Officials Worry of Pre-Election Attack

[Khephra]

WASHINGTON -- Even before the bombings in Madrid, White House officials were worrying that terrorists might strike the United States before the November elections.

Now, with the Socialists' surprise election victory in Spain, analysts believe the ballot box rebuke of one of President Bush's closest allies in the war in Iraq could embolden terrorists to try the same tactics in the United States to create fear and chaos.

"That's an amazing impact of a terrorist event, to change the party in power," said Jerrold Post, a former CIA profiler who directs the political psychology program at George Washington University.

"The implications of this are fairly staggering," agreed political psychologist Stanley Renshon of City University of New York. "This is the first time that a terrorist act has influenced a democratic election. This is a gigantic, loud wakeup call. There's no one they'd like to have out of office more than George W. Bush."

In political terms, the question is whether an attack would cause Americans to rally around Bush or blame him for the nation's vulnerabilities.

more............

http://www.newsday.com/news/politics/wire/sns-ap-terrorism-election-impact,0,4100599.story?coll=sns-ap-politics-headlines

[mtnester]

1. Torn

Would it rally or distance? Could go either way, I think.
Do I think there will be an"attack?" Absolutely

[rockymountaindem]

2. As someone here pointed out yesterday

the anger at the Spanish government wasn't over the bombing, but because of a percieved lie/coverup of who the perpetrators were. The people were mad that Aznar's party was trying to capitalize on the attack by claiming ETA was responsible in order to focus attention on Aznar's fight against that organization. The bomb didn't change the Spaniard's minds, the government's reaction to the bombings did.

[chillwindblowing]

18. ditto

Has everyone forgotten the millions of people protesting the war.. the terrorist s did not determine the election... the people voted out an unpopular governing party.:donut:

[SKKY]

37. Just one thing to add...

I'd even argue over some cold New Castles that had Aznar/PP/Rajoy been honest and stand-up with the Spanish people, they may still be in office. At least that's what my family in Spain are telling me and what I've read. But, then again, should we expect as much from the right?

[Coventina]

3. Great. Just Great

Now we are being told that there "will be" an attack.
And that its purpose will be to unseat Chimpy, so DON'T LET THE TERRORISTS WIN!
A VOTE FOR KERRY IS A VOTE FOR OSAMA!

I think I'm going to :puke:

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[arcane1]

26. and you ARE, is that it?

:shrug:

where do these anti-establishmentarian anarchists get all this money, anyway?

[Jawja]

34. Yep

that's going to be the GOP spin, but I think it will backfire. I really don't believe the American People will fall for this crap. That's pretty negative to say a "vote for Kerry is a vote for the terrorists."

[Beam Me Up]

74. That's exactly how I read it, Coventina.

Couldn't have worded it better myself.

[dusty64]

81. Yup, thats

the feeling I'm getting too for their October "surprise".

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

84. One more "yup."

I was thinking the same thing this morning when the C-SPAN question was along the lines of "Did Spain give in to the terrorists?"

You're right on the money.

[truthisfreedom]

4. bush's behaviour has radically increased the chances that they would try

to influence the election here. by examining this CIA comment, we can see that bush has increased the likelyhood of terror in the US.

and by the way, when they say "fear and chaos" the whitehouse means "fear of bush and making chaos of our marketing of the dim bulb."

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Catch22Dem]

70. While I agree with a couple of your points

Bush/Cheney/Halliburton are FAR worse for the country than Kerry could EVER be. And why are you calling your fellow DUers "demons?" That's just rude.

[gasperc]

86. I guess Bush expects "us" to defy the terrorists and re-elect Bush

are we getting the meme here? Kerry's team needs a way to get out in front of this, namely be very critical of the weaknesses in our security that way blame will fall where it belongs!!!!!!!!!

[denverbill]

5. Shrub should've caught bin Laden 2 years ago.

Instead, he called bin Laden irrelevant and wandered off to oust Saddam in a war totally unrelated to terrorism.

If al Quaida hits us AGAIN, I know who I will blame.

We didn't have two Pearl Harbor attacks under FDR. If Bush ain't up to the task of defending the country, we'll find someone who can.

[Jawja]

36. This is the point that the

Dems are making. Iraq was a distraction from the real "war" against the terrorists who attacked us on 9/11.

The attack in Madrid bolsters this argument, IMHO. If the GOP does do this, "a vote for Kerry is a vote for Osama," I think it will backfire. That would really be indictative of a slimely campaign on the part of George W. Bush.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[maggrwaggr]

47. gee, why don't you tell us, Dead Crying Island?

since it seems to concern you that Clinton supposedly had this chance (something that has since been disproven), why don't you tell us how you respond.

