Toyota sudden acceleration reports (by its own technicians) date to 2003

[Omaha Steve]

Source: LA Times

By Stuart Pfeifer and Ken Bensinger, Los Angeles Times

Documents filed in new lawsuits against the automaker show it received reports of at least six incidents before massive recalls began last year. Plaintiffs' attorneys say they prove Toyota was aware of defects.

Toyota Motor Corp. was informed of sudden acceleration incidents verified by its own technicians and dealers at least six times dating back to 2003, according to documents filed Monday in two lawsuits against the automaker.

In one case, a Toyota technician reported taking a vehicle on a test drive after a customer complained of unwanted acceleration. The car "began to accelerate on its own," as engine speed increased to 5,500 rpm from 1,500 rpm, reported the technician, who was able to stop the vehicle by applying the brakes, according to the filings.

The report was cited, along with several others, in new filings in federal court in Santa Ana by attorneys for motorists who claimed they owned Toyota and Lexus vehicles that had defects that could cause them to accelerate out of control. The incidents were culled from more than 40,000 internal Toyota documents reviewed by the attorneys.


Read more: http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-0803--toyota-lawsuit-20100803,0,4389761.story

---

2 page feature story.

[DainBramaged]

1. No matter how much we post, most will not believe and continue to support them

and they will right the recall costs off to advertising, including the lost lives.

[harun]

2. I see the same. Many people I work with are completely convinced it was just

always the drivers fault. They are delusional idiots.

[ixion]

3. I have a 2003 Camry with more than 80k miles on it

and have never had this issue.

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ixion]

18. I've alerted on you

for such rubbish. Thanks.

[DainBramaged]

24. Awww such a good DU doobie you are.

:eyes:


Lets put it another way, cheer leading for Toyota doesn't comfort the people who've lost family members to the problem you won't acknowledge.


PS

I've ignored on you.


PSS

And (as usual), you tried to get in the last word, how sad.

[ixion]

33. who is cheering? I'm stating a fact

and that fact that you can't tolerate facts isn't really my problem.

And what about the people who have lost their lives due to crappy US auto making? We should 'cheer' that? :shrug:

[Mopar151]

74. You are stating a fact which has little to do with the problem at hand

And everything to do with the standard, Toyota-endorsed response anytime a problem with Toyotas is discussed.

[ixion]

75. Yeah, and the US Auto companies never did anything like that

:eyes:

It's a given that just about any multi-national will try and cover it's ass in such a manner.

[Mopar151]

70. Truth ain't rubbish - n/t

[high density]

5. I have a (model year) (model) with more than (miles/1000)k miles on it

and have never had this issue.

(Generic post template to cover the other anecdotal data points.)

[DainBramaged]

6. You and millions of others, but that is NOT the point

There are AT EAST 53 people who have lost their lives DIRECTLY RELATED to this issue, and you folks can come into this thread and say a million times, "and never had this issue" but that doesn't bring back the dead.

[depakid]

10. The point is that "interested" parties with a long history of hating Toyota aren't credible

[Omaha Steve]

20. I don't work for the LA Times

I only posted the story.

Hate? Marta and I almost bought a Prius about 5 years ago. We have owned a Nissan Altima. It was a problem car.

On auto blog: Dec 24th 2009 LA Times details Toyota history of concealing safety issues: http://www.autoblog.com/2009/12/24/la-times-details-toyota-history-of-concealing-safety-issues/

Verifiable coverage is hate?

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[DainBramaged]

23. Broader problems? DU is immersed in bullshit, and NO ONE in Washington listens to us

get real.

[depakid]

26. That may be- and there's no question after the Gulf spill that the agencies are still captured

and the current administration has few if any intentions of changing that.

Me, I'd just like to identify and solve the problems- and hold those responsible to account.

Whether it's Toyota, BP Exxon/Mobil or Monsanto. Or corrupt public officials. Or the Chamber of Commerce.

Or anyone else.

[DainBramaged]

28. Get ready, I'm going to say something that you won't like

I don't give a rat's ass about the (your) problems in Australia, nor do I bother to learn since MY problems here are LARGE to me and my fellow citizen/residents. Why are yo sticking your nose in our business?

