Archbishop of Port-au-Prince dies in Haiti quake

[onehandle]

Source: AP

PARIS – A Roman Catholic priest in France says Monsignor Joseph Serge Miot, the archbishop of Port-au-Prince, has died in the Haiti earthquake.

Father Pierre Le Beller of the Saint Jacques Missionary Center in western France says fellow missionaries in Haiti told him they found Miot's body in the ruins of the archdiocese office.

The order of missionary priests was officially founded in 1951 by the bishop of Gonaives, Haiti. While headquartered in France, it retains a strong presence in Haiti and traces its unofficial missionary activity to 1860.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100113/ap_on_re_eu/eu_haiti_earthquake_archbishop_2

[Renew Deal]

1. I have a feeling there's going to be many more prominent deaths.

It doesn't sound like status in society is going to save anyone.

[FarCenter]

2. Masonry and concrete are more liable to kill you than bamboo and tar paper

[thereismore]

3. That's because he practiced false Christianity, being a Catholic and all.

:sarcasm:

[Rage for Order]

4. One less bigot in the world, right?

Good riddance, I'm sure!

:sarcasm:

[Fearless]

7. If he supports many Catholic views then yes he may have been a bigot.

The question is should he have died. I think we would agree that no one deserves that.

[CountAllVotes]

8. that is so very funny

NOT! :puke:

:dem:

[thereismore]

15. You missed the sarcasm thingy. Many evangelicals think that God uses disasters

to deal with some kind of sin. Remember NOLA? And many do hate Catholics for their worship of Mary, which is blasphemy in their mind. So that's what I meant. Don't be an ass.

[CountAllVotes]

59. And many do hate Catholics for their worship of Mary

I take it you are one of them.

As for assess, look in the mirror. I don't find you to be the least bit amusing. :puke: again.

[Arugula Latte]

67. Uh, I think you are missing the point of the post. nt

[crim son]

5. The pictures of the devastation are horrifying. n/t

[Fearless]

6. The church will be sending aid right?? It is their job after all.

[BP2]

9. I'm sure they could care less who gives them aid, as long as they get it. But since

the Catholic church may help only believers, or only offer aid as a carrot, please feel free to go here:

Haiti Earthquake Relief: How You Can Help
links to the Red Cross, UNICEF, Yele Haiti, and Operation USA
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/12/haiti-earthquake-relief-h_n_421014.html

[AngryOldDem]

10. Church-based groups help everyone.

Catholic Relief Services is a prime example.

Right now its Website, www.crs.org, is swamped but later on feel free to learn how CRS helps with refugee relocation, microfinancing to help people become economically independent, and with fair-trade issues. I have done work for them in the past, and frankly, I take exception to your implications.

Not everything in the Catholic Church is corrupt. CRS is a prime example.

[CatholicEdHead]

13. Agreed

CRS does not require forced prothelysization to offer help. They will just do what they can and not push anyone to convert or drive anyone away during an disaster like this.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

25. NONE of the mainstream church aid organizations proselytize

NONE of them, not Catholic Relief Services, not Episcopal Relief and Development, not Lutheran World Relief, not Church World Servies, not the American Friends (Quakers) Service Committee.

And they are ALL some of the first teams into disaster areas.

They were there handing out tents, blankets, and food to a 100% Muslim population after the earthquakes in Pakistan.

They were there after the tsunami, helping Muslims, Hindus, and Buddhists.

They are STILL at work on the Gulf Coast, four years after Katrina.

Don't let your anti-religious stance prompt you to make ignorant assumptions.

[dflprincess]

11. American Friends Service Committee is always a good choice

http://www.afsc.org/

[Fearless]

12. I'm positive they could care less, I'm merely pointing out hypocrisy.

Pay all the tithes you will for salvation but when you're hurting they turn their backs.

[JNelson6563]

16. Tithes?

The Catholic church is not a tithing church. And lots of Catholic aid organizations (right o down to the local level) help everyone who asks.