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[arcane1]

57. my question

have you read where that claim is bullshit?

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[arcane1]

65. I respond by asking questions

works both ways. SHow me yours I'll show you mine

why did Bush disregard the Hart-Rudman report, comissioned by Clinton?

[LoZoccolo]

64. Not true.

The U.S. government asked the Taliban regime in Afghanistan to expel or hand over Osama bin Laden more than two dozen times between September 1996 and summer 2001, according to a recently declassified State Department cable.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/01/30/taliban.talks

Bush*, however, did refuse an offer to take bin Laden, and now we're at risk of a terrorist attack ourselves to attempt to tilt an election:

http://www.findarticles.com/cf_dls/m0WDQ/2001_Oct_22/80338926/p1/article.jhtml

[maggrwaggr]

73. Ha! I love it when they take the bait!

gloat ... gloat ....

[Media_Lies_Daily]

60. Here's how I would respond...

...why didn't Poppy Bush take care of him following the end of the Afghan-Soviet War?

Poppy had a choice: provide to Osama what had been promised to him by the CIA during the Afghan-Soviet War and keep him on the CIA team, or pop a cap in him and eliminate the problem.

Poppy chose to do nothing. How come?

[leesa]

71. Why do you think OBL had anything to do with 9-11? Because Bush's

mob told you? He might have but we have yet to see any proof. OBL probably IS irrelevent. The real terrorists are sitting in our WH.

[ellie]

91. Thanks for saying this Leesa!

I have been saying this since the get-go! Since when should we believe ANYTHING these crooks say?

[Piperay]

6. "There's no one they'd like to have out

of office more than George W. Bush"...phooey. There is no one they would like to keep in office more than AWOL. Chimp and his family have enabled them all the way and I am sure they love what chimpy has done to this country like taking all our rights away. :mad:

[Tuttle]

83. Yes: I agree

The chimp is the favorite of terrorists and the 'chosen' one.

He knew.

Tut-tut

[screembloodymurder]

7. Sympathy for the Devil

There's no one they'd like to have out of office more than George W. Bush."
So the implication is that a vote against Bush is a vote for terrorism. Bushit! They won't influence my vote. I'm voting against Bush no matter what.

[Chitown_Dem]

8. Googled some of the interviewees

Renshon (http://shop.conservatives.com/author.jsp?ID=2623) and Post (http://shop.conservatives.com/author.jsp?ID=2808) appear on Conservatives.com.

Kohut is the Executive Director The Pew Research Center for
the People and the Press, which were "established between 1948 and 1979 by two sons and two daughters of Sun Oil Company founder Joseph N. Pew and his wife, Mary Anderson Pew." (http://www.pewtrusts.com/about/about_subpage.cfm?page=a4)

I keep a grain of salt handy while reading things like this... fear is the only thing the administration has. They've done nothing meritorious over the past three years. Absolutely nothing.

(edited to search more on Google)

[mrdmk]

20. Good research

Welcome to DU!:hi:

[bemildred]

9. al Qaeda has already stated there is an attack coming.

Do these retards have any idea what to do about that?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

61. I wonder if that message was relayed by the PNAC team in the Pentagon?

[bemildred]

72. I doubt it.

I've seen essentially the same message WRT this last
attack in three different places now, and it's pretty
clear they don't want to talk about it in the US media.
It's definitely off message. If the PNAC fellows wanted
it spread around, we'd all get to read it without having
to hunt it down in places like JihadUnspun and alJazeera,
don't you think? And it would not say things they find
inconvenient, don't you think?

Here, read it yourself:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x39589

Is that what PNAC wants you to read?

[Beam Me Up]

76. al Qaeda--or handlers operating as al Qaeda?

It is conceivable that the Madrid event is a back story for what is to happen next. (Biological, apparently.)

[bemildred]

77. Is this the "al Qaeda is a CIA front" theory, or what?

I don't get your point.

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

10. there "may be an attack?" yeah, and planning it is the job of the

OSP... they are well into it by now.

[Junkdrawer]

11. It's a hole in the neocon strategy...

Rather than actually fight terror, this administration chose to use terrorism as an excuse to implement a neocon 'control the oil' foreign policy. The weakness of that strategy is that you greatly increase terrorist recruiting and open your allies up to the kind of attack Spain just suffered.

