Moscow's new weapon called ‘revolutionary'

[dArKeR]

Moscow — Russia has designed a “revolutionary” weapon that would make the prospective American missile defence useless, Russian news agencies reported Monday, quoting a senior Defence Ministry official.

The official, who was not identified by name, said tests conducted during last month's military manoeuvres would dramatically change the philosophy behind development of Russia's nuclear forces, the Interfax and ITAR-Tass news agencies reported.

If deployed, the new weapon would take the value of any U.S. missile shield to “zero,” the news agencies quoted the official as saying.

The official said the new weapon would be inexpensive, providing an “asymmetric answer” to U.S. missile defences, which are proving extremely costly to develop.

http://theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040329.wruss0329/BNStory/International/

[Media_Lies_Daily]

1. The clock just moved closer to midnight.

[0rganism]

13. *Shrug* seems like the deterrent option is still available, as always

If anything, the "missile shield" is more of a threat, because it gives the illusion that someone could actually win a nuclear war. That was the rationale behind the ABM ban.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

58. You seem to forget that the NeoCons have championed the...

...first-strike concept. They don't seem to acknowledge ANY deterrent, do they?

[0rganism]

64. Now that's an interesting point: do the Neo-Cons recognize deterrence?

I wouldn't be so quick to say they don't, they'd likely frame it in terms of "cost-benefit analysis." What are the costs of launching a full-scale nuclear strike against the USSR and/or China, compared with the potential payoff? Doesn't add up, or they might just do it.

Conversely, I've speculated against "conventional wisdom" that the only reason the bush cartel dared to invade Iraq was the credible reports of previous UN weapons inspectors and CIA intelligence that WMDs were NOT available for immediate deployment. I think they're far too cowardly to risk a scenario in which a large segment of their popular support is exposed to widespread risk. Saddam played into their hands by having an insufficient deterrent while plausibly posing a "continued threat" for the purposes of propaganda. Similarly, no invasion of North Korea -- we know they have WMDs, we know the regime is severely oppressive, but the risk doesn't come with any attendant economic reward.

I could be wrong, of course.

[thebigidea]

2. then again, at this point ANY weapon could get by missile defense.

what with it not existing and stuff.

[hang a left]

20. tee hee

[mouse7]

34. All it would take is $2 worth of aluminum foil to beat star wars

Either in the form of chaff or shaped in the form of a cloud of incoming warheads around the real warhead... or both.

There would be such a storm of crap on radar screens it would be impossible to determine targeting.

[northzax]

59. right, and who is the largest producer of aluminum foil?

Alcoa. and who used to be the CEO of Alcoa? Paul O'Neil. I told you he was a traitor and was only out to destroy our sainted George W.

[acmavm]

3. Wheeeee! The not so Cold War is on again. (And bush* thought he

could look into Putin's eyes and see his soul.) WRONG, what he should have noticed was Putin laughting his ass off.

[orwell]

4. Tesla Howitzers

The Russians have been rumored to have "Tesla howitzers" for some time now. If this is true, it makes conventional weapons obsolete.

O

[bobbyboucher]

16. What?

Never heard of such a thing. I've heard of Tesla, and I've heard of Howitzer, but never......

[Abaques]

56. Its an imaginary weapon Telsa dreamed up....

...if its the earthquake gun that is being mentioned. It is just a physical impossibillity.

All that you need to make the missle shield obsolete is 50 mylar balloons that sit along side the warhead.

Or a Ryder truck with some lead lined walls.

[nolabels]

21. Here is something

http://www.cheniere.org/books/analysis/history.htm
(snip)
Historical Background of Scalar EM Weapons
by Lt. Col. T.E. Bearden (retd.), 1990
Copyright

Colonel Bearden is a nuclear engineer, wargames analyst, and military tactician with over 26 years experience in air defense systems, tactics and operations, technical intelligence, antiradiation missile countermeasures, nuclear weapons employment, computerized wargames and military systems requirements.



