Four Democratic senators aim to halt stimulus wind project

[alp227]

Source: Dan Eggen, The Washington Post

A group of Democratic senators called Wednesday for the government to halt a federal stimulus program aimed at building wind farms and other clean-energy projects, arguing that too much of the money spent so far has gone to create jobs overseas.

The Obama administration and wind-energy advocates strongly disputed the criticism by Sen. Charles E. Schumer (N.Y.) and three other Democrats, saying that most of the jobs under the Energy Department program have been created in the United States, despite the dominance of foreign manufacturers in the green-technology sector.

The dispute marks a rare public split among Democrats over the $862 billion stimulus package, which the Obama administration and party leaders have defended as crucial to saving jobs and easing the recession's impact. Republicans have spent the past year attacking the package as a wasteful boondoggle.

Joined by Sens. Robert P. Casey Jr. (Pa.), Sherrod Brown (Ohio) and Jon Tester (Mont.), Schumer said at a news conference that the Obama administration has ignored concerns about foreign involvement in the clean-energy program and should halt funding until Congress can pass legislation to deal with the problem.

Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/03/AR2010030302764.html?nav=rss_politics

[karynnj]

1. This is a very stupid way to handle this

Why not simply call for an accounting and argue for guidelines favoring American companies. What this reflects is what Kerry and others have argued for years - if we do not do this, the technology and manufacture of these energy sources would be jobs we could have had, that we lost.

[rhett o rick]

13. So you think that "calling for accounting and arguing for guidelines" will actually

accomplish anything? We need "buy American" in the stimulus package. The republicans didnt want it so the Dems capitulated.

I am not sure about this but I am strong about buying American, even if more expensive. STOP BUYING FROM THE COMMUNIST.

[truedelphi]

18. Good points all. plus an idea worth examining is that we continue to

Import so many tainted items from China and if the goods are not tainted, then they are often inferior.

Every year I have to replace my garden hose. It is made in China. Back when hoses were made in the USa, hoses were good for years and years.

Do we want such high tech items as wind turbines built in China? Do we want the polymers and connecting tubes for our nuclear plants built in China?

The President SEZ that the green jobs are here, but the two projects he mentioned in his state of the union address showed less than 2,500 workers on such jobs.

I would really like to see an actual accounting, and I would like to insist that the language taken out of the First Stim package be re-inserted, with regards to the jobs being for employees HERE!

[robinlynne]

43. of course.

[Chulanowa]

28. What communist? We don't buy from Cuba

We buy from China; and China hasn't been "communist" since at least 1989.

Maybe we should stop buying from all these "free market utopias" instead

[rhett o rick]

46. If you want to get picky, China never was communist. It was a dictatorship that called

itself communist. It is still a dictatorship. I call them communist to rub the noses of the hypocritical repukes that killed millions in Vietnam to "stop the communists".

[karynnj]

37. Then PUT IT THERE - pass a standalone bill that says buy the cheapest

American made equipment - possibly modified to allow only an n% increase over the world wide cheapest.

There are also jobs created at the wind power plants and the energy produced reduces the amount of foreign oil bought from countries like Saudia Arabia.

The fact is that we need to push Obama on the smart grid and we need to have alternative energy. This is grandstanding at its worst. Schumer has the ability to lead in the Senate to fix this, without ending it, or to get the administration to consider this point. Not to mention, you completely ignored the administration's response and assumed Schumer was 100% right.

The difference in their statements, is why an accounting is needed - to see if there really is a problem and what the magnitude is. As to guidelines for purchasing, I am referring to RULES either written by a bill or written by the administration. A possible guideline for the people doing the purchasing could be in the form of- take the lowest American bid if it is within 10% of the cheapest global bid. This seems far better to me than calling for a halt to the program. (Not to mention, this is Schumer willing to hurt Obama to win a few points for himself.)

[rhett o rick]

45. It's called leverage. The admin is willing to give jobs to the Communists

in order to get cheaper power. I say I want my tax dollars to BUY AMERICAN.