[Romulox]

27. LOL at YOU speaking about "lost credibility". Google "depakid + THANK GAWD IT PASSED!" to see why!

edit: I was ready to "bury the hatchet" with you, but this present string of responses is too much. The emotion called "shame" has a purpose in human relations. :hi:

[DainBramaged]

30. BBBBBBBBAAAAAWWWWHHHHHHHHH

:rofl:

[ixion]

34. indeed. I remember that day quite well. No need to google it. I have it bookmarked.

[depakid]

54. Did you note when this was posted?

Blinder, Zandi Say U.S. Bailouts Likely Averted a Depression

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-07-28/blinder-zandi-say-u-s-bailouts-likely-averted-a-depression.html

[ixion]

57. I'm not referring to the OP, I'm referring to the bailout in general

and your support for it. Do you deny that you supported it now?

[Romulox]

59. Men of good will can disagree. Depa was epically wrong, and abused anyone who DARED tell him so,.

And now, he still wants to be regarded as some sort of economic sooth-sayer. That isn't going to work for anyone with a memory.

[depakid]

48. You'd prefer the whole world look like the shambles of the rust belt

so that everyone can share in the misery. Nothing more nothing less- and it's the same reason you have this deal about Toyota.

btw: I assume that you- like me, supported the bailout of the auto industry? Yep. Rather hypocritical on some people's parts here.

No way any of us could have known ahead of time that the Obama administration (and now the Congress) would let the banksters off essentially scot free. IMO it was worth giving them a chance, rather than creating another Great Depression.

[Romulox]

58. You get really ugly when backed into a corner. Why attack "the rust belt" when you want to get ME?

I think your slip is showing (i.e. you disdain for working people goes far beyond any conflict with me.) It would be like me excoriating Australian aborigines for your (obvious) shortcomings. In other words, a pretext. :hi:

[DainBramaged]

22. Really? When people defend the indefensible, only repetition matters

I don't 'hate' them, I think they have done everything possible to screw America, and those of you who defend them are blind to it and continue support them.


Go talk about Olive Garden, it's more your style.

[Romulox]

29. Neoliberals defend Toyota as a tenet of faith.

It's the flip side of the same coin. :hi:

[DainBramaged]

37. We intrude on their 'right' to buy whatever they want to buy

as long as they can greenwash their credidibility, Toyota will always be the king of the stoopid. Oh I own a Peeus, Billy just throw that bottle in the garbage......

[divideandconquer]

46. That's why all of sudden, Faux New business division ,the WSJ is their new champion

:puke:

[divideandconquer]

7. There are people with UAW built cars that can say the same thing

We have a huge trade inbalance in cars and car parts and it make the middleclass poorer everytime someone buys a foreign or foreign brand car.

[pipoman]

11. Idiocy

"it make the middleclass poorer everytime someone buys a foreign or foreign brand car.

I may agree if you said, "it make the middleclass poorer everytime someone buys a foreign built or manufactured car regardless the brand". But to imply that somehow buying a Toyota built in Kentucky by middle class workers is bad for the middle class, but buying a Ford made in Mexico is good for the middle class is just silly.

[divideandconquer]

13. Ford had to move to Mexico because Toyota didn't have a union in Kentucky

Is that silly? BTW, Toyota still builds a bunch of cars overseas including every Prius, most Lexus models, every Scion, every 4runner, probably most of their more profitable models.

[pipoman]

14. Yes it is completely idiotic

It is nothing more than an excuse for Ford to use slave labor, Kentucky workers can unionize, Mexican workers will be disappeared for thinking about organizing. Are you one of those who would like to keep the south in poverty, deprive them of jobs? BTW Toyota's most popular models are all built in the US and a new (Prius, iirc) plant is currently in construction, again in the US.

[Romulox]

32. I don't think you understand.

Union supporters aren't going to rally for non-union workers in Kentucky. It simply doesn't work that way. :hi:

[DainBramaged]

35. Oh yes we would

:spray:


Just like we'd rally for Senator Shelby or Coker.