We begin our history in 1939 at T.H. Moray's lab in Salt Lake City. In that year, a Russian agent obtained detailed drawings of Moray's specialized amplifier which extracted energy from the powerful quantum mechanical fluctuations of vacuum. Moray's radiant energy device weighed 55 pounds and produced 50 kilowatts of power without conventional input. Numerous demonstrations are documented by engineers, scientists, and community leaders. After extensively testing Moray's device and obtaining the drawings by subterfuge, the Soviet agent destroyed the device. Moray, a truly great pioneer who was unjustifiably ignored in his time, had expended several hundred thousand dollars and exhausted his funds on the first unit. He was never financially able to rebuild it.

Thus in 1939 the Soviets obtained the secret, detailed drawings for a 29-stage electromagnetic device far ahead of its time. Moray had made the first germanium transistor, an amorphous pellet of multiple, finely powdered ingredients, sintered under heat and pressure to lock-in stress, and containing minute interfaces (very tiny built-in cracks) which acted as tiny scalar EM interferometers. Over the years Moray had painstakingly constructed 29 special tubes, each comprised of a blown quartz envelope containing several (usually three) of his transistor pellets. Only one in 300 of Moray's tubes would work, and thousands had been built to obtain the 29 good ones used in Moray's radiant energy amplifier. Each of Moray's pellets in the tube produced a vacuum state far from thermodynamic equilibrium, and the tri-assembly functioned as a macroscopic scalar interferometer and collector. Moray's 55-pound amplifier curved local spacetime and produced 50 kilowatts of usable load power from the curved vacuum source itself. Additional power could be taken from intermediate stages as well.
(snip)

Quite long actually, lots of interestig stuff, maybe somebody wants to debunk. You must note though, the European comunity is very concerned about this kind of stuff.

Going in to look for more links, cover me :scared:

On edit, wrong weapons system with the stuff about European comunity

It was this, (which is way worse,if it worked)
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/haarp_index.htm



What Is HAARP?

HAARP (High frequency Active Auroral Research Program) is to be a major Arctic facility for upper atmospheric and solar-terrestrial research. HAARP is being built on a DoD-owned site near Gakona, Alaska. Principal instruments include a high power, high-frequency (HF) phased array radio transmitter (known as the Ionospheric Research Instrument, or IRI), used to stimulate small, well-defined volumes of ionosphere, and an ultra-high frequency (UHF) incoherent scatter radar (ISR), used to measure electron densities, electron and ion temperatures, and Doppler velocities in the stimulated region and in the natural ionosphere. To further the scientific capabilities and usefulness of the IRI and ISR, HAARP is supporting the design and installation of the latest in modern geophysical research instruments, including an HF ionosonde, ELF and VLF receivers, magnetometers, riometers, a LIDAR (LIght Detection And Ranging) and optical and infrared spectrometers and cameras which will be used to observe the complex natural variations of Alaska's ionosphere as well as to detect artificial effects produced by the IRI. http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/haarp/haarpFactSheet.html

HAARP BOILS THE UPPER ATMOSPHERE - HAARP will zap the upper atmosphere with a focused and steerable electromagnetic beam. It is an advanced model of an 'ionospheric heater'. (The ionosphere is the electrically-charged sphere surrounding Earth's upper atmosphere. It ranges between about 40 to 600 miles above Earth's surface.) Put simply, the apparatus for HAARP is a reversal of a radio telescope: antennas send out signals instead of receiving. HAARP is the test run for a super-powerful radio wave beaming technology that lifts areas of the ionosphere by focusing a beam and heating those areas. Electromagnetic waves then bounce back onto Earth and penetrate everything-living and dead. HAARP publicity gives the impression that the High-frequency Active Auroral Research Program is mainly an academic project with the goal of changing the ionosphere to improve communications for our own good. However, other US military documents put it more clearly: HAARP aims to learn how to "exploit the ionosphere for Department of Defense purposes". HAARP: VANDALISM IN THE SKY?

