No More Goodies for Doctors From Drug Makers

[DainBramaged]

Source: The New Yourk Times

To Lehman Brothers, Linen ’n Things and the blank VHS tape, add another American institution that expired in 2008: drug company trinkets.

Starting Jan. 1, the pharmaceutical industry has agreed to a voluntary moratorium on the kind of branded goodies — Viagra pens, Zoloft soap dispensers, Lipitor mugs — that were meant to foster good will and, some would say, encourage doctors to prescribe more of the drugs.

No longer will Merck furnish doctors with purplish adhesive bandages advertising Gardasil, a vaccine against the human papillomavirus. Banished, too, are black T-shirts from Allergan adorned with rhinestones that spell out B-O-T-O-X. So are pens advertising the Sepracor sleep drug Lunesta, in whose barrel floats the brand’s mascot, a somnolent moth.

Some skeptics deride the voluntary ban as a superficial measure that does nothing to curb the far larger amounts drug companies spend each year on various other efforts to influence physicians. But proponents welcome it as a step toward ending the barrage of drug brands and logos that surround, and may subliminally influence, doctors and patients.

“It’s not just the pens — it’s the paper on the exam table, the tongue depressor, the stethoscope tags, medical calipers that might be used to interpret an EKG, penlights,” said Dr. Robert Goodman, a physician in internal medicine at Montefiore Medical Center in the Bronx.

(much more at link)

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/31/business/31drug.html?_r=1&hp

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It's about time. Ya think these clowns realize it's a new dawn?

[Taverner]

1. Marketing is one big slush fund of sorts

It serves those who partake

I should know

I am in the software industry


But - and please keep this in mind

It keeps elements of the economy running

[DainBramaged]

3. The shit they are giving out is mostly made in China, I am positive.

Next time I go to one of my many doctors, I'll double check.

[Taverner]

6. Well true, but we live in a global economy

If folks work in China, they buy our TV shows

I am a capitalist - even though its not the most efficient system

I just want people to eat and have shelter

[DainBramaged]

7. I am a realist, and if this brings down the price of drugs by a nickle, it's worth stopping

I personally don't give a shit if folks in China eat until our jobs cone back to the United States. That goes for EVERY country that has had jobs outsourced to it, or jobs shipped to it eliminating OUR jobs. Let 'em starve.

[Taverner]

9. Globalism could make us all comfortable, if done right

But you are asking the market to lobby in behalf of workers - and that is its weak point

This is where Governments can make this work

Unfortunately, this is where Governments have been sleeping on the job.

[DainBramaged]

11. Our economy has been going down the toilet since the Raygun years, don't give me that globalism carp

Our trading partners throw up barriers and tariffs at every junction, and we allow them to come eat at our table for free.


I am the WRONG person for you to try and preach that crap to, the WRONG person. Find someone else.:mad:

[Taverner]

13. Look, globalism botched is a bad thing

And surprisingly, I agree with your point

[cosmicone]

16. So you think American workers are entitled to every job

regardless of competence, quality, efficiency or productivity?

Do you think people around the world should starve so every American can drive a cadillac, have a 65" LCD TV and a mansion?

Don't you realize that Americans under poverty line live better than most rich people in the third world?

[Taverner]

18. No I think things will work out

We will be valued from what we can do

and others will be valued from what they can do

[skyounkin]

20. That's a load of bullshit.

"Americans under the poverty line live better than most rich people in the third world."

That's absolute bullshit.

Your whole post is reagan meme bullshit.

[DainBramaged]

32. Stop with your Right wing talking points, the Corporatists fucked this country

up and have reduced us to a service industry nation. Go to China or Japan and see if you like living there so much. Don't play that fucking race baiting game with me.

[Owl]

22. I'm with ya.

[brentspeak]

14. If you really were a capitalist...

...you wouldn't support the current system, which has China shipping their crap here almost duty-free and our stuff shipped there assessed with 20%-45% tariffs. That's not what "capitalism".