[pipoman]

61. Funny how they will rally for

nonunion workers in Mexico who actually are now doing work which was previously done in the US.

[Romulox]

63. Link or it didn't happen.

You are incoherent.

[divideandconquer]

45. Toyota actually uses slave labor to build Priuses, it's well documented

The Dark Side of the Toyota Prius
By Paul Abowd

A new report alleges that Toyota, the world's largest auto company, is violating workers' rights at Prius hybrid plants in Japan.
SHARE THIS ARTICLE |

The National Labor Committee (NLC), a New York-based human rights group, has been investigating working conditions at Toyota Motor Corp., and the labor used to produce its best-selling Prius hybrid cars.

In its 65-page report released in June, NLC includes first-hand testimony of factory conditions in “Toyota City,” outside of Nagoya, Japan — less than 200 miles southwest of Tokyo — where the largest auto company in the world employs some 70,000 people.

The report alleges that Toyota exploits guest workers, mostly shipped in from China and Vietnam. According to the NLC, these workers are “stripped of their passports and often forced to work — including at subcontract plants supplying Toyota — 16 hours a day, seven days a week, while being paid less than half the legal minimum wage.” Workers are forced to live in company dormitories and deported for complaining about poor treatment, the report finds.

Low-wage temporary workers make up one-third of Toyota’s Prius assembly-line workers, mostly in the auto-parts supply chain. They are signed to contracts for periods as short as four months, and are paid only 60 percent of a full-time employee’s wage.

Parts plants run by subcontractors advertise standard, nine-hour, five-day-a-week jobs. But according to the NLC, “the typical shift was 15 to 16.5 hours a day, from 8:30 a.m. to 11:30 p.m. or 1:00 a.m.”

In 2002, Kenichi Uchino, 30, died while working at the “green” Tsutsumi plant that assembles the Prius. During the 13th hour of a routine 14-hour day, Uchino collapsed on the shop floor of the internationally lauded “sustainable” factory, which uses sulfur-oxide-eating paint and boasts 5 percent emissions reductions. A Japanese court ruled that Uchino’s death was caused by exhaustion from overwork.

His wife, Hiroko Uchino, described a grueling lifestyle that included an 85-hour workweek prior to his death. The NLC published his time cards, which reveal that he was “putting in 106.5 to 155 hours of overtime … in the 30 days leading up to his death.”
-----------------------
<http://www.inthesetimes.com/article/3796/the_dark_side_of_the_toyota_prius/>
I'm quite sure the Mexicans at the Ford plants are treated better than this.

As far as jobs in the south, Ford and GM closed factories here in Atlanta that paid well. If Americans stuck together, we would all be better off. BTW, the Camry killing Chevy Malibu is UAW built in Kansas city with a huge percentage of American parts.

[pipoman]

62. Who is doing the jobs previously done by the Atlanta Ford and GM workers?

[divideandconquer]

69. Kia workers making half the salary and benefits, thus less multiplier effect

BTW, are you anti union or pro union?

BTW, Hyundai/KIA was massively bailed out by the Korean government a decade ago and foreign carmakers were prohibited from buying them. In fact, Mercedes took Chrysler's 13 billion dollar rainy day fund and used it to buy Hyundai and KIA stock in an effort to create a global motors but they were denied by the Koreans.

[pipoman]

76. I am pro US jobs

I believe that the collective bargaining advantage of labor organization has been systematically flushed down the shitter, first by tolerance of companies who exported US jobs by the .gov, then by 'free traders' and the whole free trade nonsense philosophy. There is nothing I would rather see than a reversal of the encouragement of privileged to use slave labor, particularly in other countries which do not allow for organization of labor. So, we are where we are. I am for any company which, with the choices of locations to build manufacturing facilities, which choose the US. Given the labor atmosphere in the US, I am thankful for all those who invest in US labor. I would love to see the unions join me and masses of others in advocating renegotiation of trade deals requiring/allowing for leveling of playing fields...at least adoption of a level time line for bringing labor in member nations to a standard of living which is similar to that of the US, abandoning the philosophy of leveling by reducing the standard of living of people in the US. In short, I love what unions have done for the US, I believe they are no longer relevant because of trade deals which I have opposed since the beginning.