I have been assured, by everyone from Ph.D.s to poets, that HAARP is: 1. An ionospheric heater 2. A research tool 3. A military test bed 4. A tax-subsidized boondoggle 5. A directed-energy weapon 6. A communication system for submarines 7. A source of field-aligned ionospheric VHF reflectors 8. A way to improve satellite links 9. A planetary x-ray machine 10. A plot to depopulate the Third World 11. A means of creating power blackouts at will 12. Electronic warfare 13. Tesla's wireless power transmission 14. Tesla's secret death ray 15. Searching for space aliens 16. Killing space aliens 17. Killing off the militias 18. Keeping them awake at night (through RF head rectification) 19. Enforcing the New World Order 20. Creating nuclear-scale explosions 21. Weather modification 22. CIA mind control 23. Brain wave modification 24. The end of HF radio 25. The end of wildlife in Alaska 26. The end of atmospheric ozone 27. The end of the human race 28. The end of Earth itself. Now, this is pretty good for one transmitter. I think the last experimental radio that attracted this kind of attention was built by Marconi. What's Up With HAARP?
(snip)

[nodehopper]

29. that website

you link to, the forbiddenknowledge.com one--I just went to it and it's some freaky fundamentalist Book-of-Revelations-thumping enterprise, comparing abortion to the Holocaust.

How about some other sources?

[nolabels]

32. Just picked that one out of the bag

I heard about this thing several months ago on a community radio station so a little foggy on it

http://www.earthpulse.com/haarp/

The governments version
http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/

But Project censored has something on it. A lot of links I went looking thru were blanked out, or dead. So my guess there is something to this

Check this out

http://www.haarp.net/
The Military's Pandora's Box

By Dr. Nick Begich and Jeane Manning

Hear Nick talk about this in depth on Art Bell*
(*If Media link goes to a blank page, just Reload browser)

This article was prepared to provide a summary of the contents of a book written in 1995 which describes an entirely new class of weapons. The weapons and their effects are described in the following pages. The United States Navy and Air Force have joined with the University of Alaska, Fairbanks, to build a prototype for a ground based "Star Wars" weapon system located in the remote bush country of Alaska.

The individuals who are demanding answers about HAARP are scattered around the planet. As well as bush dwellers in Alaska, they include: a physician in Finland; a scientist in Holland; an anti-nuclear protester in Australia; independent physicists in the United States; a grandmother in Canada, and countless others.

Unlike the protests of the 1960s the objections to HAARP have been registered using the tools of the 1990s. From the Internet, fax machines, syndicated talk radio and a number of alternative print mediums the word is getting out and people are waking up to this new intrusion by an over zealous United States government.

The research team put together to gather the materials which eventually found their way into the book never held a formal meeting, never formed a formal organization. Each person acted like a node on a planetary info-spirit-net with one goal held by all -- to keep this controversial new science in the public eye. The result of the team's effort was a book which describes the science and the political ramifications of this technology.
(snip)

[Guy_Montag]

53. HAARP etc.

I used to work with a British environmental research agency. While I don't know about HAARP directly I worked (as an engineer) on all of "HF ionosonde, ELF and VLF receivers, magnetometers, riometers, a LIDAR (LIght Detection And Ranging) and optical and infrared spectrometers and cameras" to a greater or lesser extent.

My knowledge of the science is not too hot, but there was nothing sinister involved. These were the same guys that discovered and made public the whole in the ozone layer. (You yanks nabbed the Nobel prize for it - but we found it).

Indeed the conspiracy theory article about HAARP was criculated among the scientists to much mirth.

Of course I don't expect you to believe any of this.

;)

[classics]

62. "which extracted energy from the powerful quantum mechanical fluctuations"

*cough* bullshit *cough*

[Eye and Monkey]

23. I believe that the newest version is the "Tesla Pretzel".

I am unsure as to whether it is neutron or conventional-nuke.

[ramapo]

5. Missile defense is an assinine fantasy

First Reagan, then Bush latched onto this stupid waste of money. The defense contractors cashed in though so it wasn't a total waste.