[Taverner]

17. No that is not capitalism

but i take my victories where i can get them

[brentspeak]

21. What does that mean? Where exactly is the "victory"?

[Berry Cool]

12. So are the drugs. n/t

[DainBramaged]

15. True, that's why HUNDREDS died from contaminated Heparin from China

The fucking "Globalist" drug companies put profit over safety.

[LisaM]

2. Or are they taking this voluntary step in the hopes

that it will stem some real regulation?

[DainBramaged]

5. You can't be a beacon if your light don't shine

I wonder who is really shining on them?

[Donnachaidh]

4. The drug companies use these things for tax write-offs

Now if they really want people to think well of them -- cut 50% off the top of EACH drug they manufacture.

That, of course, will never happen.

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. Oh my... when I was a medic I got a 400 dollar stethoscope, no shit

from a medical student. He got three as part of his orientation into medical school. The rep had many of them... and he didn't want to take them home. At the time I volunteered at a local hospital and worked down south in Tijuana, so he gave me the extra two for me and my partner... and they were a blessing helping us in patient care.

I loved the damn thing, until it got lost. I replaced it, just not with such an expensive scope, the eighty dollar one was expensive enough, and to this day I use it every time mom and dad come visit.

And my brother is a doctor, every-time he comes for conferences we get all kinds of useful trinkets, no shit, like a very NICE USB hub.

Brother didn't want to take it home... so what if it had I don't remember what company's logo on it?

On the bright side, if this ends, perhaps doctors will prescribe what you need... though for the record top docs do regardless of all the trinkets... the expensive dinners though... boy the expensive dinners.

[and-justice-for-all]

10. 'Gifts' = bribs...nt

[Taverner]

19. Yep

[Mojorabbit]

36. My hubby gets plastic pens

and memo pads and occasionally a rep buys pizza for the front office. It has no effect on what he prescribes. You'd have to be pretty morally cheap to write an rx for a pen. We give the pens to the mission and they are happy to receive them.

[and-justice-for-all]

38. And TV ads and billboards have no effect on what you buy? nt

[Mojorabbit]

42. Not really

I am a thrift shop shopper and I like vintage things. Never have been much on having the latest "big" things.

[Triana]

23. Good. Since they'll no longer be spending money buying this crap to hand out....

...does that mean their rediculously exhorbitant PRICES will go down?

I doubt it.

[Avalux]

24. Banning pens and tshirts will not solve the problem.

The boxes and boxes of free samples need to stop too. So do the incessant drug ads. I am so sick of them I could vomit.

[gabby garcia]

27. I have relied on those samples in the past

for me and my family on the rare occasions we absolutely have to see a doctor - we have no health insurance. Often times those samples mean the difference between spending my weekly grocery money on one necessary prescription or getting the samples from my doctor.

[kstewart33]

28. You bet.

I've appreciated very much a doc's dispensing of a sample to me that costs $70 at the pharmacy.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

31. I'll take the samples. My OB/GYN gave me three months' worth

of birth control pills at my last annual check up. That saved me $90 I would have spent at the pharmacy.

[TZ]

45. The boxes and boxes of free samples helped me out...

When I had NO health insurance and dangerously high blood pressure. Just sayin.

[Ocracoker16]

25. It is a small step forward

I am happy to see that they are getting rid of promotional pens and other gifts. They make some wacky stuff. I have Viagra boxers, Lexapro handsoap, and a Zoloft glitter globe to name a few. They can save a lot of money by discontinuing these items. The important thing is what they do wtih the saved money.

[Muttocracy]

26. Will they also stop catering lunch during presentation of their products to all staff? nt

[bluesmail]

29. I read that BigPharma's reps were 'almost made it's' in their high school

or college days. Having been to a doctor or two, I've noticed that they are the 'good lookin personality' types. HA!

