Couple beaten at Sox game after objecting to cursing

[Cocoa]

a lowlife attacks an off-duty cop, and the lowlife's wife attacks the cop's wife. :eyes:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-copbeaten29.html

Guerra said he was cutting through Section 122 near first base when his wife heard the foul language and told the Vicarios: "Do you mind? Our kids are here." Then Guerra reportedly told the brothers: "I am a cop. Watch your mouth."

Richard Vicario grabbed his crotch and said, "Cop this!" a Chicago Police report said. He allegedly punched Guerra in his face. The Vicario brothers continued to attack Guerra after he fell between the seats, police said. When Guerra's wife tried to help, Fricano allegedly attacked her.

more...

[kwyjibo]

1. Cop this!

very smooth.

[sniffa]

2. cop this

yeah, i object to "fiLL in the bLank" and i am a cop so watch it! i have no pity for the off duty - he went out of his way to be a tough guy.

[mark0rama]

14. The brothers' alleged behavior is unconscionable.

I don't care for much for Guerra using his position as a police officer to stop people from cursing, but taking the story as a whole, I'm on his side. There's a lot more in the story:

At one point before the violence, a Sox usher told the Vicarios to stop cursing and called security, prosecutors said. Three White Sox security officers arrived and Richard Vicario cursed at them -- using racial epithets, prosecutors said. He also allegedly spat in their faces.

After Sam Vicario was taken into custody, he punched a Sox security officer -- an off-duty Illinois State Police master sergeant -- in the face, officials said.

[sniffa]

16. agreed - they're jerks

and they're gonna get what's coming to them (in addition to the beating they received whiLe in custody).

however, maybe now this cop wiLL think twice before acting Like a tough guy. i wouLdn't have batted an eyeLash if he hadn't added the "watch your mouth i'm a cop" business.

[Baltimoreboy]

42. Your post is insane

The cop never acted like a tough guy. He tried to DEFUSE the situation.

Telling them he was a cop was proper and LEGAL. Even off duty, police can't ignore crimes in process.

This moron was clearly out of control. I hope he goes to jail for a nice long time. Drunk, disorderly, resisting arrest, assault and battery and attacking a police officer.

[sniffa]

44. you better watch what you post

i'm a cop.

[Baltimoreboy]

45. I am suitably unintimidated

Maybe because I am not drunk and disorderly in public.

[sniffa]

48. you shouLd be intimidated

didn't you hear me? i said i was a cop.

[Baltimoreboy]

53. Were I doing something wrong

Like disorderly conduct, and I in a public place, I wouldn't be intimidated, but I would know I could be arrested.

[kysrsoze]

21. This is exactly why nobody goes to Sox games --

That park is loaded with a bunch of drunken thugs. It's no place for a family. I'm sure lots of nice people go there, but the pathetic dirtbags who also show make it not worth going.

Oh, and banning beer at the ballpark is a stupid idea. You don't punish everyone who goes for the actions of a few idiots. You need better security.

[JVS]

26. He might have even started it

A taunts B, B hits A is a much more likely scenario than A taunts B and decides to hit B for good measure.

[Almost_there]

30. But he said that later...

The first thing out of the officer's mouth was "Could you please watch your language, we have our kids here". He didn't identify himself as an officer until they continued. Plus, just a little FYI, as an officer of the law, he has a sworn duty to uphold the law even if he is off duty. I am not a cop, but, I don't think he reacted incorrectly, and if this moron wishes to curse, do it in your own house.

[sniffa]

41. i didn't know

that chicago had no cursing statutes. is it aLso against the Law to spit in pubLic?

[GinaMaria]

50. only on the el

no loud radio playing either or soliciting. So take your pan handling loud loogie playing radio out of the city :P

[TryingToWarnYou]

51. Actually the cursing in public is a crime in many areas...

It falls under disorderly conduct. At least in Texas, its a citable offense.

Regardless of this fact, your dislike of the officer shouldnt have anything to do with whether or not the other guy broke the law, which was where this all started.

[hightime]

35. Absolutely, he deserved to get beat ...and his wife.

[sniffa]

39. bwahahaha

why Let the kids off?

