Chicken Pox Hits School (All Victims Vaccinated)

[LeighAnn]

Source: Independence (MO) Examiner

A Blue Springs elementary school is dealing with a chickenpox outbreak, even though all of the infected children have had the vaccine.

Leslie Evans, public information director for the Blue Springs School District, said nine children at Sunny Pointe Elementary have been sent home over the past week with chickenpox. Two additional students have been sent home with suspected cases.
Evans said all of the children with confirmed cases have been vaccinated.
However, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says no vaccine is 100 percent effective. The CDC estimates that 8 to 9 out of every 10 people vaccinated are completely protected.

For those who do get the chickenpox after being vaccinated, "it is usually a very mild case with fewer skin lesions lasting only a few days."

(Little more at link)

Read more: http://examiner.net/stories/033007/new_033007004.shtml

[buddysmellgood]

1. So we hit the lottery in Blue Springs OR we've been sold a drug.

[proud2BlibKansan]

2. I saw this on my local news

One of these kids was very very sick.

[tblue]

3. I heard they're supposed to get a booster, but I forget at what age

Wow. That's freaky. And I have a vaccinated kid, too. I still have scars from when I had it as a kid.

[Bozita]

4. Welcome to the Big Pharma Lotto

My mind runs wild at the possibilities.

[barb162]

5. I wonder if it's a new strain of chickenpox?

[tiptoe]

7. (how 'bout the vaccine used?)

[tiptoe]

6. Hmmm ...might these kids have been vaccinated during time of *Co mal-administration?

FEMA == *C0 FEMA (Katrina, indifference to people's lives)
EPA == *Co EPA (Scientific reports being modified by moral/neocon-MIC-saboteur morons)
FDA == *Co FDA (Rumsfeld link to Tamiflu...and previously, to Aspartame)
USDA == *Co USDA (Mad Cow assininity)
CDC == *Co CDC ??? (something curiously red-herring about a statement like "8 out 9 people are completely protected" in the context of NINE illnesses in ONE location)

[librechik]

8. virus developed resistance to inoculation?

that would be bad news...

[intaglio]

9. The big problem ain't the Chickenpox

It is the shingles years later - and I speak as someone who has suffered

[Sadie4629]

10. I've had shingles, too

I was lucky. Mine was a mild case, lasted a week or less, and the major problems was localized itching and mild pain.

Question: Will the chicken pox vaccine (when effective) eliminate the possibility of shingles--or, since the vaccine a comprised of virus, can the body react to the vaccine in the same way it does to the actual virus?

[Straight Shooter]

11. Shingles. At first I thought I was breaking out with poison ivy or poison oak.

That is, until the shingles went into full assault and I started lying in bed at night, clenching my teeth because it hurt so damn bad. Fortunately, it only went up my side and lasted maybe 3 weeks. 3 very long weeks. My neighbor's shingles went internal and damaged her nerves. She was in agony for 2 years, and finally the shingles seems to have abated.

A lot of people just don't realize how serious and life-threatening shingles can be, as in the case of someone I know whose shingles crawled up the nerves in his neck and he ended up in the hospital.

Chicken pox was bad enough as a kid, but shingles can be absolute hell. This is why adults are told to stay away from kids with chicken pox, to my understanding, because it can reactivate the chicken pox as shingles.

[nealmhughes]

12. I had shingles at 35, thought I would die from the pain. I asked my son a few years later,

"What did I do, did I even eat when I was so sick?" He said, "You got out of bed once a day to go to the bathroom and I made you some soup in the afternoon and you asked for spaghetti once." That was 2 weeks of hell on earth, popping pain medication and moaning.

Both of my lower legs are still scarred 10 years later from that.

[Straight Shooter]

14. I'm so sorry, you had one of the more awful cases.

I read in GQ one time that shingles is considered one of the top 10 painful experiences a person can have, and I think only pancreatitis was more painful. Pancreatitis, by the way, has been compared to a vicious, sharp-clawed animal trying to fight its way out of your gut.