The big difference is that while we suffered a terror attack before the Iraq diversion, Spain, England, etc. did not. Support for the neocon agenda among our allies (and especially their electorate) is weak at best. One well-timed terror attack, and that support evaporates. Here, however, the media whores have allowed the "Iraq is a battle in the war on terror" lie to stand. As perverse as it is, as long as that lie stands, a terror attack, real or otherwise will only help Bush.

[arcane1]

12. but WE'RE SAFER NOW!!! WTF???

Saddam was captured, all the terrorists are in Iraq now, blah blah blah....

Hey George, shouldn't we be having FEWER alerts now, since you have kicked so much terrorist ass???

lying sons of shit...

[leftchick]

13. "worrying" or more likely "hoping"...

why else would the WH have left the "homeland" so vulnerable?

14. Another election influenced by terrorism - 9-11, 2001

"Now, with the Socialists' surprise election victory in Spain, analysts believe the ballot box rebuke of one of President Bush's closest allies in the war in Iraq could embolden terrorists to try the same tactics in the United States to create fear and chaos. "

On September 11, 2001 there was an election in New York City. I know because I voted that morning.
Then the results got suspended, the election postponed.

There's a good chance that Michael Bloomberg would not be mayor right now if that hadn't happened.

Anybody complaining about that on the right wing side?
I doubt it.

[mrdmk]

23. Either I am stupid or uninformed

I had no idea there was an election in New York that day. None of the shills said nothing about an election in their play by play of the days events. What offices were the public voting on that day?

[arcane1]

there's one thing you are certainly NOT: alone

it's news to me, too

:shrug:

28. here you go

Mayoral election

http://www.detnews.com/2001/politics/0109/11/-291050.htm

if the link doesn't work let me know

The primary actually, but the way New York City politics are the primary election is very significant.

[Chovexani]

43. 9/11/01 was our Mayoral Primary.

Many people went into work a little late because they went to vote. That's the only reason a friend of mine who worked in a store at the WTC is alive today.

[0rganism]

75. Now that's a "get out the vote" ad waiting to happen...

"VOTE! It really could save your life!"

[xeximian1243]

15. The Spanish always appease

ETA was just as good a guess as Al Qaeda. I lived in Spain for 3 years and found them to be a rumor-filled impractical people who love to lick their wounds of the past rather than stand and fight in the current war. Franco was tough but kept the peace. In 1975 and '76 Spain was attacked several times by ETA, the Communist Party radicals and even a few times by liberals. I am TOTALLY COMFORTABLE with the fact that Aznar, one out of five brave men left in Spain, will suffer at the hands of the cowards of Iberia. The Spanish electorate will elect whoever promises them a bed of roses and free lunches. No surprises here.

[arcane1]

17. "a rumor-filled impractical people who love to lick their wounds..."

sounds like the south-eastern U.S. :evilgrin:

(no flames, I was born there & lived there for 32 years.. I know of what I speak!)

[NV1962]

21. I very much doubt you've ever been to Spain

"and even a few times by liberals"

Uh huh.

"Franco was tough but kept the peace."

Exactly what the aging nostalgics say, on their annual reunion on July 18.

22. showing colors so soon

"Franco was tough but kept the peace. "

the trains ran on time.

Define tough.

[Junkdrawer]

24. The Mods are eating supper...

His 15 minutes may become an hour.

30. Is that a bad thing or a good thing?

I can't decide.

[mrdmk]

31. Just for your information

People do not like guesses. They want honest answers and nothing less. That means, not everybody is a rumor-filled impractical person!

Want to spot a lie, take a statement to an extreme, "I lived in Spain for 3 years and found them to be a rumor-filled impractical people who love to lick their wounds of the past rather than stand and fight in the current war." That is everybody!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

62. Sounds like the same garbage that was spewed about France....

Is Franco one of your heroes? The reason I ask is because Franco was a Spanish Fascist that Hitler and Mussolini tried vainly to pull in as an active participant on the side of the Nazis.

And since you admire Franco so much and stated the same about Aznar, what does that say about Aznar himself?

Aznar ought to suffer at the hands of anyone that finds him. He has cost Spain the lives of hundreds of soldiers and civilians by siding with the NeoCon Junta.

[July]

82. I lived there, too.

And I couldn't disagree with you more.

Rumor-filled impractical people? You must be joking.

The picture you paint of Spain and Spaniards is unrecognizable to me. Your sweeping generalizations may fit your ideology, but they do not describe Spain accurately.

If you really lived in Spain, you had your eyes and ears closed.

