On 9/11, a Telling Seven-Minute Silence (WaPo re: F911)

[RedSock]

On 9/11, a Telling Seven-Minute Silence
Interpreting the President's Image in Crisis
By Joel Achenbach
Saturday, June 19, 2004; Page C01

You're at a photo op, reading a book with schoolchildren and an aide suddenly whispers that a second plane has hit the World Trade Center. "America is under attack." You're the president of the United States. What do you do? ...

From two different angles, Americans have new glimpses of that historic moment. One comes from rabble-rousing Michael Moore, whose Bush-eviscerating film "Fahrenheit 9/11" premieres next week, and includes an uninterrupted seven-minute segment showing Bush's reaction after hearing the news of the attack. He doesn't move.

Instead he continues to sit in the classroom, listening to children read aloud. Moore lets the tape roll as the minutes pass painfully by.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A53548-2004Jun18?language=printer

***********

Holy %$@#&*^$ -- do you realize how LONG 7 minutes will feel like in the theatre?

:wow:

[Doug Decker]

1. I can't wait...

Only 6 days to go!

Maybe New Yorkers will give us some juicy details before it opens here on the West Coast (please, please).

:hi:

[montanacowboy]

31. Get to see a special preview

in Seattle on Wed - Can't wait!!! I hope there is a lot of hooping in the theatre!!!

[KittyWampus]

55. Will DU'ers Be Hollering At The Screen "DO SOMETHING YOU IMBECILE"?

[gasperc]

112. let the silence speak, that's what I'll say

eom

[Thunder Road]

109. Saw a preview last week....

Moore's narration is great in this segment, he says something along the lines of - no-one told him what to do so Bush sits there for seven minutes..he cuts away at one point to some Bush aides whispering in confusion in the corner of the classroom and then back to Bush still sitting there looking like an idiot. Most moving part of the movie is the military mother who used to hate war protestors and now realizes they are protesting the war, not the men and women stuck fighting it; most disturbing is watching the US military committing if not attrocities then something close to it and realizing they are fighting in our names.

[Rose Siding]

2. This reporter needs a copy of the Constitution

snip>
However it is interpreted, it points out a basic truth about any president: He's both an executive and a symbolic figure. He's the spiritual leader of the nation as well as the head of state. He's monarch and prime minister.

HOOEY

[RedSock]

3. opens early in NYC

I think it opens on Wednesday in New York City.

Woo-Hoo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Beetwasher]

17. Yeah WTF! Is That About?? He's MONARCH????? Not In This Country Bucko!

:wtf:

[Eloriel]

83. In Bush's head he is

And apparently, this reporter buys that image. No wonder we're in such trouble.

[TacticalPeek]

19. He's a grinner and he's a sinner. And a frequent target of overblown prose

He's a mystery locked in a riddle wrapped with bacon.

[markses]

34. Kevin Bacon?

:evilgrin:

[KittyWampus]

56. TActical Peak, That Is Funny Yet Oddly Poetic!

He's a mystery licked in a riddle wrapped with bacon.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm... BA-CON.

[peacetalksforall]

50. They continually attempt to dress the Emperor.

[Art_from_Ark]

70. He's no monarch and he's no prime minister

And he's not even the freakin' president-- he just plays one on TV.

[bahrbearian]

4. He was playing Possum, he didn't want Atta to find him.

He was staying out of harms way.

[acmavm]

7. Right, he was trying to figure out where he was going to run and hide.

He picked Nebraska and Colorado (I believe, I know he was here). The look on his face was one of stupified panic.

[olddem43]

10. Why not? He hid out in the National Guard

from the Viet Nam war, he hid out from the Guard itself in Alabama, and he would naturally hide out from any other possible threat.

[Octafish]

12. A coward is a coward.

What do they say about the brave?

"Cowards die many times before their deaths;
The valiant never taste death but once."

-- Julius Caesar
Act 2, Scene 2, line 34

BTW: A hearty welcome to DU, olddem43! Those are a couple of great URLs there!

[PoliticsSportsMusic]

28. My favorite line from "Julius Ceasar"....

You blocks,you stones,you worst than a senseless thing.....pretty much sums up how I feel about repugs.

[GarySeven]

62. Why man ...

He doth bestride the narrow world like a Colossus, and we, petty men, can do nothing more than crawl about in search of honorable graves.

Or something like that.

[JoFerret]

98. While he urinates?

and fiddles?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

15. "Stupified panic"? Nope...just trying to remember what he had to....

...to do that day. He knew exactly what was going on and knew that he had to wait long enough for the events to unfold to give the NeoCons the excuse they needed to go to war in the Middle East.

It's all part of the PNACer document, "Rebuilding America's Defenses", expecially where "a new Pearl Harbor" is described as what is needed for the American people to back rapid change in the Middle East. For an excellent summary of "Rebuilding America's Defenses", go to the following link:

'Rebuilding America's Defenses' and the Project for the New American Century

<http://www.antiwar.com/orig/stockbauer1.html>

Excerpt:

"During the Clinton presidency, when the Republicans were out of power, this militaristic wing in American politics became highly organized and efficient. They formed the PNAC in 1997 And published 'RAD' in September 2000. Determined to have their world empire, they offered an eerie prophecy on page 52 of that document about how it might be accomplished, 'Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor.' Their dream of a catalyzing event could not have been better actualized than in the events of 9/11."

