Judge dismisses all charges in Blackwater shooting

[G_j]

Source: AP

Dec 31, 3:40 PM EST

Judge dismisses all charges in Blackwater shooting


WASHINGTON (AP) -- A federal judge has dismissed all charges against five Blackwater Worldwide security guards charged in a deadly Baghdad shooting.

U.S. District Judge Ricardo Urbina said Thursday the Justice Department overstepped its bounds and wrongly used evidence it was not allowed to see. He said the government's explanations have been contradictory, unbelievable and not credible.

Blackwater contractors were hired to guard State Department diplomats in Iraq. Prosecutors say the guards fired on unarmed civilians in a busy intersection in 2007, killing innocent people.

After the shooting, the guards gave statements to State Department investigators. Prosecutors were not allowed to use those statements in the case.

Read more: http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_BLACKWATER_PROSECUTION?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2009-12-31-15-40-15

[jtrockville]

1. Blackwater and their ilk are a skidmark on the underwear of the US

[HowHasItComeToThis]

7. THEY WILL SHOOT YOU IN THE BACK

[peacebird]

2. didn't blackwater refurbish the vehicle (destroying evidence) before allowing it to be seen?

these mercs are scum.

[Alcibiades]

3. Even murdr of civilians is OK

if you're a Republican.

[zbdent]

37. if Ted Kennedy were a Republican, nobody would have heard of

Chappaquiddick ... witness: Joe Scarborough ...

(nobody but liberal bloggers, but who would listen to them?)

[WriteDown]

53. Link to Joe Scarborough killing someone? nt

[zbdent]

55. Healthy, jogger, dies of blow to the head in his office ...

constituent services coordinator, Lori Klausutis, age 28, died after hitting her head on a desk when she fainted while alone in Scarborough's Fort Walton Beach, Florida, office.

At least, according to the official story ...

(oh, BTW, Kennedy didn't murder the woman ... but that isn't important to freepturds ...)

[WriteDown]

65. That's a conspiracy theory...

Not a murder. Kennedy didn't "murder" anybody either. Used bad judgment? Yeah, but it wasn't murder.

[FarLeftFist]

4. Blackwaters christian crusade continues

[valerief]

5. Blackwater (or Xe), our fourth arm of the government, protects its turf yet again. nt

[Liberation Angel]

6. Unfathomable.

I do not get this.

It makes us look like Nazis.

NO accountability. No justice.

No redemption for crimes against humanity.

Can the international court of justice prosecute?

They should. Along with Bush and Cheney and Wolfowitz and Rumsfeld

[duhneece]

21. You said it!

I want Bush, Cheney and all tried for those crimes against humanity.

[lsewpershad]

27. Totally agree

These mercs should not be allowed to get away with murdering innocent people.

[paulsby]

41. so, they don't get 5th amendment protections?

fascinating...

[paulsby]

40. it's called rule of law

or what many refer to as a "technicality"

prosecutors offered immunity to guards before getting their statements, saying they would only be used internally.

then, they USED those statements to assist the criminal case (for example, supporting documents for a search warrant)

sorry, that's a 5th amendment violation.

it's black letter law

having a rule of law and a constitution and 5th amendment rights means sometimes even the obviously guilty get to go free (assuming they were in fact obviously guilty).

[Jefferson23]

48. I think you have that exactly right, but why did the prosecutors do that in the first place is what

I would like to know.

[paulsby]

49. i've said it before, i'll say it again

federal prosecutors are a different breed. i posted on this recently with the link to volokh.com's article on the book "three felonies a day"

i suspect they got overzealous. i've seen it MANY times before, so it hardly strains credibility.

these are the same people that did that ridiculous prosecution against tommy chong. the only way they could really get away with it in his case with the ridiculous "strict liability" standard that replaces mens rea requirements in most state laws.

[Jefferson23]

57. Thanks for that paulsby, very interesting and damn frustrating too.

Btw, are you a lawyer?

[paulsby]

58. no

i'm a cop

[Jefferson23]

61. Thanks again for the legal perspective and Happy New Year too.

[paulsby]

62. thx. happy new year to you too. nt

[debunkthelies]

63. It Figures....

What if it were your family these killer goons were targeting at the local Mall? Would you still feel the same about the 5th Amendment?:shrug:
Blackwater employee's are nothing but killers for hire.