[jaysunb]

34. Yes indeed !

I've spent lots of time in waiting rooms the past 13 years and have often wondered and commented on the fact that the reps are ALWAYS very attractive.
And now that I think of it, I don't recall ever seeing a guy rep.

Hmmmmm :evilgrin:

[AnneD]

30. I can see why some folks are opposed to the give aways.........

but they help us stretch our dollars. We can give samples of medicine to folks that can't afford it. I don't need to use taxpayer money for some basic clinic supplies. When I was struggling through Nursing school-my MIL supplied me with formula, diapers and coupons for my daughter. That was such a blessing as I was barely making it. I didn't need to get any welfare or WIC because of those gifts.

Did this influence my opinion? Not really, but I was able to do a few things or help a few more desperately poor folks.

[daleo]

33. Viagra pens

For when you are having trouble with your pens.

[Mari333]

35. what infuriated me the most, the absolute most

was when a General Practitioner would ask me if I wanted to try a sample of Paxil..(I was in deep trauma at the time)..this is not a psychiatrist, this is not even a psychologist, this is a damned general practitioner...these guys cannot determine who needs an antidepressant, these guys should be looking for underlying physical ailments before handing their pharma-samples out to people like candy..i turned him down and let him know what I thought. Big pharma hands these samples out to GP's and the GP's should not even be prescribing them. Only a psychiatrist should be doing that, and only after all physical ailments are ruled out.

[boppers]

37. I work for a company that does these kind of giveaways, aka "promotional items"

Sales are down 50%, the layoffs have been brutal (everyone from executives to receptionist), they're even eliminating the water-cooler (!!) to save money on water.

I may, or may not, be fired/laid-off as of Friday, as well.

In response to a couple of things said in this thread, and some general ideas about the industry:

1) China: Yes, a lot of the goods come from there. If a customer wants to pay for american goods, at american prices, and keep american jobs, we're more than happy to help.

2) Union/Minority jobs: Yes, we track this kind of thing, too. If you want to source pens/hats/whatever from a union or minority shop, we can track 'em down.

3) Schwag in general: Yes, it's stuff being given away to drum up sales, brand recognition, and product awareness. It's also about jobs, and real people, and real US jobs going to hell as the US economy dies.

I know, because my job is on the line.

[Vinca]

39. Who cares about mugs, pens and soap dispensers?

It's much more distressing that big pharma sponsors continuing education for doctors and the classes are held in resort locations or on cruise ships . . . all paid for by big pharma. Their goal: hook every living being on at least one, hopefully more, medication for life, preferably a statin at $3.00 a day. Mugs won't accomplish that.

[napi21]

40. Personally, I don't care about the pens, t-shirts, or mugs! Their

cost is immaterial!!! I care about the weekend junkets for "seminars" that are really a golfing weekend to Palm Springs and the like. A lot more $$ is spent on one weekend than is spent all year on that other little stuff, and they offer them all the time.

[Hugin]

41. Aw, man... There goes my decor!

I have the whole house done up in what I like to call... Pharma!

:(

:eyes:

[Danmel]

43. My pediatrician refuses to see Pharma reps

He has a big sign in his office telling them to buzz off. He laso has a sign on the wall that says "Attention, parents: Mucinex works for NOTHING at all- save your money"

he is a crotchety impossible man- a real pain in the ass- but I trust him totally.

[TZ]

44. Do you actually think that scientists aka doctors

Are so weak minded that pens and coffee mugs and other shit like that actually influences them? Geezus christ. I've gotten my share of this crap and it doesn't influence me one way or the other.
Hell my old company gave me all sorts of tshirts pens and totes and such and I still think they suck (even though my current company uses their products which are actually good, even though the manufacturer is a penny pinching souless corporation).
I am constantly amazed by people who seem to think doctors and other health professionals are so dumb and easily influenced. Yeah. 8 years of hard scientific training in the scientific method and critical thinking makes one an unthinking drone. :sarcasm: