Fierce Fighting Reported Between Taliban and Coalition Forces

[DuctapeFatwa]

Fierce fighting between Taliban and coalition forces is being reported throughout Afghanistan. JUS has just received reports that seventeen Coalition forces have been killed and another fourteen wounded in various incidents in Kandahar, Qalat, and Helmand. Five Taliban have also been martyred.

The spokesman for the southern Taliban command, Maulvi Mahmud Ullah Haq Yar told reporters that a group of Taliban were visiting the area surrounding Kandahar to gather support of the locals when Afghan soldiers opened fire on them. A battled broke out and the Taliban killed four Afghan soldiers and wounded seven others. Two Taliban Mujahideen were martyred in the incident before they escaped to the mountains.

Haq Yar also said that in Qalat, American forces launched a major operation against Taliban backed up by helicopter gunships. The assault continued on for seven hours. The fierce fighting resulted in deaths of seven Coalition forces and three Taliban were martyred. Four Coalition soldiers were also wounded.

The Taliban have appointed commander Mullah Dadullah to lead the fight against Americans in the southern part of Afghanistan. Sabir Momin, a spokesman for the Taliban told reporters that Mullah Mohammad Omar appointed him after the Taliban Shura Counsil advised Mullah Mohammad Omar on this regard some days ago. The Shura Counsil named Mullah Dadullah for this post after the previous commander of the southern command Hafiz Abdul Rehman was martyred along with 14 of his men in fighting against the Americans. Mullah Dadullah has assumed command in the region and has started to distribute arms in preparation for engaging the enemy with new fervor,

http://www.jihadunspun.com/intheatre_internal.php?article=97457&list=/home.php&

[Guaranteed]

1. Geez...looks like the war's "back on" again in

Afghanistan. Why wasn't it like this in WWI, or WWII? People never stop fighting now. It's fucked up.

[markses]

2. I believe there's fighting, but this report is...um...questionable

That said, I don't think you could pick a better name for an enemy leader than Mullah Dadullah. Natch.

[trappedoldman]

3. I wonder..

I wonder who writes for jihadunspun.com?

[DuctapeFatwa]

4. It is run by a lady in Canada. Most of their stories are echoes

and links to different papers. She also has people who translate some papers that are not in English and not online.

JUS has a kind of unique position. The jihad sites say they are a CIA/Mosaad front, and the pro-crusaders say they are terrorists and not credible because they translate some papers that are not in English, not online, and not even American :)

[civil_liberties_dem]

13. Ahh interesting I didn't know where jihadunspun.com came from.

I had started reading jihadunspun.com more and more as it seemed somewhat balanced.

Not like our stupid news sites: and today 1 american soldier died, but before he went down he killed at least 100 iraqi enemy terrorists criminals.

If people came to where I live, I would expect a kill ratio of something like 2 to 1 at least, in favor of the defenders. I know my area well. I know many people where I live. I could hide weapons anywhere. I could live in the forests for months on end if neccessary. I would choose when I attacked.

The americans largely were having relatively few casualties by just hiding in two bases year round. Of course they are starting to have to come out now as the country slips back into taliban control. International journalists in afghanistan say that the taliban now controls outright 4-5 provinces and can openly operate in many more.

Some times people wonder where bin laden could be. I say he could easily be in afghanistan itself still. Let me give you this analogy, Russia takes over switzerland. They only leave 5,000 troops there though. All of which are in one base in zurich. Everytime they leave the base they get shot dead.

Would you say it would be hard for a european terrorist to hide somewhere in switzerland? Oh ya in addition the swiss forces still control 5 provinces lol.

Basicaly as most military experts said before america ever went in, you will slowly get deconstructed in afghanistan. Of course you will take over the regional capitals. All that takes is tipping whose side some warlords is on. The US spent 4 billion dollars in 2002 paying off warlords in afghanistan. And the taliban before them had been paying off warlords.