[shireen]

52. +1

:patriot:

[No Elephants]

62. The Republicans? So, why are Democratic Senators pointng at the WH?

What you claim is not meshing with what the OP is saying.

[ProSense]

51. Exactly. n/t

[AnOhioan]

2. I am surprised that Sherrod Brown is in on this

[rhett o rick]

15. Why? Looks like a good idea to me. DO NOT BUY FROM THE COMMUNISTS.

Please do not spend any of my tax dollars buying from the communists.

[JDPriestly]

20. I'm with you.

We need to completely start fresh and renegotiate our trade agreements. The agreements we have now are not working for the American people.

[rhett o rick]

44. Agree. nt

[dmr]

47. The tax dollars of the Stimulus Package should compliment the Jobs Bill

It only makes common sense.

Tax dollars should support tax payers.

Tax payers stimulate the economy.

A stimulated economy creates more jobs.

More jobs stimulate the economy further.

We need to advocate for our own survival.

We need to stop this defeatist out of control cycle of lost jobs, a lost economy, a lost nation.

The Corporate world won't do it, so we, as nation, with our tax dollars must!

[OhioBlue]

16. He probably knows how to make it better

is my guess. He probably knows what needs fixed to be sure more domestic jobs are created with this program.

He's absolutely for a renewable energy program. He's said it many, many times and has worked on such projects.

[bamacrat]

31. I agree. If Brown is against it something must not be right.

[Enthusiast]

34. He wants the money

spent on jobs HERE! Imagine that. He is correct!

[ProSense]

49. Why? Brown is one of the 14 coal supporting Senators opposing the climate change bill. n/t

[xxqqqzme]

57. That's what it looks like to me too.

Coal money is behind this.

[mod mom]

53. I'm glad he's doing this, jobs need to be created in the US:

from the article:

Cielo Wind Power of Austin, which has said it may apply for up to $450 million in stimulus funding for a massive wind farm that would be powered by turbines built in China.



"It is a no-brainer that stimulus funds should only go to projects that create jobs in the United States rather than overseas," Schumer said. "These wind projects have a lot of merit, but the manufacturing should be happening here, not in China."

[Igel]

59. And yet, the dudgeon is opportunistic.

"A spokesman for the Texas project called the senators' assumptions incorrect, saying that at least 70 percent of each turbine will be made in the United States with American steel. The Energy Department said the firm has not yet applied for stimulus funds."

So Schumer's outraged over something that might well not happen, calling things that are not as though they were. Moreover, he seems to be trying to get us to infer that since the turbine is assembled in China that it's entirely manufactured in China.

Now, we know that there are many cars assembled in the US with parts made overseas. We also consider it to be dishonest to label such cars as "made in the USA" because to a large extent they're not. So when we seem to see Schumer labelling a turbine assembled in China as "made in China", but largely with American-made parts, we suddenly turn off our brains and let our adrenal glands do the talking?

Then there's the overall amount spent. There's more to a wind farm than the 30% of the funding--not yet stimulus funding, mind you--that will go to China for the turbines. So 90% of the funds will go to American workers/companies. Schumer's apparently arguing about that tithe.

We should suspend a lot of projects and jobs, in other words, extortion, for that $45 million. Which, of course, hasn't yet been awarded, so his test example is hypothetical. Gee, I think the best I could muster is low dudgeon.

But we can look at it another way: Let's assume that $450 million does go for this project. Let's assume that the difference between US-made and Chinese-made is 10% (after all, there's a lot of transportation costs involved here and so either the time or the price makes it worthwhile outsourcing to China). Do we go for a smaller windfarm and less renewable energy for the same price--with the implication that we use more natural gas, coal, or imported oil--or do we increase the amount of money for this project, knowing that it will reduce spending elsewhere? Do we increase the stimulus, knowing that it will increase the deficit and that a good chunk of the interest on that money will go overseas? Or do we try to maximize the amount of energy we get for that money because that additional 10% going to China may well reduce the amount of money spent on overseas oil by at least that amount in the first few years?

Ah. That makes it even less simplistic. And it's obvious that we have even fewer facts than we'd need for even a poor quality, inferior dudgeon.

