Officials confirm we used Napalm-like firebombs in Iraq

[doxieone]

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/0805-01.htm

Officials Confirm Dropping Firebombs on Iraqi Troops
Results are 'remarkably similar' to using napalm

by James W. Crawley

American jets killed Iraqi troops with firebombs – similar to the controversial napalm used in the Vietnam War – in March and April as Marines battled toward Baghdad.

Marine Corps fighter pilots and commanders who have returned from the war zone have confirmed dropping dozens of incendiary bombs near bridges over the Saddam Canal and the Tigris River. The explosions created massive fireballs.



"We napalmed both those (bridge) approaches," said Col. James Alles in a recent interview. He commanded Marine Air Group 11, based at Miramar Marine Corps Air Station, during the war. "Unfortunately, there were people there because you could see them in the (cockpit) video.

[donsu]

1. "Unfortunately, there were people there.............

Crime Against Humanity

where are the lawyers?

[StandWatie]

2. of course it isn't napalm!

We destroyed all that ole evil stuff!

Rather than using gasoline and benzene as the fuel, the firebombs use kerosene-based jet fuel, which has a smaller concentration of benzene.

See!

:eyes:

[sujan]

hurray for 'liberation'

Dance nationalist monkeys dance.

[sujan]

3. hurray for 'liberation'

Dance nationalist monkeys dance.

[Pale Blue Dot]

4. Insert obilgatory "Apocolypse Now" reference here:

[treepig]

5. calling major rokke

look at what we have here - benzene, a proven carcinogen

[Voltaire99]

6. And for an encore, we dropped Ashley Banfield on them.

Burned, bombed, bulletted, bayoneted, blasted, buried, and Banfielded.

Why don't they love us?

[prolesunited]

7. Umm...

Would that mean WE used chemical weapons? Just askin'

[janx]

9. Yes indeed it does. And I hope someone (not likely) looks

into the risks and effects of our doing so.

[ameriphile]

10. Dude!

We're not on the Axis of Evil!

[ProfessorGAC]

15. No

I know you were sort of kidding, but since everything is a chemical of some sort, then a two by four between the eyes is a chemical weapon.

Actually, incindiaries are less complex, and far lower energy chemicals than the explosive in normal ordinance.

But, if you want to stretch it far enough, the leaflets we dropped on Baghdad were chemical weapons too.

By UN and World Court charter, though, napalm is not a chemical weapon.
The Professor

[janx]

8. Oh my dear God!

Rather than using gasoline and benzene as the fuel, the firebombs use kerosene-based jet fuel, which has a smaller concentration of benzene.

I want to know:

1. How much smaller is the concentration of benzene in the new firebombs, and
2. What are are risks of using them as compared to the old ones?

Or is the "oh, but there's a smaller concentration of benzene" remark just an excuse to use the new and improved NAPALM?

[treepig]

13. health effects of benzene

Benzene Health Effects
Benzene is used widely in industry even though it can be harmful to humans. Exposure to benzene can produce a range of negative health effects, varying in severity and seriousness. The most dangerous health risks typically affect people who are exposed to it over long periods of time.

Effects of Short-Term Exposure to Benzene
People who are exposed to benzene for short periods of time may experience the following health effects, depending largely on how much benzene enters the body:


Confusion

Sleepiness

Rapid pulse

Loss of consciousness

Anemia

Damage to the nervous system

Suppression of the immune system

Death
People who are exposed to high levels of benzene should seek help from a medical professional as soon as possible.

Effects of Long-Term Exposure to Benzene
People who live or work near manufacturing facilities that use benzene are the most likely to have long-term exposure to the dangerous chemical. Following is a list of possible health effects from long-term exposure to benzene:


Acute Myeloid Leukemia, a type of cancer that affects the blood

Secondary Aplastic Anemia

Damage to the reproductive system
Long-term exposure to benzene can also cause other types of leukemia and severe anemia.

from http://www.benzenefyi.com/benzene_health_effects_and_treatment.html

the good news, of course, is that there'll be less of these problems this time around based on the humane consideration of the military to use less benzene.

[janx]

14. Thanks for looking into this. Less benzene?

Maybe. We still don't know how much less.