Julie--who doesn't come here to read fiction

[Fearless]

26. Excuse me "collection"

[JNelson6563]

32. There's a very big difference.

Tithing is giving a required amount (i.e. 10% of income) where as passing the collection plate is just that. People drop in whatever they want (or don't).

Julie

[Fearless]

42. Let me tell you a story.

The Catholic Church I belonged to as a child had a school connected to it. Of course it was rather pricey, particularly with public education being free. However many parents chose this option regardless. The Church had a tuition break for Church members who went to the school under particular conditions. The first condition is need-- of course a very reasonable condition. The second was Church donation.

I remember mulling around the rectory during school one day as the priest was talking to a mother who was trying to apply for said tuition break because her husband had lost his job and they were having a hard time paying bills.

The priest's response? I'll remember it always. "I'm sorry, but you're not eligible for assistance. You see, last year your family donated almost twice as much as this year."

She left in tears.

[JNelson6563]

51. I have stories too.

I too went to Catholic school and our pastor was notorious for letting everyone in and over-due tuition situations were met with "it will work itself out". Many years later, when I wanted to send my own kids, the pastor of the parish wanted to personally donate to their tuition when I told him we needed help.

Julie

[Fearless]

52. ...The Damning of gay people.

[roguevalley]

64. and this applies to helping in Haiti how?

[Fearless]

66. This thread has to do with the death of an Archbishop.

[AnneD]

72. I view tithing differently....

it is voluntary but you give not to gain favor with God and it is not a quid pro quo.

It is a chance to be more Christ like. God's love is unconditional and he wants us to feel that same joy. By giving the first fruits, we are exercising our compassion muscle.

Since I have come to that understanding, I not only tithe, I gift above and beyond. I often receive a nudge to give a gift to someone. My favorite nudge was when I tipped a waitress $50 dollars (don't ask me why). She was nice and all, but I kept getting this feeling I needed to tip. As I left the cafe, she ran out to thank me. Seems like she just found out she was pregnant and was saving all her tips.

My fav are the anonymous gifts. And it always isn't money.

[JNelson6563]

75. You are a rare treasure Anne

We need more like you. Lots more. :hi:

[AnneD]

77. Believe it or not......

there are others out there-and the best way is anonymous.

Once you develop your tithing muscle-it changes your heart and then your attitude.

[Zynx]

19. I'm not sure that you are actually living in the real world.

Read a bit about CRS and get back to me.

[Fearless]

27. Does the Catholic Church not have billions if not trillions in assets?

Is it's sole genuine purpose not to help and serve the people? Excuse me if the real world I live in is one where they build self-aggrandizing monuments and ceremonies and leave the rest of the poor to fend for themselves.

[Zynx]

45. The Catholic Church's real estate may be worth something, but it has comparatively little cash.

It also provides some of the most significant charitable work in the poorest areas of the world.

[PacerLJ35]

23. When I was a kid, it was the church that helped us out...for free

[Fearless]

28. I'm happy to hear that.

[CBHagman]

33. Given the death toll and the fact that aid workers on the ground..

...in Haiti are coping with, in some cases, dead or missing staff and the loss of their facilities, or the disruption of their work, I think it's really inappropriate to start making cheap shots at any group, including one that has workers on the ground 24/7, 365 days a year in the developing world.

No cheap shots or bigotry at a time like this, please.

[Fearless]

44. The human species is capable of complex thought. I'll choose to exercise it.

Not everything is black or white.

[Zynx]

46. You seemed to decide that everything Catholic = Bad.

[Fearless]

48. Well when their people stop damning my people, I'll stop calling them on their evils.

[PacerLJ35]

53. If you feel that the Catholic church is a joke, then why do you care what they think?

Just curious

[Fearless]

54. Because if enough people believe it then laws get passed in coordination with that belief.

[PacerLJ35]

55. They also believe that because I'm not Catholic I'll go to hell...who cares...

[Fearless]

57. Because some of us have more at risk than fictional damnation.

[CBHagman]

60. And I'll keep calling you on yours.

Let me explain what I mean by that. I'm fine with you criticizing the Catholic Church, not that that matters. You don't need anyone's permission to do it, obviously, or to talk about the bad things that you've seen happen.

