Board Upholds R Rating for 'Fahrenheit'

[agitpropagent9]

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=493&u=/ap/20040622/ap_en_mo/film_fahrenheit_9_11_rating_1&printer=1

[2Design]

1. tha is too bad... they allow the military to start canvassing middle

schoolers and high schoolers before they graduate and are 18. They won't let them see ahead of time what will happen to them if they sign on the dotted line..

It is ok to recruit them underage but not let them see until they are 18 and dying in IRaq or some other country.

[rangerfan]

2. Look at it this way.

It's free publicity, this will get big coverage on the news tonight.

[joefree1]

3. And the big Moore Mo is unstoppable

MoveON.org has 110,000 people pledging to see the movie. The ads are everywhere.

See what other DUers are doing for F911 opening night:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=106x8384

[bluestateguy]

4. No big deal

I don't know of too many theaters that enforce that rule. If kids want to get in, they'll find a way.

[Mike Daniels]

30. Oh please.....

The solution:

Mom/Dad Will you take me to see "F 911"?

or 3-4 months from now:

Mom/Dad will you rent F 911 for me?

or in worst case scenario -

The kid can rent it when he turns 17 and before he signs on the dotted line for military service. I would figure you can't actually sign up for service until you're 18 anyway.

[2Design]

33. actually they have kids signing while still 17.....

if they get to the kids first and convince them, there is no turning back....rotc starts early...

[BattyDem]

5. Teenagers can't watch death and destruction ...

but they will be recruited to participate in it. :eyes: Oh well, this isn't a surprise. Besides, if you're not old enough to see an R rated movie, you're not old enough to vote. So as long as the kiddies watch the DVD before they're eligible to vote, I'll be happy. :-)

I'm more concerned about "small-town" America not getting to see the film. Here's an idea ... keep Fahrenheit 9/11 in the theaters for the summer and release it on DVD the first week in October. :evilgrin:

[SeattleDem]

8. not only release the DVD

but mass-mail copies to swing voters in important states!

my husband already has a list of family members to send it to - those who voted for Bush in 2000, aren't sure this time, but certainly wouldn't go to the theater to see this movie. However, if the DVD shows up at their house...

[Occulus]

19. this film is apparently already on the Gnutella/eDonkey network n/t

[Roaming]

34. I wonder, though, how many teens will actually WANT to see the movie

It doesn't seem to me to be marketed towards young teens, especially guys. Not too many kids that age are interested in things like politics yet--they're just interested in action and special effects.

[FlemingsGhost]

6. Soon enough, the marketing folks will realize...

That too much money is being lost trying to quiet this film.

Watch as even the most ardent opponents to F911, and its political agenda, scramble to cash in.

Moore is a promotional genius.

[mark0rama]

7. As Roger Ebert wrote last week,

"Only fictional beheadings get the PG-13."

http://www.suntimes.com/output/eb-feature/cst-ftr-moore18.html

I've got to say, it sounds like the subject matter really does demand an R rating. At least the rating won't turn away anyone old enough to vote.

[Voltaire99]

27. Nice column by the Ebster.

A bonus is his revelation that Moore complained about his criticism. I do love Moore's work, but no one should be thin-skinned in this business.

[SoCalDem]

9. When has an R rating kept teens from seeing a movie they want to see??

The R may actually apply a hint of "forbidden fruit" to the movie and make them want to see it more..

My son and I plan to see it, even though there are NO threatres in or near Riverside CA, that are showing it,.. We have to go to Ontario to see it... What a shame..

[rocktivity]

10. Right, SoCalDem--this is no big deal at all

And there are enough of "adult" DU-ers who can "accompany" younger viewers--it's just a matter of getting organized!

:headbang:
rocknation

[CBHagman]

11. I didn't know there was a beheading.

I have to confess that I will find that hard to watch and will probably avert my eyes. I don't know how I could possibly stand seeing that...

[damnraddem]

12. F911 is going to rule. The 15- and 16-year olds who want will get in.

Let's just hope that millions of registered voters see it and take it to heart. It looks that way.

14. I'm more concerned about the voters also

The people who really need to see it right now are the people who can vote.

[librechik]

13. Cuomo (Michael's lawyer for the MPAA) says they wouldn't allow him in

to the hearing to make Michael's case, saying lawyers "aren't allowed"--and he knows lawyers have previously been allowed in such hearings.

Once again, libs getting railroaded.

[WillyT]

35. Yep... Transcript On That Here:

<snip>

BLITZER: And this just in. The Motion Picture Association of America has just denied Moore's request to give "Fahrenheit 9/11" a PG-13 rating. As a result, the rating remain R, meaning moviegoers under the age of 17 must be accompanied by an adult.

Is "Fahrenheit 9/11" fair debate or simply political propaganda? And should teenagers be allowed or maybe even encouraged to see it? Former New York Governor Mario Cuomo is joining us now live in New York. U.S. Congressman David Dreier, Republican of California, joins us from Capitol Hill.

I know you were hired, Governor, to try to get it from an R to a PG-13. Why do you think it deserved PG-13?

MARIO CUOMO (D), FORMER NEW YORK GOVERNOR: Well, I thought it did for a couple of reasons, but what I ought to tell you, which you haven't mentioned yet, is that, for some strange reason, after negotiating for three days on how we could get a PG-13, and that didn't work out, the appeal was scheduled and suddenly they discovered that no lawyers would be allowed to appear at the appeal.

Now, there's nothing in the regulations of that group that says lawyers shouldn't be there. And other lawyers have been there, I know, because I discussed it with them. And so I was barred and wasn't able to make the case. And to say that that disappoints me is to put it very, very mildly.

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: Well, what are you suggesting? Are you suggesting, Governor, that there was...

CUOMO: I'm not suggesting anything. I'm just giving you the facts. They said that you'd have to be in production and distribution, because our rules say that somebody from production or distribution will make the case.

But they have had lawyers before. So we didn't have the benefit of a lawyer's argument. Therefore, better or for worse, that's the fact. Look, the important thing here is that we want to get as many people as possible to see this film, including 16-, 15-, and 14-year- old people, with the advice of their parents. We want them to see it.

Why? Because, in a couple of years, we're going to be asking them to join the armed forces. This war may still be on. They may be the people at risk, etcetera. The basic point here, let everybody see this film and let those who disagree, disagree, but do it in a documentary form. Produce evidence like the evidence Michael Moore has produced and let's have a real debate.

<snip>

Link: http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0406/22/wbr.00.html

:grr:

[TommyO]

15. Interesting...

the MPAA site seems to be a bit busy right now. I wonder how many other DUers and people objecting to the decision are hitting them right now.

[gort]

16. Make-up of MPAA rating board members

The main purpose of the ratings board is to assign a rating to a film that would be close to what a parent would consider appropriate for their child to see alone or have to be accompanied.

Film makers do not have to present their work for a rating, but it is in their best interest to have their film rated as most theater chains have a policy of not exhibiting unrated features. Some theaters are also bound by lease agreements with malls not to exhibit NC-17 films.

There are 14-18 MPAA board members who are chosen to try to represent a cross-section of races and/or religious beliefs. Simple majority decides the rating.

It is my understanding that a film can be screened up to three times before the decision is made final.

The MPAA is a way for the theater industry to police itself to avoid having the government step in ala the FCC. It's an imperfect system, but it's better than the Hayes Code.

"Watson, the needle!" cut from the 1939 release of "The Hound of the Baskervilles"



http://www.mpaa.org/movieratings/about/content.htm#1

[Corkey Mineola]

17. So What .. They Can't Vote

Responsible parents will take their kids to this film. I have some teens in my class right now. Very astute conversation today on Iraq, greed, and oil.
Smart kids!

[w4rma]

23. It's the kids from irresponsible parents who need to see it. And of course

the irresponsaible parents, themselves.

[HereSince1628]

18. So, accompany someone under age to the movie

It will get the message out and prove to young folks that the grey beards from the 60's still care.

[Cocoa]

20. I forgot about the napalm

We actually used freaking napalm in Iraq. That's going to blow a lot of people's minds.

[TheDonkey]

21. R rating hurts F911's use in educational facilities & a wider release

this is bad news, but at least it's coming out.

I wish someone would sue the MPAA for their biased and ridiculous standard for ratings.

[w4rma]

22. Yup. (nt)

[0rganism]

24. ' "Fahrenheit 9/11" opens...nationwide in about 850 theaters...'

:bounce: 850 theatres!?!? :bounce:

Since when does a documentary open in 850 theatres????

I think it's fair to say that the artificial conservative counterstrike against this movie and theatre owners has failed, utterly and completely.

On a sad note, the number of American military casualties in Iraq is very close to 850 today, as well.

[Windy]

25. I plan to take my 17 year old

He and his friends are socially conscious, thank goodness...a lot more than I was at his age. I want him to truly understand why I will be taking him to Canada if they start the draft!!!

[KamaAina]

26. So the same grisly scenes that are plastered on the news every night

are enough to earn a movie an R rating.

Hmmm... what if a movie called "Our Great Patriotic War Against Terror" had the same footage? I'm thinking G all the way...

[swhisper]

28. Parents need to take their teens ro F/911

[MetaTrope]

29. Jack Valenti has run the MPAA Ratings Board for nearly 40 years

That's a record many dictators aspire to.

[noonwitch]

31. Has an R rating ever stopped a determined kid over 14?

I never had a problem getting into movies from about that age on. I saw lots of R movies without my parents, from "Stir Crazy" to the Clint Eastwood monkey movie.

My personal opinion is that if it is appropriate to be shown on FOX News, than it shouldn't get an R rating.

[ElementaryPenguin]

32. Good! EVERY kid will now want to rent the video- ALL parents will see it!

Swing voters, moderates, even many Repukes will ultimately be exposed to it who wouldn't go to the theater to see it (and many conservatives will be converted - at least enough to be dissuaded from voting Bush - even if that means just NOT voting at all!) Biggest problem for BushCo is that they can't dispute/refute THE FACTS of Fahrenheit 9-11 - they can only attack Moore personally. At the end of that film - people (with the exception of hardcore freeper types - who are only people in the academic sense of the word) are going to be thinking a helluva lot more about the Bush Administration thugs and George Bush than they are Moore.

:bounce:
:party:

[theHandpuppet]

36. Christians love beheadings...

As long as they're the ones doing the beheading.

Note these popular Biblical heroes whose images hang in public galleries and chapels around the world for ALL to view:

Let's have a sampling of Judith:

http://www.abcgallery.com/C/cranach/cranach13.html
http://www.mfa.org/artemis/fullrecord.asp?oid=31440
http://www.excelsiordirect.com/judith.htm
http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/html/a/allori/cristofa/judith_h.html
http://www.wallacecollection.org/c/w_a/p_w_d/i/p/p525.htm
http://www.bc.edu/bc_org/avp/cas/artmuseum/collection/italpaint/1988_24.html
http://www.sepulchritude.com/chapelperilous/decollete/judith-ren.html

... and now for a sampling of the many images of David with Goliath's severed head:

http://www.abcgallery.com/R/rembrandt/rembrandt197.html
http://www.abcgallery.com/C/caravaggio/caravaggio55.html
http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/html/g/gentiles/orazio/david.html
http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/html/r/reni/1/david.html
http://www.masterpiece-paintings-gallery.com/caravaggio-david-head-goliath.htm
http://www.ngv.vic.gov.au/collection/international/painting/xyz/ipa00138.html
http://txtell.lib.utexas.edu/stories/media/s0006-1.html
http://www.victorianweb.org/sculpture/french/mercie1.html
http://www.nga.gov/press/2003/exhibitions/211/

So it's okay for the kiddies to see such pics hanging in church -- where they are taught that these beheadings were actual, historical events -- but not in a theatre? Ah, don't you just love the smell of hypocrisy in the morning?

[revree]

37. MOST KIDS WON'T SEE PG 13 CRAP ANYWAY...

AND ARE MORE ATTRACTED TO R MOVIES, SO THIS COULD BE A BLESSING IN DISGUISE IF THEY CAN FIND ADULTS OPEN MINDED ENOUGH TO TAKE THEM!!!