[devinsgram]

54. Oh crap, now what did Cheyney tell me to do

when it all goes down? Oh, now I remember, just sit here and wait about 7 minuets or so. The public is not that smart, they'll never notice.

[Art_from_Ark]

69. A look of stupefied panic

He was afraid of getting caught, like all criminals after they have been involved in some horrible crime.

[JoFerret]

99. He was projecting

steadfast resolve so the children and the nation would not panic.

[Art_from_Ark]

104. Of course, if a President Clinton, or a President Gore, or a President

Kerry had been projecting the same "steadfast resolve", his ass would have been dragged in front of one Senate investigation after another.

It's interesting that bu$hCo claim they "didn't want to frighten the children". And how, exactly, did they convey that message? Telepathically? Andy Card whispered something for two seconds into $hrub's ear. What did he say? "We don't want to frighten the children."? At any rate, it would have been extremely difficult to squeeze "The second tower has been hit. America is under attack" into those two quick seconds.

[Warpy]

14. Even that doesn't explain it.

The country was under attack, but he just SAT THERE. There was information coming in over the phones, beepers were going off like crazy, but he just SAT THERE. He didn't ask for more detailed information, he SAT THERE.

Either this man is incapable of doing anything he isn't told to do, or he's the most callous, heartless piece of shit on the face of the planet.

Either way, this footage being shown will get the point across. He didn't care. He just SAT THERE.

[reprobate]

23. That's definatley what they call a "Dear in the Headlites" stare.

That expression is priceless. I'm embarrassed for my country that this is it's leader.





"What are we going to do tonight, Dick?"

"Same thing we do every night, George. Try to take over the world."

[oneighty]

26. pucker factor

the vacuum could not be broken.

I guess.

180

[disinfo_guy]

45. that's because he didn't have any idea of what to do

Fact is if Bush HAD gotten involved and started giving orders, it could have been worse. Bush did his job - he waited patiently until they handed him a speech to read.

[Booster]

65. After seeing that video just days after 911,

what I found most chilling (and telling) was that when Card whispered in his ear, they never made eye contact. Card didn't wait for a response and Bush didn't offer one. If someone gives you news that's that bad, you would automatically say "What did you say?" or SOMETHING. That one thing made me think that something was really wrong in our country.

[susu369]

81. Excellent observation, spenbax

*eom*

[burythehatchet]

105. Yes I agree, that is an excellent observation

LIHOP
LIHOP
LIHOP
LIHOP

[Auntie Bush]

92. I like that..."He didn't care...He just sat there!" Good bumper sticker!

[Thor_MN]

63. He was establishing his alibi....

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Octafish]

11. At least Streisand is SMART enough to know what to do.

Unlike Bush, who was scared shitless.

Oh yeah. Bush had been briefed on the very possibility. And he did NOTHING. Remember the CIA's "Bin Laden Set to Strike in the US" residential daily briefing he ignored while vacationing the entire month of August 20001?

BTW: A hearty welcome to DU, Air II! Where ya been?

[markses]

35. Let us know when you bring your filmmaking insights to the theater

I'm sure we'll all be stunned by your artistry...:eyes:

[ljm2002]

41. I said it before,

and I'll say it again: this footage, of GWB at Booker Elementary, will be quite damning when it is seen by the American public at large, rather than just us DUers and political junkies to whom it is old hat.

Why? Because it illustrates, better than any words could, these facts: 1: GWB is not a leader -- he did not take charge. 2: the Chain of Command was broken -- while the Government knew, had to know, that several airliners had been hijacked and were being flown into buildings, our Commander in Chief sat incommunicado in an elementary school classroom, therefore unable to "make the call" if necessary on how to respond to these terrorist attacks. Which brings up 3: not only was GWB not a leader that morning, he was in fact, guilty of gross, criminal dereliction of duty. And that's the BEST thing you can say about his performance that morning. It all goes downhill from there.

Go ahead and scoff at Michael Moore's film making abilities. It may be comforting to assume that this 7 minute segment will be ineffective. But if I were you, I wouldn't place any large bets on it.

[LittleApple81]

6. This article is BS. Tries to excuse the inexcusable. The SECOND plane

tells you it is not "a really bad pilot" even IF it is true that he was totally unaware of what it might really represent (AND THAT, SUPPOSEDLY, HE WAS UNAWARE IS AN INDICTEMENT OF HIM AS A LEADER after he had gotten the August PDB!!!).
If he tries to use 9/11 for his campaign, Bush is going to have to combat the images that come out in Farenheit 9/11... which is a documentary!

[Catfight]

20. Impossible he wasn't aware, there was the August PDB that

was titled, "Al Quida determined to strike within the US," and some of the details were using planes to fly into buildings. I hardly think he was unaware, he was incapable of taking action without direction. Therefore, what we have is an ineffective leader who is neither capable or worthy to be a commander in chief. I don't want him on my team and I never felt safe with him in the WH.

But hey...I know, he's really good coming out with a constituional amendment against sinners (aka: gays) but he can't do much more than hate. Sorry spinners out there..your man is weak and pathetic.