The problem is america is greedy, it stopped paying the warlords. So now it is confined to its base in Kabul. And to a far lesser extent the airbase outside of Kandahar. America controls the area directly around their base in Kabul during the daytime.

Was it enough to tip the balance of power? Absolutely. Is it enough to get control of the country? Not even remotely close. The soviets had over 10 times the number of troops that america has in there, and they had that for 10 years. And they couldn't do it. The greatest land army the world has ever seen, the one that beat the germans, couldnt' keep control of it. And it was their neighbour. They were moving equipment and men in by rail.

The americans are flying them around the world in. Do you have any idea how much amunition costs when you have to fly it in? We are talking small small fights costing in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Oh ya and afghanistan's population has exploded since 1989 when the soviets left, as has the talibans backers pakistan. For afghanistan 13.8 million in 1990 to 25 million today. For pakistan 110 million to 160 million.

I dont' care what type of enron accounting you do, 13 million people is easier to control then 25 million. And I dont' care what type of Arthur anderson consulting the bush administration is getting, the soviets were in a far better position to deal with the situation then america is.

The americans claim that there has been 135 dead or so, and 1200 or so wounded. Now if the Iraq war is any indication we can immediately jump that up to 270 dead. As if you aren't found dead, and I mean you are pronounced as having no chance of coming back to life by the onseen medic, you are listed as 'wounded'. Then there is accidental deaths and suicides which are another story. And in addition there is the fact that the military just outright lies to make the numbers look low.

In reality we are probably looking at 1000 or more american dead, but for the sake of the arguments lets pretend the pentagon is actualy telling the truth for the first time ever. And for the first time in the history of nations. They have 12,000 troops there. Wounded definition is having to leave the theatre. So over 1/10th of the force has been killed or removed from the war because of battle wounds.

That is some pretty bad losses. As soon as the figure moves over 5% morale falls to nothing, even when fighting for a homeland.

And this rate of casualties is with the americans mainly hiding in their bases. As they move out on a spring offensive they are going to sustain orders of magnitude more losses. And in addition as the enemy evolves to fight you.

It sort of makes me laugh when I hear news reports saying how we have pacified afghanistan now we are going into pakistan. 12,000 people in a region that size and that heavily armed is literaly nothing.

[DuctapeFatwa]

15. Oh, don't worry. America still pays the warlords

Fighting is something of a traditional pasttime in that part of the world, but nobody fights without being paid by at least one of whoever the opposing sides are in any given hour, and most people make an effort to be fair and spend at least part of the day fighting for both, depending on who's paying the best shift differential when.

US casualties in Afghanistan have always been under cover ban.

[ewagner]

16. Read the book

Taliban if you get the chance. Interesting pieces in there about the wrlords, Hickmetyr, Khan and Dostum. (my spelling my be off because I loaned the book out to a friend) Dostum had the distinction of being on the payroll of both Iran and Pakistan at the same time. Hickmetyr changes sides so frequently you don't know who's side he's on from one day to the next.

[DuctapeFatwa]

19. I have it. And mine is loaned out too :)

It would be funny if people weren't being killed. 98% of the people there are delighted to fight, and point out "Taliban" to the Amrikans ("Taliban" in this instance being their third cousin they are mad at, but will still give him half the money they get for pointing him out if he survives, which he probably will because the Amrikans know better than to enter that particular village, so they hire a local specialist with a reputation for being very fearless who just happens to be the brother in law of the first guy's cousin who will shoot the nephew of a different guy who didn't cut him in to the $ HE got from the Amrikans last week for pointing out some "Taliban" in ANOTHER village, who had insulted his cousin after they had both just spent the day fighting for Ismail Khan against the Amrikans...)

[ewagner]

22. Laugh or cry?

I can't decide which..........

The State Department used to have people who were knowledgeable about the culture in which they represented the US. Now, either those people don't exist or they are ignored. We have no understanding whatsoever of the cultures of either Afghanistan or Iraq. We smugly believe that 'Merican style democracy fits all cultures.......and...'Merican style democracy can be imposed at the point of a gun.