But I'm going to call you on using this thread for your agenda, or to indulge in blanket condemnations.

[Fearless]

61. Let me make it clear then that I had no intention of doing anything of the sort.

And that I have only provided my opinion and defended it when necessary.

[roguevalley]

65. a person died horribly. a lot of people died horribly. it didn't matter

who they were, they are dead. that is all that should matter on this thread. tomorrow, we can return to the agenda spewing but people are dead and that should mean something.

[Fearless]

69. If you're not with us your against us is a very dangerous meme.

My original statement is that the church should be providing aid. I don't see how this is doing any disservice to the dead.

[roguevalley]

73. This thread is about a man being dead. the church is providing

aid.

[CBHagman]

56. And, evidently, ignore the issue.

You must be a delight to be around when the biopsy results come back...

[Fearless]

58. There are always many issues in life. We are capable of focusing on more than one at a time.

[roguevalley]

63. you really need to google catholic charities.

[TexasProgresive]

14. It would be nice if you had real facts

[Zynx]

18. CRS has helped tens of millions of non-catholics over the years.

They don't proselytize.

[proteus_lives]

20. Wow, you're ignorant.

[Regret My New Name]

21. *couldn't care less.

[hedgehog]

24. "The employees of Catholic Relief Services do not proselytize—ever—period.

We are organizationally inspired by our faith. But we let our actions do the talking," said Ken Hackett, president of Catholic Relief Services.

Both Catholic Relief Services and World Vision have programs in majority Islamic countries.

http://ethicsdaily.com/news.php?viewStory=15042


November 1, 2005 – New York – The American Jewish Committee today gave a $25,000 grant to Catholic Relief Services to assist the survivors of the massive earthquake that recently hit Pakistan and India.

"The American Jewish Committee has a long tradition of responding to humanitarian crises," said David A. Harris, executive director of the American Jewish Committee. "Among our most cherished partners, whether in Africa or the Balkans or now Asia, has been the Catholic Relief Services. We admire the efficient and compassionate relief work of this fine organization. Moreover, in a world too often divided by faith, we wish to underscore our enduring commitment to interreligious cooperation, all the more so in the face of natural calamities that don’t discriminate by religion in their path of destruction."

The cooperative relationship between AJC and CRS goes back more than 20 years, and Harris and Hackett both recalled the collaboration in responding to hunger in Ethiopia in the mid-1980s, and then spoke about addressing the current needs in the Kashmir region along the India-Pakistan border where CRS staff are providing humanitarian aid.

http://www.ajc.org/site/apps/nlnet/content2.aspx?c=ioJNISOyErH&b=2690691&ct=3807673




CRS was on the ground in Haiti before the earthquake

Rivera says because the Caribbean island nation is so frequently visited by natural disasters like 2008’s gauntlet of hurricanes and tropical storms, CRS has learned to keep emergency supplies on hand. Rivera says the agency has enough right now to care for 1,000 families in the short term, but much more will be needed soon. CRS has already committed $5 million to the relief effort and Rivera thinks that figure will likely rise.

CRS has been working in Haiti for 55 years and its program there is the agency's third largest. It employs about 340 in Haiti.

http://www.americamagazine.org/blog/entry.cfm?blog_id=2&id=40376890-3048-741E-1143519684580219

[Fearless]

30. Red Cross... Catholic Charities... Red Cross... Catholic Charities...

I wonder which one to support. :eyes:

:kick:

[Illuminated]

31. Stay Classy, San Diego.

Fine take your anti-religion outlook and do what you want to do. Support who you want to support and let it go.

[Fearless]

38. I never said I'm anti-religion but whatever you want.

[SoxFan]

71. The world revolves around Fearless's crotch

Everything else is secondary, dont'cha know...