[Skittles]

74. and the picture on the right with Card & Bush

has that same lie - that he is telling him about the first plane.

[Eloriel]

84. OMG, you're right -- that's horrible

THAT needs to be corrected. Care to write at least an LTE to the NYT??

[Skittles]

85. oh they know it is not correct

they know it

[priller]

8. Conservatives love the straw man:

Presidential scholar Fred Greenstein, a professor emeritus at Princeton, defends Bush's response in the initial minutes. "It's made a little more complex by being in the presence of little kids," Greenstein said. "It certainly wouldn't present the right message if he turned white, rushed out, and kids started crying."

Of course, NO ONE is saying Bush should have had a panic attack in front of the class. He just should have calmly excused himself and taken charge. Bush supporters always yammer on about what a strong leader he is; on that day, he was more concerned about his appearance in front of a bunch of kids.

Maybe Krugman (also at Princeton) should run over to this guy's office and talk some sense into him.

[Beetwasher]

18. Actually He DID Turn White and Probably Sat There Cuz He Shit In His Pants

Otherwise he probably WOULD have run out of the room screaming...

[PoliticsSportsMusic]

29. Wait a minute this guy is a scholar????

It doesn't take a genius to figure out that the safety of 260 million Americans are more important than how he would be perceived by a group of school children.....gee Mr. Greenstein,I wish I was as smart as you....you are such a scholar. BRRRRAAAWWWWHA HA HA HA

[sendero]

60. Y'all

Noticed that too? "Crying kids" indeed. He did not have to stand up and scream "Oh My God We Are Under Attack". He could have quietly excused himself. Everyone would understand later why he did.

Man, they are digging pretty deep if this guy's reasoning is supposed to add any intelligence to the dialog.

[JoFerret]

100. ...yep...as if there is no

middle ground between doing nothing and abject panic.

[UpInArms]

9. on a scale of 1 to 10, I give this

article a "2"

the WP is still whoring itself for this imposter.

:puke:

[JoFerret]

101. I like the adjective telling though

.

[NashVegas]

13. Bush Was Scared Shitless - Here's Why

It's not often been reported, but earlier on the morning of 9/11, a film crew looking for an interview with * made an unexpected appearance.

By now, most everyone knows President George W. Bush began that fateful day, Sept. 11, on Longboat Key, but the FBI is now investigating whether terrorists also began that fateful day here on the island.

At about 6 a.m. Sept. 11, Longboat Key Fire Marshall Carroll Mooneyhan was at the front desk of the Colony Beach & Tennis Resort as Bush prepared for his morning jog. From that vantage point, Mooneyhan overheard a strange exchange between a Colony receptionist and security guard.

A van occupied by men of Middle Eastern descent had pulled up to the Colony stating they had a “poolside” interview with the president, Mooneyhan said. The self-proclaimed reporters then asked for a Secret Service agent by name. Guards from security relayed the request to the receptionist, who had not heard of either the agent or plans for an interview, Mooneyhan said.

The receptionist gave the phone over to a nearby Secret Service agent, who said the same thing — no one knew of an agent by that name or of any poolside interview.

http://www.longboatobserver.com/showarticle.asp?ai=1874


Remember how they took care of Massoud?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

16. This story sounds almost exactly like the "Air Force One was a target"....

...story that has been completely discredited despite numerous attempts by some in the media to revive it to cast Junior in a more sympathetic light.

If I'm a Secret Service agent and I get a phone call like the one the agent got on 911, I would have sent a number of agents out to meet them from all sides. What was done according to this story? Nothing. This story doesn't pass muster, IMHO.

And no, he wasn't "scared shitless"...read my post #15.

[NashVegas]

22. I Believe It

The 'Air Force 1 was a target' defense came up because everyone was asking, "why the hell did he not return to Washingtom." No one with a big bullhorn asked "why the hell did he sit there," at the time.

The story was published in the Longboat paper two weeks after the fact, yet wasn't disseminated. About the only place you see mention of it is in the hardcore timeline sites. No one in major media ever picked up on it.

Finally, although Massoud was assassinated two days prior, no one heard about it until after the fact, IIRC.

Also, even if 9/11 was a BFEE deal, what are the chances the SS was let in on the plans?

[TolstoyAndy]

42. Massoud assassination was reported by BBC

I saw it on the local PBS station on the 9th or 10th of Sep.

[Jane Austin]

110. I remember it, too.

He was somebody's brother, and was supposed to be a uniter of the Northern Forces.

I was dismayed at the time that he was killed.

[Barkley]

58. I Bush has to piss, he wouldn't wait 7 seven mins ...

Just goes to show where his priorities are.

[sendero]

61. Nor....

... would he wait to clean his glasses.

[Art_from_Ark]

68. He WAS scared shitless

But he wasn't scared of terrorists-- he was scared about getting caught.

[crossroads]

66. Interesting...

That was an unknown to me...
:wow:

[rumguy]

87. That story has been debunked

I forgot where, but it was debunked...there were no tersts lookin' for him that morning...

Believe me, if there had been, we would all have heard about it by now...the Bushies would have used it....

[LizW]

21. If I'm not mistaken, it's a split screen

showing Bush sitting immobile in the classroom and the towers burning.