[0rganism]

14. Surround the planet with an impenetrable dome of Money!

It can't fail!
:evilgrin:

[mulethree]

26. Or just channel the money to chums and build a dome of bullcrap

[tabasco]

51. You are correct.

The republicans use projects like this to funnel taxpayer money to their corporate friends. Then the repugs claim they are big on defense, when the opposite is the truth. When they waste massive amounts of money like this, they take away from the rest of the military. Star Wars was condemned by real scientists for years as easily defeated, even if a working prototype was developed. But the repugs don't really care about feasibility, they care about how much money goes to Northrup, Rockwell, Grumman, GE, etc.

[northzax]

60. exactamundo

if Missile Defense is so feasible, how come no contractor will take on a closed end, guaranteed contract for delivery of a system? Surely Boeing will guarantee us they can make it work, given large resources. Let's give them, say, ten years, and as much money as they want to guarantee delivery of a funactional system that will be tested to a specified standard developed by the Pentagon. There will be two caveats on this deal, however. First, if the system does no meet expectations at testing, the money will be refunded to the government. If it does meet expectations, Boeing can take a 20 percent cash bonus. Also, all executives who have to be listed on SEC reports can only recieve slaray or bonus increases over the overage of the past five years in stock, which will be held in Escrow as collateral for the Government. When the system works, that excrow account is released to them, if it doesn't work, well he value of the stock will be almost nothing as they are forced to pay back billions of dollars to the government. Thus, we can link compensation to performance.

[usscole]

6. This sounds like complete BS

I don't doubt that Russia already has the capability to defeat any ABM system we could build, but I seriously doubt that it has recently made some dramatic technological development. But then again, it is possible.

[salib]

15. Symptomatic

Whether or not this statement is factual is probably not the most important part of the announcement. More importantly is the fundamental reality that this announcement points to: If you say to the world that "We are the ONLY ONES who have 'weapons of mass destruction' because we can take yours out!", then others are going to say "not so fast." When are we going to EVER see the totally obvious, just totally obvious, folly of an arms race. NO ONE WINS. EVERYONE CAUGHT IN THE CROSS-FIRE LOSES!

We live in a world where we are not the only potential bully on the block. We are going to have to learn how to "work well with others." We currently have a "U" for "Unsatisfactory." And the rest of the world is simply pointing that out.

[Chomskyite]

7. Buck Turgidson says,

Gee, I wish we had one of them doomsday machines.

[FlashHarry]

10. I'm not saying we wouldn't get our hair mussed!

But no more than twenty million killed... tops!

[Strelnikov_]

57. We Better Start Addressing That Mine-Shaft Gap <nt>

[Algorem]

8. Exploding-ship bombs?

[Ready4Change]

9. This segment of the article is interesting:

"...the military tested a “hypersonic flying vehicle” that was able to manoeuvre between space and the earth's atmosphere."

Interesting that this comes up so soon after the first successful flight of the X-43.

[whistle]

11. America's Maginot Line in the sky...

...No matter what kinds of defenses we can build and no matter how many trillions we spend on arms, others will find ways to overcome them and penetrate them. Dumb twits. Launch loaves of bread, not missiles.:donut:

[kysrsoze]

61. ....Said so eloquently. I had to laugh at that because it's so true.

Nice term, Whistle.

[proud patriot]

12. It's shit like this that proves what an utterly WEAK leader bush is

:grr:

[Diego360]

17. Could be this:

I remember reading this article when it first came out (when Bush and Rumsfeld were so focused on missile defense).

"Other experts point to the possibility of fielding long-distance, multistage supercavitating torpedoes/ missiles fitted with nuclear warheads ("long-range guided preemptive weapons") that could prove to be a relatively cheap and effective counter to future "Star Wars" missile defense systems. These devices could dash in from many miles out at sea entirely underwater, pop out of coastal waters close to their targets, and drop their lethal payloads before any aerial or space-based defenses could react."