[wordpix]

55. WHY? Ohio has NO JOBS, don't you get it? If you don't give it to the Chinese, maybe some $ would

go to OH for manufacturing these turbines and other parts.

[toolabard]

3. Keeping the Money In Town

I'm kinda split on this one. On the one hand the DEMS should be standing together as much as possible. However, I am in favor of keeping the money 'in town'. The last thing I wish to do is line the pockets of some Chinese industrialist! We need to rebuild America with AMERICAN labor.

[Arctic Dave]

4. Why not make a graduated tax benefit that favors US products over foriegn.

[harkadog]

5. If most of the money is going for American jobs

I think they should let it go. In today's economy with raw materials and parts coming from everywhere you will always find some money going overseas no matter what you do.

[JDPriestly]

21. In too many cases, our trade agreements with countries like Mexico

and Canada do not permit any kind of measure that could be construed as protectionist. We have shackled ourselves with these trade agreements.

[Autumn]

6. 1.4 billion of the 2 billion for green jobs has

gone to China according to an article posted earlier. This is a disgrace.

[AlbertCat]

7. 1.4 billion of the 2 billion for green jobs has gone to China

See... there should be no problem getting the facts on how much has gone where (unless their doing it like the Bushies did things). If too much is gone overseas, then that should be easy to see.

If 1.4 billion.... more than half.... has then we should say whoa and figure out a way to keep more here.

[Autumn]

9. The article that was posted earlier also

said that 3000 jobs had gone to the Chinese plant and we ended up with 300 temporary jobs at the plant in Texas.

[mbperrin]

8. Will someone alert these goddam idiots about a little thing called the Internet?

Employment is jumping in the US to build windmill components, including right here in west Texas, where a brand new company is building controller units, and the local college just got a curriculum approved for manufacturing, maintenance, and installation of these. There are already several hundred wind generators within an hour's drive of here and more going in.

A quick Google search:

Google

Advanced Search
Web
Hide optionsShow options...

Results 1 - 10 of about 603,000 for companies building windmill plants and parts factories in the united states. (0.42 seconds)

FIRST HIT of 603,000!

Example:
http://www.celsias.com/article/us-wind-turbine-manufacturing-will-increase/

Foreign-owned companies building factories in U.S.

Seven out of 10 top wind turbine manufacturers have manufacturing plants in the U.S., according to AWEA. In addition, there are hundreds of U.S. based companies manufacturing wind turbine parts. In March, the Dutch-owned Siemens opened a wind blade factory in Iowa which employees 360 people.

"The whole concept, I think, of foreign-owned is a misnomer," said Kevin Hazel, vice president of supply-chain management in the Americas for Siemens Wind Power U.S. "Siemens, with 85,000 employees , are we foreign-owned? Or are we employing and adding to the economy here?"

Danish-owned Vestas is the world's leading turbine manufacturer. The company wants to obtain all the parts for its U.S. turbines from domestic suppliers. Four factories in Colorado will be launched this year to assemble key parts of a turbine. The factories will create thousands of jobs. It currently has over 1,800 employees in the U.S. and Canada and is expected to increase to 4,000 employees in the U.S. by 2010, when it plans to make all of its U.S. turbines in the U.S.

"Vestas is enhancing its U.S. supply chain," said Soren Husted, president of Vestas Nacelles.

"These new Vestas factories are important steps in helping the U.S. wind energy market move forward," said Roby Roberts, Senior Vice President of External Relations at Vestas Americas.

"Wind is positioned to help take a lot of those manufacturing jobs that have been lost, especially in the auto industry, and move them into the work we're trying to do, " said Roby Roberts, a senior vice president with Vestas.






Now I'm just a high school teacher, and I have access to this information. Why cannot the stupid fuckers who are supposed to be in the same party of FDR, Truman, Kennedy, Johnson find this out before crashing down on it?


Jesus wept.

[elleng]

11. Not 'just a high school teacher,' I'd say, mbp!

THANKS!!!