[paulsby]

66. it's called rule of law

of course if a criminal got off on a technicality, it would piss me off.

guess what? it happens a lot.

but IF (and maybe you don't believe in this) you believe in rule of law and constitutional rights, then you accept a fundamental proposition of our criminal justice system "it is better that 10 guilty men go free, than that an innocent man go to jail"

even scumbags, and god knows i've arrested scumbags deserve protection of law.

only on DU would a person criticize a cop for DEFENDING the constitution. lol

the US is unique amongst most nations, for example, in having an automatic exclusionary rule. in england, for instance, evidence illegally obtained often CAN be used against a suspect. a suspect also does NOT have the right to remain silent. if they do, it CAN be used against them.

do you believe in civil rights or not

it's actually pretty ironic.

most of the cop haters here think we routinely violate civil rights, and then i get criticized for defending them.

i could cut the irony with a ladle.

[Jax]

88. Bullshit.

You live in Seattle now? Not the peninsula....pathetic.

[dorkulon]

56. I'd say intentionally sabotaging their own case is at least a possible motive.

This could definitely be inside baseball.

[defendandprotect]

72. Agree --

[paulsby]

73. i'm not discounting the possibility

i'm just saying, and especially when talking about the federal govt. and federal prosecutors, that believing they fucked up and.or were overzealous is far more likely than that it was planned as intentional sabotage

[dorkulon]

82. It will be interesting to see where these specific prosecutors' careers go from here.

If they are rewarded for their "overzealousness", then that will strengthen the case for premeditated self-sabotage.

[paulsby]

83. i strongly suggest people read

"three felonies a day" . it talks a lot about overzealous federal prosecutors combined with many "strict liability" laws. quite an eye opener.

[liberation]

51. Dunno if that falls under the 5th at all...

Miranda reading: "Any statement you make can and will be used against you"

In order to be a 5th amendment violation, the suspects would have been forced to speak even after they recluse themselves from doing so. The 5th does not apply after you have made a statement.

[paulsby]

52. um, no

miranda is just ONE decision (see Miranda v. Arizona)...

the 5th amendmentr says you have the right not to incriminate oneself.

miranda, applied specific rules to custodial interrogation (the two prongs required to trigger the warnings)

this is also a 5th amendment case. there is metric assloads of case law that says that when suspects are offered IMMUNITY and/or that their statements will not be used against them criminally, that this cannot be done as a ruse. CERTAIN ruses are allowable (under the 5th) as long as they do not "shock the conscience", but this is not one of them.

this exact same case law applies to cops. for example, if a cop in our dept. is involved in a use of force, we will not volunteer any information to a supervisor UNLESS a promise is made that the statement will not be used criminally. that's based on case law.

if the cop IS offered immunity and refuses to give a statement, he can be disciplined and even fired. that's ADMINISTRATIVE. but in no way can his statement (or refusal to give one) be used in any way criminally

this case is a 5th amendment case. miranda is only one of many cases that affect the 5th amendment

[MrsBrady]

70. Somebody screwed up for sure

What really gets me is that whomever was in charge could have played
this differently. If they had not screwed up by breaking the law
to try to get a conviction, then justice may have been served better.

It's really sick that these guys are getting away with it.

I wonder if they could be prosecuted on different charges.

[paulsby]

77. they could have been prosecuted

if prosecutors set up a chinese wall, so that NOTHING they gained in the confessions was used in the case in chief, whether for intel, to lead to other leads, or as support for PC for warrants, etc.

most likely, i don't think they could be prosecuted on anything at this point.

the well is too poisoned.

[Paladin]

78. Eugene Volokh Called......

He said if you used the term "black letter law" one more time on this thread, he was going to beat the shit out of you......

[paulsby]

79. lol

it has a beat and i can dance to it, and i laughed

i give it a 8!

[Paladin]

91. High Praise Indeed....... (n/t)

[wordpix]

89. one of the guards pled guilty--he didn't implicate anyone else?

:shrug: sounds fishy, he didn't get a plea deal?

[24601]

74. Upholding the constitution looks like nazis? Maybe in bizarro

world, but not in the US.

[Doctor_J]

75. No, but letting mass murderes get away scot free does

:eyes:

Besides, I thought our constitution doesn't apply to war.

[boppers]

80. Are you missing a sarcasm tag?

Our Constitution not only applies to war, it's especially applicable to war.

[Dr. Strange]

90. Some people are happy to ignore the constitutiuon in order to punish the wrong-doers.

And some of those people are not on the "right."