[Retrograde]

39. the one that spends most on aid and least on overhead? (n/t)

[Fearless]

43. The one that doesn't support pseudo-imperialism.

[Zynx]

47. CRS supports psuedo-imperialism? News to me.

[Fearless]

49. Not surprizingly.

[musicblind]

76. It's news to her because it doesn't.

And I'm an openly gay male who has spent time working both in churches as a vacation bible school teacher and as a male entertainer in gay bars. I've had preachers in Asheboro offer to perform weddings for me if I choose to marry. There is also an all gay church in Winston-Salem that supports many progressive ideals. On top of that the Baptist church at Wake Forest performs gay weddings. Being gay doesn't mean you have to be a bigot against religion, nor does being Christian mean that you have to be a bigot against gay people.

Problem is, the bigots (on both sides) are just the loudest. Their opinions do not represent the opinions of all Christians. Just because some leaders in the Catholic church are against homosexuality or gay marriage doesn't mean that each member of the Catholic church agrees with them. If you find yourself going to a church you feel doesn't support your beliefs then go to another one that does because many do... OR, if you are an atheist don't go to any church. But please do not stereotype Christians by claiming they are all against Gay people. It's as bad as the people who assume every Christian thinks the Bible is absolute literal word of God.

There are many Christians who believe in strong separation of church and state, anti-death penalty, pro gay marriage, and so on. Jesus himself was an advocate for separation of Church and state as well as anti-death penalty. He also never mentioned homosexuality, and if it was such a deal to him then I'd imagine he would have brought it up. Instead he said the greatest commandment was for us to love each other as we love ourselves.

So while believing that Christianity is make believe is a perfectly valid opinion with which I do not argue against because you cannot prove or disprove religion... believing that all Christians are bigots is not a valid argument because you can easily disprove such a claim.

From reading your post it seems you have experienced plenty of anecdotal evidence during your youth that has led you to believe that religion is hateful. I and some other posters here have experienced something different. Perhaps the truth lies somewhere in the middle? Perhaps there are hateful people in religion as well as loving people in religion? Perhaps there are conservative Christians as well as progressive Christians? Like you said, everything isn't black and white... but so many people who hate on the religious point of view try and make it so.

[defendandprotect]

41. Our tax dollars are already supporting "faith based" organizations . . .

[SoxFan]

17. Ignoramus

[Fearless]

29. Enlighten me.

[Psephos]

62. How much are you giving?

Or isn't that your "job"?

[skamaria]

22. Old Quote...

"Even mother church is subject to the laws of plate tectonics."

[EFerrari]

34. Rest in peace, Father. You labored among the poor.

[onehandle]

35. Thanks for the photo.

He was a good man.

[QC]

36. May he rest in peace and rise in glory! n/t

[struggle4progress]

37. One Down, 700 To Go (Boston Haitian Reporter | 2004)

Brian Concannon Jr.
December 2004
A cause for Thanks Giving arrived last Monday, four days late for the official celebrations but still most welcome. Haiti's most famous political prisoner, Fr. Gérard Jean-Juste, drove away from the Omega prison in Carrefour to the Archbishop's residence in Port-au-Prince. During seven weeks of incarceration, Haiti's interim government spared no effort to build a case against Fr. Jean-Juste in the Court of Public Opinion ... The interim government worked just as hard to avoid presenting its case in a Court of Law. No judge approved the arrest beforehand, or confirmed it afterwards (both Constitutional requirements, in Haiti as in the U.S.) ... Religious leaders like Archbishop Joseph Serge Miot of Port-au-Prince and Bishop Thomas Gumbleton of Detroit deployed their moral authority against the illegal detention ... http://www.ijdh.org/articles/article_onedown.htm

[superconnected]

50. Correction, I see that was the title of the artilce. RIP Arch Bishop!

[defendandprotect]

40. "Rich Church - Poor People" . . .

Remember that Artistide was a Catholic priest and told quite some truths about

the situation in Haiti!

[Arugula Latte]

68. Maybe the Vatican will sell off some of its massive treasures to help Haiti.

Yeah, I'm sure that will happen any day now ...

[Fearless]

70. +1

[defendandprotect]

74. Do you remember .... "Shoes of the Fisherman" . .. ??? Anthony Quinn . .. they showed ...

it recently -- I think like October or November on AMC TV --

Haven't seen it in a long time -- I'm quite sure it hasn't been around TV in a

decade or more -- probably more!