'India represents fear and terror in Kashmir'

[Turborama]

Source: Daily Times

By Iftikhar Gilani -

Wednesday, August 18, 2010 -

NEW DELHI: A Kashmiri student stunned Nitin Gadkari, the president of the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP), by telling him that India in Kashmir represented fear and terror. A student delegation, arranged by the Shyama Prasad Muherjee Foundation, a think-tank to showcase them to BJP president, pleaded the Indian public to listen to their aspirations.

An eloquent Afsana, a student delegate, told the BJP president that India had long represented fear and terror. "I mean, when the word 'India' comes to a Kashmiri's mind, a common Kashmiri, what comes in mind is a soldier with a gun in his hand. Fear and terror is all what a common Kashmiri feels," she said. The students also asked him to understand the Kashmiri youth and their aspirations.

"It's really nice to be here and to see that there are wonderful people around in India who are really ready to listen to us, to listen to our aspirations, to listen to what we feel. It's really, really good to be here and nice to know how wonderful Indian people are," she added.

Over 56 students from Kashmir University, Islamic University for Science and Technology and other professional colleges are in New Delhi to interact with Union Home Minister P Chidambaram, BJP leader Sushma Swaraj, Islamic scholar Maulana Wahiduddin Khan and Chief Election Commissioner SY Quarishi.

Read more: http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2010\08\18\story_18-8-2010_pg7_25

---

Not sure why that link isn't working. :shrug: It works like this, though: http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2010\08\18\story_18-8-2010_pg7_25">Working Link To The Article

Bharatiya Janata Party

The Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) (Hindi: भारतीय जनता पार्टी <भाजपा>, translation: Indian People's Party) is a major political party in India. It is the second largest political party established in 1980. The party is associated with Hindu nationalism and strongly advocates conservative social policies, self-reliance, free market capitalist policy, foreign policy driven by a nationalist agenda, and strong national defence. The party's platform is generally considered right of center in Indian political spectrum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Janata_Party

Some recent articles about what's been happening in Kashmir...

Why silence over Kashmir speaks volumes
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4502117&mesg_id=4503747

Indian Forces Face Broader Revolt in Kashmir
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4502117

Indian Prime Minister Appeals for Calm in Kashmir
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4504822

[cosmicone]

1. Kashmir issue is kept alive by Pakistan and Pakistani media

Looking at what would have happened to them if they were ruled by Pakistan after the recent floods should wake some of the younger ideologues riled by the ISI up.

Eventually, as Pakistan becomes weaker and weaker, the Kashmiris will get over it.

By the way, the Kashmiris, though Muslim, practice a very peaceful sect of Islam -- Sufi. The Sifis believe in tolerance and coexistence. It was Kashmir's tradition until Pakistan founded, trained, funded and armed militants to the cause to create havoc in a peaceful state of India until then.

The Wahabis in Pakistan don't even consider the Sufis and Ahmadiyas as true muslims and massacre them in Pakistan on a regular basis.

[nyy1998]

20. +1

Excellent analysis of the situation there.

[OhioChick]

2. I find this to be interesting:

"However, anti-India sentiment runs deep in the Indian controlled portion, with most reportedly favoring either independence from India or a merger with Pakistan."

http://www1.voanews.com/english/news/Indian-Prime-Minister-Appeals-for-Calm-in-Kashmir-100732584.html

[closeupready]

4. Of course. Even many of those in India proper are going hungry:

>>In spite of government claim to have succeeded in checking starvation death ,a woman jumped in the well along with 3 children.

The woman has survived but her three kids are dead. The mother and her three children were hungry allegedly for a week.

A mother along with her three children jumped into the well to allegedly commit suicide after going hungry for seven days at Harlagora village in Bokaro district of Jharkhand...

India is failing its rural poor with 230 million people being undernourished which is the highest for any country in the world. Malnutrition accounts for nearly 50% of child deaths in India as every third adult between age group15-49 years is reported to be weak due to starvation...<<

http://english.samaylive.com/regional/jharkhand/676471484.html

I have a number of friends from India, I should note.