Laugh or cry? Maybe a little of each.

[DuctapeFatwa]

24. Once you understand that "Democracy" means a dictator who will

put US business interests first and boil his citizens alive if necessary to crack down on anti-American sentiment, it all falls into place quite nicely. No cultural knowledge is necessary. We got bombs.

[civil_liberties_dem]

32. exactly but now they have bombs too.

democracy is the last thing america wants. Case in point, sistani wins Iraq election: region given to Iran.

Honesty I don't think democracy is that good of a system anyway. We were meant to be a republic. And have democracy as a check and balance against an out of control government.

You would have some say on who was elected to impose the laws laid down in the constitution.

It was never meant to be okay folks vote for who we are going to piss off with bombs this week. Or how should we design our power grid? Lets vote, ahh it seems people want damns, but they think this time we should make them out of a cheaper concrete.

If you are going to be expansionist power allowing other nations people to decide the course of their nation is suicidal.

[DuctapeFatwa]

34. If you value your national sovereignity, being an expansionist power is

a really bad idea. In fact, it's suicide.

The last thing Amrika wants even in Amrika is democracy. Most people don't vote. And that's no accident. They're not supposed to.

[civil_liberties_dem]

36. Ya I agree, 'honest friendship with all nations' comes to mind.

The hawks argument is this. (not saying I agree)

They intervened 3 times last century to prevent the rises of a hegemonic eurasian power. The fear is that a power that can use the vast resources of eurasia would be one that would threaten america outright.

The strategy is to pre-empt that rise. In 1917 they came into WWI because Wilhelm was moving troops from the east to the west. As he had just gotten the russian's effective surrender.

He was going to make a final push to end the war with all his troops on the eastern front. The logic is that america intervened at that point, because wilhelm was in a position to become the world's hegemonic power.

Wilhelm was in a far better position population and economic wise then hitler ever was, relatively speaking.

Then they say they came into europe to stop hitler's hegemonic rise. But to me careful examination shows that they actualy came in to stop the soviets from just overrunning all of europe. Without a D-day the soviets would not have stopped in east germany. And nothing could have stopped them.

A soviet union stretching from Normanday to Vladivostok would have been a serious threat to world domination. And no doubt american policy makers stayed and supported places like Japan, Taiwan, and germany to limit soviet power. And indeed the genisis of the current problem, by bolstering afghan resistance, and to some degree helping pakistan. Now imo the afghan resistance was going to win either way, but no doubt the american money and technology sped it up and made those groups stronger.

Anyway america like everyone else is an expationist power. I agree totally.

And your right your sovereignity becomes increasingly reliant on foreigners the more you expand. The very fact that events in afghanistan are worrying americans shows how much of a failure the plan has been. Now maybe you can argue however though that intervening to stop wilhelm, and later to stop the soviets to prevent global domination wasn't a bad move.

You could easily have lost your sovereignty altogether in both those situations. Infact I don't really know why stalin didn't just keep rolling west. I don't think the allies would have been any match for his ground army.

I know this might sound strange but I was playing this huge MMORPG that had 3000 people on it. And three realms. In our realm our alliance slowly built up and was taking over. Finally we were bringing all the major guilds into our alliance. The other alliances were basicaly dead in the water. Finaly the number two alliance came to us and said can we join your alliance. (each alliance is led by a guild). I was the general for our alliance. We had a 'president' who was leading it. We were talking in officer chat about it all day long. And had to come to a decision.

Our decision was no. And that no more powerful guilds would join us for some time. The reason: You need a balance to move forward. If we monopolized power and started to not make good decisions our realm would be screwed. And it would take a long time for our realm to reorganize under new structures. We are talking months at least as people have deep seated loyalties and friendships etc, and during those months our realm could lose everything we had conquered.