[NV1962]

16. Mr Jerrold Post may know his trade, he knows jack shit of Spanish politics

He should have been trained to snap his waffle shut before speaking on the record about subjects he knows little about.

[Just Me]

25. They are probably shocked that "the people" overcame fear.

I do find it remarkable that they would find it surprising that another attack could be interpreted in more ways than one e.g. evidence that the "war on terror" approach isn't working or that the deception wasn't acceptable or that the people were not going to be taken advantage of.

[BabsSong]

29. Jesus H. Christ they are setting the stage

They will make something or other go "boom" and then if Kerry is elected they will say the terrorist's have won because we are running scared and elected Kerry.....and god knows then what reason this crime syndicate will give for nullifying the elections. SOB's are setting something up here.

[BabsSong]

32. Opps just caught wind of the asshole on this board who thinks he's a

marine. Honey, al Qaeda pulled a good one on 9/11. The world felt for the US of A. Then Junior decided "fuck, baby, can use this to further my oil buddies thrust into the middle east". Then he lied to world. The world, unlike the asshole morons of Amureka, caught the lie immediately and protested. The terrorists, yes, looked at this and knew that one thing that went "boom" in their countries now would turn them against their governments and they were correct. But Bush set this inevitable stage when he went before the UN and insulted the world--of course they were going to protest. And now the game is in high gear. Tony and the rest of them are going to have dead people on their hands and a lot of angry kin. And in the end, they are going to have a bunch of dead people in this country too. We had the support of the international community to into Afghanistan and kill the bin Laden bastards and to pursue them to the ends of the earth. And the international community would be with us today if that is the quest we kept on. But it was Bush, and Bush alone, who decided to get a little oil out of America's fears and that in the end is going to fuck this country to death.

[SKKY]

45. Couldn't agree more...

Everything that happens here on out is on Bush's watch, and his responsibility. He's put us in this position and it's going to be Kerry's job to get us out. Never, ever has world opinion of the US been so low and it's all on W, Rummy, and Condie. I'm just left wondering one thing- if we hadn't invaded Iraq, and hadn't had our attention diverted from the war on terror, would there have been 200 funerals in Madrid this week?

[Art_from_Ark]

89. They never were interested in the "war on terror"

as anything but a rallying cry to get people to agree to the bombing of a nearly Stone Age country, and the bombing of another country that just happened to sitting on top of the world's second-largest known reserves of crude oil. That was their plan all along. Osama is a real-life Goldstein, and bu$h is Big Brother.

[mrdmk]

33. here is a thread of relevance

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1228783

and also
http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/031504A.shtml

on edit: added second link.

[jumptheshadow]

35. Actually, the implications are staggering

Just think of it, a carefully timed terrorist act determined the outcome of a democratic election. That's stunning...and symbolically, it came at a time when a democratic constitution is being installed in Iraq. It was a carefully aimed slash at the jugular.

Somehow, I get the feeling Al Qaeda would love for Bush to remain in office. He has, after all, isolated the U.S. from the world, overextended its military, and set it on an economic course for desolation. How better could it get if you're a terrorist bent on the destruction of America?

[fishnfla]

44. synchronicity

I agree with you completely on both points. The events are troublesome to me, re: the election

also shrub is a perfect poster child for terrorist recruitment, they need him in power

[MikeG]

38. Remember, Muslim attacks have only hurt Democrats.

Remember, the Iranian hostage crisis gave us Reagan.
911 boosted W's poll numbers.
An Al Queda attack will guarantee W will be re-elected.

[AP]

39. Two pieces of advice then, for Bush: (1) stop ignoring prevention measures

that got ignored so that Bush could give money to Haliburton, and (2) concede and/or withdraw.

(Who wants to bet that when Bush loses, the Freepers will say he didn't try to win because he's a patriot and wanted to spare America a terrorist attack?)

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sendero]

46. nice try...

... but your one inch deep analysis won't carry much weight here. Why don't you go somewhere where the people are kinda stupid?

[Name removed]

58. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[maggrwaggr]

48. hm, there's more than one troll on this thread

not saying you are, DeadCI. No, I'd never say that.

[Name removed]

59. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[darkstar]

69. So are you mad

that terrorists infuenced the outcome of the election? Or are you mad at the outcome?

If PP had won by 12% points, i.e. beyond the margin of error in the pre-election polling, would you still be upset? Or would you view it as having taken a tragedy to bring the Spanish people to their senses?

[BadGimp]

42. So are we safer yet?

oh brother

I have been pondering just this subject since the election in Spain showed the Socialists headed for a victory.