[OhioChick]

5. That's awful.

I hadn't heard that, yet. :(

[Vehl]

9. yep :(

This is something that should be eradicated as soon as possible.

if only some politicians would stop lining their pockets and think more towards the welfare of the people...India would have done away with its poverty by now.

but then again...even though the numbers are huge, one can find some consolation that the number of poor have been reduced by half(not sure of the number) or more than it was during independence.

the recent actions by the parliament suggest that India might pass the "right to food" legislation..which would entail that every poor family would get a allocated amount of food per year, to ensure that nourishment needs are met

http://www.righttofoodindia.org/


progress has been slow in the early decades after freedom..mostly due to the inept trade and market policies of the congress government which aped that of the soviet union. The opening of the market in the mid 90s has started to provide great dividends...and im sure the 8% average growth sustained in the past 10 years has indeed done a lot towards the alleviation of the suffering of the poor.

there is a long way to go yet...but at least now the light at the end of the tunnel is visible.
Democracies might be slow...but they will eventually win out.after all India is the greatest example of democracy on the planet....a nation of dozens of languages and cultures.....multiple religions....and hundreds of political parties.

[closeupready]

10. As long as things steadily improve, that's to be encouraged.

I'm glad hunger is less of a problem now than it used to be. I look forward to the day when it is eliminated entirely. :)

[Vehl]

16. same here .

It seems achievable in this generation

food should be a fundamental right of people

[Turborama]

13. India is *one of* the greatest examples of democracy on the planet

Indonesia is a post colonial (and ex-dictatorship) nation of many languages, cultures, multiple religions and dozens of political parties. ;-)

BTW I'm not Indonesian, just an expat who lives there.

[Vehl]

15. sure,

I meant in terms of population as well as diversity. Each Indian state is almost like a country by itself...as they are mostly drawn along linguistic and ethnic lines.

btw i like the recent 1/3rd quota allocation for Women in the parliament :)
even though im not a fan of quotas, i think actions such as these would hasten the participation of more women in politics as a whole



ps:

fun fact

According to Census of India of 2001, 29 languages are spoken by more than a million native speakers, 122 by more than 10,000.
this include the 20+ official languages


:)

[sabrina 1]

12. Very interesting ....

[OhioChick]

3. Youth’s death sparks fresh violence in Kashmir

Wednesday, Aug 18, 2010, 0:23 IST

The death of another youth in Kashmir on Tuesday brought people out on the streets again. The death toll in clashes between people and policemen has risen to 58 since June 11.

Mohammad Abbas Dhobi, 20, who sustained spinal cord injuries in a clash with security forces on August 13, died on Tuesday. He had been admitted to the Sher-e-Kashmir Institute of Medical Sciences (SKIMS).

“Around 300 people pelted stones and bricks on security forces in Mattan, Anantnag, on August 13. The forces cane-charged the mob and chased them away. There was a stampede during this and Dhobi was injured. He was referred to SKIMS. Doctors tried their best to save his life,” a police spokesman said.

Local people and Dhobi’s family disputed that story. They said he was badly beaten up by security forces. The death sparked off anger in Anantnag district. People pelted stones on security forces. Shops and business establishments, which had opened in response to a plea from Hurriyat hawk Syed Ali Shah Geelani, again shut down in protest.

More:
http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_youth-s-death-sparks-fresh-violence-in-kashmir_1424997

[Turborama]

6. 58 protesters killed over a period of 2 months?

The lack of attention this is getting from the western media is stunning.

[OhioChick]

7. Videos (WARNING GRAPHIC)

A cycle of violence has erupted again in India’s troubled Kashmir valley since 11th June 2010 with the shooting to death of a schoolboy by Indian troops.

http://vimeo.com/13998848

Again, there are several videos here but they are GRAPHIC.

[Vehl]

8. merger with pakistan? what next?

It makes no sense...


one has to keep in mind that this 'Kashmir" was a land that is occupied by those who invaded it..and drove those who did not convert to the religion of the invaders out..or killed them outright.


How would a person react if someone occupied the aforementioned person's home, kicks the occupants out...and after a short while claims that home to be his own? Only those who agree that the home invader gets to keep the occupied home, would agree with the demand for merger with Pakistan.


What is oft left unsaid is that the Kashmir Hindus, the pundits have been driven out of their native land and live in nearby states, many as refugees. For all the fire and brimstone one sees against Indian kashmir on certain segments of the media...one hardly hears about the plight of Kashmiri Hindus, the same people whose land was usurped by those who now raise such a hue and cry.


it would be really great if people post the full story than parts of it, cos telling only part of it, out of context, would only result in some Andrew Breitbart'ish news

[Turborama]

11. I agree that context is very important. There's lots of context in the links I posted in the OP n/t

[Vehl]

14. religion cannot be used as an unifying force, and should not be allowed to influence politics.