Two powerful forces at least keep everyone honest. Or somewhat honest. If we didn't promote capable people the other alliance could start surpassing us. If we didn't make fair decisions, the other alliance would get more recruits and vice versa.

I don't really know why Stalin didn't just go to normandy, maybe there was strategic limitations. Maybe he actualy did have honor.


And I agree you can't have democracy and expansionism. That is what is coming out in europe this week. The rich elites and power people want to send the nation to war. The people don't really want to fight a war on some foreign soil. And they get to vote. So every politician in europe knows he could lose his job if there is a terror attack near elections. Maybe even if there isn't.

And america I believe will cave if there is a terrorist attack pre-elections. I'm just not buying that americans are that tough and would support a president who had failed. Maybe gallops fake polls would show it, but the average american would say the same things the spanish are.

I believe thats why the neo-cons are already talking suspending or cancelling elections in the event of a terror attack. They understand power and peoples thinking far better then we give them credit for. They would never have attained power if they didn't. And to some extent I believe they are fighting for what they believe in, as flawed as it may be.

If america were to in their thinking 'cave' to a terror attack, that would be the end of america as anything but a regional power. I don't personally see how it ultimately can be avoided. But for them letting it happen is allowing the unthinkable. They are dead serious when they talk of military dictatorship. They don't care about freedom, or even prosperity what they care about is american 'greatness' and 'patriotism'.

If they believed the american people would back them in an election if a terror attack had just happened, why the #@$# would they consider suspending the election?

[DuctapeFatwa]

40. They have Diebold, they don't need to cancel elections

They can make a big deal about NOT cancelling them, in fact.

I do not know what decision, if any, Washington has made about a second Unity Operation before the elections.

I would assume such an operation would have more to do with facilitating implementation of subsequent phases of domestic operations than elections. Unity One got them the Patriot Act :)

[civil_liberties_dem]

33. I'm not so sure with the warlords, I agree on casualties though.

Ya if you believe any government or organizations story of casualties blindly you're a fool. They will always go low, and in every report go extra super duper high on the enemy casualties. Duh.

I was reading to this day in Vietnam there is 80,000 MIA. Plus a huge number that died to their wounds later that were never counted. Not to mention a huge number that they just never bothered telling about their wounds.

As for the warlords Hekmatyr, Khan and damn can't remember the last ones name, don't seem to thrilled with the protection money. Not to mention the almost limitless number of more local warlords.

More and more to me america is starting to look more like an Iran in afghanistan, then the hegemonic power. They are a player but there is other bigger fish swimming around.

There is a lot of warlords and local leaders who dont' seem to be pro-US at all right now. I know hekmatyr has been on many sides, but now he does seem to be leading the resistance. I believe one reason he is not switching sides so much now, is that he is much more powerful then he was 5-10 years ago.

He doesn't really need to listen to others at this point. And leading something can actualy bring him more power. Also the islamists have insane amounts of money. We think they are poor because are retard government tells us that we are 100 times richer per person. But if you've actualy been to any islamic country you see the people live practicaly as good as we do here. The young people maybe better.

They buy into homes earlier then americans, have cell phones, computers, families where the wife doesn't work.

Plus its not like the islamists are paying them to risk their own troops they just are paying them to turn a blind eye. Plus the islamists can threaten to cause havoc more readily then the americans can.

I don't believe people there are born to fight, I just think that it is a crossroads of civilizations. There is many huge cultures that have a prescence in the area. But none are anywhere near hegemonic. Plus the geography of afghanistan means that they can't stamp out local resistance either. You just can't move ammunition and supplies through the country.

One thing about a place like vietnam even is that most people there consider themselves 'vietnamese.' They want to be in the same nation. Most afghans don't even want to be in the same nation as each other. They want their own independent areas. And they probably would get it, except the nation is so strategic being the crossroads that it is. So they end up having to fight just to survive. And having to make complicated deals constantly as well. In afghanistan if you go with the losing side you are probably dead. And if you go with the winning side, and they get to strong, you are probably dead.