Warp Drive Underwater

-edited for quote

[Calico Jack Rackham]

18. The Revolutionary weapon

could be the SS-N-25 Onyx which is an upgraded SS-N-22 Sunburn missile. These were originally designed to be anti-ship missiles, but were later reconfigured to carry nuclear payloads. These babies cruise at a rummored 45-100 feet using map of the earth guidance systems similar to our cruise missiles. The estimated speed is an incredible 2,100 mph (Mach 2.9)

I guess the NATO expansion is getting Pooty Poot on edge.

[Paulie]

19. I know what they did

They got the blueprints for the homing beacon used in the missle tests. So when an attack missile re-enters the atmosphere, it released the homing beacon, so our anit-missile missile goes straight for it, just like it was taught in class.

Probably got the parts at RadioShack. ;)

[DerBeppo]

22. yeah right

this fits right along side the failed missile test that humiliated putin a while back.

they can't afford to keep what they already have working, they're not building anything like this.

[freeforall]

24. Now how does a missle shield protect against

anthrax or biochemical attacks, suicide bombers...


What a gross waste of money!

[Zorra]

25. Another Bu$h success story.

Results of backing out of the ABM treaty.

Ain't this just swell?

[teryang]

27. The Russian strategic ICBM force

...could easily destroy the United States completely. What's the point?

[NickB79]

30. Exactly

Even in its most optimistic form, a future missile defense system would only be able to take out a few dozen missiles or warheads at a time. The Russians could put several THOUSAND warheads over US airspace in a half hr. Its like trying to stop a swarm of bees with a BB gun.

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

28. After awhile, it starts looking like an episode of

[GregW]

31. Ahhh ... more job security for Condi

Gotta raise the ol' cold-war nemesis ... you know ... the ONLY thing she IS qualified for.

[yltlatl]

33. Oh, c'mon

"Mr. Putin said the development of such new weapons wasn't aimed against the United States."

No, they're obviously for terrorists. I'm sure that we could get UBL if we only had a hypersonic ICBM.

[sixtoes1]

35. Well.....

whoopty-fuckin-doo. They've got so many missiles already that a defense system would be useless anyway. Ha! They've just wasted their time. Dumbasses. The point of missile defense is to stop rogue nations with nothing to lose by firing some pissant nuclear warhead at us. Unless Russia has their own missile defense system capable surviving our barrage, this is stupid news. Wow! I wonder how much money they wasted on it?

[TankLV]

41. The point of the defense system is to pour zillions of our tax dollars

into bunkerboy's friends and family enterprises.

And wipe out all social programs, too boot.

There is no such thing as a defense system, No one has developed one, or is anywhere near developing one. They ALL are a waste of money to everyone but bushco.

[Desperadoe]

36. What was it that Patton said?

"Fixed fortifications are a demonstration of the stupidity of man".....or something like that.

[orthogonal]

37. My guess is...

My bet's on a backpack carried by a "tourist", or possibly disguising the nuke as a shipment of cocaine -- none of that crosses our borders, right?

That said, I'm still for SDI -- for the same reason I wear a seatbelt in a car with airbags.

Eventually someone is going to attempt to nuke an American city with a missile, and the cost of that will be more than the cost of SDI -- and besides, we need to be in space anyway.

[mouse7]

38. If they can afford to make a nuclear missile...

...they can afford to make two with one carrying a warhead case filled with aluminum foil strips. Instant undefeatable chaff cloud surrounding incoming warhead.

The "shooting a bb gun at a swarm of bees" comparison is very appropriate... except you have to hit one particular bee in the swarm.

Star Wars is will be utter nonsense until we have "science-fiction-movie quality" long range sensor equipment that can determine exact locations of fissionable material and target from that data. We're at least 50 years from such technology.

[mmm]

52. Star Wars does not and will never work

The late Carl Sagan, no lightwieght in the field of physics,
stated that creating a workable missle defense system
requires solving six problems as complex as E=mc squared.
Even after the fact that a rogue nation is least likely
to launch a missle; most likely to send a warhead
special delivery via ship or over land.