[divideandconquer]

78. Just one more thing, if these foreign companies are just as good.........

Just one more thing, if these foreign companies are just as good as American employers, where are their minorities? A Chrysler, Ralph Gilles is charge of styling for all of Chrysler and the CEO of the Dodge division, Fred Diaz is CEO of the RAM truck division and Linda Soave, CEO of FIAT America. Google them, they all are quite impressive and probably wouldn't be hired by the Japanese zaibatsus.

[pipoman]

80. Yea whatever..

[divideandconquer]

84. Great defense of your position, don't care about minorities?

What can we expect from anti-union people?

[pipoman]

85. Actually it is the resorting to call people racists who happen to disagree

with you which is again reprehensible and frankly the sign of a true idiot.

[divideandconquer]

86. You can't answer about minorities at Toyota, so I'm a racist?

Did you know that the UAW played an integral part of the civil rights movement? Did you know the "I have a Dream" speech was first given in Detroit?

[pipoman]

87. Yea, and Toyota rapes children and kills bunny rabbits too...we get who you are..

[divideandconquer]

88. Who am I? Someone opposed to the rule of anti-union Confederates?

Mitch McConnell, Jeff Sessions, Richard Shelby, Haley Barbour, the former mayor of Chattanooga who owns all the land around the new VW plant.

Rejoice in your allies my friend.

[ingac70]

49. The Prius plant in Miss. is on hold. n/t

[Romulox]

31. You don't understand how unions work, or why "scabs" are detested.

:hi:

[pipoman]

60. Many here don't understand what it is to

need to feed a family with no work, then suddenly the opportunity to work arises. :hi:

[Romulox]

65. What a ridiculous post. Only scab workers have families to feed?

On another board I used to frequent, they called posts like yours "a clown dance"

:eyes:

[pipoman]

67. Are you suggesting workers in the poorest parts of the US

screw themselves? Move someplace else? Or should they apply for jobs where they live?

Associating poor people in poor communities with being scabs is reprehensible.

[dencol]

8. You must think the world revolves around you.

If you don't see something, it must not have happened. If you don't believe something, it must not be true. If you aren't unemployed, there must not be an unemployment problem. WTF? The world does not revolve around your experiences.

[ixion]

19. No, I was stating a fact. Is that okay with you?

apparently not.

[dencol]

43. Why do you think anybody would care about your car?

Is this thread about your car? Why do you think it should be?

[ixion]

44. My car is in the subset, and therefore noteworthy

In any case: since when do you decide what are the appropriate parameters for a thread?

[susanna]

15. I hope you never do. n/t

[ingac70]

40. lucky you. n/t

[depakid]

9. I'd still like to know why we're not having any of these problems in Australia

When someone figures that out, the case will be more credible.

[mackerel]

16. I have the opposite problem in my Prius.

It decelerates.

[depakid]

17. Either way- if there's a problem with the electronic components

then one way to isolate it is to look at places where there have been problems and where there haven't been.

It's a lot like epidemiology.

Some will always blame this group or that for spreading disease, based on their prejudices.

[DainBramaged]

25. Oh so since you live there, you are an expert on matters here?

:eyes:

[ingac70]

41. "TOYOTA AUSTRALIA ISSUES HYBRID RECALL"

From Feb. of this year....

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/02/09/2814730.htm

More recently...

http://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/989388

http://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/952857

Sounds like Toyota of Australia has its share of problems. Thanks for playing.

[DainBramaged]

42. I guess Google IS our friend after all!!!

:toast:

[depakid]

47. Not sudden acceleration as per the topic under discussion-

Reading comprehension is your friend...

:eyes:

btw: Holden (GM) has also had major recalls this year.

[Omaha Steve]

50. No Tailgating: Holden Ute Recall (read the first 2 sentences)

http://blog.cardomain.com/2010/07/14/no-tailgating-holden-ute-recall/

By Ron Honig WaytooFurious

It’s nice to see car makers that are proactive when faults are found with their cars. Unlike the recent example set by Toyota, it’s good to know that you can still count on some organisations to do the right thing, and save themselves a heap of trouble in the process. Australia’s Holden has recently announced a recall of 34,000 utes as there is the possibility that their tailgates might open unexpectedly while in motion. The chances that this will actually happen to anyone are slim, but in the event that it did, it could pose some obvious hazards to anyone driving behind the defective vehicle. Get the full story at the Age.