So the warlords have an interest in making a strange and shifting balance of power. Between many sides. Its one reason so many are probably going against the US at the moment. If the coalition government or whatever it is, gets to strong it could take them out one by one. Like it tried to do with the US military to Hekmartyr last year. He repelled them, but afterwards he made a lot of deals and got a lot of allies.

For the men he allied up with, if hekmartyr goes down, the coalition government would turn on one of them next. Of course if hekmartyr got to powerful he could do the same thing to them. You can quickly see how it pays to be well armed and willing to change sides in an instant if you had to live there.

[DuctapeFatwa]

35. They have to pay them, if they want anybody to fight for them Amrika

is just another warlord, basically, just an extremely rich and extremely stupid one.

[civil_liberties_dem]

37. Ya they do, but I'm not seeing them fighting.

Most of the warlords seem to be peeling away from America now. And many of the lesser warlords are nuetral or even siding with the resistance.

There certainly are still some fighting for america, but they dont' seem nearly as eager as they once were. To me this means the money just isn't coming in, or there are other people with more money entering the picture.

Which it is probably a combination. The US government is running out of money. It has promised to pay so many people inside and out of the country every year that it has to choose where to cut. Cutting inside america means they lose the election plain and simple. Cutting military in many places is difficult, they might simply be taking the easiest place to cut.

And the islamists probably have as much or more money to spend now as well. The average is a ten percent tithe. Most muslims still pay this. And a huge portion of that goes to jihadists. But what is more important is that in islamic countries you don't get the shit taxed out of you like you do in the west. So we see many rich in america but its largely through equity increasing. As opposed to income or profit. So even americans who do pay the religious tithe its 10% of a small percentage of their wealth increase.

In the islamic world there isn't the stupid taxes to force people into the equity way. They just take profit. The world historic average for profit vs. revenue is 40%. In many western nations its an anemic 5% or less. In Japan its negative.

Also a huge percentage of the islamic worlds economy is just outright black market, so there is no taxes or regulations. Think of how much cash uneducated, moron drug dealers have to move around. Thats what happens in an industry without taxes and regulations. Even idiots who can stand on a street corner make many hundreds of dollars a day.

That is the picture we see across the islamic world. Yes their official economy doesn't look good, but everywhere you go there is ridiculus amounts of cash. Nightclubs in Cairo, Egypt have 20$ american cover fees and 5$ drinks. These are the average clubs.

They are catchign low level jihadists out there with 150,000$ in cash +. The latest one I saw was two guys caught with 700,000$ cash.

I dont' think its unrealistic that some of these groups could outbid the US governemnt. Obviously in any one place the US government could put more up, but the US government has commitments all over the world. If they go high on one bidding war in Afghanistan it means they have to go low on say a payoff in South America.

[DuctapeFatwa]

39. I wonder if you could be confusing the Christian tithe with zakat taxes?

Not sure either play a big part in the efforts to get a secure corridor for pipeline construction in Afhganistan & environs. I'm sure you're aware that the original Taliban themselves were more about pre-Islamic customs of village Pashtunistan than Islam, Islam there is the closest to a "modern development" that that area of the world has seen.

I don't think it's so much a question of the US being "outbid" as being taken for a ride to an extent, but they really want that pipeline :)

South America is being staffed by 100% commercials, as is sub-Saharan Africa, the US has pretty much sewed up the world supply and the "jihadi groups" you refer to have neither the funds, the inclination, nor in most cases the knowledge to outbid the US.

[saigon68]

38. Welcome civil_liberties_dem

Join the fun :-) :-)

[PsychoDad]

5. The war never ended there...

has it?

[NNN0LHI]

6. Rummy said that the Taliban were eviscerated a couple of years ago

Whatever the hell he meant by that I will never know?