[Capt_Nemo]

39. Strange, they had already made this filter out a month ago...

http://archive.ap.org/cgi-bin/APdisplay.cgi?id=406930b1cad43Mpqaweb1P11018&doc=results.html

"Russia boasts of future weapons that can penetrate missile defense
Relevancy: 83 Byline: VLADIMIR ISACHENKOV; Associated Press Writer Category: International Pub. date: 02-19-2004 Word Count: 5K
MOSCOW (AP) Russia successfully tested a space vehicle that could lead to weapons capable of penetrating missile defenses, a senior general said Thursday. He insisted the device was not meant to counter U.S. efforts to develop an anti-missile shield."


From the Globe and Mail:

"...Military analysts said that the mysterious new weapons could be a manoeuvrable ballistic missile warhead or a hypersonic cruise missile."

Check out this late February discussion in a military aviation forum
that echoes these analysts' guesses (and dig the asshole with the
Limbaugh avatar):

http://forum.airforces.info/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21605

The fact that the russians recycled this story after the X-43 flight
seem to point to the test of a demonstration vehicle, either for
an hypersonic long range cruise missile, or an hypersonic UCAV.

[abracadabra]

40. this is why we need STAR WARS --gimmie sum mo munee

*****************
isn't it OBVIOUS--

dumb transparent sales pitch !!!

mo munee mo munee mo munee

[Devils Advocate NZ]

42. I don't know what the big mystery is...

They have plainly said what this new "weapon" is. A nuclear missile has multiple stages. The first is the launch vehicle, which is designed to accelerate the missile into orbit. The next is the orbit vehicle which transports the re-entry vehicles during the orbit phase of the flight. Finally there is the re-entry vehicle which plunges back into the atmosphere and delivers the warhead to the target.

Multiple Independant Re-entry Vehicle (MIRV) ICBM's contain multiple warheads and in more advanced versions contain dummy warheads as well.

Now, to defend against an ICBM, you either shoot it down at launch, during orbit or during re-entry. Re-entry is the LEAST desirable time to shoot down a nuclear warhead because firstly it is over friendly territory, second it is travelling so fast that it is exremely difficult to hit, added to which is the fact that they are maneuvering (guided) and thus not only fast but unpredictable, and the amount of time to re-engage a missed target is practically zero.

So, the best times to shoot down an ICBM have been during launch, which is hard because you need near instant reactions to get it before it reaches orbit, or in orbit.

Until now, orbit stage vehicles have been ballistic (hence "Ballistic Missile"). They did not manuever, and although they were travelling very fast, they were easily predicted, based on their trajectory. This also meant taking out multiple warheads (on MIRV ICBM's) with one shot.

This new Russian vehicle though is capable of manuevring during the orbit phase of the flight. This effectively removes the orbit phase from the equation, meaning that the ONLY time an ICBM could be shot down would be during launch, and you would only have 2 or three minutes from the moment the engines fired until the orbit vehicle began maneuvering in orbit.

Just because the Russians may not have the money to deploy many of these high tech systems, does NOT mean they do not have the ability to design them and to deploy enough to make missile defense pointless.

This is indeed a dangerous addition to Russian missiles, and one that is bound to be copied by any nation that currently makes ICBM's. So Star Wars, once again, is TOTALLY USELESS.

[theboss]

50. The problem is that it's hard to believe anything coming out of Russia

There have been so many contradictory statements floating around about the state of their military, it's nearly impossible for a layperson to know what is going on there.

What would not surprise is if this is a holdover project from the Soviet days that finally (15 years later) came to some sort of conclusion.

To me, the real danger is not that Russia would deploy these types of missles. It's that Putin would sell the technology to China or Pakistan or North Korea.

I am against the grain here in that I can see the benefit of SDI against a limited attack. (Thought I question whether the cost is worth the effort). In fact, the spin is that a limited attack is precisely the threat we face. This would - as you say - render SDI useless in that capacity.

[barbaraann]

43. Was Condi's mission to help restart the Cold War?

It looks like she has succeeded.

[Algorem]

44. The 'defense' profiteers(war pigs) have failed us,surprisesurprise.Time

to confiscate their wealth(ill-gotten gains).