[OhioBlue]

14. Well, I can't speak for my Senator

(Sherrod Brown), nor do I have all the pertinent information..

But I can tell you that Sherrod Brown is a top supporter of alternative energy - he works on the issue tirelessly. He has said for years that he would like to see Ohio become the silicon valley of renewable energy. If he has signed this letter, I am sure it is only b/c he sees areas that need fixed regarding the importation of components or the strengthening of local manufacturing for such projects.

He is not against them at all. I am sure. He is only FOR making sure as much tax payer money as possible goes to support domestic job creation.

This is a man that has always stood up for the Unions, the working class, the most vulnerable and was against NAFTA from day one. He wrote a book about it.

I trust that he is not for halting any alternative energy projects, but only for making sure that the intended job creation actually happens domestically and improving the program.

[JDPriestly]

22. As I understood the article in the OP, these senators want some time

to pass law that will insure that a bigger hunk of the stimulus money for environmental projects stays here. It isn't that we don't have manufacturing here. It's that the senators want to insure that the manufacturers in this country get the money, not those in China or any other country.

[glinda]

25. If so I totally agree with you. We need the jobs.

[Sub Atomic]

50. Here in Colorado, Vestas was hoping to be awarded stimulus funds but those funds went overseas.

http://investigativereportingworkshop.org/investigations/wind-energy-funds-going-overseas/story/renewable-energy-money-still-going-abroad/

http://www.grist.org/article/2009-10-30-american-stimulus-funds-benefiting-foreign-wind-energy-firms/

http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:gKUjREUgJkgJ:thinkoregon.squarespace.com/news/2009/12/8/vestas-to-suspend-production-furlough-workers.html+vestas+stimulus+funds+jobs+lost&cd=8&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us


The last link is a google cache but is an announcement from last December about furloughing 500 workers at one production plant and they're not hiring and won't open two other plants due to wind energy funding going to companies overseas.


I wholeheartedly support ending the stimulus funding for alternative energies until the bill is re-written to ensure the jobs are created here, not overseas.

[amborin]

56. we have

a vesta refrigerator; it's a good company

[petersjo02]

10. There is a plant here in Iowa (West Branch)

that builds wind generators, Acconia. In Iowa, we get 20% of our energy from wind farms and our electric rates are among the least expensive in the country. Such ventures should be directed to U.S. companies.

[harun]

26. A lot of them are foreign but have plants here. The one near me (PA) is a Spanish

company but has numerous plants in the U.S. So they employ a wide mix of foreigners and Americans.

[bullwinkle428]

29. I was going to post that I go by that plant every day!

I know they were forced to lay off some workers maybe a year or so, because the lousy rotten banks were refusing to extend credit to them! :mad:

[Iowa]

12. The Obama administration strikes again.

[williesgirl]

17. I agree w/them. If taxpayer money is used, jobs should be in the US. Period. rec'd

[Dogmudgeon]

19. It's not about wind energy -- it's about giving away money overseas

Stimulus money should be kept at home because its purpose is to stimulate the domestic economy, not the world economy.

I think that the Post knew they could turn this into a Big Deal AND protect the interest of their rich pals, all at the same time.

--d!

[LynneSin]

23. I agree with these 4 senators - some of them the more liberal senators in DC

This is NOT about denying a project on clean energy. This is about buying Turbines not made in the United States. What good is that if a large chunk of the work and benefits goes overseas? You can't tell me that there isn't anyone able to build clean energy systems right here in the USA? How about using the Stimulus money to build a factory that creates wind turbines and creates jobs in the US.

[PSPS]

24. China's stimulus program has "buy Chinese" but the republicans didn't want the same in ours.

And, of course, President Milquetoast Obama capitulated.

[w4rma]

27. Good for them. Hurry up and fix the problem. (nt)

[SlingBlade]

30. I Call Bull Shit ! On this Thread. It's a fight against NAFTA

And Corporate Whoredom. Not Clean Energy !

[winyanstaz]

32. There will be no recovery without jobs.....

The answer is simple.

Keep the renewable energy focus but add some financial help out of the money we would be spending overseas along with a bit of the money in the stimulus program for AMERICAN factories to start up production of what is needed.