[Gman2]

8. Should rethugs get power, they will shoot YOU, in the back. And thats IN a cage.

[MsLeopard]

9. There is no justice in this country

It's perfectly legal for US authorities to disappear someone, render them, torture them, kill them and never let anyone know, but mercs can murder for fun and recreation and our court system lets them go. What the f*ck is wrong with this picture. Incredible and pathetic.

[No Elephants]

10. Oh, great.

[husky92]

11. Another Sad Day

Once again, another travesty of justice. Who dismissed this, one of Bush's right appointees.

When people ask why people in the Middle East hate America so much all they have to look at this decision. While I never wish to see American citizens in these predicaments, these guys were hired guns who knew what they were getting themselves into. Blackwater's record is what it is. Sure this was swept under the rug but everyone knows the real story. The saddest part is innocent lives were taken by some trigger-happy mercenaries. They'll come home and friends and family will congratulate them for beating this charge, but they'll live with this the rest of their lives. But then again, maybe these asses don't care one bit. It's just a few less Hajis as they call them.

[WriteDown]

13. Appointed by Clinton...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ricardo_M._Urbina

[Synicus Maximus]

33. The judge was appointed by Clinton in n1994

[paulsby]

42. it's called rule of law

here's a fucking hint. even bad people get the protection of the constitution

the prosecutors (federal, not surprising), violated the 5th amendment by using statements taking under promise of immunity in the case in chief, such as to support search warrants.


that's unconstitutional.

rule of law means that sometimes even the guilty as hell, get to go free.

[LiberalFighter]

12. I support executions in the case of Xe (formerly Blackwater) thugs.

Too bad we don't have database of the thugs with their photos.

[BreweryYardRat]

28. Agreed.

Blackwater mercenaries seem to be primarily neo-fascist racist goons.

Have we EVER seen an example of a Blackwater "contractor" doing something positive over there?!

[debunkthelies]

64. The Article

Gives their names and states of residence.

[avaistheone1]

14. Amazingly bad decision.

[paulsby]

43. only if you don't understand the constitution

or respect it.

which is your problem?

it's called the 5th amendment. it's called the exclusionary rule (see for example, Mapp v. Ohio).

it's black letter law.

the prosecutors screwed up.

but even merc's get constitutional rights.

hth

[Octafish]

15. C'mon. It's not like Blackwater wasn't doing what everybody else was doing.

Killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing and killing and stealing until they find somebody else to kill and something easier to steal.

[G_j]

16. with all that, it's amazing

contractors still have time for the sex trade.

http://www.afghanmania.com/en/board/topic/illicit-sex-and-boozing-by-civilian-u-s-contracto

[Octafish]

69. Blast! I forgot the ''perversion.''

Children. Not ice cream. Children.

[Hissyspit]

17. The cover-up continues.

No accountability because it US doing it.

[City Lights]

18. Fuck Blackwater and all those who defend/protect them.

Unfortunately, some people are above the law. :nuke:

[paulsby]

45. no, they enjoy the protection of the 5th amendment

it's that simple

the prosecutors violated their constitutional rights. are you for throwing out the constitution, when it's scumbag merc's on trial?

hmmm. didn't we recently have a president who thought the constitution shouldn't apply to some US citizens.

wasn't that a bad thing?

[hlthe2b]

19. I hope this judge was on the "up and up..." (which he may well be)

and didn't just see a major contribution to his overseas bank account....:shrug:

And if the former is correct, I then have to hope that this "prosecutorial mistake" was not intentional

[G_j]

24. "..have to hope that this "prosecutorial mistake" was not intentional"

that certainly crossed my mind also.

[Arctic Dave]

20. Tell me again why I should give a fuck when an Iraqi puts a cap in one of the occupiers.

Fuck em all.

[HBravo]

22. You got to be kidding me

[RedCloud]

23. I guess Urbina is hoping to move up if the repugs win.

So only justice against them will be that of the victims families. And so it goes.

[LouKneeLib]

25. No surpise.

The cover up continues. The jackboots march along.

[Deny and Shred]

26. Their immunity was established before they set foot in the country

There is a reason that "terrorists" were never imprisoned on US soil, namely because US law could potentially apply.
Jusidiction over contractors on foreign soil was made purposely vague. The troops on the other hand, are still subject to military codes of conduct anywhere. This vagueness is and has been the crux of CIA viability.
The State dept having to cut a deal just so someone goes on record, uselessly in a court of law apparently, is pathetic. As with many Bush era violations, the legalities seem to have been carefully considered well before any action was taken. It seems the question asked at the highest levels was "how can we sidestep US law and do what "needs" to be done?' - need being an obvious matter of opinion.
The clear loser in all of this is US reputation/prestige abroad - the very thing necessary for these governments and security forces to 'stand up' and be viable on their own. Many Iraqis just see the US presence as an ATM they ought to cash out for as long as we stay.

