Bush? Who doesn't grasp rhetoric?

_Bush would need an advisor playing a complex game like dominoes.

I don't care if you are "converted" to "St. Hugo's cult following," whatever that is. Not particularly important.

By the way, we've had earlier tools who used to gibber at people who support Cuba's independence as being "Castro lovers." It's all the same thing. We've all heard this attempt at character assassination since the early days of red-baiting. It's nothing to be proud of.



The late, discredited, drunkard right-wing Senator Joe McCarthy.

[UTUSN]

19. Now, now, I've always respected you and we agree on other things.

You have never engaged in the vicious flaming that emanates from other Hugo/Fidel/AMLO followers. I hope "earlier tools" is not referring to me as a tool, or that pic of that a-hole. And we've seen the authoritarian denial-to-others of having differing OPINIONS throughout the St Hugo followers.

As for demonizing people we dislike, that's what we do. Why do I call Shrub "Shrub" (and worse)? It is very unfair for you to imply that if I don't like St Hugo I must not be a very good Dem.

In all the flame wars, I have never personally attacked other DUers, have DEFENDED myself. And do NOT respond that I am attacking YOU. I am talking mostly (except the 1st paragraph) about your other Hugo followers who flame.

By the way, after seeing how Hugo-ites flame, I have concluded (wished) that they ought to DECLARE who they are: Socialists? What background to they have? Have they lived in Latin America? Are they acolytes of some geology professor at an Ivy League school?

The Democratic Party label covers a wide spectrum of sometimes loosely allied groups. I have voted for every Democratic nominee from prez on down to county and city without exception, and the roster covers conservative-to-liberal Demos, so long as they were under the Dem label and not 3rd party.

Sometimes somebody's opinion (mine) is just what it is and is SELF-CONTAINED, needing NO discussion.

[vote5polend]

22. simple

id want to bet hard against bush and take his money in dominoes. its not seeking acceptance, its beating him and taking his money.

[ProudDad]

26. I don't know that you'll ever be "converted"

but no one here has ever said he was "Saint Hugo"...

Many here do lament the accident of birth that gave us the shrub instead of Hugo Chavez...

But, that's ok, I don't mind being part of the underground resistance to the capitalist monster...

[UTUSN]

33. Why yes you HAVE, not in words "Saint Hugo" but in TOTAL UNCRITICAL ACCEPTANCE

of that fellow.

What/who laments "the accident of birth that gave us the shrub instead of Hugo Chavez"???

Who on EARTH would want to trade CALIGULA for NERO? To me, those two dudes are THE SAME.


Forget about the "capitalist monster." When you see a Chinese/Mexican/African/MiddleEast/European/WHATEVER marketplace, it's DARWIN and it's REALITY.

[gratuitous]

16. Not personal at all

Just like the failed coup attempt in 2002 against Chavez, backed, financed and hastily recognized by the Bush junta, was nothing personal against Chavez.

I love the way Mr. Chavez plays the game. After all, Ann Coulter's remarks weren't anything personal against John Edwards. And why did those Abu Ghraib prisoners take all that torture and abuse personally? They're so thin-skinned! And don't get me started on John Kerry's overreaction to the Swift Boat Veteran for Truth! Boy, talk about being unable to take a joke, huh?

Chavez has the Repressive Right's self-serving hypocritical patter down.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

36. Hm. As a shrink, you're an excellent... what is it that you do for a living anyway? -nt

[MAGICBULLET]

13. he's an ASS

it's either chavez or absolutely nothing to him...if you disagree with him, he rants and shuts you down and then fingerpoints dumbass dubya for being corrupt.

[1932]

20. You talk about him like he's your brother-in-law or your ex-wife.

What are you basing those opinions on?

[MAGICBULLET]

21. Yea, sorry I don't have a link to base my opinion on

Maybe I just have family and friends there who are getting sick of his shit. I think we can just agree to disagree with this, I don't want to dissuade anyone from liking him if they feel he's doing great things. I just feel he's not the savior of Venezuela, even less Latin America just because he has oil and provides little programs for the poor to keep them pacified. The truth is, there is still a lot of poverty and he's been in power since 1998. How would you feel if Bush wanted to change the constitution to keep himself in office for another 6 years?? Only time will tell and I could be very wrong, I hope so, in this case. I just don't have this overhwlming faith in him. The Peruvians didn't want him meddling in their elections either, and that didn't work too well for Ollanta Humala, did it ?