[qanda]

3. Oh, Dick Cheney...

Officer Guerra would like a word with you.

[Cocoa]

5. Halliburton this!

[FizzFuzz]

27. good one!!! lolol n/t

[Bunny]

4. My, what a charming tale of family togetherness. n/t

[Kelvin Mace]

6. Yet another reason

to ban beer at sporting events.

David Allen
www.thoughtcrimes.org
Distrusting the Government Since 1984

[Richardo]

10. At $6.50 each, they've effectively done that at Astros games...

Ban beer, that is.

($7.50 if you want Shiner.) :eyes:

Hell, I don't pay $6.50 for a six-pack, let alone one beer.

I tell ya if you're not on an expense account it's almost financially unpossible to get drunk at a baseball game anymore. :cry:

[tabasco]

36. I hear ya' my brother ! I get tuned up before the game.

- Then enjoy MAYBE one cold one in the park. They gouge me so bad at PNC Park that I am not just boycotting beer - I don't go to as many games as I used to.
- Love Clemente! I was at his last game.

[Cocoa]

37. they don't call it Enron Field for nothing

you have to expect to get ripped off.

[underpants]

7. Sounds like the low-lifes who jumped the first base coach at a Sox game

But that was a father and son low-life duo not brothers.

[Jacobin]

8. Ah yes, the pleasures of alcoholic beverages at ball games

About 5 percent of the population really should stay at home when they drink and beat up on a punching bag.

[yellowcanine]

9. Sounds as if those brothers and their mother are pretty cheneyed up.

The Vicarios' mother, Joann Bussie, said she thinks Guerra started the fight.

"Yeah, they used some language they shouldn't have," Bussie said of her sons. "But this gentleman came from two sections over. He did not have to pass them. He provoked it."

Uh - so he wasn't supposed to walk by your low-life spawn in a public place? Now how could he have known that, lady?

[Richardo]

11. So that's better? That he could hear them from 2 sections away?

Nice thinking, Mom. :eyes:

[natrat]

12. flush em

both down the cheney for a few years

[rebel_liberal]

13. Yes... the really Cheneyed up that night..........

If they had not gotten so cheneyed on the booze, they probably would not have hit the off-duty and cheneyed up a good family night out.

I also think off-duty cop cheneyed up a bit by acting tough guy.

Any way you look at it...... it is one cheneyed up situation.

Please forgive my foul mouth this morning ;-)

Peace not Bush!

[madrchsod]

15. just one of the reasons

that even though the white sox are the best team in chicago right now and have the best manager, the park is not "family" friendly- way to many assholes...."you can put it on the board-yessssssssssss"
oh yes these guys are going...going...gone- they`re out of here....

[chiburb]

18. It's funny...

At the old park, the assholes would usually come out on Friday nights. The rest of the week was pretty safe, especially Sat. and Sun.

[AngryAmish]

34. 1/2 price Mondays and Tuesdays are bad

Gives people more $ for beer.

[playahata1]

71. Anybody attend "Disco Demolition Night" at the old Comiskey in '79?

Or know someone who did? Tell me about it!

[AngryAmish]

93. Before my time - But here is the scoop

But I heard about it. It was a doubleheader. The promotion was a discount if you showed up with a disco record to destroy. Fans were jumping the turnstiles and the place was packed. Waaay over capacity. There was not a lot of security and they were overmatched. Tons of dope. The average guy in Chicago HATED disco, and Steve Dahl (the local DJ who thought up the stunt) really knew how to tap into that anger.

So, Steve and Garry Meirer came out b/w games and blew up some disco records. The fans went nuts, ran on the field.

White Sox foreited the second game. The umps said the field was unplayable. That was a lie. The crowd was already drunk/high. There was no rule then that you shut off the beer sales after X hour. If they tried to cut off the beer, there would have been a bigger riot.

However, there was a more poorly thought out baseball promotion. Anyone ever hear of "Dime Beer Night" in Cleveland in the 70s? I swear to God it happened.