34,000 Utes. 12 MILLION Toyota's world wide this year!

[depakid]

52. More than just utes...

Cruze's and Commodore, too.

http://smh.drive.com.au/motor-news/holden-recalls-9000-cars-20100317-qfa5.html

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/fuel-line-sparks-recall/story-e6frf7l6-1111115268249

(a long history of recalls with this car).

Considering the size of the market here, these are pretty substantial.

[ingac70]

51. Just for you.....

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/02/26/2830884.htm

[depakid]

53. Fact is, outside of a report or two during the midst of the hysteria, it's not a persistent problem

which as I noted- calls the claim into question.

What's the difference? and what's the source of the problem?

Bottom line is that he evidence isn't there- and no one can identify what's going on. If anything.

[Omaha Steve]

55. The evidence isn't there- and no one can identify what's going on

Psst. This is an LBN story today: Toyota Documents Allegedly Reveal Company Able to Recreate Sudden Acceleration Incidents

Got me on Australian recalls. I'll do some looking around tomorrow night. I'm headed to bed.

[ingac70]

56. .....

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/RunawayToyotas/runaway-toyotas-toyota-documents-reveal-company-recreate-sudden/story?id=11312612

[Mopar151]

71. From my post of March 16

(And a reply made to a post last week)
Posted by Mopar151 in General Discussion
Tue Mar 16th 2010, 04:30 PM
LOOKIT - THE TOYOTA UNINTENDED ACCELERATION PROBLEM DOES NOT APPLY TO THE PRIUS! And it never did - it applies to US assembled cars using the CTS pedal assembly, and the US specific engine control calibration program.
Whether or not the San Diego Speeding Prius is a hoax, or operator stupidity, or demonic possesion does'nt really matter, UNLESS YOU ARE USING INTENTIONALLY DEFECTIVE LOGIC! This should do nothing to change Toyota's problems (or "be a gift to Toyota")- of which they have many - or "rehabilitate" their reputation, or put them into the "MALIGNED HERO PHASE".
There are a lot of you who have been smug, happy Toyota customers, because the car that your car nut buddies, with their Beemers, WRX/EVO/SHO, mid-life crisis cars, or those awful hot rods and "classics" , told you was slow and boring and looked cheap, rated higher than theirs. It says so, right here in the magazine that says it's so unbiased.
When they show you stuff in "their" magazines, there's a bunch of mumbo-jumbo in there that does'nt matter in the case of your beloved 'Yota - transitional handling, brake bias, torsional stiffness, 2-sided gal-fan plating, electrocoat primers, drivetrain inertia, bumpsteer, and high speed data bus. All you want is to look OK when you pick up your kid after school, and to have as little to fix or change (and no winter tires!) as possible, 'til you trade it in because you're scared it might need work, or 4 new tires.
And now your'e finding out you got played, by a company who got really good at covering things up. But-but-but you trusted them! Their recalls were not in the paper all the time! It must not be their fault! Sorry, pal - Toyota had your number, all along. And some of the things they did, to keep up their image, were wrong. Big, bad wrong. And no amount of finger-pointing at old Fords, or Corvairs, or old wierd-hair furrin cars, will change that.

[pipoman]

12. I keep waiting for the Ford inquisition to begin...

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/nhtsa-data-dive-3-117-models-ranked-by-rate-of-ua-incidents/

[Romulox]

36. That link says that the data "filters out the spike of the UA reports...after the Toyota recall..."

Um, :wtf: :hi:

And the data beat goes on. I asked Edmunds if they had updated model information to filter out the spike of UA reports to NHTSA after the 9/29/09 Toyota mat recall in order to improve my attempt at coming up with a model-specific UA rate. Not only did they oblige, but they already did all the work! A big hat tip to Edmunds, who has taken a lead in the quest to make sense of the data as well as the whole UA fiasco.

