Report: Feds improperly gathered intel on Nation of Islam

[sabra]

Source: Chicago Trib/AP

WASHINGTON -- Newly released government papers show homeland security officials improperly gathered intelligence on the Nation of Islam, a black Muslim group.

Internal correspondence shows the 2007 report -- titled "Nation of Islam: Uncertain Leadership Succession Poses Risks" -- was by an intelligence group working within the Department of Homeland Security.

Hours after the report was issued internally, officials recalled it, deciding the report violated intelligence rules against collecting or disseminating information on U.S. citizens.

One official wrote at the time that the group uses extreme rhetoric but had not engaged in or advocated violence and should not have been the subject of intelligence gathering. The documents were released Wednesday as part of a Freedom of Information lawsuit.

Read more: http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2009/12/nation-of-islam-chicago-department-of-homeland-security-surveillance.html

[Kurska]

1. Poor nation of Islam!

“German Jews financed Hitler right here in America...International bankers financed Hitler and poor Jews died while big Jews were at the root of what you call the Holocaust...Little Jews died while big Jews made money. Little Jews being turned into soap while big Jews washed themselves with it. Jews playing violin, Jews playing music, while other Jews marching into the gas chambers"
- Louis Farrakhan

No seriously, fuck them, that doesn't make it okay to spy on them illegally, but the nation of islam isn't a civil rights group or a social club, we should be monitoring them, but only in legal ways.

[Hiei]

3. illegal and unwarranted

Bush''s Grandfather was "punished" for having aided the Nazi's and Henry Ford wrote the propaganda piece about the 'Elders of Zion'.

Seeing the words Farrakhan and Jew in the same sentence doesn't make a statement invalid and I'd even question the truth of that passage. I remember years ago when Donnahue was busted attributing something to him that was never uttered.

This isn't any different than the RIAA getting a pass for hacking people's computers (a criminal act)

This isn't any different than the 60's-70's CoIntel programs

The Fed's have gathered information on the Nation of Islam and know full well that the organization isn't violent. And they're no more of a hate group than unions who do NOT place corporate profits over people's lives and living conditions.

[paulsby]

4. they ARE a hate group

but that criteria alone does not justify intel gathering under federal law.

hth

nothing to provent an org like SPLC from gathering and sharing intel though

[jaysunb]

5. Welcome to DU

Well said. :thumbsup:

[Kurska]

8. They very much are a hate group.

Look, I don't know the extent of the spying going on in this case, all I know is that the government needs to keep its head about itself and remain aware of such groups, but to do so while strictly staying to the legal line.

[boppers]

9. "unwarranted"?

I'm guessing there are warrants, and NSL's, involved.

As far as claims the NOI isn't violent, I suggest you visit a library.

[iandhr]

2. doesn't the Southern Poverty Law Center...

... classify them has a hate group


I am so sympathy for this organization. The Fed should have gathered this info legaly them

[paulsby]

6. i think people are missing the point

generally speaking the fed can't gather.collect,disseminate pretty much ANY intel on non-criminal orgs.

essentially, there IS no way to gather the info legally. that's the point

[Goldstein1984]

7. The Southern Poverty Law Center

is a good organization.

But they're classification of the Nation of Islam as a hate group is irrelevant. "Improper" is a euphemism for illegal in this case. They had no more right to do this than the FBI had to gather intelligence on John Lennon or Albert Einstein.

In the 50s, my grandfather was visited by the FBI after his neighbor reported him because he had named his two mules Roosevelt and Truman. Is that where we are again?

[paulsby]

13. right

we have to deal with this in my job all the time

we (LEO) , but imo, there are still good arguments against it- because it is clearly non criminal intel. many law enforcement agencies take case reports on verbal domestic incidents (husband wife, boyfriend girlfriend) etc.

i am against that. if no crime is alleged and it's merely a heated argument, imo a case report is non-criminal intel.

but some agencies still do that.

it's especially important they don't share with other agencies, that intel

[boppers]

10. Either you have a typo, or a deep confusion about US law.

The fed can gather, collect, and disseminate absolutely massive amounts of intel on "non-criminal orgs".

Census records.
Tax records.
Transportation records.
Credit records.
Property records.
Publication records.
Copyright/Trademark records.
Patent records.

The list goes on and on... this is *public* intel.

[pipoman]

11. There is a difference between

submitted statistical information and covert investigation and dissemination.

[paulsby]

14. correct

and also, there are a lot of limitations on SHARING non-criminal intel with other agencies, even within the same govt.

tax info comes to mind.

criminal intel can be shared, generally. non-criminal must have a specific NONlaw enforcement purpose. and be carefully controlled.

[The Stranger]

12. If you criminalized joining an organization, where being a member was in itself criminal,

wouldn't that violate the First Amendment?

[paulsby]

15. if i understand your point...

yes.