[JVS]

23. God bless those Blacksox!

[chiburb]

17. Hmm... why is this being reported a week after the fact?

Do the Vicario brothers have some clout? Was Guerra playing hooky from his job? Just seems strange that this wasn't reported at the time...

[mbperrin]

19. Hey, if cursing makes you feel good, it's OK!

Just ask that Dick who's usually in some undisclosed location.

Right?

[rebel_liberal]

20. That is right! ...............

Ohhhhhhhhhhh Dick!?! Come out.... Come out wherever you are!!

[JVS]

22. A ballpark is no place for people who might be offended by ...

coarse language and drunkeness.

I remember the time I was at opening day as a child and sat up in the cheap seats, watching drunken women remove their shirts and dance around, while the men hurled the most vulgar language imaginable at the field. Those were the days.

[AngryAmish]

24. What do you expect from White Sox fans?

I saw a picture of said Vicario brothers. The one who spat on and punched the cop had blood all over his shirt. The police said he "fell" on a bench while in custody. He just got tuned-up.

But really, why can't those South Siders control themselves? Are their mullets too tight? No sugar for their churros? Simply put, the White Sox are proven to be the most corrupt franchise in major professional sports history, and their fans live up to that standard every day.

[LSK]

28. do you remember the murder outside wrigley???

Someone was shot right outside of Wrigley field a few months back after a game. http://www.nbc5.com/news/3331062/detail.html


Stereotyping the White Sox fans is HYPOCRITICAL.

Stupid drunk people can be anywhere - at a Cubs or a Sox game.

[AngryAmish]

32. It would be hypocritical if I compared Cubs fans to Sox fans.

The shooters outside Wrigley were not at the game and the shooting was well after the game. Beside, I never said anything about Cubs fans and their behavior.

Just loosen your mullet up and relax. It is a long season.

[chiburb]

52. Cheney you.

I'm educated, have no mullet, and am a Sox fan. Go Cheney yourself.

[AngryAmish]

58. No mullet AND a Sox Fan... Riiight!

[chiburb]

64. I notice your bulb is a little dim...

Must be a Cub fan.

[slappypan]

25. "Springer Nation"

Some Cubs fans I know refer to White Sox fans collectively as "the Springer Nation," as in Jerry Springer.

[lil-petunia]

29. hee hee

and after millions in trying to get families to dare enter the park, they have episodes like this. Then, they get robbed outside the park.

The highest rate of unemployment is just south of Comiskey Field I refuse to call it
Us Sell-U-out Field.

Mainly black, some hispanic, and run by all too many gangs, it is a perfect place for Shrub to spend some serious urban time when reflecting how much development money he will cut next year.

[DrWho]

31. at least

at least he sox picked up Garcia

[Logansquare]

40. These were white guys from the suburbs

If you want to see some scary white people, go to a Sox game. Jerry Springer works, too.

[playahata1]

74. Why wasn't STEVE WILKO doing security that night?

:evilgrin:

[gatlingforme]

33. A cop off duty never should say "watch your mouth" to someone

and then say " I am a cop" that is asking for trouble at a white sox game. (or where ever for that matter) What the cop was saying to these people was --- forget your first amendment rights, I will Eff you because I am a cop. SORRY, won't work.

Edit: The cop was stupid.

[Logansquare]

38. Well it didn't work out very well anyway. They broke his nose

and his wife's nin front of their little boys, who are now frightened and traumatized. They also spat at and shouted racial epithets at Sox security ; it took three people to subdue them. The photos in the paper are priceless--one of them is splattered with the blood of his victims. Yeah the "I'm a cop" thing wasn't very smart, especially with kids involved, but I have a hard time conjuring up sympathy for these guys (and woman), and their mother-of-the-year (quoted in the article)

[livinginphotographs]

49. I agree...

I can't believe anybody could justify beating the cop and his wife up in front of their kids, even he was acting like a "tough-guy."

Asking someone to watch their language (even at a White Sox game) does not give a drunken piece of trash the right to pummel you in front of your kids. I have a LOT more sympathy for the cop than I do for these lowlifes.

And their mother....what can I say? And we wonder how her charming sons ended up this way?

[Baltimoreboy]

43. No, he was doing his job

Cops are on duty 24-7. They don't turn away from crimes in process. This was such a case. He tried to be reasonable. That didn't work. Then he tried to warn them and they attacked him.

I hope this guy falls off his bench more.

[sniffa]

46. i'm about to commit a crime now

by quoting the vice president.

[Baltimoreboy]

55. If you are drunken and rowdy at a ball game

You can get arrested. I've seen it happen on several occasions at both baseball and football games.

[jayfish]

57. That's Not Quite Correct.

A policy like that is usually determined by the individual law enforcement agency. If your department does not have such a policy it is a good idea to keep your head down and your mouth shut unless asked to do otherwise by an on-duty officer. Brandishing your copness when not on duty is a good way for you to get yourself beaten up (just like this fella) or worse. The real world isn't a TV show. I seem to remember a rapper (Maybe Tupac) who shot two off duty officers for brandishing their weapons and their copness. You know what? He walked.

Jay

[Baltimoreboy]

62. Again, that's ridiculous

I'm not a cop and I don't have to ignore drunken rowdy behavior. He is a cop and shouldn't ignore it either.

And the asshole who attacked should be locked up for about 50 years.

[jayfish]

68. Hmmm... It's Not Ridiculous. It's The Way Things Work. It's A Good Thing..

Your not a cop because, obviously, you would put yourself into the same situation and probably suffer the same result. I never said the behavior should have been ignored, the off-duty officer should have handled if differently.

Jay

[JVS]

70. But handling it differently doesn't let him do the...

"You'd better watch your mouth because I'm a cop, do you have to do what I say" thing and look like a big man. Of course getting his ass handed to him probably didn't make him look too big either.

[jayfish]

73. Yup, I'm Sure His Buds At The Station Are Going Use This...

incident as a source of comedic outlet for years to come.

Jay

[Baltimoreboy]

78. Not a cop

But grew up around them. Ironically, I have football tickets right near a pair of cops. The higher rank of the two has used badge on several occasions to restore order.

No one has tried to kick his ass.

Maybe people in Baltimore actually respect law and order.

[jayfish]

80. They Are Playing The Percentages Then And I Have No Problem With That

But don't expect any sympathy when they get called out as well. BTW the higher ranking officer should know better. At least he has backup though. I'm not sure if you are aware of this but LEO don't have any special rights (in the law) the rest of us don't have. For example, did you know that a LEO who is speeding even while running with lights and sirens can be pulled and over and ticketed for doing so? Basically they are just citizens who are given authority to enforce the law more aggressively than the rest of us.

Jay

[Baltimoreboy]

82. Here, I know you are incorrect

The stadium is in Baltimore. They are off-duty Baltimore cops and remain recognized police officers. They are allowed, encouraged and told to have their badges with them at all times. ELsewhere, they also carry their guns. I don't believe they do so at the games.

As for the part about speeding, that will rank as one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen on DU.

If you want to call them out, I wouldn't recommend it. If they ever had any trouble, they'd have about a dozen sudden deputies from their neighbors.

You and others in this thread seem to dislike cops. I don't.

[jayfish]

86. If They Are Carrying Around Their Badge Cases Without A Sidearm...

then they are asking for real trouble. And I'm not talking about a broken nose and broken pride. Thats the second post for me today that has been called the most ridiculous post on DU. (I kinda like it) Unfortunately from what I have been taught it is the truth. Police officers (especially those who are on duty) are not gods. Sheesh.

Jay

[Baltimoreboy]

88. They might not be allowed to do so on stadium property

We all go through security checks to get in. Or, if they do, they are not visible. I don't frisk at games.

I never said they were gods or even God. But police officers are to be generally obeyed when they tell you to stop misbehaving.

[playahata1]

75. It was indeed Tupac Shakur who shot those two cops.

n/t

[jayfish]

77. Thanks For The Confirmation. Also If My Memory Serves...

the altercation took place in Baltimore or DC so Baltimoreboy should be familiar with the case.