In other words, these numbers are bogus and must be run with a disclaimer, at best. You don't get to manipulate the data to the desired ("expected") outcome. :hi:

[DainBramaged]

38. But but but it's what they have to do.....

:crazy:

[Romulox]

64. Love how the poster back to this thread, but avoided correcting his blatant misrepresentation.

:hi:

[pipoman]

81. So I guess you are saying Ford hasn't had UA incidents reported?

Is that what you are claiming? Have a link?

Only someone who knows nothing about these types of legal issues can't figure out that there are an abundance of ambulance chaser attys and people who make fictitious claims after a story like this is run...so there's really no need to address your post as it is a complete no brainer.

[Romulox]

82. The data you've presented has been doctored to exclude Toyota UA incidents.

You are shameless.

[pipoman]

83. Nobody would ever try to get in on a class action

based on a news report. Klingons are a fact of class action law. I would wager 95%+ of claims made after initial news reports are klingons...

You still haven't answered my initial post nor my subsequent post..shameless indeed.

[DainBramaged]

39. Many of you folks just think Toyota is being singled out, they are criminals, read

Toyota Motor Co. ignored evidence of acceleration problems in its vehicles for most of the past decade and failed to install a brake override system it knew could have prevented accidents, an amended federal lawsuit claims.

The revised lawsuit was filed in U.S. District Court in Southern California on Monday on behalf of nearly 40 consumers and businesses for claims of economic losses, including diminished vehicle values, stemming from complaints of Toyota cars accelerating out of control.

Plaintiff lawyers say they expect the litigation will encompass some 40 million U.S. consumers if class-action status is conferred on the lawsuit as intended.

The amended suit cited an internal company memo as saying that

Toyota's U.S. sales arm had requested a "fail-safe (brake override) option" in 2007, three years before the company committed to making that safety feature standard.

Toyota also failed to address a marked spike in complaints involving sudden unintended acceleration starting in 2002, the year a new electronic throttle control system became standard equipment in its cars and trucks, the lawsuit claims.



Read more: http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100803/OEM/308039998/1147#ixzz0vYFMO47Z

[Mopar151]

72. And such a system has been available for 25- years

In the American auto racing aftermarket. A fact which I have posted here, with proper cites and sources, numerous times before.

[formercia]

66. It will be interesting to see what happens tonight when the Solar Storm hits.

One theory is that high energy particles from Space cause the microprocessors to go off to lala land. If there's a sudden rash of acceleration incidence reported, it would seem to validate the theory.

[jsamuel]

68. 6 incidents in 7 years? out of how many millions of cars?

[Omaha Steve]

73. Where do you get 6 from?

http://www.nitrobahn.com/news/revised-lawsuit-reveals-toyota-stayed-ignorant-to-safety-issues-with-intent/

And they knew: And we are back again. A class-action lawsuit against Toyota now claims that the Japanese automaker was aware as far back as 2003 of the problem of unintended acceleration in cars manufactured by the company. Toyota had deliberately stayed ignorant to the evidences and failed to install a brake override system it knew could have prevented accidents.

The lawyers have reportedly got their hands on a field report that was written seven years ago by a technician outlining the instance of unintended acceleration. According to these documents, there was a need for an immediate action by the company.

From Feb. : http://www.nitrobahn.com/news/revised-lawsuit-reveals-toyota-stayed-ignorant-to-safety-issues-with-intent/

New tally: 56 dead in Toyota sudden acceleration accidents
February 28th, 2010, 11:13 am · 76 Comments · posted by Teri Sforza, Register staff writer



Latest numbers are now over 100. I'm headed to bed and won't have time to find the link till Friday.

[jsamuel]

77. Its in the OP you posted

"Toyota Motor Corp. was informed of sudden acceleration incidents verified by its own technicians and dealers at least six times dating back to 2003, according to documents filed Monday in two lawsuits against the automaker."

[Omaha Steve]

79. Six incidents reported by it's OWN technicians starting in 2003

I misunderstood what you were saying. Your not counting the numerous incidents OUTSIDE the company. The public didn't know about these six until Monday.