No use pulling everything out of context and mangle everything.Where have I done that?
I have nothing against Jewish people, except that some are always seeking insults everywhere. That trait isn't especially Jewish, of course, I'm not implying that. Here we go.
1. "The Jews are the world's least discriminated against minority":
Not strictly speaking of course. It's a hyperbole comparison. I'm also speaking of the present, after WOII, the world you and I live in. To me it seems that in the Netherlands there are more Jewish individuals with respected, high paying jobs than individuals from African, Turkish or Arabic origins. Since that can't be because Jewish people are smarter, for we are all equal, that must be because the other minorities have fewer prospects. Therefore Jewish people must be discriminated against less by the dominant culture.Upon what do you base your assertion that "we are all equal?" Do you allow for the possibility that certain cultural traits and proclivities lend themselves to greater professional and cultural achievement while others tend to hold certain cultural groups back iwith respect to such achievement?
For example, Jewish culture has always placed great emphasis on education. So do, notably, several Asian cultures (especially among their immigrant communities). Not surprisingly, the members of these cultures tend to have better than average educations and, therefore, tend to achieve a higher than average level of professional success. Other cultures emphasize or de-emphasize other traits and the expected results follow. For pretty much as long as Jews have been given any kind of an opportunity to live and compete on anything like an equal footing in any society, they have managed to succeed well beyond the norm for that society and out of all proportion to their number. Do you really believe that has nothing to do with Jewish culture and is a result of Jews receiving some sort of preferential treatment wherever they go in the world?
2. "It is also your feeling that there is nothing inherently wrong with the term "to Jew""
No. We do have a expression with a similar meaning, but I do not think that "there is nothing wrong with it". I am NOT defending the expression. I just compared it to the American use of the word "Dutch" in the meaning of dumb, cheap or alcohol dependant. That isn't very nice either, but I don't see it as proof that American society hates the Dutch for everything they are. I said that this derogetary expression "to jew" at leasts implies that Jewish people posses shrewdness and intelligence. That's better than dumb, no?Where did you see or hear such usage of the word "dutch?" Honestly, having lived in this country for nearly 27 years (on both coasts, in the middle, north and south), this is the first that I've heard of it. I've looked in the regular dictionary and only saw the common meaning of the term. Specifically, that it is an adverb, meaning that each party will pay their own way, as on a date. I have looked in several slang dictionaries and found nothing. Do you have a link or a cite for the usage that you reference? Here's mine:
http://www.bartleby.com/61/63/D0436300.htmlIn truth, I do not believe that American society, on the whole, gives much thought to the Dutch one way or the other.
3. "You see no obvious connection between Judas and the Jews"
I didn't at first, now I do. But I think most Germans would never have made the connection either. Except of course the German Jewish population and the Germans that were anti-semites already. and I don't think anyone would start hating Jewish people because of the name of a friggin' game show!Well, you see the connection. That's progress and you are to be commended for acknowledging it. As to whether most Germans would have made the connection or start hating the Jews, may I suggest that, fairly recently, most Germans hated the Jews without the necessity of too much persuasion. As recently as two generations ago German society was horribly diseased to its very core. It would be a foolish mistake, in my opinion, to believe that it has been fully cured and rid of such a terrible blight in so short a time. Surely, Germany has made great progress in the last 59 years, due largely to the fact that all expressions of anti-semitism were strictly outlawed (combined with a very large and healthy dose of shame) but there is no reason to believe that just because public expressions of a great hatred were suppressed taht the hatred itself has ceased to exist. I do not think that many people would start hating anyone because of a name. However, it is entirely possible that those predisposed to such feelings would feel emboldened if the restrictions on their expression were to be relaxed so soon after they had consumed a whole people.
4. "you also believe that Jews, as a group, are over-sensitive"
I meant some Jews. My apologies for the generalisation.Fair enough. Apology accepted.
5. "should stop feeling "so g*ddamn special"
Again, I meant some Jews. My apologies. Of course, everybody is special in his or her own way, by the way. Again, apology accepted.
6. "You blame some Jews for being unfair to "aryans" such as yourself by assuming that you are latently anti-semitic."
Yes I do. Your use of "Fritz" in the meaning of nazi, by the way is very insulting to all the non-nazi Fritzes in Germany. The use of a German name implying racist moreover is insulting to all Germans. If you can understand the horror of the holocaust, you must also be able how insulting it is to imply that someone is a nazi.Now who's being overly sensitive? How in the world did you manage to conclude that I used "Fritz" in the meaning of nazi or that the term has any racist undertones. In English, the term "on the fritz" simply means broken or not working. Here you go:
http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=fritzThe term, as far as my resarch of it shows, has absolutely nothing to do with nazis or bigotry.
7. "The Nazis didn't particularly have it out for the Jews ... they just happened to be the largest minority. They were egalitarian in that they hated everybody equally. Do I have the sense of what you're trying to convey?"
Yes. The nazi's were looking for a scapegoat. The turned to the Jewish
minority. If there was a substantial community of Black people in Germany at that time, I think the nazi's would have tried to destroy that too.Let me simply suggest that your conclusion that the nazis were simply looking for a scapegoat is a tad simplistic. The fact is thaht there was massive anti-semitism in Germany and throughout Europe long before the nazis came along. They simply tapped into it. Furthermore, the Holocaust was a massive drain on German resources and manpower with very little practical return. Had the nazis not pursued the complete extermination of the Jews, they may well have been able to prevail in the war. If Hitler and other top Nazis had not ignored the work of top German-Jewish scientists simply becasue they were Jewish, they may have gotten atomic weapons in time to use them. Finally, there has been anti-semitism throughout Europe (even with almost no Jews to direct it at) since the fall of the Nazi regime. Anti-semitism in the Soviet Union was institutionalized and pandemic. Were the Soviets also simply looking for a scapegoat? I suggest that you do some research on the nature and history of European anti-semitism and anti-semitism in general.
8. "Also, it is your position that "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" is an offensive title, just like or more so than "Judas-Game," correct?"
No. But it could be seen as such. "Queer" has often been used as a derogatory term for homosexual. Homosexuals haven't had it very well in the past either. They can't even marry in the USA.Context matters. In the instant case, "queer" is being used in a positive, pro-gay sense. As for marriage, that issue is certainly on the front burner here. Homosexuals have had a difficult time throughout history. However, they are better off in the United States than they are in the vast majority of the world.
9."Moreover, it is your belief that the persecution of Protestants by Catholics and Catholics by Romans was identical in nature, if not magnitude, to what the Jews suffered at the hands of the Egyptians, the Romans, the Spaniards, the Germans, the Georgians, the Ukrainians, the Austrians, the Russians, various Arab nations, etc."
The prosecution of a minority on the basis of a different system of beliefs. Yes I belief that.Might I suggest that degree, pervasiveness, duration and application matter. Again, I suggest that you do some reading on the nature and history of anti-semitism.
OK, I'm off to watch the Chinese New Year's Parade.
Printer-friendly format
Email this thread to a friend
Bookmark this thread
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