[ProudDad]

27. If you want to post an intelligent criticism

of Sr. Chavez, you might try educating yourself about his life, history and philosophy.

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?z=y&EAN=9781920888008&itm=1

Just make sure you buy the book from your local bookseller!

[1932]

32. Ok, so no facts?

And, by the way, Venezuela, just like the US, has a process for amending the constitution.

And, in the '70s when there was an ERA movement, would you have called women who supported it despots because they wanted to change the constitution?

Humala had problems for which Chavez is hardly responsible. But if you want to measure Chavez by how well other left wing candidates are doing in Latin America, then I'd have to say that Chavez is probably the most incredible liberal politician elected to his or her country's highest office this planet has seen.

[Warren Stupidity]

38. provides little programs for the poor

'little programs for the poor'? Like education housing land and healthcare? Those little programs? I see your point. Fuck the poor. Damnit the oligarchy are losing their estates and their corrupt gravy train! This has to stop!

[Warren Stupidity]

37. what are you talking about?

[Virginia Dare]

17. Yes, they'll one day play a friendly game of dominos..

At Bush's Paraguayan compound, the one he was forced to flee to, in order to avoid criminal charges in the U.S.

[POAS]

23. Isn't that what the capo says

right before he pulls the trigger? "Nothing personal, it's just business".

[0rganism]

24. "It's nothing personal, you filthy reeking asshole of a mangy capitalist running-dog!"

"No hard feelings, okay? Now bend over..."

This Hugo Chavez, he is a funny man. :D

[happydreams]

25. LOL! Nice one. I was thinking the same thing.

Hugo would never engage in personal attacks against the war-mongering, megalomaniacal piece of shrubery.

[TheConstantGardener]

28. Little in world affairs is personal

^_^

[ProudDad]

29. It's not surprising that the Knee-Jerk Chavez haters

with no facts to base their opinions on don't understand Sr. Chavez.

He's basically a happy person, not given to revenge unlike the fascist shit in the White House who's ALL ABOUT revenge.

Frankly, whether you like Chavez or not, he's still the best hope for a viable, sustainable socio/economic system going.


And, FYI, I'm a Socialist. I believe in a modicum of little-c capitalism (small family enterprises) but definitely NOT the corporate capitalist cancer metastasizing in the United States.

[Judi Lynn]

30. He does genuinely seem to like people in general, unlike the anal, furtive, selfish right-wingers.nt

[Unvanguard]

31. Can you play "street baseball" in a cell in The Hague?

:)

[MilesColtrane]

34. I'm sure the Primate Pretender wouldn't play baseball.

He would, however, be happy to dress up in his old cheerleading outfit and root for the home team.

[ProudDad]

39. the shrub should have stayed in his seat

in the Rangers' ballpark.

He hit his Peter Plateau there. Just sittin' and talkin' to the fans and rootin' for the home team. That's where they put his fat ass and, for the sake of the world, that's where he should have stayed...

Alas...



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_principle

"The Peter Principle is a colloquial principle of hierarchiology, stated as "In a hierarchy every employee tends to rise to his level of incompetence." Formulated by Dr. Laurence J. Peter in his 1968 book of the same name, the Peter Principle pertains to the level of competence of the human resources in a hierarchical organization. The principle explains the upward, downward, and lateral movement of personnel within a hierarchically organized system of ranks."

[Judi Lynn]

41. Great Op-Ed in the NY Times: What We See in Hugo Chávez

Op-Ed Contributor
What We See in Hugo Chávez

By LUISA VALENZUELA
Published: March 17, 2007
Buenos Aires

THE fervent welcome that greeted President Hugo Chávez of Venezuela during his visit to Argentina a week ago was inexplicable to some Argentines and left others indignant. Many here tend to mistrust populism and demagoguery, finding them redolent of Peronism. But even among the wary, a window of hope has opened, with Mr. Chávez as its symbol.

A lot of water has passed under the bridge since Juan Perón’s time. And it was the expansive waters of our own broad river that defined the vectors of force last weekend. For once, the tensions in the American hemisphere flowed on an east-west axis along the Río de la Plata — which means “River of Silver” and by extension, very appropriately in this case, “River of Money.”

The struggle was about energy, both concrete and metaphorical, and equally combustible in both forms. Across the river in Uruguay’s capital, Montevideo, the presence of President George W. Bush caused red-hot passions to flare, along with sizable protests like those he faced in Brazil. In Buenos Aires, my city, on the opposite bank of that river of money, red abounded as well, though in our case it had a very different connotation. Red was the color of President Chávez’s jacket and of many of the flags brought by the masses who flooded into a stadium to hear the president of Venezuela speak.

Unlike the homogenous rallies of Peronist times, the 30,000 people in this crowd came from very diverse backgrounds. In Argentina, the economic crisis of December 2001 significantly altered not only our social dynamic but our semantics. We no longer talk about the “pueblo” — which means town or village as well as people. Now we talk about the “gente,” which also means people, but with a different nuance, derived as it is from the Latin gens meaning race, clan or breed.

The new vocabulary transcends distinctions of class: the middle classes have now merged with the poor to demand their rights. Hence many students and professionals were in attendance that day, not necessarily attracted by the figure of President Chávez himself so much as by the anti-imperialist opportunity he symbolized. We Argentines, who once imagined ourselves more sophisticated, or more European, than the citizens of neighboring states, were brought closer to the rest of the continent by our impoverishment, and we find ourselves more open to the idea of pan-Latin American solidarity.
(snip/...)

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/17/opinion/17valenzuela.html?em&ex=1174363200&en=51b6b24645bdccb6&ei=5087%0A

On edit, located photos of the Argentinian author, Luisa Valenzuela:





Biographical notes:

Luisa Valenzuela

Luisa Valenzuela (born 1938) is an Argentine writer of both fiction and journalistic works. She is among her nation's most significant writers, best known for the style of writing that blends magical and fantastic elements into prose known as magical realism, a style often associated with Latin-American writers such as Gabriel García Marquez and Julio Cortazar. Valenzuela is also one of the most widely translated female South American writers. As Naomi Lindstrom wrote in World Literature Today, Valenzuela "hascreated numerous narratives in which authoritarian rule in society is mirrored by patriarchal domination in relations between men and women."
(snip)

http://www.answers.com/topic/luisa-valenzuela

[Judi Lynn]

42. A look at the same event from a different author:

Chavez vs Bush in Latin America: No contest


John Catalinotto, Buenos Aires
16 March 2007

US President George Bush has been touring Latin American countries this March with two goals in mind: keep the continent divided and keep it subservient to US imperialist interests. Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has also been visiting his neighbours. His goals are the opposite: to unite the countries of Latin America and to encourage and support the continent’s independence from US imperialism.

On March 9, the two presidents were faced off on opposite sides of the river separating Argentina and Uruguay. Bush had just arrived in Uruguay, where he was driven in a well-armoured limousine caravan, protected from a strong demonstration protesting the visit. Chavez, after signing a treaty with Argentine President Nestor Kirchner on cooperation between the two countries’ energy companies, spoke to a public meeting of 40,000 people in the Cancha de Ferro soccer field in Buenos Aires.

As the work day in the Argentine capital ended, residents from Buenos Aires and its working-class suburbs began to pour into the stadium. Coming in chartered buses, by public transport and on foot, they represented dozens of parties and organisations, from the Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo to unions and community organisations. There were also visitors and immigrants from Paraguay, Chile and Uruguay (there were many Uruguayan flags) — plus at least two anti-imperialists from the United States.

Even from the middle-class apartment block behind the stadium, people had hung a Brazilian and other national flags to show their solidarity with the pro-Chavez, anti-Bush demonstration.
(snip/...)

http://www.greenleft.org.au/2007/703/36497