I for one cannot understand how people could find brotherhood with someone halfway around the world just because they share the same religion.

The Kashmiri Muslims and the ones running Pakistan(Overwhelmingly punjabi) don't share much in the way of ethnicity or blood ties...the only link they have is religion. Thus their "politics" are based on religion. I can understand a bit of someone is arguing from the base of one's language/ethnicity etc etc..but to say that they need to secede and join some other nation because of religion is absurd and archaic in the extreme.

religion and politics ought not mix...and if they do, the result is quite explosive.

For all their claims against India, the % of Islamic people in India is higher than it was right after partition.whereas the % of minority religions in Pakistan(be it Christian or Hindu) is almost non-existent now compared to its original %. The horror stories of the overt discrimination minorities in Pakistan face are legion. I do not want to clutter this post with links, but a simple Google search would suffice.

lets not even get into the rights minorities have...in fact i could name a couple of presidents/prime ministers of India who were Muslim. The current one is a minority as well.

what do those from Kashmir(who want to join Pakistan) plan to achieve? they are but pawns in a game by Pakistan (and china as well) which use them in order to try destabilize India. If Pakistan is such a heaven as they claim it to be..why is it almost over-run by the Taliban and their ilk?..with the government barely holding onto power...and lets not forget the recent wiki-leaks info about how the Pakistani ISI diverts funds to support the Taliban against both America, as well as mujaheddin against India?
Are these the actions of a responsible government?..a government that is fighting quite a few insurgencies itself...namely that of the Balochi people against Pakistan. Maybe Pakistan should try to have 20 years of civilian rule in one stretch before trying to acquire more land.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balochistan_conflict


Kashmiris , regardless of religion, would reap much more benefits by being part of a democratic nation than saddling themselves with one which seems to have used up a lot of its many lives.

[cosmicone]

17. I support a free Balochistan and a free Sindhudesh.....

Balochistan has most of the natural resources and Sindhudesh the ports. The struggle of the Sindhis and Balochis is swept under the rug by Pakistani Punjabis and it should not be.

Far more atrocities are committed by Pakistan in Balochistan and Sindhudesh and deliberately so. Indian army in Kashmir is simply there to defend and doesn't commit atrocities on purpose because it would run counter to India's objectives of winning the hearts and minds of the Kashmiri people. Indians are not that stupid.

Indian side of Kashmir enjoys a democracy and regular elections where 65%+ people turn out to vote. That is the most significant poll of the Kashmiri people -- not the fake polls conducted by ISI front outfits for propaganda purposes.

[Turborama]

18. According to what I've read, the Pakistan backed insurgency has pretty much been quashed

IE no more poking their noses in and making matters worse. Of course, if you have evidence to prove otherwise I'd be interested in reading it for some extra context.

As I understand it, this is more about local people protesting against the lack of election promises being kept. Such as "repealing laws that largely shield security forces from scrutiny and demilitarizing the state", as described in the NYT's Indian Forces Face Broader Revolt in Kashmir article I linked to in the OP...

For decades, India maintained hundreds of thousands of security forces in Kashmir to fight an insurgency sponsored by Pakistan, which claims this border region, too. The insurgency has been largely vanquished. But those Indian forces are still here, and today they face a threat potentially more dangerous to the world’s largest democracy: an intifada-like popular revolt against the Indian military presence that includes not just stone-throwing young men but their sisters, mothers, uncles and grandparents.

=snip=

The insurgency of the 1990s has mostly dried up, and elections in 2008 drew the highest percentage of voters in a generation. High expectations met the new chief minister, Omar Abdullah, a scion of Kashmir’s leading political family, whose fresh face seemed well suited to bringing better government and prosperity to Kashmir.

But election promises, like repealing laws that largely shield security forces from scrutiny and demilitarizing the state, went unfulfilled. After two summers of protests on specific grievances, this summer’s unrest has taken on a new character, one more difficult to define and mollify.

Direct link for easy access: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/13/world/asia/13kashmir.html?_r=1&hp=&pagewanted=all

[Vehl]

19. demilitarization might be hard due to the location

as Kashmir borders Pakistan, both sides have hundreds of thousands of soldiers staring across the border.