:hug:

[Tracer]

16. Chicken Pox = Shingles = Cold Sores

If you've had chicken pox (Herpes Zoster) you're vulnerable to shingles and cold sores (Herpes Simplex 1), since they are all in the same viral family.

I should know. I'm suffering from a huge cold sore right now.

I happened to have a regular doctor's appointment on Thursday and asked him about a vaccine that's supposed to prevent shingles, and whether it would have any effect on preventing cold sores.

He said that there hasn't been enough testing or data to prove its efficacy one way or the other.

[Straight Shooter]

20. You know about Lysine, don't you?

A doctor recommended it to me years ago. I think it's 1000 mg a day, but I could be wrong, and it helps to keep the virus dormant unless extreme stress or sun triggers it, or whatever your personal triggers are. If you do have a breakout, eat Lysine like it's candy, (I've taken as many as 20 in a day), and it keeps it from turning into a monster. I used to get cold sores regularly, and always at the worst time, and in the last 10 years have only had a couple tiny ones, even when I don't take Lysine regularly like I'm supposed to.

Also, tea tree oil, dabbed lightly on it, at the first sign of tingling and afterwards, helps to heal it faster.

Some people, it seems no matter what, will break out and just have to ride out the storm.

Good luck. You definitely have my sympathy :)

[all.of.me]

28. i take mass amounts of lysine for herpes breakouts.

if it's a bad episode, the lysine doesn't seem to work, so i take homeopathic rhus tox every hour to speed up the process. i try to suppress it with lysine, but if that doesn't work, i speed it up with rhus tox. the older i get, though, the fewer and less severe the breakouts are.

[rosesaylavee]

51. THIS is a better remedy - Apple Cider Vinegar

Pour apple cider vinegar on cotton balls. Apply to shingles or chicken pox or cold sore (or areas that feel like they are in pre-emergent mode). Carefully dispose of cotton so others won't touch and get contaminated. Allow to air dry sores without rinsing (or dry with hair dryer). Repeat every 6 or 12 hours. Itching should be relieved almost immediately, with sores scabbed over within 24 hours or less.

I have had shingles 2x so far, and this has worked for me both times. My son had two bouts of chicken pox. Worked both times for him. This is only anecdotal - but would recommend it as it won't hurt, there are no side effects. I am guessing it is vinegar's anti-viral properties that make this work.

[mopinko]

23. valtrex and deniver

work very well for me. i took valtrex for about a year, and never had a cold sore the whole time. i take it twice a day for 4 days when i feel that dreaded tingle. if i catch it quickly enough, it will not break out at all. if i don't, the deniver shuts it down.
it's a real mercy.

[Straight Shooter]

37. Thanks for this info. I'm going to pass it along to a friend.

A gal I know told me that even lysine doesn't help her. She runs a retail business and it's important for her to always look good in public.

I never heard of valtrex or deniver. Learn something new every day :)

[mopinko]

38. just a bit more info

that deniver is an ointment, and it can shut them down pretty well by itself, if you can resist the itch. someone here recommended ice, as well. last one i had, i tried it, but it didn't work for me. any kind of touching or itching makes them worse, even if it is an ice cube.
i don't know how common the knowledge that valtrex can be used this way is. it is usually prescribed as a daily preventive med.
good luck to your friend. i hate these damn things.

[Straight Shooter]

42. Oh, I see, these are prescriptions. RXmeds to the rescue, then.

http://www.rxmedslist.com/buy/online/Denavir.shtml (1 tube, 2 gram, spendy @ $70)

Yikes! Valtrex costs even more.
http://www.rxmedslist.com/buy/online/valtrex.shtml

She doesn't have a lot of money, her store is small and she barely gets by. I think I'll recommend the Denavir because ointment would last a long time, and perhaps the rhus tox as a homoeopathic, too.

Thanks! :hi:

[mopinko]

44. a tube of denavir will get you through

maybe 3 outbreaks. although the valtrex is expensive, a bottle of 30 will get you through 5 or 6.

denavir is cheaper at costco- $35 for 2 gram, $96 for 6 gram.
valtrex is more there. sigh.
i am a lucky stiff, with good insurance.

