Pelosi: Bill will put U.S. 'on road to energy independence

[cal04]

Source: Associated Press

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, anticipating final congressional action on energy legislation next week, said the bill will "put America on a road to energy independence," save people money at the gas pumps and increase the country's security.

In remarks prepared for the Democrats' weekly radio address on Saturday, Pelosi noted that the bill will require, for the first time in 32 years, an increase in automobile fuel efficiency to an average of 35 miles per gallon by 2020.

That, along with a requirement to use more ethanol as a motor fuel, "will strengthen our national security, protect consumers from spiraling energy prices, create jobs and ... tell the world that America is prepared to become a leader in addressing the global climate crisis," said Pelosi, D-California.

(snip)
"Congress has acted to put America on a road to energy independence with a new direction for energy security," Pelosi said in her radio remarks, excerpts of which were released Friday by her office.

Read more: http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/12/15/pelosi.radio.ap/index.html?section=cnn_latest

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Speaker Nancy Pelosi to Deliver Democratic Radio Address
http://www.dnc.org/a/2007/12/speaker_nancy_p_1.php

[European Socialist]

1. Makes me ill.

They threw solar and other renewables under the bus, when 90 percent of the public would agree that big oil should lose their subsidies and the tax breaks be given to renewables.

[leftchick]

2. ethanol is bullshit!

How about tax breaks/incentives for renewables like solar,wind etc? Fuck! More lipstick on a pig from Marie Antoinette Pelosi.

[Fearless]

3. Well it isn't bullshit...

It's just not ready for mass use. It needs to return to the research stage... But it primarily won't work anyways (other than because of net energy gained) because growing all the corn (or sugar beets) that you'll need for this will severely deplete the mid west of fresh water and California would become very dry. Of course we could buy it from Brazil as they destroy the Amazon further. But that would be the same problem anew.

Then again... electric cannot work either because first it usually comes from coal which pollutes. And more so because the national grid cannot hold the strain even if one in ten had electric cars.

Then there's hydrogen, which is stripped off of gasoline which presents the same problem...

Of course we could all go back to horses and donate the excrement for farming instead of using flourine-precipitating fertilizers.

Or we could go to an extensive train system, yet it's so very hard to come up with long narrow stretches of property without using eminent domain. Of course they already exist anyways, but the American mindset is against them for some reason...

I guess there's no simple answer.

[msongs]

4. umm hfow about electric batteries recharged by the sun? no coal required nt

[seriousstan]

6. The math doesn't support this idea, unless you are talking about weak-ass driveway lights.

[jpak]

26. A seriously uninformed statement

Global PV and solar electric generating capacity currently exceeds 9000 MW and is growing at >15% per year.

Germany will deploy >1000 MW of new PV capacity this year alone.

Megawatt-scale PV arrays are inaugurated here in the US and worldwide every week...

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/prnewswire/AQM06217122007-1.htm

"weak-assed" driveway lights it ain't...

[Fearless]

8. I was speaking about traditional electric cars...

Solar powered cars would be difficult for anyone who parks indoors I suppose. Otherwise I suppose the only drawback would be on how fast it would charge and how far you could drive it on that capacity. I would assume that you would want it to charge while driving as well. I doubt we could get effective enough solar panels to charge in real time, at least in the next two decades or so. It may be possible, at least for smaller cars, I don't know.

[IDemo]

7. Incorrect

Electric vehicles would pollute less than their equivalent internal combustion engined counterparts, even when coal power is factored in.

And the national grid could power more than 80 percent of today's light passenger vehicle fleet without a meltdown (from the Dept. of Energy).