Don

[Sugarbleus]

7. We need to do something about enemy

radicals.......BUT I DON'T THINK OUR GOVERNMENT KNOWS HOW.

We should have stayed in Afgahnistan in the first place.

On the other hand, I can't help but wonder if Bush left Afgahnistan early, then went to Iraq illegally and, then "called out" the radicals ALL TO PURPOSELY CAUSE the mayhem we are seeing all over the place. Just so he can bring on the "Armeggedon" scenario/WWIII.

I think he could be just that whacko in his religious zeal. If so, we could be toast soon. :scared:


My browser froze: I tried to edit for spelling. eek

[NNN0LHI]

8. Even better yet we should have left Afghanistan to the USSR

The Afghan people were never as advanced as when the USSR was in control there. Women had rights. There was order. No Islamic fundamentalism to speak of. And then the USA got involved supporting terrorists like Osama bin Laden, and Mullah Omar with money, weapons and training in Afghanistan to destabilize the puppet government that the USSR had set up there. Our interference worked very well too. Too well. And we have been paying for those decisions ever since in blood and dollars. What a mess.

Don

[civil_liberties_dem]

10. People complain that aethiesm would destroy civilization.

Here we have a nice comparison. Aetheism vs. Theocracy.

[DuctapeFatwa]

20. When Alexander the Great runs screaming from a place....

Smart countries consider that something of a clue stick.

Amrika really wants that pipeline...

[blindpig]

41. DF, I have a somewhat off topic question for you

You seem to have a very good understanding of that part of the world and perhaps can answer this for me.
When this shit started the US demanded that the Taliban give up OBL. The Taliban required that Washington provide specific evidence and Bush refused to out of hand. So we invaded.
I have little understanding of the culture, mostly derived from many readings of T E Lawerences Seven Pillars of Wisdom. Something that strongly came across was the importance of hospitality. By these lights a really strong case would have to be presented in order for the Taliban to hand over their guest. Do you think they would have if the US had presented the goods?

[hedgetrimmer]

9. There is only one way...

Georgie needs to fly out to Afghanistan and declare the war over, then those Talibannies will lie down and give up... don't they know we won the war? Let the ladies go burka free! O- that reminds me of those burkenstocks you know the sandles, are they related to the Talibannies, because if they are it could boost some business for their country and ya know I'd buy 'em.

[Aidoneus]

11. Afghan offensive: Grand plans hit rugged reality

Afghan offensive: Grand plans hit rugged reality
By Syed Saleem Shahzad

KARACHI - The plan to eradicate the Afghan resistance was straightforward: US-led coalition forces would drive from inside Afghanistan into the last real sanctuary of the insurgents, and meet the Pakistani military driving from the opposite direction. There would then be no safe place left to hide for the Taliban and al-Qaeda remnants, or, presumably, for Osama bin Laden himself. The plan's implementation began with the launch of operation "Mountain Storm" around March 15.

But the insurgents have a plan of their own, which they have revealed to Asia Times Online. Conceived by foreign resistance fighters of Bangladeshi, Pakistani and Arab origin, it is a classic guerrilla stratagem that involves enmeshing the mighty military forces of the United States and its allies in numerous local conflicts, diverting them from their real goal and dissipating their strength.

The insurgents' plan, too, has been put into effect, and the fierce fighting in Pakistan's tribal agency of South Waziristan last Tuesday, when resistance fighters and their tribal sympathizers took on the Pakistani military and routed it, was an early manifestation. Now Pakistan must quell its own rebel tribespeople before it continues to help the US with Mountain Storm. Indeed, Pakistan is attempting just that, on Thursday launching a "full force" operation in South Waziristan, using artillery and helicopter gunships. At the same time, tribal opposition to the Pakistani military has spread to North Waziristan - all according to plan, it seems.

--snip--

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/FC20Df02.html

[civil_liberties_dem]

14. Wow excellent article.

Guess it makes sense people that actualy live there would understand the situation better then our journalists. Who get their information from the US embassy in Islamabad.