[Straight Shooter]

46. Thank you.

I think she has a Costco card. I'll let her know, and at least she'll have more options than before.

:hi:

[LeighAnn]

24. Shingles Vaccine

This is from the National Institute of Health

In May 2006, the Food and Drug Administration approved use of a vaccine to prevent shingles. The vaccine, called Zostavax, is recommended for people 60 years of age and older who have had chickenpox but who have not had shingles. Researchers estimate the vaccine could prevent 250,000 cases of shingles that occur in the United States each year and significantly reduce the severity of the disease in another 250,000 cases annually.

So it hasn't been out long, true, but here's an article that says it's good stuff but doctors aren't using it because the cost is prohibitive

http://pharmalot.com/2007/02/doctors_balk_at_cost_of_merck.php

Edited to fix blockquote

[yorkiemommie1]

47. I just got my shot this week

cost me $171 here in SoCal.

My neighbor was charged $225.

[elehhhhna]

31. A buddy of mine got shingles/adult chicken pox that were in his

mucous membranes (mouth, throat, eyelids, and further south--he was MISERABLE) His prescription for his glasses changed because of it, as well...he couldn't wear contacts for about a year.

[young_at_heart]

18. My husband got shingles in his eye......really dangerous

He has been on anti-viral medication for nearly two years now and will probably have to stay on it the rest of his life. At first we thought he had poison ivy.....there was a spot near his eye and that is what it looked like. After a week it migrated to his retina. This can cause blindness.

[hedgehog]

33. Similar thing happened to my mother-in-law.

I think she ended up with scarring on her corneas.

[DemoTex]

39. Mom: 6 weeks now in hospital with esophageal shingles and MRSA.

Few things are as painful as shingles of the mouth, throat, and esophagus. Morphine hardly dents it. She also has an MRSA (mesicillin resistant staph) infection on her back. She has come close to death several times in the past few weeks, but seems now to be getting marginally better.

[donsu]

13. someone should investigate if the sick children got their shots

from the same place and or the same drug lot

[Recursion]

40. Vaccination is ONLY ONE component of disease prevention but pharma sells it as the only thing

Simply vaccinating a population is not sufficient to control most diseases -- public health measures like sanitation, hygiene, and nutrition are just as important. Unlike those other components, vaccination makes rich people richer, so it's what gets pushed as the only important thing, and dries up all the money for public health.

[rainbow4321]

15. Whooping cough outbreak at one of our area schools (kids were immunized)

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/localnews/stories/DN-whoopingcough_31cco.ART.North.Edition1.44c3271.html

A whooping cough outbreak has a Plano private school on alert.

Antibiotics have been recommended for the entire first grade of Prestonwood Christian Academy in hopes of curbing transmission of the illness, which has spread to more than 15 elementary students and other adult relatives, said Janet Glowicz, nurse epidemiologist for Collin County Health Care Services.

Ms. Glowicz said that recommendation might be made for other grades next week

All of the children infected have been immunized against whooping cough. But they're still coming down with a mild form of the condition as the protection appears to wane, Ms. Glowicz said.

[hedgehog]

19. Again, the problem is that no vaccine is 100% effective.

The problem is that when making up a batch, there is always a problem of ensuring that all the bacteria or viruses are disabled or killed without destroying their ability to train the immune system. Ironically, with the pertussis vaccine, the bacteria manufacture a toxin which causes the cough. This vaccine has a bad reputation for causing side effects because of the difficulty of filtering out 100% of the toxin.

The logic is this: immunize 100% of the population. If 10% is still unprotected by the vaccine they are given, at least they're protected because the people around them cannot catch and transmit the disease. It's why families of asthmatics are encouraged to get flu shots. Vaccinating the asthmatic is all well and good, but by vaccinating the people around him you add a second layer of protection. The theory of herd immunity only works if the herd is immunized.