Think about what you did when you got the news. I had just walked back into the house from taking the kids to school and my friend called from her car. She said, "A plane has crashed into the World Trade Center. Turn on the tv and see what they're saying. Call me back." While I was fumbling for the remote and getting the channel, I called my mom, because she ALWAYS has the tv on in the morning. The first thing she said was, "Another one! Another one hit! This is not accidental!" And when I finally got the tv on, the first thing I saw was people jumping out of the towers.

That's what was going on while Bush sat in the classroom.

Edited for typo.

[Occulus]

24. Keep in mind,

the Booker video isn't even known about by the vast majority. This and this alne could sink him almost immediately.

Images can be very powerful things; ask Goebbels and Rove.

[RedSock]

27. you are right

this will be HUGE -- like 100 point type HUGE.

when the big middle ground of people (not far left, not far right) go check this out because the buzz will be deafening -- their heads will explode

i have a strong sense this movie will be THE TOPIC of conversation all summer.

[SeattleDem]

30. yup, power of images, a la Abu Ghraib

the reports of torture were known in the print media, but there was no outrage until the photos appeared.

same thing here. This 7- minute footage ought to wake up the sleeping citizens.

I just wonder how Moore got the footage. Was the teacher who was shooting the film pissed off once she realized she had the president in her room sitting quietly while American was under attack? Did she volunteer it to Moore? I'd love to know what she has to say, or what the parents of the kids in the room that day have to say about the "courage" of our leader.

[JoFerret]

102. It is/was widely available on the internet

.

[leQ]

52. i was sitting on irc, and the log is posted at

9/11 log. every time i read it, i get the chills i had when i was watching it unfold on tv.

[Pastiche423]

25. Will whistle ass' seven minutes

be like Nixon's eighteen minutes?

[lolly]

32. Hasn't that video been online?

Somebody--several people, in fact--posted a link for a short documentary that plays that video on a split screen accompanied by a classical Requiem.

Can't remember the link--anybody have it?

[JohnyCanuck]

40. It's Requiem for America from takebackthemedia.com

Here's the link to the Flash Presentation.

http://www.tbtmradio.com/geeklog/public_html/staticpages/index.php?page=20040606205339801

[killbotfactory]

33. Why didn't he calmly get up and walk away?

I guess he thought it didn't matter since Cheney is the real president.

[Hailtothechimp]

36. THIS is why there is so much resistance to the film.

Watching the Booker footage for the first time online convinced me that 9/11 was LIHOP at the very least. I imagine others will have the same reaction.

The rest of the movie will all be gravy, but the Booker footage will cost Tex the election.

[GingerSnaps]

37. F-9/11 is going to do some major damage to Bush

They must have a "war room" that is sitting around trying to figure out how to tear the movie apart and make it a fraud and they can't come up with anything.

[drb]

38. But here's my question about it -- Did Bush have someone...

...reading another copy of the book to him over an ear bug? There might be some pretty big words in there, two syllables even!

[loudsue]

39. The neocons are working their butts off to get this movie BANNED

from a whole lot of the movie houses that were going to show it. Already some theaters have dropped the film due to death threats and protests.

If we want this movie to get out, we're going to have to work for it.

:kick::kick::kick:

[sampsonblk]

43. He's in trubble!

I hope the movie is a big hit. That way, even GOPers will hear about it, and see clips on TV. I say Bush will lose a lot of votes based on the free media for this film. I sure hope so.

[JoFerret]

103. ....maybe even tWubble

.

[peekaloo]

44. using those children as potential human shields?

a brave, honorable man........:puke:

[Catfight]

46. Saddam hid behind women and children, the line between Bush and

Saddam is very blurry. The only difference I see is Bush had a bigger and better military to conquer the world, Saddam was weakened in the Gulf War. I didn't know Bush had told a reporter he already knew about NY and he claims he saw the first plane hit the tower before it was ever televised. Why hasn't this been brought up to him during press conferences or any other format? He really needs to be impeached and throughly investigated. The next reality hit will be, "What to do with a criminal president." My suggestion is stick in him the spider hole they found Saddam in and seal it up with a gun and one bullet.

[scarletlib]

47. PDB of 8/6/01

He had absolutely no excuse to just sit there and wait. He had been told just a bare 30 days earlier in the PDB that bin ladin was DETERMINED TO STRIKE THE US.

That alone should have immediately moved him into action. This needs to be shouted from the frickin' roof tops. HE HAD NO EXCUSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[arwalden]

48. If I Were The Director...

(and I'm not... nor have I seen it yet) I would have done a split-screen showing in "real time" what Bush* was doing and what was going on in NY and VA.

Bush* on the one side of the screen, legs daintily crossed... horrors and death on the other side. (Who knows... maybe he's already done something like that... or maybe his version is just perfect by itself.)

-- Allen

[daleo]

49. I thought it would be split screen

But this is brilliant. Imagine what thoughts will run through the minds of viewers in seven long minutes.

[mountainvue]

51. Thank you Michael

Moore. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Seven minutes is going to seem like an eternity-because it is in this case.

[nolabels]

53. This is just so much more B. S. cover

The focus on * is ignorant from the get-go. To the effect of needing to have a clown for a punching bag does not satisfy any of my questions.