[Ganja Ninja]

45. Nothing like a good arms race to keep the corporate/....

republican/military/industrial alliance rolling in dough. Not that any of it's necessary.

[rooboy]

46. Al Martin was on Tony Trupiano's show about 2 weeks ago...

and he was talking about a conspiracy between the Bushes and the Russians to make a shitload of money out of palladium amongst other things. A Russian weaponry system was a large part of the story.

Check out the prices of palladium and platinum recently. Al Martin's article is by subscription only, but this is the intro to it...

<snip>
(Mar 15) For the first time in 24 years, on March 1, platinum traded above $900 an ounce, having doubled its price over the past 18 months. This event bespeaks of the conspiracy that the Bush Regime and the Russian government have entered, in order to force the price of platinum higher. Russia, it should be noted, produces 3/5 of the world’s platinum, and it is a substantial export earner for Russia. </snip>

www.almartinraw.com

[CaptainClark23]

55. Good catch

Will have to look into that connection.

Note that today we have reports that Russia's largest metals concern, Norilsk Nickel, has bought 20% of Gold Fields - S. Africa's largest mining firm.

Their only other foreign investment comes from a 56% stake in US's Stillwater Mining. Stillwater's bread and butter is palldium and platinum.

Maybe we should have a look-see at who else owns a pieces of Still Water.

Norilsk story here:

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/03/30/1080544485724.html

[Nlighten1]

47. I bet they are called...

balloons.

[GRClarkesq]

48. Is this like the super torpedo they were selling in the 90s?

The Russian not above a little puffing to make themselves feel good despite no longer being a superpower.

[Narf]

49. This is great news....if you're a U.S. Defense Contractor.

Think of the money they'll rake in now, trying to come up with a defense against this alleged threat. Again, the big contractor companies win huge and we get the shaft.

[ProfessorGAC]

54. SSSUUUURRRREEE!

The Russians have learned from Saddam. Don't want someone to think you're a toothless tiger, pretend you've got super weapons.

Now, understand, i don't believe we will have the technology for a missile shield for many, many years, so i don't support that initiative. But, i also don't believe the Russians have developed an untrackable, or undamageable weapon.

Lastly, if the value of the missile shield would be brought to "zero" how is that different than the value of the missile shield now, given the lack of success in testing so far? It's already a useless idea, isn't it?
The Professor

[Devils Advocate NZ]

65. I gotta laugh at the contradiction in your post...

But, i also don't believe the Russians have developed an untrackable, or undamageable weapon.

Sounds reasonable. Except...

given the lack of success in testing so far? It's already a useless idea, isn't it?

Think about that fact for a moment, and you will see how ridiculous your assertion above is. If Russia is ALREADY making missiles that the US missile defence project can't hit, how much of an advancement would be needed to make it impossible?

Remember, the Russians don't have to design a vehicle that is impossible to hit forever, they just have to stay far enough ahead of the US that the US is constantly spending billions upgrading the defence to counter the LAST Russian development.

So, if the US can't hit orbit vehicles that travel in a predictable ballistic arc, how much change is needed to make it impossible for the current Star Wars design to intercept them?

In fact it is as simple as mounting an engine, fuel and a guidance computer to cause the vehicle to change altitude at random intervals. Just doing that would TOTALLY stuff the ABM system which relies on bein able to predict the missiles location far enough ahead to put an anti-missile in orbit within range of it.

So this one changes altitude, maybe by as little as a few thousand feet, but at the moment that is enough to totally screw the US system up. The next one might add lateral translations as well, and so on. Just making enough change to require the US system to be upgraded will eventually drive the US broke. Just ask the Russians, they know how it works.

As you said, the CURRENT missiles can't even be hit yet, if they ever will. Just how much money is the US willing to spend on a system that will probably NEVER actually succeed at its assigned task?

American arrogance will be its downfall. Just because the US didn't make it doesn't mean it won't work, and just because the US makes it, doesn't mean it will.

[GOPBasher]

63. If this is true, Bush has restarted the Cold War.