NOW, I think we have something to worrry about as far as a domestic terror strike or more..

[frylock]

49. watch for bushco to save the day..

staged terrorist attack averted.

[Sophree]

50. bull$hit

"There's no one they'd like to have out of office more than George W. Bush."

Al-Qaeda and UBL want * to stay in office because they know he'll fight the war they (meaning the terrorists) want on THEIR terms. Aggressive Imperialism, attacking the wrong Arab countries, Holy War/Jihad, MORE recruits for al-Qaeda and justification for their "War."

We should be treating International Terrorists like the International CRIMINALS and MURDERERS that they are. Low life scum, NOT Holy Warriors.

[Just Me]

66. I agree 100%!!!! The * administration actually SERVES al Qaeda's,...

,...agenda for a world-wide jihad (and, apparently, al Qaeda was being used to serve the neocon imperialistic PNAC). The best way to address the problems that extremists present around the globe is a unified, international policing effort: NOT WARS AGAINST NATIONS!!!

[Dr Fate]

51. The CIA guy is lying: 9/11 influenced the 2002 election in the US...

"This is the first time that a terrorist act has influenced a democratic election"

Not so. No one is going to tell me that 9/11 did not "influence" the 2002 elections in favor of Bush...

[fishnfla]

52. Question: did any intel info point to an attack in Spain?

They (we) had NO IDEA this was coming, which says something about (their)our intelligence gathering aparatus.

Yet another troubling aspect of the spanish bombings.

[arcane1]

53. yet they have ALL KINDS of ideas when they want to scare us

"wings of black death" anyone?


I wonder which PR person came up with that? :shrug:

[hang a left]

80. Did they receive a warning from the perps before the attack?

n/t

[fishnfla]

85. I dont believe there was a warning, that was ETA's M.O.

I'm talking about intelligence indications, like there were before 9/11, and like we are suppossed to be on the lookout for since 9/11, all that "terrorist chatter" bullcrap that raises the homeland security levels.

Intel agencies were caught flat footed and clueless about this attack in Spain, which leads me to believe that AQ has reached new levels of sophistication in their methods. It also could be said that they attack when most unexpected,to heighten the fear and chaos, so maybe there wont be anything here before the election, as the article indicates.

[hang a left]

88. I was being sarcastic.

You know all the Al Queda warnings we get here (wink, wink).

[fishnfla]

90. i was being wrong

i just read a news report in another thread, one of the suspects just arrested threatened attacks in one of the areas bombed. told the police in jan. man, this sort of sh*t gives me a headache.

[Hotler]

54. I'd be worrying about the neo-cons pulling something.

Or, the bush crime family thugs. A couple of small bombs in a couple of subways and call off the elections.

[arcane1]

55. I would not be surprised

Bush ALWAYS benefits from terrorist attacks

[Zero Gravitas]

67. BULLSHIT!

notice how they automatically assume with no basis whatsoever that bin Laden wants to get rid of Bush! Why is that? They couldn't wish for a better US President if they want to start a war between Islam and secularism!

[arcane1]

68. bullshit indeed, WPE. If bin Laden is SOOOOO scared of Bush

then WHY did he attack us 9 months into Bush's first year? One would think he would've held off until another weak Dem was in office, no?

:shrug:


he just hated our freedom so much, he wasn't thinking straight, I guess..

:silly:

[Gman]

78. If Clinton could prevent a millenium attack,

and there were several planned, Bush can stop an attack before the November elections... assuming he wants to stop one. I don't think he does. A seeming "terrorist attack" is bush's only chance at election.

[leesa]

79. Officials worry their pre-election attack won't work.

[Crachet2004]

87. The Spanish people, I think, were angry at Aznar&co over their attempts...

to direct the anger felt at this tragedy, towards the Basques.

Given the Bushco stonewalling, spinning, and misdirection over 911, I think it is given he will be blamed automatically for any further attacks on the US...in light of how the Spanish just reacted.

Half the people in this country don't trust him anyway, given his family links to the Bin Laden family in the past, and many more will blame him for an attack suffered on his watch.

The rally effect won't happen, because he has had three years to prepare; people will be unforgiving.

Reshon and Post are trying to spin it that the Spanish vote amounted to appeasement...and by extension, a vote for Kerry, would be as well. Spin must be fought with counterspin.

I think these accusations by Bush of Spanish appeasement amount to an insult to voters in this country of Spanish extraction...an insult to their honour and 'machismo'. That is ONE spin I would put on it.