UK ready to produce Iran evidence

[sabra]

Source: BBC

The government is preparing to release photographic evidence to support its assertion that 15 UK sailors seized by Iran were not in Iranian waters.

...

The BBC's political editor Nick Robinson said preparations are in place for a news conference at the Ministry of Defence where photographs of the moments when the Britons were captured will be revealed.

BBC diplomatic correspondent James Robbins said the UK could confront Iran directly with satellite pictures and other evidence to show the personnel had not strayed into Iranian territorial waters.

...

Downing Street has said that up to now the UK has been attempting to talk "discreetly" to the Iranians to secure the release of the Royal Navy personnel.

Read more: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6501555.stm

[babylonsister]

1. Why the hell didn't they do that to begin with? nt

[Solo_in_MD]

8. They were giving the Iranians a chance to save face and backdown in private

[babylonsister]

12. So you think the Iranians didn't know video was involved? I think not;

this is a serious bunch of bull shit here.

[Solo_in_MD]

18. This is being done by the Mullahs and the Pasdaran...who answer to higher authorities, just ask them

The Iranians were aware that things were being monitored and what that monitoring would say. It clearly does not matter to them. They took the Brits captive for a reason, and it has nothing to do with disputed territorial waters. What they want is yet to be known publically.

[babylonsister]

21. So being the wealth of info that you are, I hope you share the

results you might find; it might not have to do with disputed territorial waters, but lots to do with politics.
We all shall see.

[Henny Penny]

28. "The Iranians were aware that things were being monitored"...

So does that mean they knew they'd be vindicated?

Seems that we can't take anything at face value.

[Solo_in_MD]

29. I don't think they cared, since they have a specific goal in mind

At the very least there were going to be radar plots from the frigate nearby. They should have also known about satellites and other surveillance assets that would have coverage of the events. It will be interesting to see what all they release and what they don't. Much of it will come from American sources.

The inspections have been going on for some time in the same location. The mullahs and the Pasdaran chose this time to grab the inspection team. One has to wonder:
- Why now and not in the past
- Why the Pasdaran, not the regular Iranian navy
- Why the threats of trials as spies
- Why the unwillingness to release them after a token time
- Why the unwillingness to allow access (this may be changing)
- Why announce interrogations

Something else is being sought by Iran that is not yet public knowledge. Maybe its the UN backing off, maybe its something esle. However since private talks have failed, going public is clearly escalation. If that does not solve the issue then military action clearly looms. Thats not such a good thing

[Demeter]

35. Or There Was a Bug in Photoshop; or Maybe the Ink Wasn't Dry

[Vidar]

22. It takes time to fabricate evidence.

[NuttyFluffers]

33. this is the most logical answer

the truth tends to be very easy to say.

waiting for a vial of baby powder and 'drawr'ings...

[IndianaGreen]

2. The Blair government has so much credibility that...

the entire world will be mesmerized by its claims.

:sarcasm:

[BayCityProgressive]

3. Why didn't they show them that day?

because they were busy forging the pictures of course.

[Solo_in_MD]

10. They were giving Iran a chance to back down in private

It doesn't take that long to forge a picture...just ask Reuters.

[leftynyc]

32. It amazes me how so many on this board are

willing to believe the Iranians. I can see being skeptical of anything bush and blair say and do but believe Iran without pause??? I find it embarassing.

[katsy]

36. It has less to do with believing Iranians than not believing...

the liars in power here and the U.K.

Demanding irrefutable proof from these criminals is a natural a prudent demand. Mushroom clouds and wmds.. indeed.

The poodle and the chimp have no one to blame but themselves when people can't trust them and the skeptics need not apologize to anyone.

[Imagevision]

4. Tony leaves office next month, tsk-tsk-tsk...

[Kagemusha]

5. Blair and Iran differ on what constitutes Iranian waters anyway.

Just because they have GPS coordinates doesn't mean that Iran won't still say it's Iranian waters. Blair, OTOH, seems to be using Saddam's maps.

[Alcibiades]

6. I suspect that if an Iranian ship

were that close to the US or UK, their sailors would be exactly where the British sailors are now.

[Imagevision]

7. I still remember when Blair produced evidence on Iraq... then apologized...

[Purveyor]

9. I believe! Really, really really...I do! LOL... / chuckle /smirk /grin.... eom

[Monkeyman]

11. hmmm you do huh lol

[WillParkinson]

13. Produce?

Or manufacture?