[treepig]

16. probably something like 0.01% less

bringing the amount down to 20.99%

here's what good old-fashioned napalm is made of:

Napalm is a mixture of benzene (21%), gasoline (33%), and polystyrene (46%).


http://www.efdsw.navfac.navy.mil/environmental/NapalmInformation.htm

want to find out more about benzene? consult the material safety data sheet (required by law to be supplied to purchasers) - CAUTION PDF!

www.trconsultinggroup.com/safety/msds/benzene.pdf

[ProfessorGAC]

17. No. That's Not Right

Kerosene is much more highly saturated than gasoline. As a result, the amount of resonant structures is FAR lower.

The new incidiaries contain oxygenated organic acceleratators that allow a much more rapid combustion without the naphthenic content or the added benzene that was in napalm. So, these new formulas use nowhere near the amount of benzene.

BTW: Your formula is in error. Napalm ALWAYS must have a 60:40 mix of sodium and magnesium palmitate, which is a soap that allows the polystyrene to suspend into the gasoline/benzene. So, the 21% benzene is 21% of the combustible liquids in the mixture. I'm pretty sure that the soap content is around 15%.

Last point: The benzene was added to make the fuel burn more slowly. Gasoline combustion rate and heat of combustion are higher than benzene. But, when benzene is burned at these temperatures, the mixture rate of combustion is so high that barely any of it would escape. So, the use of benzene in napalm is not intended to add toxicity. It's intended to make it a little safer to transport and help the burn rate fall a little.

The lower burn rate is actually a nasty little thing, since it means the gelatinous material can be ignited, fly through the air, stick to other stuff and still burn a while. That's why it's such a nasty anti-personnel weapon. Pure gasoline would more blow up into one big fireball, since the rate of combustion is nearly 100% higher.

But, the amount of free benzene after detonation would be incredibly small. Probably on the order of 2 or 3 ppb in the surrounding area. It's added to make it a nastier weapon, to be sure, but it's toxicity has nothing to to with that.
The Professor

[treepig]

19. yes, the information i presented clearly was 'not right'

since the currently used 'MARK 77 firebomb'



is described as having 44 pounds of polystyrene-like gelling material the bottom line is we really don't have a clue what's in it so i took the liberty of speculating.

as far as the information i posted about the composition of 'traditional' napalm, it came directly from a site that bore this incription:

This is an official U.S. Navy Web Site

so, are you telling me that

(a) the navy doesn't know what's in napalm?

or

(b) they're (shockingly enough) spreading misinformation?

[Thor_MN]

20. Relative risks... Just a thought, but

if you are exposed to significant quantities of burning napalm (new or old) you probably have bigger things to worry about than benzene toxicity. Once the skin grafts start to take hold, assuming that you make it that far, then you might start thinking about it.

Like the good professor (spent too much time in Nobel Hall to think otherwise) says if you are merely passing through the area afterwards, you would probably pick up more benzene (not to mention other nasties) by smoking one cigarette.

The focus should be on firebombing people in an unprovoked invasion of a sovereign nation, rather than worrying about a little benzene.

[Generic Other]

11. Napalm (a Malvina Reynold's song updated)

Jenna Bush, did you ever see that napalm?
Did you ever see a baby hit with napalm?
When they try and pull it loose
why the flesh comes too
And that's the way they do with that napalm.

They have lots of funny names for that napalm
Like escalation games, but it's napalm
And they drop it from the sky
And the people die
And the world is wondering why we're using napalm.

Well, your school is too refined to speak of napalm
And the White House has no time to talk of napalm
And the war is far away
But it goes on night and day
And it's your hand and mine that drops the napalm.

[arcane1]

12. more WMD from the US, just like the MOABs

Is that lack of Iraqi resistance starting to makie sense now?


:grr:


we are going to be hearing things like this for some time, as the secrets begin to trickle out...

[malachi]

18. Makes me proud to be an American

Why would they drop this kind of shit? Was it necessary? Was the Iraqi resistence so formidable that they had to resort to such evil measures? Our karma is way out of whack and we're going to pay somewhere done the line.