I spelled it out in detail here -> http://journals.democraticunderground.com/IDemo/1

[Fearless]

15. I researched it and tried to be openminded...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2475345

[IDemo]

19. The experts have done all the math already

Argonne National Laboratory, a Department of Energy lab, generated the exhaustive GREET study
(Greenhouse Gases, Regulated Emissions, and Energy Use in Transportation) in 2003. The study
dealt with the life-cycle fuel analysis ('Well-to-Pump', and 'Well-to-Wheel') of multiple fuel sources
and vehicle systems. Here is a graph from GREET depicting per mile greenhouse gas emissions
for various fuel/vehicle systems (regular gasoline and diesel on the far left, battery-electric on the right):



Mileage From Megawatts: Study Finds Enough Electric Capacity To 'Fill Up' Plug-in Vehicles
Pacific Northwest National Laboratory, also a US Dept. of Energy lab, found that there is enough
excess generating capacity during the night and morning to allow more than 80 percent of today's
vehicles to make the average daily commute solely using this electricity. If plug-in-hybrid or
all-electric-car owners charge their vehicles at these times, the power needed for about 180 million cars
could be provided simply by running these plants at full capacity.

Debunking the Myth of EVs and Smokestacks
Because California has a mix of cleaner fuels and renewable sources, several studies have concluded
that improvements in air quality can be achieved easily by “plugging-in” to EVs.

The California Air Resources Board (CARB) estimates that EV’s operating in the Los Angeles Basin
would produce 98 percent fewer hydrocarbons, 89 percent fewer oxides of nitrogen, and 99 percent
less carbon monoxide than ICE vehicles.

In a study conducted by the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power, EVs are significantly cleaner
over the course of 100,000 miles than ICE cars. The electricity generation process produces less than
100 pounds of pollutants for EVs compared to 3000 pounds for ICE vehicles. See Table 3.



CO2 emissions are also significantly lower. Over the course of 100,000 miles, CO2 emissions from EVs
are projected to be 10 tons versus 35 tons for ICE vehicles.

Many EV critics remain skeptical of such findings because California’s mix of power plants is relatively
clean compared to that in the rest of the country. However, in Arizona where 67 percent of power plants
are coal-fired, a study concluded that EVs would reduce greenhouse gases such as CO2 by 71 percent.

Similar comparisons to those in California and Arizona can be found in the Northeastern part of the
country where the majority of power plants are coal-fired.

A study conducted by the Union of Concerned Scientists found that EVs in the Northeast would reduce
CO emissions by 99.8 percent, volatile organic compounds (VOC) by 90 percent, NOx by 80 percent, and
CO2 by as much as 60 percent.

According to a Northeast States for Coordinated Air Use Management (NESCAUM) study, EVs result in
significant reductions of carbon monoxide, greenhouse gases, and ground level ozone in the region with
magnitudes cleaner than even the cleanest ULEV.

A couple more notes to make --

to charge cars you would need special voltage anyways. -- All current production model electric vehicles
rely on standard 120 or 240v household AC voltage levels. These are converted by the vehicle's charging
circuitry to DC suitable for battery charging. No additional power conditioning needs to occur from the utility.

If 100% of the population used them -- This is not going to happen for a very long time, if ever. Just as
multiple energy sources will be required to maintain the energy status quo, many transportation technologies
will share the stage before the economically and ecologically viable ones prevail. The energy consumption and
waste alone involved in a simultaneous switch make it untenable.

[Kolesar]

22. Your comprehensive research compares nicely to the ignorant,2-sentence Pelosi bashing on this thread

I foresee when motorists will be happy to have a battery powered automobile that will suit *all* of their needs. It will get them to school, work, or the market. Vacation driving will become a memory or a priveledge of the upper middle class when oil is $300/barrel.

[0007]

28. Thank you.......nt

[BreweryYardRat]

33. Hasn't someone commented on here a LOT about algae as an ethanol power source?

Seems workable to me -- use retention ponds to grow biofuel.

[humbled_opinion]

23. Damn I thought it was corn... I'm so stupid...

LOL>...

[ohio2007]

5. When do they open up the north slope? when the permafrost frees it up

for exploitation?
maybe they plan to go with the off shore oil rig expansion?

[Warren Stupidity]

9. "35 miles per gallon by 2020"

I'm sure that crap will be added to the bullshit list of bullshit accomplishments that gets trotted out here on a regular basis.

Why doesn't Pelosi just say the truth: "this is a pathetic bill, but with the obstructionist Republicans in Congress and the White House, it was the best we could get done this year. It is not good enough. It will not solve the problems we face, it is not even a good start at solving those problems. If the American people elect more Democratic representatives and senators, and put a Democrat in the White House in 2008, Congress can get to work, finally, at tackling the tough challenges we face."