[AnneD]

53. Back when Bush was pushing for health care workers

to get vaccinated for Small Pox (I outright refused direct orders!). this country was going through a SEVERE shortage of DPT vaccine. I was so bad they were only vaccinating infants and folks in the emergency rooms. This went on for almost 2 years while they were saying a crazed terrorist would release Small pox. Once they saw that health care workers weren't buying their brand of crazy, they put more of a priority on routine vaccines. I suspect these kids didn't get their booster, might be from another country, or had a diluted product.

[hedgehog]

17. If there were 200 kids in the school and 11 got sick, that's

about what you'd expect according to the CDC estimate of vaccine effectiveness. I'd be curious as to who was Patient Zero. Someone had to introduce live virus into the population. Dare I suggest that it was probably someone whose parents don't vaccinate?

[knitter4democracy]

25. Last year, in the NEJM, there was a study of a similar case.

Preschool epidemic, and patient zero had been vaccinated. They weren't sure where he'd gotten it. The sickest kids in the preschool were the ones who'd been vaccinated. It was the first time I read anywhere about needing boosters.

[hedgehog]

26. That is interesting.

As far as I know, only people carry the Herpes zoraster virus. If all the kids are vaccinated, where is it coming from? Do people with shingles shed the virus? Did a bad batch of vaccine get loose? It is a live virus vaccine, so it is possible to get the disease if the vaccine wasn't made properly. The current CDC recommendation is for 2 doses of the vaccine (http://www.cdc.gov/nip/publications/VIS/vis-varicella.pdf) Did these kids get the second dose?

[knitter4democracy]

36. That's the one I don't get, too.

The article was really interesting. They kept trying to figure out where the patient zero got it but couldn't find a reason. This was before the CDC changed the recommendation for a second dose.

Interesting story: when Hubby was in med school in his peds rotation at Rainbow Children's in Cleveland, he asked the attending (a high-up peds doc there) about the then-new vaccine. The attending told him that the only reason they came out with one was because of lost work days for parents. The problem has now become, though, that the booster has erased any economic benefit to parents. The attending was against the vaccine, saying that it hadn't erased all problems in Japan, where it's been in use longer, and that he didn't think it was worth the money.

I had started questioning what the attending had said until I read the journal article last year that said pretty much the same thing in the conclusion section, that a booster was going to erase all economic benefits and that obviously it's not a perfect vaccine.

The only other article on it I've seen this year was an interesting outbreak in Indiana amongst a Christian group with patient zero being a girl who had gotten it in Poland on a mission trip and then infected the church when she went to a welcome-home dinner for her, even though she had a fever and felt ill. Very few of the kids were vaccinated (faith reasons), and a few got quite ill and had to be hospitalized, but even several of the vaccinated kids got it.

[antigop]

43. NY TImes: Chickenpox Vaccine Loses Effectiveness in Study

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/15/health/15pox.html\\
>>
The chickenpox vaccine Varivax has changed the profile of the disease in the population, researchers are reporting.

In a study appearing Thursday in The New England Journal of Medicine, the researchers confirm what doctors have already known — that the vaccine has sharply reduced the number of cases in children but that its protection does not last long.

With fewer natural cases of the disease, the study says, unvaccinated children or those whose first dose of the vaccine fails to work are getting chickenpox later in life, when the risk of complications is higher.

“If you’re unvaccinated and you get it later in life, there’s a 20-times greater risk of dying compared to a child, and a 10- to 15-times greater chance of getting hospitalized,” said Dr. Jane Seward of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in Atlanta, who worked on the study.
>>

Varivax is made by Merck.

Did Merck know about this and did Merck inform the public?

I asked this question before on a different thread.

[Gormy Cuss]

50. I remember discussing this 'economic impact' argument with my colleagues

who were public health policy experts and epidemiologists. This was the first recommendation for mandated immunization based less on morbidity/mortality costs and more on the economic impact. Prior immunizations factored in the economic costs but as I recall this was the first recommendation where it was a major deciding factor. It's bad policy, IMHO.

[knitter4democracy]

56. Me too.

It's not that chicken pox is this totally benign disease, but I do think we're going to run into stuff years from now (or already are, from the sound of it) that is going to be an unexpected side effect, like worse shingles down the road.