To date has anybody lost their job, been penalized or fined for anything that has happened. There is so much about security that is the same from prior to 9/11 and why? 9/11 seems to be missing a lot of detail of things that would be expected if it was a large group of mistakes or Co-Winky-Dinks. I am sending for my copy of the......

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1566565529/002-2510228-6104013?v=glance#product-details


(snip)
106 of 116 people found the following review helpful:

Letting bad things happen in order to achieve great goals, April 2, 2004
Reviewer: James S. Ackerman from Bloomington,, IN United States
Until reading this book I have despised any conspiracy theory that involved persons in any American administration doing harm to their fellow Americans. But Dr. Griffin, a noted professor at the prestigious Claremont School of Theology, has written a dispassionate study of the many inconsistencies that are involved in the official version of what happened on 9/11, our surveillance of Middle Eastern terrorist networks before that time, and our pursuit of the true perpetrators since then. For example, when Flight 11's transponder went off at 8:20 a.m. and flight attendants reported at 8:21 a.m. that it had been hijacked when it turned 90 degrees to the south, F-16's are routinely supposed to scramble and head it off within ten minutes--long before it reached the North Tower. There is an average of 100 scramblings per year. We went zero for three on 9/11. How could we not protect against a plane going directly towards the Pentagon or the White House? One starts this book, wanting with all one's heart to believe that it was incompetence or surprise that day, but there are just too many other really strange things (about twenty more) noted by Griffin that warrant an even more complete investigation than what is going on now (April 2). Why? Because a lot of these elements, briefly captured by one media source or another, were swept away in our focus on the war and not brought back into the national consciousness. I must agree with the professor who wrote that "it is rare, indeed, that a book has this potential to become a force of history." This slim book is a MUST READ!
(snip)

[davekriss]

95. I highly recommend David Ray Griffin's book

Most importantly it points out that the Incompetence Theory, the thought that 9-11 resulted from the coincident failure of the FAA, NORAD, the CIA, the FBI, the Whitehouse, et alia, to provide for our security that brilliantly blue September morning (despite the trillions borrowed from future generations), is itself the more complex and less probable theory. Apply Occam's Razor and this is not what a reasonable observer will conclude.

Second, it points out that the Offical Story is itself a "conspiracy theory" -- it posits that a terrorist organization, Al Qaeda, conspired by itself to overcome the multi-trillion dollar security apparatus of the United States and wreak havoc and destruction that coincidentally serves as the "new Pearl Harbor" wished for by the neo-conservatives under Bush.

Griffin makes the case that 9-11 begs for a thorough, well-funded, independent investigation to uncover what really happened that day, and makes clear that the current investigation is crimped by budget and conflicted interests, starts and stops with the presupposition that 9-11 was an "intelligence failure" and no more -- i.e., it will not uncover anything but support for the Official Story.

[glitch]

113. Thank you - the idea that disagreeing with the official conspiracy theory

makes you a conspiracy theorist needs to be DEBUNKED. I will buy the book based on your review - you should post it on Amazon if you haven't already. Thanks!

[Jane Eyre]

57. FINALLY THEY NOTICE THAT!!!

I sat there the morning of 9-11-01, watching in horror and disbelief as Bush sat there in the 2nd grade classroom without responding. It was carried, in part, on live TV. The cameras showed him in the classroom for a few minutes around 9:00, then went back to the events in New York. There was commentary during this intermission about waiting for the President to speak. I was posting on another site at the time, and I registered my disgust by saying that they were waiting for him to finish reading "The Very Hungry Caterpillar". The only part of that that I got wrong was that the book was about a goat instead of a caterpillar.

When he finally did make a few remarks at the school, it was not very reassuring. Even worse was the broadcast from an undisclosed bunker in Louisiana or Nebraska.

For the Secret Service to have not physically removed him from the classroom is beyond comprehension, especially since Dick Cheney says that they did precisely that with his person. Just as the Secret Service physically pushed Ronald Reagan into the car when it was clear that there was a crazed man with a gun in the area, the Secret Service was obliged to physically remove Bush from a live TV broadcast during a time when the country was clearly under attack from hijackers using commercial planes as weapons. And, I might add, a President with a modicum of common sense would have immediately removed himself from the classroom and the live TV photo-op.

[Barkley]

59. If Bush had to piss, he would wait 7 mins. - n/t

[LibDemAlways]

64. This footage will finally destroy the

myth of the chimp's great "leadership" on 9/11 - which DUers have known was total bullshit from the start. Now the rest of the public will find out what we've known all along - that the moronic idiot sat there clueless waiting to be told by Cheney and Rove what to do next.

[Geo55]

67. Also...

The shoot down order for the pathetic intercept response came "after" all the hijacked planes had crashed....from....wait for it...

DICK CHENEY

[PurityOfEssence]

71. Bush "argued forcefully for returning" to Washington?

Isn't this guy THE FUCKING PRESIDENT? Any of us who live lives in leadership positions know that even a subordinate mid-manager is expected to ignore all advice at some times. A PRESIDENT should do as he damn well pleases in a moment like this. This is very convincing proof that he's just a figurehead.

Does he have to ask his Mommy's permission to do his goddamned job?