I didn't think about the current fighting in northwest pakistan as being at this point a counter rebellion by the pakistani forces. I did however predict that if the pakistani military went for some of these militants they would be surprised how good they were.

Someone who has been fighting guerilla wars for 20 years is going to waste fresh faced young soldiers. I was thinking that if they took a beating the pakistanis would have to make an example. What I didn't think is that this might be part of that.

Those south waziristan tribesmen will likely try to fight back, or some elements of them. Which of course as the writer said will stop the offensive on al-qaeda, as the pakistanis will have to get this under control and fast. If one province starts holding out and fighting back, they are literally looking at a civil war. If its true that the fighting has spread to North Waziristan as well, they are facing a civil war on multiple fronts.

They have to use extreme force immediately or things can spiral out of control. I believe we are going to see some big things going down in pakistan over the next few days.

My bet is that the pakistanis are testing the tribespeople and if the tribesmen are willing to fight they will likely go to a deal on al-qaeda. If the tribesmen don't want to fight they will just roll in. Of course why I believe its likely the tribesmen will fight, is that when you let an army roll in it rarely ever leaves.

[jayfish]

18. Nice Analysis. I Am Wondering If All Of This...

"high value target" talk is just a ruse for anti-insurgency operations in Waziristan. How will we ever know? If this "high value target" escapes that could be the first clue.

Jay

[DuctapeFatwa]

21. LOL and Dara Adem Khel has more Land Rovers than they ever dreamed

of. Business has always boomed, but the last few years have been a windfall.

[leftchick]

12. makes one wonder yet again how aWol* get s away with ...

yet another lie in his daily campaign speech. For two years now he has been saying "the taliban are no more"!

[Th1onein]

17. This is the beginning of WW III

They can put a good face on it; they can call it a war on "terra," but this is the beginning of WW III. We have ignited a powder keg in the middle east and all over the world.

[Mad_Bulgarian]

23. This is good

Once and for all they must catch these terrorists like Zawarhi and hang them.

[jayfish]

25. Have You Ever Heard Of The Term...

Martyr? Attitudes like yours are the reason they hate us. Hang'em all, they'll make more.

Jay

[Mad_Bulgarian]

26. This is not true

You do not understand the reasoning behind the Islamics hatred of the west. Their hatred has been alive for christians and the west long before the United States ever existed. They have and always will hate the west, and America for now is the representative of "evil" in their eyes. America, Britain, Europe - they do not differ in their opinion of those countries. You do not understand their mindset. I lived amongst them for many years. They raped and murdered my people 500 years.

[Teaser]

27. You lived among "Islamics"? Let's chat. Sabah ul-kheir!

Marhabben. Ismi Teaser. Meh Ismulkah? Ana min "Democratic Underground". Min aina anta?

[Mad_Bulgarian]

28. I lived amongst Bulgarian Islamics

and they do not speak arabic.

Eto ti iskeese govorya Bulgarski na mi, as mozham govorya mnogo dobre.

Rasbirateh?

Bulgarian Islamics are generally of mixed Bulgarian and Turkish blood and they speak in Bulgarian. The only arabic words I know is for insults.

[Mad_Bulgarian]

29. However

thank you for your kind welcome. Nazdrovya!

[Teaser]

30. They're supposed to *read* Arabic, no?

Otherwise you ain't really reading the Quran, but simply a translation of the Quran.

So do you think all "Islamics" (the term I'd use is "muslim") but maybe they do things different in Bulgaria) are as radical as you were saying. Or do you mean something else?

[jayfish]

31. Dude, Get Real.

I have heard straight from the horses mouth why they hate the west. I dated a Palestinian and was good friends with several Saudis in college.
It comes down to the West keeping their noses out of other peoples business, It's (US in particular) unwavering support for Israel and this "the west is best, F*&ck the rest" attitude.

Jay