[K8-EEE]

21. I let my girls get CP as children rather than

have them not keep up on the boosters and getting it when they're 30 and pregnant or something....

[postulater]

22. I wonder

how many of the unvaccinated kids got chicken pox.

[all.of.me]

29. i'd like to know that, too. nt

[ContraBass Black]

27. There's a vaccine for Chicken Pox?

Now I feel old, and I'm 22.

[hedgehog]

32. You probably had the chicken pox.

My youngest who is 16 had the chicken pox. Her cousins who are younger got the vaccine instead.

[AlCzervik]

35. there is but it's kind of new, maybe within the last 10 years or so. My daughter

is 12 and she ahsn't had the vaccine or the chicken pox yet.

[Justice]

30. my child got CP even though they had the vaccine.

milder case of CP though.

[hedgehog]

34. Did anyone here ever hear the old saw about how if shingles

wrap around your entire body and meet across your stomach, you'll die?

Shingles follow the nerves and nerves don't meet in front of your body, so it's physically impossible for them to meet across your stomach!

[kestrel91316]

41. Well, if they weren't immune before, they sure as hell will be NOW.

And for life.

I'm one of those weirdos who thinks it is unwise to try to eliminate all childhood diseases with immunizations. I also think lack of GI parasites contributes to Crohn's and Ulcerative Colitis. Heck, it's also possible that elimination of many kitten GI parasites leads THEM to be at increased risk of Inflammatory Bowel Disease.

No man is an island.
Bacteria are our friends (and viruses and worms, too).
Etc.

We evolved with these infectious disease agents, and they evolved with us. One might consider them to commensals-to-be.

[Gelliebeans]

45. Kestral

I have Crohns and an extremely screwy immune system. I have had shingles but mine have come back twice now probably because the immune system has to be artificially suppressed. I have often wondered about the whole parasites thingy. Do you have any links as I am deeply interested in this?

Thanks for the work you have been doing trying to stay abreast of the recall situation.

[kestrel91316]

48. Shingles..............hm. An interesting aside.................

I have suffered with cold sores most of the last 45 years. I even got trigeminal neuralgia and corneal pain and a big nasty tonsil and all sorts of chronic stuff, all on the right side of my face/head where I also always got the cold sores. Since I started taking L-lysine 2 1/2 yrs ago, everything is virtually normal. It's like a miracle.

The reason I am telling you this is that both cold sores and shingles/chicken pox are herpesviruses. Current theory on lysine with herpes is that it interferes with herpesvirus replication by blocking a receptor site for arginine. We use lysine in cats with herpesvirus (the most common feline respiratory virus and cause of eye problems) with varying degrees of success - it is my first line of defense with anything remotely suspected of being herpes in cats.

Anyway, I always wondered if it would make sense to treat shingles with lysine.................things that make me go HMMMMMMM. They do say that trigeminal neuralgia is very much like shingles pain, what with the herpesvirus in the nerves.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now about the worms and Crohn's:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=15591509&dopt=Citation

I think this research came about as a response to some Italian study several years ago that was mentioned in the AVMA Journal, IIRC. IOW, the results are extremely reproducible. WOW.

I like this quote I found elsewhere:
"....immunological dysfunction may result from insufficient exposure to certain organisms that activate a balanced immune system....."
See, I TOLD YOU ALL that bacteria are our friends!

[Gelliebeans]

57. Thanks for the link

I think you are right on the money about the L-lysine. I can't help but think that taking it in therapeutic doses will be beneficial and help keep herpeszoster dormant, I will tell the doctor next week. Herpeszoster is a horrible sleeping giant that awakes and causes havoc while it hangs around.

Isn't it ironic that patients are often given Flagyl as a first line of defense against Crohns being that is an anti-parasitic drug? I am surprised somewhat that these findings aren't in study for a type of vaccine especially for people with familial tendencies to develop CD or UC. I liked this quote, "These findings also support the premise that natural exposure to helminths such as T suis affords protection from immunological diseases like Crohn's disease."