[azurnoir]

14. The Brits themselves did not know for sure

This is an article from Saturday, CNN interviews a British officer who was there, he's confused as to whether or not they were in Iranian waters.
http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/03/23/iran.uk/index.html

[Solo_in_MD]

20. To the contrary, its sounds like the Brits were sure but gave the face saving way out to the Iran

that the Pasdaran might have made an honest mistake

[babylonsister]

25. LINK? nt

[Solo_in_MD]

27. Sure...

From http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/03/23/iran.uk/index.html

Lambert said there is "absolutely no doubt in my mind" that the marines were in Iraqi waters. But, he said, "The extent and the definition of territorial waters in this part of the world is very complicated... We may well find, and I hope we find, that this is a simple misunderstanding at a tactical level," he said.

"There hopefully has been a mistake that's been made, and we'll see early clarification and early release of my people."

Pretty clear that the Brits were confident in their location and were giving the Iranians an easy out, which the mullahs and the Pasdaran have chosen not to use.

[muriel_volestrangler]

34. 'Lambert said there is "absolutely no doubt in my mind" that the marines were in Iraqi waters

But, he said, "The extent and the definition of territorial waters in this part of the world is very complicated... We may well find, and I hope we find, that this is a simple misunderstanding at a tactical level," he said.'

In other words, he's blaming the Iranians for making a mistake. He's not saying he's confused at all.

[azurnoir]

37. I took this part as meaning some confusion

Lambert said there is "absolutely no doubt in my mind" that the marines were in Iraqi waters. But, he said, "The extent and the definition of territorial waters in this part of the world is very complicated... We may well find, and I hope we find, that this is a simple misunderstanding at a tactical level," he said.

I have also read that they were taken in an area of river deltas, some boundaries are not as written in stone as maps would have you believe or in certain conditions shift, that is why borders between some gulf countries in the Arabian desert are dotted lines.
My take on situation is that in more "normal" times, before the ratchet up by all countries concerned this would have been a far more common happening and no arrests would have been made, but right now everyone is on red alert,did the Iranians jump the gun? Maybe so, maybe no the Brit commander could not say I am not sure we were, so instead he says "it's so complicated".
Unfortunately due to political conditions no one will admit to a mistake.

[daleo]

15. How about the evidence that Saddam had WMD?

Didn't Blair promise to produce that once, too?

[msongs]

16. photoshop is a wunnerful program. do they have it in the UK? hmmm. nt

[Colobo]

17. I'm with the UK on this one.

[aquart]

19. And we can trust it because they've been so truthful about Iraq.

[Canuckistanian]

23. Don't push them - they might do it

Oooo, I'm scared. They wouldn't DARE release the EVIDENCE that they were right in the first place.

Why, just you wait... they have PHOTOS and everything!

And not PhotoShopped at all! Nosirree! The Gen-U-Wine article!

Just don't pressure them.

[Amused Musings]

24. Frankly,

I am very scared that this could escalate into something much worse. Should anything happen, Iran probably has agents within the US and definitely in Iraq and Europe. The attacks Iran will unleash are more terrifying than most because they have the infrastructure and the money to repeat attacks in a short time. Notice how Al-Qaeda takes so long between operations. Things will get hot very fast. If we thought that Iraq is a disaster now, Iran will ratchet up the mayhem to new levels of death and destruction. It is sad really, because Iran has actually done more than any other country in legitimizing Iraq and helping the struggling country (they have also done a lot of bad things too- but we shouldnt have been there in the first fucking place).

[muryan]

26. normally id be skeptical of this

but giving irans track record, including the kidnapping of british soldiers back in 2003 for no legitimate reason...this seems to be a repeat. they were inspecting a merchant ship in two individual lifeboats, you dont just go cruising into hostile waters on what essentially amounts to a raft compared to the destroyer they came from. No real reason to think that they were actually in iranian water, and despite current leadership id take the word of the UK over Iran's anyday of the week

[maddezmom]

30. Turk diplomats may visit detained UK sailors -TV

Turk diplomats may visit detained UK sailors -TV
28 Mar 2007 08:37:35 GMT
Source: Reuters
Alert Me | Printable view | Email this article | RSS <-> Text <+>

ANKARA, March 28 (Reuters) - Turkish diplomats may be allowed to visit British military personnel detained in Iran, CNN Turk television quoted Turkish Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan as saying at a meeting of the Arab League in Saudi Arabia.

British Foreign Secretary Margaret Beckett discussed the plight of the 15 personnel in talks with Erdogan in Ankara on Tuesday. Turkey, which shares a border with Iran, said it would do all it could to help its NATO ally.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L28121735.htm

[HuffleClaw]

31. suuuure they are

took a bit to PRODUCE it though of course.

[angstlessk]

38. Let's not forget the satellite evidence of Iraq troops amassing at

the Saudi boarder...so they allowed us to set up bases inside Saudi Arabia. BOGUS!!!