Instead of outsourcing overseas, build it here.

[DesertDiamond]

33. The stimulus program is for getting US economy going using US tax money --

Why in hell is so much of it being sent overseas? There is just no excuse for it. We are not being helped at all. We will just end up buying turbines with our tax dollars that were built with our tax dollars. How completely stupid is that???

[Moostache]

35. Time to start hunting us some D.I.N.O's!!!!

Of course, doing THAT just might turn the party into an endangered species...

[Lagomorph]

36. Why can't Americans make the stuff?

The government is not on our side. I have many friends who are highly skilled workers who would be willing to make the stuff. In fact, we thought that was the idea, spend the money putting Americans to work.

[Romulox]

40. Because our government readily gives money to foreign corporations on any pretense, for a start. nt

[architect359]

41. In a pure numbers point of view - it costs less. eom

[Lagomorph]

60. I don't care if it costs less.

The song and dance was that it would put Americans to work.

That's what I agreed to, that's what I wanted.

I already know that if the government is doing it or even American labor, it will cost more than whatever China will sell us. But that's not the point. I'm willing to pay more to support the American workforce than I'm willing to pay China to sell me crap.

edit for spelling

[DisgustedInMN]

38. GOOD FOR THEM!

ANY and EVERY stimulus project should contain a Buy 100% American Clause. Period. End of debate.

Don't like it?

Kiss my jobless American ASS.

[Romulox]

39. This version of globalist corporate welfare practiced by Obama has to be stopped.

I never thought I'd say this, but THANK YOU CHARLES SCHUMER!

[Romulox]

42. People were THRILLED about taxpayer money going to foreign corps when they got a PRIUS out of it....

How is this different from Cash 4 Clunkers again? :wtf:

[ProSense]

48. This is dumb. Why not just

pass the bill if they're worried?

AWEA STATEMENT ON SENATORS SCHUMER, CASEY, BROWN AND TESTER URGING ADMINISTRATION TO SUSPEND STIMULUS PROGRAM

The American Wind Energy Association (AWEA) today issued the following statement from AWEA CEO Denise Bode:

“At a time when the construction unemployment rate is nearly 25% and the manufacturing unemployment rate is 13%, this proposal would cost 50,000 American workers their jobs.

The truth is, by law, Recovery Act grants can only be used to finance projects that are being built in the United States.

This proposal would torpedo one of the most successful job creation efforts of the Recovery Act, which has already preserved half of the 85,000 American jobs in the U.S. wind industry.

Rather than adopt policies that will kill American jobs, Congress should enact policies that will create jobs by encouraging manufacturers to invest in U.S. plants. That means passing a Renewable Electricity Standard now.

The Recovery Act has been creating jobs by helping finance new American wind energy projects that have broken ground or been completed since the Act was passed. The proposed moratorium and legislation would kill this effort and destroy the momentum for one of the few industries that has been creating jobs and economic growth.

It is unfortunate that the proponents of this moratorium and legislation are using a deeply flawed study as the basis for a policy that would destroy tens of thousands of American jobs.

We support the goal of continuing the rapid expansion of U.S. wind manufacturing. More than half of the value of wind turbines used in U.S. wind projects is domestically produced, and that percentage is increasing every year as more turbine makers build U.S. manufacturing capability. We do not have the capability today to produce 100% of wind turbine components in the U.S., but we can grow our manufacturing base and add 274,000 American jobs if Congress passes a strong Renewable Electricity Standard."

[ThomThom]

54. simple just say the money must be spent in the US to US companies

not foreign subsidiaries

[Frank Booth]

58. So the only time senators care about protecting American jobs is when clean energy's involved?

And it's okay that the project will never get built at all because American turbine manufacturers can't get the funding? And we'll sacrifice the American jobs needed for the blades, installation, and upkeep?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. I never knew DU was so against clean energy. Drill, baby, drill!

[No Elephants]

61. "saying that most of the jobs" That's the WH's defense? MOST stimulus jobs stayed in the U.S.?