This is pathetic, especially since this posturing little popinjay struts the lie of confident leadership. He's a nobody. He's the most powerful nobody since Louis XVI.

[Skittles]

72. WHY are they just NOW talking about this?

it's the most shining, documented example of what an incompetent piece of SHIT our "president" is. WHY has it taken so long for them to NOTICE?????

[stickdog]

73. The Real Story

In July 2001, Bush stayed offshore in an armed military ship when he was at the G8 summit to protect him from a suspected terrorist plot to crash a hijacked commercial plane into a building. (Sources: New York Newsday, Sept 19, 2001 and LA Times, Sept. 29, 2001, http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-092701genoa.story )

Given that Bush himself was a suspected target of a "hijacked plane bomb" terrorist attack in July, how can his administration possibly explain the fact that he kept reading about a pet goat in a widely publicized, previously scheduled public appearance only 5 miles from the Sarasota International airport for more than 7 full minutes AFTER it had become obvious to everyone that the US was dealing with a coordinated attack of suicide-bomber-terrorist-hijackers? Didn't it cross anybody's mind in the entire Bush entourage that the grammar school might just be the next target and that they just might want to get Bush and all of the little kids he was reading with out of harm's way? If not, why not? Remember that Bush STAYED at the school until AFTER 9:30 EDT (over 25 minutes after the SECOND plane hit the WTC) and even held his initial "we'll get'em" press conference AT THE SCHOOL!

Is there no one in the entire Bush administration/intelligence/Secret Service with a three digit IQ? The simplest and clearest explanation for this bizarre reaction to the VERY real potential of toddler mass murder is administration foreknowedge at the highest levels. Bravado doesn't fly as an explanation because Bush would be taking little kids with him in any potential attack. Stunned inaction doesn't fly either because the primary mission of the entire Secret Service is to ensure the President's safety. There are only two logical choices here: the Bush administration was either CRIMINAL or else CRIMINALLY NEGLIGENT.



Much more:

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/main/essayaninterestingday.html

just one little excerpt ...

The reason given why Bush didn't leave as soon as Card told him the news is: "Without all the facts at hand, George Bush had no intention of upsetting the schoolchildren who had come to read for him." Advisor Karl Rove said, "The President thought for a second or two about getting up and walking out of the room. But the drill was coming to a close and he didn't want to alarm the children." This excuse is patently absurd, given the security risks and importance of Bush being informed and making decisions as Commander in Chief. Nor was the drill coming to a close: one drill had ended and another was about to begin - it was a perfect time to simply say, "Excuse me" and leave the room. Sarasota-Bradenton International Airport is only 3½ miles away; in fact, Booker was chosen as the location for the photo-op partly because of its proximity to the airport. Hijackers could have crashed a plane into Bush's publicized location and his security would have been completely helpless to stop it. Remember, Bush's schedule had been announced on September 7 and two of the 9/11 hijackers came to Sarasota that same day. Furthermore, the Secret Service was aware of the strange request for an interview a few hours earlier and the previous night's report of a person in town who had made violent threats against Bush.

Indeed, a few days after 9/11, Sarasota's main newspaper reported, "Sarasota barely skirted its own disaster. As it turns out, terrorists targeted the president and Air Force One on Tuesday, maybe even while they were on the ground in Sarasota and certainly not long after. The Secret Service learned of the threat just minutes after Bush left Booker Elementary."

Bush Lingers On

Once he was out of the classroom, did Bush immediately leave Booker? No. He stayed in the adjacent room with his staff, calling Vice President Cheney and National Security Advisor Rice, and preparing a speech. Incredibly, even as uncertain information began to surface, suggesting that more planes had been hijacked (eventually 11 planes would be suspected) , Bush was allowed to make his remarks at 9:30 - exactly the time and place stated on his advance schedule. Why hasn't Bush's security staff been criticized for their completely inexplicable decision to stay at the school? And why didn't Bush's concern for the children extend to not making them and the rest of the 200 or so people at the school terrorist targets?

[Eloriel]

89. He could have excused himself very graciously but succinctly

By simply saying, "Children, as President sometimes there are issues that need my immediate attention. I'm sorry to leave early, but I have some things I have to take care of right away. Thanks for a great visit."

That wouldn't have been alarming in the least. Certainly not to little kids -- high schoolers or maybe middle schoolers perhaps, but not little kids reading about goats.

[Blue Gardener]

75. He was just trying to figure out how it would effect him

He had to sit and figure out how this would effect his life, I'm pretty sure he wasn't too worried about anyone or anything else. You know, he just might have to re-schedule a vacation at the pig farm or an important golf outing with his corporate buddies.

[Francis]

76. What I don't understand

Is if as reported, the president gave the vice president permission to order a shoot down of the rogue planes, when did he do it?
before he entered the classroom?

[Cooley Hurd]

77. 2 out of 3 historians agree that Bush's inaction was unforgiveable...

From the same WaPo article:

Presidential historian Robert Dallek of Boston University thinks Bush focused too much on appearances, rather than leaping into action.

"It speaks volumes about the preoccupation these politicians have about manipulating image," Dallek said yesterday. Bush should have immediately excused himself and started figuring out what was happening and what he could do. "The way to project calm and strength is to take care of business."