Kestral you are so right, "Some bacteria are OUR friends"

Currently I am on Remicade because my body has been resistant to other drugs and therapies but I am always concerned about building up anti-bodies against the murine in Remicade. Understanding that I will not be helped by boosting my immune system is hard for some to understand. I use the analogy that I have a front line of little firefighters putting out hot spots and trying to keep things calm and cool within my immune system.

Just maybe it is exposure to the right bacteria in the first place that will avert over stimulation of the immune system that causes a war within ones own body.

You given me lots to pour over, thanks. :yourock:

[Pachamama]

49. I've always had this wild thought that what if having been exposed to Chickenpox & the Herpes virus

actually helped your body build up a resistance that will someday fight off some other "virus"...

I am more nervous these days about the "vaccinations" than I am about my kid getting Chickenpox....also, because of risk factors to my daughters health, especially in childbearing years, I'd rather she get exposed to Chickenpox as a child, than as a pregnant mom....

[AnneD]

54. I think folks have forgotten that prior to the advance of vaccines...

one child in four survived to adulthood. Don't believe me...go to an old cemetery. The reason why some kids don't get the disease is because we have so much 'herd immunity' (so many have been vaccinated). There is risk in any vaccine, but for a fact....THE VACCINE IS LESS SEVER THAN THE DISEASE.

:rant:

If the parent fuss about the vaccine, I give them the paperwork for them to file objections, but I know these folks that scream the loudest to exclude their precious will be the first to yell, scream, and threaten me if there is an outbreak and no vaccine.:nopity:: My POV...you should have gotten precious vaccinated when ya had the chance.:spank: They line up in third world countries to get this protection, yet folks here piss and moan about it. Just because we don't now have crowded conditions and unsanitary conditions now doesn't mean we won't one day (witness Katrina). I know how parents give their kids tylenol and send them to school with a raging temp and are totally ignorant about sanitation and the spread of disease-despite my teaching til I am blue in the face. If the government is smart-in a pandemic...schools will shut down first.

If I seem harsh, it is because I have seen more than one needless death that was preventable with a few pennies of vaccine. I don't give a rats ass about the drug companies but I do care about kids growing into adulthood. My precious will be going to college soon and you can bet her series will be updated and she will have the vaccine for encephalitis.

I'll get off my soap box and I apologize for my bluntness but an ounce of prevention is worth more than a tombstone.

[AnneD]

52. I have seen this problem happening in my school.

Several thing are a source of the vaccine failures.
1) the disease may not be chicken pox but Fifth's disease, esp if reported as a 'mild' case. Chicken pox, even a mild case will have pox in the mouth. I have noted that kids do have a milder case and it follow the dermetomes more. Seeing those pox in the mouth confirm it for me.
2) the vaccine is very temperature sensitive. It's efficacy goes down if exposed to heat. I suspect this is a BIG reason for vaccine failure.
3) some kids immune system fails to convert.

It has become hard for me to diagnose chicken pox these days, it really has chanced the outward symptoms. But the good news is pox's don't last as long and are milder.

Just my $0.02

[hedgehog]

55. I think we have to look at the individual vaccines and not discard the

entire concept of vaccination. For example, the campaign to vaccinate health care workers against small pox died when nurses took a look at the risks and stood up to ask whether they would be compensated for lost work days due to side effects. That's what killed that campaign

The chicken pox vaccine was pushed based on economic reasons because chicken pox never killed enough people to warrant mass inoculation to prevent people dying. I would edit that to never caused enough problems THAT WE KNOW OF to warrant mass inoculation. Once you have herpes sister, you have it for life. We know that if your immune system is stressed by age or whatever the virus can flair as shingles. Who knows what else this virus might cause? When 100% of the population has the virus, how are you going to spot the 0.05% who go on to develop other symptoms as time goes on? Maybe fibromylagia is tied to this virus, maybe schizophrenia is. We may learn some interesting facts as the first cohort to receive this protection ages out.

Even if this vaccine does nothing but prevent chicken pox, I think it's worth it. My kids had a miserable time with chicken pox, and one developed a fast moving secondary infection just when I thought she was over the worst.