But no, instead she just lies.

[whistle]

11. The DLC elements in congress seem to go along to get along I'm afraid

[sandnsea]

18. True,

It would be much better if they'd just tell the damn truth. I wish I knew who is concocting these political strategies because they suck. Somebody needs a head thunkin'.

[whistle]

10. Is this the version Bush said he won't veto? If so, what is wrong with it

...is that Bush and his corporate cronies got everything they want. So why should the rest of us be rejoicing?

[SlingBlade]

12. What a buch of right wing bullshit

Fuck you Pelosi !

Electric is the ONLY option.

[balantz]

13. Which corporate empire benefits from this pretty band-aid crap?

[liberal hypnotist]

14. What other fun tid-bit is attached to this little bill?

Well, that's only twelve years away. Plus, this concept has been talked about since 1973. Doesn't Pelosi get it. We know who her bed partners are. The auto manufacturers just don't want to change.

Oh by 20200 gas will be aahh? $7.50 a gal.

[SKKY]

16. Yes, but the problem with this road, you Bush Circus-Seal,...

...is that it starts in Pensacola and ends on Pluto.

[ohio2007]

17. Solar Street Lights For Fallujah (video )

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7c6_1197297585

Nancy should go check out that solar array

[Triana]

20. Nancy Marie...

...there she goes again...I'm sure she knows best though, certainly she knows better than us peasants and little people.

[Solon]

21. This will get reduce our addiction to oil the same way that reformulating cocaine into crack...

reduced our coke addiction.

[Javaman]

24. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

god she should do stand up.

Oh? what's that you say? she's serious?

holy shit!!!

This is like handing everyone a dixie cup on the titanic and telling them to help bail water.

The term "fart in the wind" comes to mind.

[jpak]

25. I disrespectfully disagree - Dems caved to GOP on renewable energy and Big Oil taxes

It was truly disgusting...

NO federal renewable portfolio standard

NO extensions of renewable energy tax credits for homeowners and businesses

NO roll back of disgusting GOP tax breaks for Big Oil....

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

[Kolesar]

31. Voinovich filibustered

What alternative did we have?

[0007]

27. Pelosi couldn't put us on the road to a 'hot dog stand' nt

[Mz Pip]

29. Subtext:

"BUT we don't have the votes so we won't really pursue this. We'll yammer a bit, then make it exactly like George wants it. What's the point of forcing a veto? Might as well cave now."

Sigh.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[DadOf2LittleAngels]

30. "That, along with a requirement to use more ethanol as a motor fuel"

Production and use of ethanol releases more CO2 than gasoline! Energy independence is fine but lets keep the environment in mind when we do it..

[The2ndWheel]

32. Well, since we're still squishy humans, there is no such thing as energy independence

The more we take for ourselves, the less the rest of life gets.

We started with human energy. Obviously we got that energy from eating other forms of life, but we gave as much as we got.

Then we moved to non-human energy, and the energy of other people(slaves in both cases).

Then we moved to "free" energy we found in the ground. It's only free because it does the work for us, but the environmental impact increased from the previous stage. It's the only reason there is no overt human slavery anymore.

Now of course we wish to harness the wind and sun. If we're able to do so on an ever increasing scale of organization, we will have a greater impact on the environment. We won't be able to do everything we want to do with all that energy and not screw things up more. We live in physical reality. We won't get something for nothing. We may get all the energy we want. We won't have much of a habitat though.

We don't live independently from the planet. We think we do, which is why we end up causes all sorts of problems that we end up fixing with the same process that created the problem, which results in the problem never going away. It just keeps getting bigger and more complex. That means we can't stop trying to fix the problems with the problems themselves, because to do so would mean we actually have to pay the bill. We would have to deal with the consequences of our actions. If we had to do that, it would get ugly.

[hatrack]

34. I thought Cargill and ADM were on the road to even fatter corporate subsidies

But then, I tend to be cynical about such announcements . . . .

[Zhade]

35. She's either misinformed, or lying to us.

Or she just doesn't understand basic math.

Ethanol is a pointless waste of time and resources.