Douglas Brinkley, a presidential historian at the University of New Orleans, concurs: "I don't understand how one sits there. I just don't. Minutes are an eternity in that sort of situation. . . . A quick presidential decision may save lives."

Brinkley credits Bush with dusting himself off after a rough first day and regaining his composure. And he acknowledges that few presidents have had to endure such a Candid Camera moment. But Brinkley adds, "Character is not defined in good times, when you've been properly briefed, it's defined when you're in a desperate crisis situation."

Presidential scholar Fred Greenstein, a professor emeritus at Princeton, defends Bush's response in the initial minutes.

"It's made a little more complex by being in the presence of little kids," Greenstein said. "It certainly wouldn't present the right message if he turned white, rushed out, and kids started crying."

He rushes out and the kids would start crying???? Sorry but that's just not plausable on any level. Maybe, if he murdered a bunny in front of them, but by merely leaving the room???

[FlaGranny]

78. Sometimes I wonder if

Cheney himself instructed Bush to stay there in the classroom, while he, himself, was whisked away to the bunker. Maybe he thought another plane would target the present and take out Bush with along with hundreds of kids, and then we would all be talking about President Cheney. Shame on me for thinking such a thing, but I can't put it out of the realm of possibilities.

[susu369]

80. "target the present"

boy, what a present (gift) that would have been for Cheney, eh?

Friendly, kidding, FlaGranny. Actually, your theory is quite interesting.

[FlaGranny]

82. Geez, target the "present" -

well, I guess they ARE targeting the "present" ;-) I'm not going to even bother correcting the post - although I do have time. He, he.

[Simeon Salus]

79. "When professional baseball resumed play, he courageously walked...

...to the mound in a crowded stadium and threw out the first pitch."

THAT'S a slam dunk, Colin Powell!

[rumguy]

86. Also remember: He KNEW the first plane had hit as he was leaving the hotel

Terrorism had to have been in his mind....

And...HE...JUST....SAT.....THERE!!!!

[reprobate]

88. I'm gonna sit in the back and watch the audience.

And I'm betting that by minute three or four the audience's biggest reaction will be.....LAUGHTER.

This may just be the end for Captain Codpiece. Politicians can survive almost anything except derision. By the seventh minute I'd bet that most of the audience will be howling with contempt for the figure head.

This is the kind of thing that can end political carreers.

[GinaMaria]

90. What was *'s stated account of the time frame?

Wasn't that in papers at the time. He stated his thought process. It was something about a bad pilot. Anyone remember. I don't think it matches the video time line.

[genius]

91. Go Michael. This is great.

[nolabels]

93. Remember it was only a bad pilot.

The Secret Dick, the guy behind the curtain, The crash cart kid, just another one of them dudes who escaped the from the grasp of the reaper to wage on us all

Not only in sense imunne to to suffering of others, more in the realm of oblivious



Is the US military torturing Iraqis with electricity? E-mail this
Print this
Dahr Jamail, Electronic Iraq, 8 January 2004

Sadiq Zoman Abrahim, 55 years old, lies in a coma in Tikrit hospital.

7 January 2003 -- Sadiq Zoman Abrahim, 55 years old, was detained this past August in Kirkuk by US Soldiers during a home raid which produced no weapons. He was taken to the police office in Kirkuk, questioned by the Americans there, then transferred to Kirkuk Airport Detention Center.

It was from this detention center he was transferred to Tikrit Airport Detention Center. While in this detention center Mr. Abrahim managed to find a man who was about to be released, and have him pass on to his family information about where he was.

It was from this place that the Americans transferred him, comatose, to the hospital in Tikrit.

Acting on this information the family searched the hospital, but was unable to find him. While there, hospital staff (who wish to remain anonymous) informed them they had someone in a coma by the name of Abrahim Sadiq Zoman, who was dropped off two days prior by the Americans.
(snip)
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/torture_pow.html
http://electroniciraq.net/news/1313.shtml

WWW.NYPRESS.COM | JUNE 8, 2004

MARK AMES
NEWS & COLUMNS

IT CAME ON suddenly and without warning. Fuck the Democrats. Fuck the liberals. I hope Bush wins. I hope Bush steals another election and urinates into everyone's wounds…

This interior rant lasted for a good five minutes before I snapped out of it. The realization that some pro-Republican sentiment lurks inside of me was enough to make me want to stick my head in the oven. Or throw myself out the window like the possessed priest at the end of The Exorcist.

What inspired this crazed outburst wasn't any love for Bush. It was an instinctual reaction to a tonal shift I've detected among the American left. They're losing that brave, cornered, hysterical tone that I've identified with, a tone that came from years of increasing marginalization combined with a sense that the whole country had gone completely insane.

For the first time in almost 30 years, the left has a chance to occupy the reality vacuum that opened up after the big barbecue in Fallujah. The left can sense that their time may have finally arrived, and they're prematurely settling into their new role as saviors of the national soul, with their former hysteria already reverting to a smug, nurturing tone. The once-vicious humor, born of desperation and hatred, is again becoming nauseatingly didactic and responsible. This is a disaster. The left seems to be buying into the high school civics teacher's idiotic lie that "you can't just be de-structive, you have to be con-structive as well." Yeah, and did you know that girls prefer shy, sensitive boys?