Jay

EDITED FOR CONTENT

[uhhuh]

87. I'm sure

That Tupac would have liked to have a couple extra officers around in Vegas after the Tyson fight, huh?

[sniffa]

90. you mean more officers to heLp

set up that hit on him? it seems the 2 that did didn't need any heLp.

[uhhuh]

91. L.inks?

Are you saying that the white caddilac that sprayed his car with bullets was filled with cops? Interesting. How come the cops that pulled over his car with no tags earlier didn't just waste him right there instead of letting him go?

[gatlingforme]

81. I do not have sympathy for the low lifes, but a cop off-duty is not

going to solve the problem by telling people (who were drunk) that I am a cop watch your mouth. Also, many departments have regulations that state when and where they may carry their firearms. I do not think pulling a Cheney warrants an off-duty officer's service - IMO

[TX-RAT]

47. The cop was stupid?

I do believe disturbing the peace is against the law, whether at a ball park or in your neighborhood. Sounds like they should have taken his advise.Then they might have seen the rest of the game, instead of disturbing other patrons who paid good money to watch and enjoy a ball game.

Seems some here at DU are not very LEO friendly.

[jayfish]

59. How Does One Disturb The Peace Where No Expectation...

of peace is evident? Drunk & Disorderly would be a more Germain charge. Anyway, the off-duty office should have kept his mouth shut and alerted the proper on-duty officials if he had a problem with the situation. To do otherwise is to invite trouble and thats what he got.

Jay

[TX-RAT]

60. Maybe they weren't drunk

Officer is never really off duty.

(alerted the proper on-duty officials) Which happen to be a off duty officer.

[jayfish]

61. Read #57 Please. Also...

if they were not drunk then what would the charge have been?

Jay

[Baltimoreboy]

63. Disorderly conduct

That's a start.

[TX-RAT]

65. felony aggravated battery's good enough.

Assault on a peace officer would be another. Once the officer ID himself he went from off duty to ON.
Seems the individual you defend had quite a criminal past.

[jayfish]

66. Keep Your Timeline Straight.

The charges you refer to would be made after the perps beat this guy down. And I'm not defending the perps, I'm saying the off-duty officer was being an idiot.

Jay

[TX-RAT]

69. Thats what he was charged with.

The officer had as much right as you or i to ask him to quit cussing, especially if children were present. As i said, once he ID himself he was no longer off duty.

[jayfish]

72. You Are Absolutely Correct He Did Have The Right To...

ask the guys to quit cussing. He also has a right to suffer the same fate as the rest of us for doing so and to press charges if so inclined. The guy was sporting his machismo and got called on it. Thats really the long and short of it. I'm sure that the thugs will face the consequences of their actions and rightly so.

Jay

[TX-RAT]

76. I would hardly call that ( sporting his machismo )

[sniffa]

79. exactLy

i didn't see too many peopLe defending the idiots here, just attacking the cop. he was fLexing his manjuice and he did indeed get caLLed on it. that in itseLf was stupid, but more so because his wife and chiLdren were there and he obviousLy pLaced them in danger.

the man shouLd be fired for being a poor cop if he indeed is "on duty" after IDing himseLf.

best thread of the day so far

[FeebMaster]

67. Assault on a peace officer?

If I claim I'm a cop and subsequently get beaten stupid, can the guy beating me be charged with assault on a peace officer?

[Baltimoreboy]

83. If it turns out you are a cop, yes

He identified himself as such. You better hope he was lying.

[FeebMaster]

84. That's the point.

Any idiot can claim he's a cop.

[Baltimoreboy]

89. But if you beat him and it turns out he was correct

You are in for a world of hurt.

[FeebMaster]

92. Obviously.

But that's not what my first post said.

[gatlingforme]

85. I should have said the cop did a stupid thing. And I think that

you should not judge me based on that assertation, now that I have corrected myself. I am LEO friendly trust me. ;)

[Zerex71]

54. I didn't know Dick Cheney was at that game?

[Zerex71]

56. And then people wonder why ticket prices are high

Would be nice to keep out the riff-raff. :)

Well, what do you expect...white trash are everywhere. Just look at 1600 Penn. Ave. for starters.