[BreweryYardRat]

29. One bit of good news: "Prosecutors can appeal the ruling."

They fucking better appeal it.

[zeemike]

34. Months will go by

and when it is gone from our attention the prosecutors will decide not to appeal the case....
That is how it works. they never intended to win a conviction.

[fascisthunter]

30. An Untouchable private for hire paramilitary? Sounds a bit creepy and undemocratic

I guess nothing has been learned about the dangers of giving any military outfit that much power.

[alp227]

31. where was the misconduct?

Judge Urbina wrote:

In their zeal to bring charges against the defendant in this case, the prosecutors and investigators aggressively sought out statements the defendants had been compelled to make to government investigators in the immediate aftermath of the shooting and in the subsequent investigation.

:wtf:

"zeal to bring charges"? THAT'S WHAT PROSECUTORS ARE SUPPOSED TO DO! "PROSECUTE"!!!

[G_j]

36. there was a plea deal

"The disputed evidence concerned statements the guards gave to state department investigators, which they were told would not be used to bring a criminal case.
This limited immunity deal meant that prosecutors should have built their case against the men without using the statements."

[Neurotica]

39. Why were they given immunity of any kind if they were alleged to have fired

on the civilians? What would compel the investigators to offer a plea deal in this case? This just doesn't make sense to me.

(BTW, the book "Big Boy Rules" by Steve Fainaru explores this whole sorry episode in-depth)

[paulsby]

46. read a bit further

they offered criminal immunity, THEN used those statements obtained UNDER that promise in the case in chief.

that is A VIOLATION OF THE CONSTITUTION. it's black letter law.

see: (for example) Mapp v. Ohio

this is BASIC stuff

the prosecutors screwed up

and yes, rule of law applies to even scumbag merc's

hth

[Jefferson23]

67. Yes, but they are suppose to prosecute within the law, evidently, they did not do so.

[dipsydoodle]

32. Headline news in the UK too

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8436780.stm

[ProudDad]

35. "They hate our freedom"

The freedom of the USAmerikan Empire to rape, pillage and kill...

[New Dawn]

38. The US "justice system" is controlled by the super-rich.

[paulsby]

47. it's called the constitution

see: 5th amendment

it's black letter law

[Hulk]

44. It was only 17 unarmed Iraqi civilians....hell, they were probably Muslims too....

This just says it all. Let them walk. We are NOT a nation of laws, as this is a prime example. We DO consider anyone NOT an American less worthy of life, liberty and protection. Hell....their relatives got a couple hundred dollars...right? All's well that ends well.

Such a pathetic shame!

[snake in the grass]

50. "...and justice for all."

The U.S. is such a fucking joke!

[Solly Mack]

54. k/r

shakes head

[Lars77]

59. What a fucking outrage. nt

[winyanstaz]

60. This is pure evil...

How can this be? How can my beloved Nation allow such dispicable evil to stand? America I weep for you.

[alp227]

68. Jeremy Scahill of The Nation replies:

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20100111/scahill

[Doctor_J]

76. This is not a reply

just a regurgitation of the highlights.

[defendandprotect]

71. Pitiful injustice . . .

[daleo]

81. Maybe this is legally correct

But to the Iraqis, it will reinforce their belief that Americans can kill their people with impunity.

[yojon]

84. Prosecutors were either corrupt or incompetent

Either they sabotaged their own cases intentionally or they didn't know what they were doing. I suspect it was the former.

I wonder why this is not being tried in Iraqui courts since the shootings occured there.

[Arrowhead2k1]

85. I wish these guys were tried in an Iraqi court. It makes more sense to me that they should have.

They were civilians who committed murder in Iraq and should have been subject to Iraqi laws. How can we expect the Iraqis to take us seriously after this?!

[classysassy]

86. Our system of j ustice

is a joke.

[truthisfreedom]

87. There's a key line in this article that reveals exactly what's going on.

lead prosecutor Ken Kohl and others "purposefully flouted the advice" of senior Justice Department officials telling them not to use the statements.

Ken Kohl did this because he knew it would get Xe off the hook.

Now we need to investigate Ken Kohl.