What's worse is that the new smug tone is being accompanied by high-profile outbursts of fake rage. Yesterday's genuine fury has been hijacked and reified by painted-up frauds like Al Gore and Nancy Pelosi, who look about as comfortable feigning rage as Rumsfeld looked when he tried to squirt a few tears before Congress over Abu Ghraib.
(snip)
http://www.nypress.com/print.cfm?content_id=10369

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

94. kick, and request to check out reply #32

an early preview of F9/11, and the Booker footage. MKJ
edited from post to reply

[nolabels]

96. Then click on the link on #40

I have been round and round here but never seen that one. That is even worse then I knew, after have after checked out all these things before hand, then seen that timeline on the link putting it into perspective of what was going on. He was not in the loop to be sure, but they wanted it to make it appear that way. This is way more than just him (duh, I know)

[number6]

97. kick .....bu$$hes criminal clown ass ...

:kick:

[nolabels]

106. And another Kick

Check that post #40 up there, its really something :kick:

[nolabels]

107. An interesting article to ad to this thread

http://tomflocco.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=6
Rookie in the 9-11 Hot Seat?

National Military Command Center operations director asked newly-qualified substitute on Sept. 10 to stand his watch at 8:30 am on Sept. 11

by Tom Flocco

WASHINGTON -- June 17, 2004 Posted 11:45 pm -- Tom Flocco.com -- According to the personal written statement of Navy Captain Charles J. Leidig, Jr., entered into the record during today’s hearings before the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States, Leidig revealed that on September 10 he was asked by Brigadier General Montague Winfield to stand a portion of his duty as Deputy Director for Operations for the National Military Command Center (NMCC), which would require supervision and operation of all necessary communications as watch commander.

Leidig said "On 10 September 2001, Brigadier General Winfield, U.S. Army, asked that I stand a portion of his duty as Deputy Director for Operations, NMCC, on the following day. I agreed and relieved Brigadier General Winfield at 0830 on 11 September 2001."

Winfield had requested Leidig to assume his watch at what turned out to be the very outset of the September 11 attacks--but even after American Flight 11 had already been determined to be hijacked just minutes before Winfield handed over his watch to Leidig.
Captain Leidig’s Commission statement was 1.25 typewritten pages, large font, and double-spaced--the shortest written statement provided by any 9-11 Commission deponent as observed by this writer since the commencement of the probe.
(snip)

[nolabels]

108. More lies?

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5251871/site/newsweek/
Who Was Really In Charge?
Did Bush know Cheney had given orders to down airliners on September 11? The commission staff wonders—and remains at odds with both men over alleged Saddam-Al Qaeda ties.
Eric Draper / The White House


The president and his staff react to the unfolding news of the September 11 attacks at the Emma E. Booker Elementary School in Florida

By Daniel Klaidman and Michael Hirsh
Newsweek
June 28 issue - America was under attack, and somebody had to make a decision. Dick Cheney, huddled in the Presidential Emergency Operations Center under the White House, had just urged the traveling George W. Bush not to return to Washington. The president had left Florida aboard Air Force One at 9:55 a.m. on 9/11 "with no destination at take-off," as last week's 9-11 Commission report noted. Nor had Bush given any known instructions on how to respond to the attacks. Now Cheney faced another huge decision on a morning in which every minute seemed monumental. The two airliners had already crashed into the Twin Towers, another into the Pentagon. Combat air patrols were aloft, and a military aide was asking for shoot-down authority, telling Cheney that a fourth plane was "80 miles out" from Washington. Cheney didn't flinch, the report said. "In about the time it takes a batter to decide to swing," he gave the order to shoot it down, telling others the president had "signed off on the concept" during a brief phone chat. When the plane was 60 miles out, Cheney was again informed and again he ordered: take it out.

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Then Joshua Bolten, after what he described in testimony as "a quiet moment," spoke up. Bolten, the White House deputy chief of staff, asked the veep to get back in touch with the president to "confirm the engage order." Bolten was clearly subordinate to Cheney, but "he had not heard any prior conversation on the subject with the president," the 9/11 report notes. Nor did the real-time notes taken by two others in the room, Cheney's chief of staff, "Scooter" Libby—who is known for his meticulous record-keeping—or Cheney's wife, Lynne, reflect that such a phone call between Bush and Cheney occurred or that such a major decision as shooting down a U.S. airliner was discussed. Bush and Cheney later testified the president gave the order. And national-security adviser Condoleezza Rice and a military aide said they remembered a call, but gave few specifics. The report concluded "there is no documentary evidence for this call."
(snip)

[Nlighten1]

111. Wasn't it longer that 7 minutes though?

I think he sat there longer but the only tapes available are ones that have been edited. Is that true?

[glitch]

114. His entire time in the classroom was bizarre - he knew the first plane had

already hit the WTC BEFORE he went in, since he'd been warned about a impending terrorist attack since August 6, what the hell was he doing even going into the photo op in the first place?
Everybody else on the planet stopped what they were doing once they heard about the FIRST plane and paid attention. It's what you do as humans (and animals) when a threat is perceived...
But the pResident of the nation being attacked. Nope.